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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
The purpose of this thread is to start some positive ideas, to fight this problem.
It's time to step up and quit all our whining about the problem. I define the problem, now lets take some positive action.

Enemy Objective Report:

This has become an epidemic on some of our northwest rivers. The snaggers have launched an offensive to take over our rivers. The tactics being employed range from small squad stealthy raids, to huge mobilazation of troops to numerically dominate the the battlefield. The enemy is cultrally engrianing thier youth that this is accepptable behavior. This practice, along with recriuting of new anglers, threatens to in the future create legions of troops for thier cause.

Risk Asessment:

The risk of inaction our our part could have devastaing effects in the short term & long term.
I will seperate them.
short term
#1. The rule of the law is voilated!
#2. There actions paint all anglers in a bad light to the uninformed general public.
#3. Youths and new anglers are "exposed" to this unethnical behavior.
#4. Fishing is ruined for "legit" anglers, who cross there path.
#5. Fish are being victumized!
#6. Waters may be closed to fishing, to stop there illegal activies.
Long Term:

#1. Public perceptions becomes pointedly against angling. The sceans of the "Snaggers" in action on the news, turned there stomach. Some liken the behavior to that of the "Buffalo Hunters."
#2. Sport angling is outlawed, thus depriving our childern use of the resources. The childern will ask us all " why "?? Didn't you stop them, why didn't you take care of the resource for us??
#3. The enemy population explosion theatens the gentic stock of the human race.

Counter Offensive Objectives:

#1. Put a face on this for the public! We must take the truth to the public!
> This can be achieved by having "legit" angling groups, promoting thier battle against the forces of "evil." The public must be courted to help in this war.
#2. Report all illegal activity!!
> This must be done every time a violation is seen. This creates a public record, wich must be a mile long to sway opinon in our favor. Can you imagine the impact of 1000 snagging reports to the gamies in a two month period. The record must be overwhemlimg, thus you fail in your mission if you do not report every action witnessed.
#3. Recruit new anglers to join the cause of right! The truth is our weapon here.
> I can't stress how effective of a tactic this can be for us. That new guy you turn to our side, could have a brother, friend, son he fishes with. Every new troop we bring in, has his people he can bring in. We must not let thease people slip away to the "dark" side.
A educated new troop can soon be out fishing speaking the "truth"!!
#4. Call a spade a spade when you see it on the water. Remember, ananomitty makes them feel safe.
A loud " hey, you in the Red hat, that fish if foul hooked! Why don't you just do the sporting thing and bust him off, instead of yarding him around by the adipose."
That usally tweaks them good. They know everyone knows who's in the red hat. Now, they think everyone is noticing him, the guy in the red hat.
#5. Exercise your right to fish free of being subjected to illegal activity!

Closing Address:

My friends, We all must unite together under this common cause. I will not, go into detail what we are up against! We all now know the risk to our fishing rights. We all know the layers of unethnical actions that go on. We all know about the misinformation being spewed by the ememy. We all know about the poor fish, some native sujected to this. We all know about the "brainwashing" tactics be used on children.
My friends, I pose a question to you.
Are we at war?? Is it time to define this as a war?? We have a war on terror, and drugs!
And if, My friends we are at war.
Will we fight for our rights, our childrens rights, and the rule of law????????
Finally, I'll tell you that I'm declaring war as of 7:42pm. on this day 9-22-03 on the multi-ethnical underground snagging conspirosicy!

Signed,
General
GL2

[ 09-22-2003, 10:14 PM: Message edited by: GL2 ]
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Ya. But what are we gonna do about it??
The problem is a epidemic. Does anyone deny it?
We need Bill Monroe's help. We need Jerry Dove of Tillamook anglers.We need the N.W. steelheaders.
Thease outfits already have a organzation up and running.
I don't belong to any of thease groups and I know I'm not giving them the credit due for stuff they already have going. But, I think thease gruops could really bring thier profile up with the general public (G.P.), and "legit" anglers.
If I ran one of thease clubs i'd be looking @ using our confronting of this issue. The G.P. love animals & hates to see cruel things done to them. They love to support groups who are fighting the good fight. Seems like a good way to fend off the enviro. zealots too. Sportsmen standing up and drawing a line between right and wrong, trying to police themselves. Policing themselves by, educating the G.P. of the problem and asking for support to stop it.
I'd have a grassroots get out the issue. Like a get out the vote. Try to get some media coverage for our cause. Does the G.P. know there are thousands of "snaggers"??
You know, If a group was to take on this issue it would be a no lose for them. This can have a quick quantive return. The typical stream resto. project take more(years) time than the G.P. has for a attention span. This issue can produce a result in a year or two max. Then I'd come back @ the G.P. for help & money on resto. work.
I bet it would get membership up too.
Heck, I'd join up. Of course you could make a case i should have already.
I'm not disresecting them in any way. They;ve done way more than i ever have.


Alone we can each be dilgent in reporting.
I think we need a thread:
" Angling Violations I Witnessed & Reported"

then everyone could post that wanted to particapate. Maybe some pics.
Then we'd have a running record , then we can get a number on how many times & @ what spot. Law enforcement could then distingush spots where, increased patrols are required. Plus the "snaggers" would know "legit" anglers were watching them.
I like this idea alot! :dance:
We could have a pool on how many pages long it would go by the end of the season.
What are you gonna do?

[ 09-22-2003, 09:24 PM: Message edited by: GL2 ]
 

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I was fishing on Eagle Creek above the dam yesterday when I witnessed 3 SNAGGERS snagging in closed water. I called the State Police to report what was going on. Much to my surprise they all got busted. I was walking by when the Trooper was writing them all tickets. The excuses they were using was sickening. OH BOY OH BOY that made my day!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

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GL2,

I've already posted this once to night and I might post it again on another thread that I am thinking of starting.



The word is out on the Salmon River and I have heard their has been improvement there and there is more improvement needed. But it is a start in the right direction.

I have mentioned on several threads the past few weeks and months about getting fishermen involved instead of just complaining and whining. I know Rob Allen is aware of this because I have replied on a few threads he has been involved on regarding this big problem. I also mentioned about taking pic's and starting a thread "Northwest Most Wanted Snaggers" and was somewhat serious. I did post a pic I took last week of some gigger's that were ilegally gigging on the Kalama tidewater on Jennie's "Lewis River KATU" thread. It is illegal to plunk a corkie there and the Washougal both this year.

I mentioned getting organized with some SW Washington anglers against snagging and had a few of them express their interest on the board and a few emailed me wanting to do something about it.

It's time to get organized and get rid of or at least curtail the out-of-control snagging on the NW rivers.

Maybe Jennie who is appaled by snagging herself can post a thread started by herself or someone else and keep it at the top of the community forum during the fall salmon season? That way we could all compare notes and maybe even get the Oregon Stater's and Washington Gamie's involved to work together with us as did the Washington gamie did on the KATU thread?

I want to get really involved in a SW Washington anti-snagging group but I am currently moving from Depoe Bay, Oregon to SW Washington this week and the moving is taking all my time presently.

I agree with you that we need Bill Monroe's help along with Henry Miller and other local newspaper's and television to make it obvious to the unethical that this is not going to be tolerated any longer and we mean business. It does make a difference when they realize that the GP fishermen aren't going to condone it any longer.

Real busy right now but let me know how I can help. I've been fighting this battle myself for a while now.

Dan
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Dan,

That is a neat sign you guys got there. The Salmon River is changing.
The thing that stands out to me is this.
People got fed up with this type of behavoir and took positive action about it.
The result??
Well most people now know that type of behavior is being cracked down on the salmon River.
Those who would show up and break the law are not even showing up at the river now.
The positive momentum building at the Salmon
River should, be a example of what can be done to promote change thru postive actions.
I salute all paties involved!!


Dan,
I also saw your pics on the Kalama snaggers. Great work. I hope to get out with my Dig. camera and get some shots. Lot's of places change needs to be promoted.
And what about David Ulrich!!!
The man did us a service yesterday turning in "snaggers" on Eagle Creek. He's got one for the record.
But, what inpresses me most about David is this.
He's wearing his heart on his sleave on this issue. He's not trying to effect change thru, anamonity. No, David is standing up by his name, boldy taking a stand for postive change and action. It's people like you & David who will turn the tide in this war.
I think as a byproduct of getting involved and tackling this issue, we will see that alot of Ifishers are tops!
 

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GL2, thank you.

A story in a more positive light. A friend who lurks on this site but will not register or post told me a story a few days ago about his son.

It seems that the boy has discovered fishing and with his fathers help has begun the learning that must go on as a man begins his fishing career. He drives now and spends most of his after school time driving to Cedar Creek hatchery and the N. fork Lewis and other bank fishing spots and tries to catch salmon and steelhead. It gets better. The boy's friends from High school are becoming involved as well.

Gary often finds himself coaching these boys and teaching them tackle, methods, rod and reel selection and philosophy of fishing. He takes a great deal of pride and pleasure in his son's activities and his role, as the boys father, as a mentor.

Some weeks ago the boy asked his father about the snaggers at the meat hole near the N. Fork Lewis hatchery at Cedar creek. Gary replied that although it seemed everyone did it and they seldom got busted the boys should do the right thing and plunk spin and glos or eggs and catch fish using legitimate methods. Even though it was harder to fish that way and they would get fewer salmon to take home.

He taught his son to fish using the legitimate methods and the boy learned quickly and taught his friends from school. The snagging activities continued unabated and the boy brought a few salmon home after fishing almost every night and continued to complain to his father about the snaggers.

A few days ago the Washington troopers did a round up and the boys were there to see it. About 15 snaggers were ticketed and the boys were checked also. The cops were surprised to find not 2 corkies and a mooching rig on the teenage boys lines but plunking gear with eggs and spin and glos. The police congratulated the boys, the only 3 anglers out of the group of 18 that were not ticketed and told them to keep fishing while they did the paperwork on the other 15.

Gary will never post this story so I thought I would share it with all of you. Gary is proud of his son. It starts at home. Teach your kids fishing, ethical fishing and watch the magic happen.

Snaggers are poor sports, period. Turn them in, shame them into learning how to fish, tolerate poaching activities not.
 

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I think a lot of iFishers would be willing to participate in an organized assault on snaggers. I am willing to bet that between us we can come up with some good ideas of action to take. A couple of things that I can think of are:

-Signs: We make signs similar to the one that DepoBayDan has posted that basically say "Attention Snaggers, snagging fish is illegal and results in fines of up to $*** etc. You are being watched and photographed by members of iFish and you WILL be reported." If Jennie and crew do not want iFish to be associated with something like this then I suppose we don't have to include iFish but it would sure carry more weight if we could.

-SnagHole visits: We identify the worst places (Washougal, Eagle Creek, Cedar Creek, etc) and a group of us go for a few hours to each place and observe digital cameras and cell phones in hand. We make it known why we are there, we educate those who truly don't understand the regulations and what they risk by not following them and we show the blatant snaggers that there are a number of people out there (in addition to the ODFW) who will not tolerate this activity.

-Work for Closures and/or stricter reg's at snagfest holes: Places like Cedar Creek should either be closed or perhaps at least the gear should be restricted to single hooks, etc. Whatever we need to do to lobby ODFW we should do.

These are just a few ideas. As I said I'm sure we can come up with others. We are never going to completely stop snagging but I believe we can have an impact. Right now when you go to a place like Cedar Creek no one thinks anyone is watching them. If they thought people were they might actually be forced to change their habits. I am willing to participate in any organized activities that will make a difference.

GS
West Linn Wader

[ 09-23-2003, 08:06 AM: Message edited by: West Linn Wader ]
 

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I would start at Cedar Creek. Yesterday, I saw the "real deal". 3 guys that brought a elk pack board down and packed out 9 fish....most of which (I was told) were snagged. :mad: :mad:
 

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I will gladly give up my fishing time to prevent some 3 tooth from snagging our fish, as if it's not enough we provide them with welfare they think they can snag our fish. So if anybody wants to meet up and stake out a hole to patrol for the day let me know, I have a cell and cameras both digital and video. send me mail or reply here
 

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I like the sign idea. There could be text that is directed at snaggers and those violating other regs to include " Violaters may be photographed or video-taped. Those of us who fish by legal methods are also carrying cellular phones and will not hesitate to contact the state police"
We could get these sign printed fairly cheap, on a light waterproof stock.
I like Depot dan's sign, I'd just add this. Add the element of paranoia to these scum. They need to know that eyes are on them.
GBS

[ 09-23-2003, 10:05 AM: Message edited by: greenbuttskunk ]
 

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The only problem with signs is they get ripped down the first day. Don't get me wrong I like the idea but............
 

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A few signs posted at the Salmon River have got ripped down but most remain and there are plenty of them.

They are making a difference and I hear that is the talk around the Salmon River this season from several anglers including at the last Salmon River meeting last week.

Both district biologist Bob Buckman and his assistant Kevin Goodson have become very proactive in this issue this year and if you have some questions or insight feel free to contact them for this area (Salmon River on down to the Siuslaw River) or contact the local OSP. This thread is a good place to start though as there are several biologist and game enforcement officials that read ifish.net.

The OSP is making their presence felt more than normal even with their limited personel and it is all working together to make a difference.

I just left a voice mail message with officer Swede Pierson with the local Newport OSP regarding this thread and suggesting that they might participate in this thread via email to Jennie as Sgt. Rick Webb from Washington did on another thread. Officer Swede does read ifish also and would have probably seen this thread without me pointing it out.

I have a good feeling about this and feel we have turned the corner on snagging and other unethical behavior.

An email I sent to Jennie this morning:

Thank you Jen for taking the time to reply to both of these emails.
I think we are on to a good thing here and possibly amongst us we will organize and make a difference.
And thanks for pinning the snagging thread and I hope it stays positive.
I will notify some ODFW and local Stater's about the thread and maybe they will save it to their favorites and become proactive even if it is a matter of emailing you and you posting it as you did on the KATU thread.
I will also email Bill Monroe and Henry Miller and some of the local papers.
The more the snagger's and unethical see this, the better off we are.
<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">As I stated earlier, I am extremely busy right now moving (I should be fishing) but will do what I can since the season is upon us. I will notify the local Lincoln City News Guard and Depoe Bay Beacon as soon as I’m done here and possibly KATU.

If Jennie or someone else was to come up with a positive low-key “anti-snagging” tee-shirt, I would gladly spend the money to buy one or two to wear this fall on the rivers and possibly a sweatshirt for when the weather requires one.

I really feel signage combined with media coverage will make a big difference!

Maybe some of you out there can contact some more media for example the Columbian in Vancouver and the Daily News in Longview and shoot the sports editors an email with the URL for this thread.

I won’t be involved with ifish much this week because of my move but will monitor this thread and my emails if anyone can use my help in this.

Pilar, that was an excellent story you posted and shows where a lot of the problem is and how “preventive maintenance” (for lack of better words) can and will make a difference.

After just looking back at some of the post, maybe including “poaching hotlines” on tee-shirts might not be a bad addition if someone was to make some.

I will attempt to take a pic or two of some other signs we came up with that are presently making a statement at the Salmon River.

Jen sent me a positive email from an enforcement official that appreciates our involvement in this matter and I would hope that she would post it.

Got to go and I don’t want to say: let’s go get them, but, let’s make a difference.

And hopefully this thread will be a positive thread and productive one at that. :smile:

Dan
 

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Jennie,

I read with interest the new topic on "War On Snagging". Those who are interested in taking a positive step toward making a lasting difference are speaking out and stepping forward. You've finally asked the right question. What makes snaggers feel uncomfortable enough (in addition to the game warden arriving) to make them alter their behavior? These folks have identified a few here and are getting close to doing something meaningful away from the keyboard. I hope they keep the ideas coming. I think we can all work together and mold that product into something where law enforcement and concerned fisherman can work hand-in-hand at a different level and be able to measure the results. Let's not forget to educate those who render the decisions along the way about how important this is to us. Most don't hunt or fish and may not share the same passion for this specific issue as we do. I have enjoyed seeing the posts where we have been acknowledged for being active in bringing some of these folks to justice. I will let you know the types of fines we see as these cases are heard. Keep up the good work on your end.

Sgt. Rick Webb
 

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We should all carry a pair of Vise Grips with us. When we pull into a hole full of snaggers we can set up shop and offer free tooth removal. Of course there is a 3 tooth(teeth) limit.

[ 09-23-2003, 01:22 PM: Message edited by: David Ulrich ]
 

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We all must do our part and it starts at the field level. Just dont stand for people keeping foul hooked fish.

Pilar, that was a good story to hear. But i was a little confused. Why did the corkie people get a ticket and spin glo plunkers not get a ticket. I did read somethere your lure had to be moving on the Washougal and the lower Kalama. I am wondering what i missed and i want to make sure i understand the rules.
 
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