Cosmo, you're not missing a thing. A 7-08 is a .308-class cartridge and the .270 is a .30-06 class cartridge. You can't ignore ballistic facts. That's not to denigrate the 7-08. I bought one for my daughter.

 

You probably aren't missing anything, but when you put away the reloading manuals/ballistic charts or step away from the computer screen and actually go hunt, the 7MM-08 just works.

One thing for me - I just like the overall balance better of any short action rifle versus a long. I know its not much different but IMHO its more better for my hunting.

 

You probably aren't missing anything, but when you put away the reloading manuals/ballistic charts or step away from the computer screen and actually go hunt, the 7MM-08 just works.

One thing for me - I just like the overall balance better of any short action rifle versus a long. I know its not much different but IMHO its more better for my hunting.

You aren't suggesting the 270 doesn't work are you? Please tell me you aren't saying that.

 

What am I missing?

Nothing.

But the Chipster shoots a 6.5 SAUM, not a .270. :wink:

 

Recoil chart shows a .270 shooting 140 gr. @ 3,000 fps has recoil energy of 17.1 and a 7mm-08 shooting 140 gr. @ 2860 fps has recoil energy of 12.6. Both with 8 lbs. rifles.

Certainly the .270 can pump out a little better ballistics but the recoil will go up substantially. Not a big deal if you don't care about recoil but the 7-08 is a great choice if you want to keep recoil down and still delivers good ballistics.


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Recoil chart shows a .270 shooting 140 gr. @ 3,000 fps has recoil energy of 17.1 and a 7mm-08 shooting 140 gr. @ 2860 fps has recoil energy of 12.6. Both with 8 lbs. rifles.


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Download the 270 a few grains to 2850fps and it would be a good bit closer.

 

The 7-08 is to the 270 and 280 what the 308 is to the 30-06. It does 90 percent of what the long action version does but in a shorter more efficient case. The only time the 7-08 will really beat a 270 is when you're trying to get the lightest possible rifle you can and can save a couple of ounces going with a short action, and Tikka's don't count in that category as they're all long action rifles.

If you're wanting equal or better performance than you're 270 in a short action you should look at the 270 wsm or the 284 whinchester. The 7-08 is very capable but no more so than a 270 or 280. It's a nice capable low recoil round, that's it's niche and why it is so popular.

 

The 7x57 came first (Pre 1900)

The 270 came later (1920s), and was 100% influenced by the 7x57. Since the 30-06 had already been invented, and actions were long enough to house it, Winchester figured it would be smart to screw in a barrel that was smaller in bore diameter and based on the same case.

Winchester was right. The 270 was and is the king of modern deer rifles.

Remington, being another 800 pound gorilla in the gun room, had hurt feelings over the success of the 270. They tried the 280, but soft loaded it because they introduced it in autoloaders. Until the 80's, it was a bust as well. Remington renamed it a couple times (280, 7mm06, 7mm rem express) To this day, factory ammo is loaded under the potential velocity because of the soft pressure restriction the brain trust at Remington hung on it.

Then, they got real smart, and introduced the 6.5 Remington magnum. It was a total flop. It was a short action in an ugly rifle. It was (Still is) a bore size that the American public never liked. Rumor is, the higher ups at Remington who gave this the thumbs up are still in Gitmo today. They deserve it.

In the early 1960s, they introduced the 7mag. Despite the fact that Remington was involved in it's development, it was a huge hit. The 7mag deserves most of it's popularity. I still wonder why they didn't introduce it in the 277 bullet size. Would have been a stake in the heart of the 270. Instead, Remington went to the 284 slug, and it's higher sectional densities with their benefits. Until that cartridge was introduced, the US market had never really embraced the 7mm bullet.

Then they tried the 7mm08. It spun it's wheels for a long time. It made some popularity in competition shooting circles. But was a less than stellar performer sales wise for a long time.

People who are educated past day 1 hour 1 in the gun world understand the 7-08 is simply a gimmick. Some people who love the 7mm08 are buying rifles that are in long action only(Long enough to house a 270/280/30-06). They carry the extra metal around, and see zero benefit from it.

If a guy already has a 270, there is no reason to buy a 7mm08.

Oh, and for the record, I bought my first 7mm08 in about 1990. Sold it a few years later.

The last rifle I bought was a 270. Dad ended up taking it home and refuses to give it back. I will go out and buy another 270.

The only people in the world who can justify a 7mm08 are folks who collect guns, and simply want one of each chambering. Right after the 7-30 Waters, 7mmBR and the super useful 7x50bmg. Past that, it's simply an attempt to line the pockets of Remington because they missed out on too many good opportunities.

Will someone pass the popcorn? And please wear suspenders. I don't wanna see any pink panties/plumber butt.

 

The 7x57 came first (Pre 1900)

The only people in the world who can justify a 7mm08 are folks who collect guns, and simply want one of each chambering. Right after the 7-30 Waters, 7mmBR and the super useful 7x50bmg. Past that, it's simply an attempt to line the pockets of Remington because they missed out on too many good opportunities.

Will someone pass the popcorn? And please wear suspenders. I don't wanna see any pink panties/plumber butt.

HaHa I love this, instigate and then tell people not react = tightly spinning herring.

Several posters have already justified a few reason's someone would want a 7mm08. My wife has killed several Alaskan Moose with hers. I bought it for her because it is shorter, lighter and the recoil is almost non existent when stacked side by side with the 270. Oh and the deal I got was one of those that you don't say no too. I count that as 4 solid reasons for the purchase.

 

My guess is Chip Kelly would shoot a 270, Helfrich an 08.

Urban Meyer would shoot a 308.

 

The "short cartridge in a long action" argument cracks me up. As if it matters in the field.




P

 

Nor does recoil for the most part.

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Chip kelly would shoot blanks. All kinds of noise and makes a helluva ruckus, but no result.

 

I Love the 270 but!
7/08 is a short action (lighter, albeit a few ounces)
Less Powder -Cheaper to shoot- we shoot a lot.
Less Recoil- Easier to stay on target.
And I will go way out on a limb here but I believe it to be true that because it doesn't have super velocities it doesn't Jelly critters nearly as often. I subscribe to the 1800/1000 rule of thumb (velocity,energy) as my maximum range, my trusty 7/08 is good to 600.
I know a lot of guys like to compare ballistics and wind numbers but if you aren't proficient at calling wind your in trouble regardless.

 

Well played. Makes sense.


I knew I should have thrown some of these and these :meme: and these :flag2: in the original post to lighten the mood.

 

It's fun to discuss, but poke a critter in the ribs with either and you'll notch your tag.

In other words, there's no significant difference in the field. I don't like recoil and I don't shoot past 400 yards (and I expect 95%+ of us don't) so the 7mm-08 is my huckleberry.

Plus, I prefer using 47.5 grains of powder to 60 grains.

If a 7mm-08 won't kill it, a .30-06 won't either.




P

 

Short cartridge in long action only makes sense when bullets you want to use need to be seated beyond the bottom of the case neck. About the only "modern" cartridges that won't benefit from a long action is the .250 and .300 Savage or cartridges with a similarly short case.

 

A 270 appears to be what an 08 would be if it was endowed with a bigger action.
More expensive ammo, less from it?
What am I missing?

Not a darned thing.

You probably aren't missing anything, but when you put away the reloading manuals/ballistic charts or step away from the computer screen and actually go hunt, the 7MM-08 just works.

As does the .270.
As a matter of fact, a number of people pointed out the .270 "just works" 50 years before the 7mm-08 came along as a SAAMI cartridge.

I resisted the .270 influence for a long time. I got sick of Col. Askins and Jack O'Connor.
Then I bought one a took it hunting. And I've been laughing at the comparos ever since.
It's like the 30-06, if they didn't "just work," no one would compare every other cartridge in the(ir) class to them.

 

Is the 7-08 the Subaru Outback of the rifle world? Sure, it can get the job done under the right circumstances, it's very friendly to women and kids, cheaper to operate than some other alternatives but in the end, it's nothing a 'real man' would ever really ever want to admit having as their primary weapon/auto?

 

BAM...and there you have it. A cartridge with front wheel drive. :dance:

Can't believe I can't get more bites on the duck references.

 

.270 fan boy here. If I could only have one, it would be a .270. Load it with 130 Partitions and you're good to go in North America, except for big bears (go with the 160 Partition then). I've shot jackrabbits to moose with mine (but never an elk, dad gave me his '06). I don't even load mine past the middle of the chart, and if I do my part, it's usually a "bang, flop" tool.

However, when my kid was starting out I got a great deal on a 7x57 barreled action. Which is pretty much a 7-08. What I've noticed is that it has a great selection of bullets (I suspect a 140 grain Partition would do everything the 130 does in the .270), and it too is easy on the shoulder. Had I bought new, I most likely would have gone with a .257 Roberts or a .260 Remington (which has faded away more or less), of maybe the 7-08. She shot one deer with it, and yep, it just works.

What I don't understand is why the 270 WSM is popular, and the 7mm WSM has vanished. Of the short mags, the 7mm is pretty spectacular from just about every aspect.

Bottom line is most shooters shoot low recoiling rifles better. Better shooting, better shot placement. Not much survives for long with a hole in both lungs or the heart. But I think Pharmy gets a kickback for every 7-08 sold.

 

If your all going to step down from .30 cal then why not shoot something sporting like the .243 or 5.56 short actions, using less powder and way reduced recoil and great accuracy? My old .243 just killed deer like now.

The main reason the .30 caliber is so popular is all the bullet and powder choices for any hunting purpose from gophers to moose. The 7mm 08 is a gimmick, especially if you're not shooting out over 400 yards at game animals, pharm. For elk, moose and bears I shoot my .300 mag with 200 grain bullets on distance hunts and for short range hunts my short barrel .308 with 180 grain bullets.

The only problem I have with the .270 is muzzle blast and to much recoil when I see guys on the range banging away.

 

If you need to worry about a few ounces of weight savings from a short action, eat a salad..

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Most normal adults should be able to tolerate .270 recoil with a little thoughtful practice, i.e., not all hunched forward over the rifle from a shooting bench. Just saying.

 

That .270 WSM I bought from you a few years ago has accounted for the last 5 elk and a couple of deer in my family. Everyone loves it. The only other killer we have is a model 70 .270 that gets the job done as well.

 

I have not had time to read all of the posts on this thread but will do so when I get a chance. I don't see myself becoming a fanatic for the 7mm-08. But having said that I plan on buying one in the next couple of years. I am only interested in 1 bullet. According to the reloading manuals the 120g Nosler BT will have a muzzle velocity just over 3k fps (and I have been told that it will do that even in a 20" barrel). If I can get that kind of performance I will use it exclusively for Blacktails. I have some hunting spots that require me to backpack into. A lightweight 7mm-08 shooting shooting at those velocities tipped with a 2x7 32mm scope is all I would need for Blacktail (or so I think).

 

I have not had time to read all of the posts on this thread but will do so when I get a chance. I don't see myself becoming a fanatic for the 7mm-08. But having said that I plan on buying one in the next couple of years. I am only interested in 1 bullet. According to the reloading manuals the 120g Nosler BT will have a muzzle velocity just over 3k fps (and I have been told that it will do that even in a 20" barrel). If I can get that kind of performance I will use it exclusively for Blacktails. I have some hunting spots that require me to backpack into. A lightweight 7mm-08 shooting shooting at those velocities tipped with a 2x7 32mm scope is all I would need for Blacktail (or so I think).

i'm thinking along the same lines, I have a 270, it shoots really well, and kills deer and bear just fine, but I would like a little light 7-08 to shoot 120gr bullets at coyotes and lions. I am liking the specs of the new stainless lightweight hunter from savage, 5.85lbs, 20" barrel

 

I can really only explain my own thought process, and why I chose the 7mm/08.

In 2000, I decided I wanted a new rifle. I already had a .30/06, but didn't like the recoil (I am, in fact, a wuss about recoil. I own up to it.) I also figured that I was willing to schlep around a couple of extra pounds in order to gain a little better accuracy (and to reduce recoil even further). Finally, this was about the time we started hunting Wyoming for antelope, and the ability to split hairs at a zillion yards seemed important.

Savage rifles have always had reputations as, if nothing else, accurate. Savage manufactured, at that time, a rifle called the model 10 FP (110 FP in long-action cartridges). It had a bunch of cool-sounding features that aren't terribly important in a hunting rifle (recessed crown, an additional stud for a bipod AND a sling, some special wonderful bedding that I can't remember, etc.), but which sounded awesome to me. I decided that it was the rifle I wanted.

I then looked at the available chamberings--it came in .223, .243, .260, 7mm/08, and .308. The .223 was too small for a dedicated deer/antelope rifle. .308 offered no real difference over my .30/06. I begrudgingly ruled out the .243, thinking that I might someday try to use the gun for elk (hasn't happened yet). This left the .260 and the 7mm/08. At the time, the .260 was a brand-new cartridge, and had a great reputation. The 7mm/08 had already established a reputation as a great target shooter, and as having mild recoil.

I looked at reloading data for the two. The 7mm/08 offered a HUGE variety of bullet weights and designs, mainly due to the popularity of the 7mm Rem. Mag. What I saw with the bullets intrigued me. Loaded with a 160-ish grain boattail, the 7mm/08 actually offered very slight advantages over the .308. Loaded with 120 grain boattails, the 7mm/08 gave almost identical performance as a .270 shooting 130 grainers. The 140/150 range bullets gave more-than adequate, though unspectacular performance.

So I bought a Savage Model 10 FP in 7mm/08 for $361.00 new in the box, and aside from shortening the length of trigger pull a little bit, have left it pretty much stock. In my mind, what I got was a rifle that would do anything a .270 would do, with a broader range of available bullet choices, in the platform I wanted.

For whatever reason, I shoot this rifle better and more accurately than I shoot other rifles. I'm sure a lot of it is psychological, but I think a lot of it's mechanical too. It's that one rifle in my safe that, if I had to make a shot to save my life or the life of a loved one, I'd reach for every time. Have I missed animals with it? Sure... but always for reasons I could identify. Has it ever required a follow-up shot to kill an animal? Yes, twice, when I hit them squarely through the spine but totally missed vitals. I've done the same with a .30/'06.

I have a .270, and the aforementioned .30/06 in the safe too. But most of the time the 7 is what I reach for. It has no magical properties, but it's exactly what I wanted it to be.

 

I've literally seen C-Lice drive nails with a .270 after I loaded him up some new ammo (multiple holes touching, just making the hole bigger), YET he brings the "15lb warhammer" to camp every year. I say we all shoot best with what we're most comfortable with. My last 4 kills with my .270 have all been one shot, no movement, animals didn't take a step, including a 426 yard antelope shot. I saw C-lice make a 1 shot kill @ 275 yard mule deer kill this year freehand with the 7mm-08. I probably wouldn't be comfortable making that shot with his rifle but I would with my .270. Basically if you shoot like **** you won't hit anything, if your comfortable with whatever round/rifle you use you'll be just fine.

o/

Good hunting

 

I don't even know why you're comparing them. I'd lump 7mm-08 in with a .243, and a .270 in with a 30.-06.


I have a 7mm Rem Mag for an elk/deer gun, but am looking for either a Ruger or Savage in .243 or 7mm-08 for deer. Small, a lot more of a pleasure to shoot. And Cheaper. Well, the .243 is at least...

 

Unless you are a recoil wimp, a .270 beats 7mm/08 in every category.

 

Two things:

I'm a recoil wimp

On paper you're right. In practice a properly placed bullet from either is lethal at distances most hunters are lethal.



P

 

I like the 7X57, the 270, and the 7mm-08. . . . . . and a bunch of others.

I put together a 7x57 Winchester M70 featherweight as a gift for my wife. I wanted her to have a classic, a '57 Chevy if you will. Manageable recoil with capable terminal ability at moderate distances. Velocity works great with traditional cup and core bullets as well. All this in a just under 8 lb rifle.

I have a 270 Winchester M70 sporter for myself. This is a hot rod, a '67 Shelby Mustang. I love this gun both at the range and in the field. Recoil is increased when compared to the 7x57 but so is effective distance. . . . because of the speed. That is the 'rumble from the tailpipes'. This rifle weighs just over 8 lbs.

When I go mountain hunting for sheep or elk or other creatures that may live in rugged country I don't prefer either of those guns. Long days and many miles makes a lightweight rifle appealing. Not to mention I do not care to abuse a nice wood/blued rifle if I can help it. But I also do not care for the 'sharp' recoil of a 270 in a 6-6.5 lb rifle. Much different than in an 8 lb one. And it is near impossible to find a 7x57 in a synthetic/stainless, lightweight rifle.

That is where the 7mm-08 shines: REDUCED RECOIL with reliable terminal results in a lightweight rifle. Thus it is more tolerable to shoot, become more accurate with, and have more confidence in. This reduced recoil with reliable terminal effects (compared to 270 or others in class) in standard weight rifles is why it has become popular for ladies and youth. That 'bang for your buck' filters down to men and lightweight rifles as well. Well, at least to ones who do not believe you need a bazooka to kill an ungulate.

So some might say the 7mm-08 is like a '77 Corolla. Sure, it is not a classic and it is not a hot rod. But it doesn't have to be a gimmick either. It might be considered niche to some or even utilitarian to others . . . . . but it does have lower recoil than the 270/7mms. To some people and for some applications that matters. Just like the Corolla that does its job and gets me to the grocery store and back. Maybe not in style but surely reliably and comfortably. I may not look 'cool' to the hip crowd, but I am eating steak at night.

When it comes to rifles and calibers . . . . . to each his own.

And when it comes to talking sense with duck haters . . . . . their smack belies their jealousy and misery

 

I got a 7mm-08 when I was 12, I just never stopped using it because you know what? It works, so why fix it?

Being able to "take the recoil" is not even a factor for me when I consider the low recoil and my preference for it. It's not about my shoulder being slapped it's about the fact when I fire my 7mm-08 my scope wont leave the animal and I can watch the impact.

My 7mm-08 will kill big deer and big elk and has done it at over 400 yards. Long range, short range, it's an effective round. I've owned larger rounds, I've owned faster rounds. But in the end I was the most comfortable with the 7mm-08 and it's always done what I asked of it, so I stick with it.

Of course with the whole .270 vs 7mm-08 debate, I may as well ask: "Should I buy a ford or a chevy!" Someone will break out raw numbers and tell me which one is better. It's Chevrolet by the way and I refuse to hear anything bad about my bowtied beauty! Lalalalalalala can't hear you!

 

Factory or handloads? If handloads, can you share the recipe?



P

 

I am picking up a savage model 11 lightweight 7mm-08 with the walnut stock...Saturday!!!