Exciting times for myself! I recently sold my truck for a good deal for myself and the buddy who bought it. I then was able to finish paying off my ThunderJet, so that's also pretty exciting for me. The time is nigh to buy myself a new diesel pusher so I can get back out on the water and hunt springers. I have narrowed it down to either a GMC 3500 or a Ford F350. I need a heavy duty truck, as I plan on occasionally towing a 5th wheel that I have access to, and I like having more power than not enough for towing. I am thinking of going as new as possible. I am interested in hearing from those of you who own either truck about the pros and cons of them, as well as stir the preferences pot for trucks. I don't really have much interest in Ram trucks, so no real need to try and sell me on those. What say y'all?
Whethole
They all have their issues, one isn't necessarily more reliable than the other. After owning Duramax trucks for a decade I bought a 6.7 Ford, and don't regret it one bit. People complain about the CP4 injection pump on the Fords, but I've seen more 2020+ Duramax trucks with fuel system failures than Fords. Newer GM products definitely have more electrical issues.
They both have more power than you will need, but the Fords walk all over the Duramax trucks if that's something that matters to you.
They both have more power than you will need, but the Fords walk all over the Duramax trucks if that's something that matters to you.
Ford has reinvented the diesel several times since the old 7.3 (A wonderful engine) went away. The only reason I can think they would go from 7.3 to 6.0 to 6.4 to 6.7 is they are not seeing stellar results with their motor program.
GM has had the same basic engine for a long time. Which tells me they got it right.
Transmissions in Chevys (Allison) have a good reputation as well.
I am not a Ford hater (Last rig was a 7.3. Solid rig. Especially considering competing product in that time). I drive 40k a year. Vehicles are a tool to me. Like a tape measure. I want them to be reliable.
Diesels are not cheap to buy or operate. My next rig will likely be a gas engine.
Edit- FWIW, all new diesels have obscene amount of power. You can get into trouble towing if you only consider the pulling ability. Not that the OP suggests it's the plan. But it's worth noting that the tire patch on the road hasn't changed in a long tine. So just because an engineer in Detroit says it can PULL 30,000 pounds doesen't mean it will STOP real well going downhill on a steel grade when the trailer brakes are kinda sketchy.
GM has had the same basic engine for a long time. Which tells me they got it right.
Transmissions in Chevys (Allison) have a good reputation as well.
I am not a Ford hater (Last rig was a 7.3. Solid rig. Especially considering competing product in that time). I drive 40k a year. Vehicles are a tool to me. Like a tape measure. I want them to be reliable.
Diesels are not cheap to buy or operate. My next rig will likely be a gas engine.
Edit- FWIW, all new diesels have obscene amount of power. You can get into trouble towing if you only consider the pulling ability. Not that the OP suggests it's the plan. But it's worth noting that the tire patch on the road hasn't changed in a long tine. So just because an engineer in Detroit says it can PULL 30,000 pounds doesen't mean it will STOP real well going downhill on a steel grade when the trailer brakes are kinda sketchy.
They both make great trucks now. Really. My last two have been duramax with the Alison and I honestly couldn't be happier. My current is a 2016 Chevy 3500 and it's been flawless. Have not had one issue with both of the durmamax engines I've ran. My last one I ran to 190,000 miles and it was still flawlessly running when I sold it. My 2016 has 120k now and it's been flawless. And I tow a lot.
Happy customer with the durmax/Alison combo, I'd buy another in a heartbeat.
Mu little brother has a 2019 f350 (platinum) with 90k and he has not had a single issue with his as well. Love the look of his truck. But mine rides so much smoother. š
Happy customer with the durmax/Alison combo, I'd buy another in a heartbeat.
Mu little brother has a 2019 f350 (platinum) with 90k and he has not had a single issue with his as well. Love the look of his truck. But mine rides so much smoother. š
I talked to a new ford owner who said he dislikes the new aluminum frame on the ford's. He mentioned it gets a little tweeky when towing at times.
The ride is smoother in the GMCs, for sure. And as far as towing, that's not something I plan on pushing to the limit. I did read that the 2020 GMC has odd electrical issues, but Ford recently did a recall for the same things. I guess another thing to consider is, which company is more willing to admit they mucked up and will ACTUALLY do a recall. š¤£
The ride is smoother in the GMCs, for sure. And as far as towing, that's not something I plan on pushing to the limit. I did read that the 2020 GMC has odd electrical issues, but Ford recently did a recall for the same things. I guess another thing to consider is, which company is more willing to admit they mucked up and will ACTUALLY do a recall. š¤£
My personal bias from my experience, and friends who swore by their later model diesels right up until an $8,000 to $15,0000 repair bill came due, is buy either an older, simpler diesel, or a late model gasser. Any of the domestic 1/2 tons are plenty powerful to tow your 20' Thunderjet, and unless you are planning on some ginormous 5th wheel you don't need a 1000+ pound feet of torque.
I tow with a nearly bone stock 2006 GMC 3500 (LBZ engine, 6 speed Allison-designed transmission) and it is awesome for everything I do. It "only" has 650 pound feet of torque, but will easily hold 65 mph with my current 8500# boat up all the grades I hit towing back and forth to the coast. If you have your heart set on a diesel, I'd look for an old LBZ Duramax that hasn't been thrashed by some kid with a tuner, then invest a few grand in updating it, and take the $30-40k you save vs. a late model diesel, DEF fluid, and potentially nasty repair bills and invest it in boat fuel or your retirement savings.
The main attractions of a latter model truck to me are stouter brakes/better sway control, the lane-keeping and braking assist safety stuff, and more creature comforts. A used GM 3/4 or 1 ton with the 6.0 (or newer 6.6 gasser), or a Ford with their 6.2 gasser, have all those things and go for a lot less $$ than a diesel. If you end up towing a heavy 5th wheel a few times a year, they will do fine.
I tow with a nearly bone stock 2006 GMC 3500 (LBZ engine, 6 speed Allison-designed transmission) and it is awesome for everything I do. It "only" has 650 pound feet of torque, but will easily hold 65 mph with my current 8500# boat up all the grades I hit towing back and forth to the coast. If you have your heart set on a diesel, I'd look for an old LBZ Duramax that hasn't been thrashed by some kid with a tuner, then invest a few grand in updating it, and take the $30-40k you save vs. a late model diesel, DEF fluid, and potentially nasty repair bills and invest it in boat fuel or your retirement savings.
The main attractions of a latter model truck to me are stouter brakes/better sway control, the lane-keeping and braking assist safety stuff, and more creature comforts. A used GM 3/4 or 1 ton with the 6.0 (or newer 6.6 gasser), or a Ford with their 6.2 gasser, have all those things and go for a lot less $$ than a diesel. If you end up towing a heavy 5th wheel a few times a year, they will do fine.
Ford has been using the same basic motor since 2011. GM completely redesigned the Duramax in 2017. Both are good engines, but the Ford's been around quite a bit longer.
The 10 speed in the 2020+ Duramax trucks was developed and built by GM, it's only an Allison by name.
7.3s were simple, reliable engines, but by modern standards they are gutless. Big engines tend to be reliable when they don't make any power, just like the Ford 300 straight 6.
Fords don't have aluminum frames. There's nothing getting tweeky while towing.
If you aren't towing more than 12K on a regular basis, the gas motors are the smart choices. They make good power and the ten speeds make it a much better experience than the 4 and 6 speeds gave. They have issues too, but a whole engine is cheaper than a fuel system on a diesel. 1000ft lbs is way more fun, though.
All the comparisons in the world weren't going to change the fact that my grandpa had a ford and I always wanted one so when my time came that's what it was going to be. No regrets...you should get what you really want. FWIW I have sat in both and found the seats in my '23 F-350 to be a bit more comfortable and the dash layout is more to my liking than my neighbors newer HD Denali. Mine has the 8ft bed and the big fuel tank and I hear the thoughts on getting a gasser but having almost 800 miles of range is amazing.
Amazes me how an inline 6 powers the majority of semi trucks on the road and folks still gravitate to a V-8 conversion motor. Take any trip for the last 25 years on an interstate and watch which vehicles are pulling long distance heavy loads.
Pre DEF. Donāt mess with that stuff.
Might want To Google reliability issues and see just how serious they are. Some may leave you stranded, others may simply annoy you. Sources like Consumer Reports treat a broken connecting rod as seriously as an interior light burning out. Their reliability ratings donāt mean much if anything. Flip a coinā¦..
Might want To Google reliability issues and see just how serious they are. Some may leave you stranded, others may simply annoy you. Sources like Consumer Reports treat a broken connecting rod as seriously as an interior light burning out. Their reliability ratings donāt mean much if anything. Flip a coinā¦..
You don't say if you are thinking new or not. Personally, I don't want a newer truck if well equipped because they are far too complicated for what I want to do.
There are common issues with the diesels of the past 10 years because they have common parts and similar designs. The exception is the Cummins that has it's own unique intake issue that Banks has a fix for. Generally speaking, GMs ride better and haul less.
For occasional towing, a large gasoline model might be a better choice though as both Ford and Chevy have new larger gasoline engines. Obviously, they are easier to work on at more shops and work better for occasional use and in town. Diesels are generally at their worst for short trips. Other than extreme range or high altitude at high speed with a load, gasoline works better with a much cheaper cost to buy and more fuel availability at lower cost.
Fwiw, I have a Ford F450 6.4 diesel with 4.30 gears.
There are common issues with the diesels of the past 10 years because they have common parts and similar designs. The exception is the Cummins that has it's own unique intake issue that Banks has a fix for. Generally speaking, GMs ride better and haul less.
For occasional towing, a large gasoline model might be a better choice though as both Ford and Chevy have new larger gasoline engines. Obviously, they are easier to work on at more shops and work better for occasional use and in town. Diesels are generally at their worst for short trips. Other than extreme range or high altitude at high speed with a load, gasoline works better with a much cheaper cost to buy and more fuel availability at lower cost.
Fwiw, I have a Ford F450 6.4 diesel with 4.30 gears.
I see more and more heavy civil contractors driving one ton gassers nowadays. That's a major, major, major indicator for me if buying new.
But I'm biased, I'd rather spend $1000/yr replacing 20 year old water pumps on my LBZ than $3000 and 4 weeks for the mechanic to figure out that the magnet in the gym membership card on the Keychain is interfering with the vehicle starting. True story.
But I'm biased, I'd rather spend $1000/yr replacing 20 year old water pumps on my LBZ than $3000 and 4 weeks for the mechanic to figure out that the magnet in the gym membership card on the Keychain is interfering with the vehicle starting. True story.
The Platform with the least amount of $ issues is the way to go. GM had it right during the era of the 6 leaker.
That was until I learned how much it cost to replace a set of heads on a 2000 Duramax. 6000 K just for the heads if I remember what a buddy told me.
Platform is considered the Engine, Transmission and Axles with the best styling.
That was until I learned how much it cost to replace a set of heads on a 2000 Duramax. 6000 K just for the heads if I remember what a buddy told me.
Platform is considered the Engine, Transmission and Axles with the best styling.
my currant dodge 5.9 has 401,000 on it running great transmission is starting get pressure fluctuations at low speed probable needs the 2004 transmission rebuilt again soon or put the one out of my 2007 engine and trans with computer they all get old and tired eventually
Dave's Auto Center is a famous engine builder and rebuilder down in Utah. They cover this at length. The Powerstroke and the Duramax have shared issues because of shared parts, especially the CP4 fuel pump. I've owned Chrysler products, so you can't fool me. I know that they are ALL to be run away from with loud, terrible screaming.
Had a 2011 Chev 2500HD with Duramax and no engine/drivetrain issues. Was told I'd need a new $6k-$8k turbo soon so traded it in. Just got a 2024 Chev 3500HD with Duramax. Power to spare, quiet and doesn't seem to use near the DEF the '011 did. Everything is electrical which I assume will fail at some point. Have heard the stories of the alum vs cast iron or steel fuel pumps failing at 100k. Just installed a winch/bumper on the front and had to basically removed the entire front end which is all plastic. Seemed every piece had a sensor or electrical plug. Inside comfort is great. Even though the mirrors seem huge they just don't provide alot of viewing. Has all the outside cameras for every view so backing up is nice when camera eye is clean. Has the 10 speed tranny and at slow speeds it shifts alot. Has the big touch screen display which I'm still figuring out. I'm a Chevy guy but think either Ford or Chevy is fine.
I purchased a slightly used 2019 F350 DUALLY (had 9000 miles on it) a couple years back after searching for a while. It's loaded and super comfortable. The best part though is how it tows.
Having 4 rear wheels makes it super stable. Factory engine brake and tow haul mode. Been very happy with it. I'm just over 40 k miles at present.
Having 4 rear wheels makes it super stable. Factory engine brake and tow haul mode. Been very happy with it. I'm just over 40 k miles at present.
No matter what anyone says, the new trucks from all of the big 3 have about a shared amount of issues, which is really very few considering the number of these trucks being built. I admit I am a ford guy, but I work on and maintain them all in my line of work, and I can't put any one above the others as far as reliability, they are all pretty good. I have had a 2014, a 2016, and now a 2024 6.7 powerstroke, and all 3 of them have been flawless. The 2014 needed a 99 cent plastic tread replaced on one of the side steps, the 2016 once blew a 15 amp fuse (it has 250,000 miles) and the 2024 so far has been flawless. Pick the one that makes you smile when you drive it and tune out the noise anybody has to say about it.
And I can assure you many of the modern inline 6 class 8 engines are far less reliable than any light duty diesel. I've had HALF of my fleet unable to move down the road under their own power at one time. Trucks that are a year or two old, some with less than 100k. I won't get into camshaft failures. They could put a radial engine in the trucks for all I care, I just want them to run.
Oh, and none of the V8 diesels are any kind of "conversion motor." They are built from the ground up as diesel engines. This isnāt the 1970s.
Yeah, you couldn't pay me to drive a Stellantis/FCA product as my personal vehicle. There's an illusion that having a straight 6 with a C on the fender makes it the best thing since sliced bread. It was worth it 30 years ago when the competition was a 6.5L GM/Detroit product. Cummins 6.7s are no more reliable than GM or Fords offerings, and they sure wonāt outrun them, especially the Fords. How many videos does Dave have of Cummins engines with holes in the pistons?
I have a 2019 GMC. Had a 2004 Chevy. Extra maintenance cost? Sure, oil change is $40 more for extra oil. But other than that, I see little difference from my cars. And $50 every 8000 miles, is not a lot on a $60-90k vehicle. Neighborās girlfriend had a maseratI. $250 for oil change service.
The variable pressure oil pump and delaminating camshafts on the Godzillas sound almost as bad as disintegrating CP4 pumps in late model diesels.
The old Ford 6.2 gasser makes a lot less power, but is one of the most durable HD gas engines ever made.
The old Ford 6.2 gasser makes a lot less power, but is one of the most durable HD gas engines ever made.
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