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I see on the news this morning,... "This year's salmon run on the Columbia is so good the natives are returning to the use of gill nets". Showing boats with LARGE nets coming in to shore.
Then they show footage of people buying whole fresh salmon from an indian guy, and discuss the return to "tribal traditions", and how its a great way to earn a little "extra" cash.
Hmmm. I wonder if selling salmon to whites and asians is in their tribal history too?
Sheesh!
Jamie
 

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Originally posted by lingslayer:
Hmmm. I wonder if selling salmon to whites and asians is in their tribal history too?
Sheesh!
Jamie
<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">Sure they did. Regardless, there's not many other indians around currently so ya gotta sell to who's buying.

Not saying it's right, just helping ya with the facts a bit.
 

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I deleted the obnoxious posts. Please refrain from typing racist comments.

[ 07-16-2003, 06:16 PM: Message edited by: STGRule ]
 

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That's the answer! There are turkey farms, cattle farms, etc. Let the native Americans open up a salmon farm, and call it Celilo Hatchery. Their fish will come right into their fish ladders and pens. The native Americans can keep all the fish that come into their pens, no questions. They won't need to gill net any more. Why gill net when you have a whole run come right to you? This would be similar to the old Ore-Aqua facility in Newport, but put one on a tributary of the Columbia nearest the old tribal fishing grounds, wherever you could get a good tributary flow.

There could be a certain fin-clip, that if caught by non-Native sportsman, would have to be released unharmed, just like non-finclipped fish. No one would get mad at the native Americans, and the native Americans would not get mad at all the others. Non-native fin-clipped salmon would also have to be released back into the Columbia.

This should supply all the needs of both worlds.

This would work fine!

SKP
 

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Geek,
Not the traditions that they have fought so hard to "protect". Selling came much later to the CR tribes.

And as for your turkey analogy lets just say its a Turkey of an analogy.


Jim

[ 07-15-2003, 02:45 PM: Message edited by: Pete ]
 

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Just a little warning, this topic seems to generate trouble each time it comes up.

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Whether commercial or tribal makes not a wit's worth of difference to me.

Here's my opinion. Unless a net is on the end of a pole, it doesn't belong in the Columbia River, or any of her tributaries, Period!

Dams, habitat, toxic chemicals from our lawns and orchards and agribusiness don't do the damage that nets do. IMHO..... Tim
 

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So geek tell me where you get your facts that the indians sold fish to the whites in their traditional tribal days. Hopefully this isn't too "offensive" that you have to erase it.
 

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Tim,

do you really think dams are easier on fish populations than nets?? You cannot be saying that with a straight face. Show me one figure that backs up the nets kill more Columbia fish than the dams.

Ya'll wanna hate the nets? Fine. But don't let emotion type for you.

Mark and the dog.
 

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Don't want to get contentious here but if you really want to know the whole story read the Treaty of 1855 sometime. "We" do not set the rules for who harvests the fish. According to the treaty, we were given the right to half of the fish, not the other way around. Of course we have been known to break treaties. One thing is for sure if it came to a court fight we would lose, big time. Let's count ourselves lucky that the Native Americans have enough fish to harvest commercially because that means there are plenty to harvest downriver also.

Most of the fish enhancement came as result of pressure from the tribes to get fish back up the river. And some would kill the golden goose. :shrug:
 

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Mark (and the dog),

Dams are a fact. Bonneville, The Dalles, John Day, and McNary are NOT going away in our life-time.

The current threat is NETS! Do you disagree? I'm not trying to pick a fight here, just stating my opinon that nets scour the river with more collateral damage to all species, without regard to who puts them there, it's just wrong.....

Again, IMHO, and respectfully..... Tim :smile:
 

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Yes, lets say that you are only able to procreate in your bedroom, but your in front of the big screen watching ESPN. You aren't feeling well because there were some toxins in your dinner, but hey your still up for it! You stand up and jump over the couch. You caught your foot and fell back down, but give it another shot and make it this time. Your spouse put a net in the living room because he / she was mad at you for watching ESPN. It is not covering the whole living room, so you get lucky and are able to walk around it. A soliciter rings the doorbell and has you reeled in, but realizing that you are a native of your own house, they let you off the hook. Then as you turn down the hallway you see it! A SOLID CONCRETE WALL! with no "man ladder" end of game, maybe Sports center is still on.
:grin: RIPPLE :grin:
 

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Ripple..... that was the most obscure, puzzling analogy I've ever heard.

Did it have a point? I've never claimed to be the most acute thinker, but jeez.

Could you make your point in a way my rather feeble mind can understand??

Tim.... :smile:
 

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Originally posted by llabwolg:
So geek tell me where you get your facts that the indians sold fish to the whites in their traditional tribal days.
<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">Thanks for asking, llabwolg. It is fully documented in most any thorough book about the Lewis and Clark expedition (very timely, as it's the 200th anniversary of said travels) that the indians all along the Columbia River traded in dried salmon (among other things) to the explorers, to other indian tribes, and to French trappers. Curiously enough the Lewis and Clark expedition preferred dog meat to salmon, but I doubt that herding dogs for meat would be of any value in the 21st century.

Previous explorers that came into the mouth of the Columbia documented similar behavior (Captain Cook, for instance); however, I don't have specific sources handy so you'll just have to trust me there.

As my wife just went through several college courses relating to the Lewis and Clark expedition I would be happy to provide you specific sources if you need them. If you'd like to do some reading on your own, check this interesting website out.
 

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treaty shmeaty! If the treaty is so binding and they are in fact a sovern nation then let them get a passport to leave the reservation, and have to get U.S. citizenship to move off permanently. I am just as native to this land as any Indian born in the last 30 years, as are most of us.
 

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The Boldt decision was given to us by the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals based in San Francisco. This the same judicial body that last year declared the Pledge of Allegiance unconstitutional. The California judicial arena has also produced other jems like the OJ Simpson innocent verdict. It is definately the place to go for rational/logical law!!!!
 

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I saw the news footage this morning with the tourist gleefully displaying his "prize". If you get a chance look again...white mouth...it was a steelhead and most likely a native steelhead.

Look at the Bonneville counts. Without looking something like 3/1 steelhead, and from what I've seen heard up there, a VERY high percentage of natives right now.

I don't deny the natives the right to harvest, I just can't understand how we obsess about proper release techniques and whether or not to click a photo, while they gill net natives (the natives that is) with impunity and the subject is not even touched.

They want to collect some of the windfall hatchery fish and sell them along the highway...no complaint from me, just dip net them out of the ladders and release the natives. How could this idea not be worth pushing forward?!?
 
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