Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma? - www.ifish.net

Go Back   www.ifish.net > Ifish Fishing and Hunting > Life in General

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 02-11-2015, 06:05 AM   #1
El-Kabong
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Out on the edge of an empty highway, Howling at the blood on the moon
Posts: 5,775
Default Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

find out here

https://openpaymentsdata.cms.gov

and some background via John Oliver here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YQZ2UeOTO3I

information is freedom

__________________
Team Savage
Team Gregor
Team Rye Whiskey
Team Backcountry Hunters and Anglers
El-Kabong is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 02-11-2015, 06:13 AM   #2
Bill Rogue V.
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Alamogordo, New Mexico
Posts: 15,097
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

No, mine is not.
__________________
The language of God is science.
Bill Rogue V. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 06:23 AM   #3
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Hey, to be fair, we make so dang much money we gotta pay somebody.




P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Old 02-11-2015, 06:43 AM   #4
crabbait
King Salmon
 
crabbait's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Jose, Costa Rica
Posts: 36,733
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Yeah, what were those numbers again? Was it $4,000,000,000 for advertising to the public and $24,000,000,000 in doctor's bribes...I mean advertising?

When Christ said, "heal the sick" I don't think this is what he had in mind...

The Oliver piece is excellent:
__________________
The government you elect is the government you deserve. - Thomas Jefferson

Last edited by crabbait; 02-11-2015 at 06:48 AM.
crabbait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 06:49 AM   #5
lamb3947
Chromer
 
lamb3947's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 857
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Mine - $560.
40 transactions, mostly $10-$11 each.
lamb3947 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 06:49 AM   #6
rob allen
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Vancouver, WA
Posts: 6,494
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

the only problem with the drug industry is that they spend all their time creating products that alleviate symptoms rather than products that cure diseases..

Look on the bright side though. with all the drugs they are pumping out that kill or injure people that they keep those as seen on TV layers in business..
__________________
tired of fighting.
rob allen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:13 AM   #7
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lamb3947 View Post
Mine - $560.
40 transactions, mostly $10-$11 each.

Looks like they're reporting the value of lunch paid for by a rep during an appointment as income.

I have decided to join all y'all in condemning Big Pharma. I just called my boss and resigned.

Power to the People! We shall overcome! No blood for oil! Make love, not war!



P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:23 AM   #8
DoryDrifter
Tuna!
 
DoryDrifter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Woods
Posts: 1,208
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

I wonder how many full time government employees we've hired for this very important role! Great information for me to know that my doctor is guilty of taking a $13.85 lunch to learn more about a particular drug that may be helpful in treating her patients. Way to go Government. Thanks for watching out for us!
DoryDrifter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:26 AM   #9
Stick'em
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 12,777
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

If the doctor makes me feel better, frankly I don't give a damn.
Stick'em is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:29 AM   #10
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoryDrifter View Post
I wonder how many full time government employees we've hired for this very important role! Great information for me to know that my doctor is guilty of taking a $13.85 lunch to learn more about a particular drug that may be helpful in treating her patients. Way to go Government. Thanks for watching out for us!

DoryDrifter,
The time for facts is over. I have come to realize the error of my ways. Come join me, it's so uplifting to throw off the bonds of logic and reason and just condemn.

Let not your soul be troubled, brother. Embrace the hatred and be free.

Power to the People! We shall overcome! No blood for oil!



P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:32 AM   #11
lost_sailor
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Willamette
Posts: 6,569
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmseller View Post
DoryDrifter,
The time for facts is over. I have come to realize the error of my ways. Come join me, it's so uplifting to throw off the bonds of logic and reason and just condemn.

Let not your soul be troubled, brother. Embrace the hatred and be free.

Power to the People! We shall overcome! No blood for oil!
I'm in! I just threw all of my medication in the toilet! USA! USA! USA!
lost_sailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:37 AM   #12
crabbait
King Salmon
 
crabbait's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Jose, Costa Rica
Posts: 36,733
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Some reps were delivering lunch to doctors and staff every day. Why should they be allowed to bribe doctors and their staffs?

Big Pharma is also privy to every prescription the doctors write. Why should they have the privilege of that access when they use it to intimidate doctors?
__________________
The government you elect is the government you deserve. - Thomas Jefferson
crabbait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:40 AM   #13
crabbait
King Salmon
 
crabbait's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Jose, Costa Rica
Posts: 36,733
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoryDrifter View Post
I wonder how many full time government employees we've hired for this very important role! Great information for me to know that my doctor is guilty of taking a $13.85 lunch to learn more about a particular drug that may be helpful in treating her patients. Way to go Government. Thanks for watching out for us!
As a federal employee I was banned from taking gifts as part of my employment. It might give the appearance of impropriety if I were to let someone who might benefit from my assistance buy me lunch. Why is it different when drug pushers try to buy doctors?
__________________
The government you elect is the government you deserve. - Thomas Jefferson
crabbait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:43 AM   #14
Lucky Guy
Sturgeon
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Central Oregon
Posts: 4,978
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmseller View Post
Hey, to be fair, we make so dang much money we gotta pay somebody.

P
You have that backwards, first you pay the docs then you make the big money.

This was called payola (greed) back in am radio days and people went to jail for it (greed). Ahh, for the good old days ...

This from Huffington kind of sums it up.

In addition to the $24,000,000,000 (that's billion) in payola to the docs (greed),

"the same [11 pharma] companies paid their chief executive officers a combined $1.57 billion in that period (greed). Not bad work if you can get it. They achieved this thanks in part to their [greed and] systematic exploitation of Medicare and an epidemic of illegal marketing activity."

If it's so good and you're god's gift to humanity, why does your product have to be sold using deceptive tactics and secret payments to doctors who presumably wouldn't use your stuff if you didn't pay them? Otherwise why would you pay them right?

Want to start a spirited conversation with a pharma type, say "compulsory licensing", then sit back and enjoy the ducking, dodging and weaving that would make a middleweight proud.

It really is this simple - enact compulsory licensing as part of the patenting process for pharmaceuticals, then let the free market go to work.

How about that Pharm, how about a free market in the drug industry and no payola to docs?
Lucky Guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:47 AM   #15
DoryDrifter
Tuna!
 
DoryDrifter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Woods
Posts: 1,208
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmseller View Post
DoryDrifter,
The time for facts is over. I have come to realize the error of my ways. Come join me, it's so uplifting to throw off the bonds of logic and reason and just condemn.

Let not your soul be troubled, brother. Embrace the hatred and be free.

Power to the People! We shall overcome! No blood for oil!



P
Thanks Pham, I'm in! Geeze.....I feel better already. Good to know that we'll all be taken care of!
DoryDrifter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:48 AM   #16
leefromseattle
Steelhead
 
leefromseattle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Seattle
Posts: 344
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Biggest one is $3k to a neurosurgeon. Most of my doctors didn't have any record so I guess that's good.

The neurosurgeon who did my craniectomy only had $20

ENT doctor had $200
leefromseattle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:48 AM   #17
Fried Oyster
Ifish Nate
 
Fried Oyster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,162
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky Guy View Post
You have that backwards, first you pay the docs then you make the big money.

This was called payola (greed) back in am radio days and people went to jail for it (greed). Ahh, for the good old days ...

This from Huffington kind of sums it up.

In addition to the $24,000,000,000 (that's billion) in payola to the docs (greed),

"the same [11 pharma] companies paid their chief executive officers a combined $1.57 billion in that period (greed). Not bad work if you can get it. They achieved this thanks in part to their [greed and] systematic exploitation of Medicare and an epidemic of illegal marketing activity."

If it's so good and you're god's gift to humanity, why does your product have to be sold using deceptive tactics and secret payments to doctors who presumably wouldn't use your stuff if you didn't pay them? Otherwise why would you pay them right?

Want to start a spirited conversation with a pharma type, say "compulsory licensing", then sit back and enjoy the ducking, dodging and weaving that would make a middleweight proud.

It really is this simple - enact compulsory licensing as part of the patenting process for pharmaceuticals, then let the free market go to work.

How about that Pharm, how about a free market in the drug industry and no payola to docs?

There's nothing wrong with any of that. It is all as it should be. As is blood for oil. As is the military industrial complex. As is the banking industry. And the list goes on. It is all functioning properly.

Capitalists do exactly what capitalists are supposed to do to be successful in a capitalist economy. If you agree to capitalism, you have no business chirping about any of it. They are doing what they are supposed to do.
__________________
I’m not saying you are stupid – I’m just saying you have a lot of bad luck when it comes to thinking.
Fried Oyster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 07:59 AM   #18
El-Kabong
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Out on the edge of an empty highway, Howling at the blood on the moon
Posts: 5,775
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoryDrifter View Post
Well Crabby, thankfully most Doctors aren't government employees yet. I realize that's in the master plan,
see, this here is a perfect example of what is wrong with ifish and makes me thinf of Jennies recent - Please be nice thread

DoryDrifters post adds NOTHING to this thread, but for some strange reason DoryFisher feels compelled to post some tangential nonsense and call another ifisher a name. IF YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING OF VALUE TO ADD TO A THREAD

DON'T
__________________
Team Savage
Team Gregor
Team Rye Whiskey
Team Backcountry Hunters and Anglers
El-Kabong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 08:22 AM   #19
northriver1
Ifish Nate
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Junction City
Posts: 3,021
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by El-Kabong View Post
see, this here is a perfect example of what is wrong with ifish and makes me thinf of Jennies recent - Please be nice thread

DoryDrifters post adds NOTHING to this thread, but for some strange reason DoryFisher feels compelled to post some tangential nonsense and call another ifisher a name. IF YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING OF VALUE TO ADD TO A THREAD

DON'T
NO,,, DoryDrifter is one of the good things about Ifish.. I looked high and low on the AUP and adding value to a thread is not a requirement to post. And that is good for many on here that is for sure.
__________________
NR1
team no pants
Team Parker Boats
northriver1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 08:25 AM   #20
crabbait
King Salmon
 
crabbait's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Jose, Costa Rica
Posts: 36,733
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoryDrifter View Post
Well Crabby, thankfully most Doctors aren't government employees yet.
So you think it is a good thing for pharmacy sales reps to be lining the pockets of doctors? Let me put it another way: Should your doctor be more concerned with your health or which prescriptions bring him the biggest kickbacks?
__________________
The government you elect is the government you deserve. - Thomas Jefferson
crabbait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 08:27 AM   #21
driven2fish
Ifish Nate
 
driven2fish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,102
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by El-Kabong View Post
see, this here is a perfect example of what is wrong with ifish and makes me thinf of Jennies recent - Please be nice thread

DoryDrifters post adds NOTHING to this thread, but for some strange reason DoryFisher feels compelled to post some tangential nonsense and call another ifisher a name. IF YOU DON'T HAVE ANYTHING OF VALUE TO ADD TO A THREAD

DON'T

It's not what's wrong with Ifish it's the way the Internet is and it's not going to change.
driven2fish is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 08:33 AM   #22
Fried Oyster
Ifish Nate
 
Fried Oyster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,162
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

So big pharma is the weed of the day.

Spray some poison on the weed and walk away, satisfied you've done some good. Watch your shows, have a beer. Then walk back out a week later and wonder why weeds keep popping up.

What a foolish cycle.

Try looking at the soil.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZU3wfjtIJY
__________________
I’m not saying you are stupid – I’m just saying you have a lot of bad luck when it comes to thinking.
Fried Oyster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 08:47 AM   #23
DoryDrifter
Tuna!
 
DoryDrifter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Woods
Posts: 1,208
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

I'd hardly say that offering to bring breakfast or lunch into a Doctors office to discuss a new product that may be beneficial to her clients would be considered "lining her pocket". The government regulations that have been imposed over that past 10 years have already clamped down hard on what the Phamacutical reps can and cannot do as it relates to promoting their products. $13.85 doesn't seem to me to be a "big kickback", but then again, I live in the real world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crabbait View Post
So you think it is a good thing for pharmacy sales reps to be lining the pockets of doctors? Let me put it another way: Should your doctor be more concerned with your health or which prescriptions bring him the biggest kickbacks?
DoryDrifter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 09:03 AM   #24
lamb3947
Chromer
 
lamb3947's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 857
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

I think from my original post that small amounts were involved - to my doctor - it appears that this is just a sales strategy to get their foot in the door. "I've brought lunch for you and your staff, could you spare a few minutes and let's chat about why you should use prescribe our product".
Those doctors that are receiving thousands of dollars are more likely taking payola.
lamb3947 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 09:12 AM   #25
skahorse
Tuna!
 
skahorse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Hillsboro, OR
Posts: 1,848
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

I am not in the medical industry. But I am in a position that sales reps want to bring me and my team bagels, donuts, take us out to lunch, etc (equivalent $10-$15 type stuff).

I welcome these treats for me and my team. However, it does nothing to impact our decision making process when selecting a vendor. We look at cold hard facts, examine all options, and make educated decisions based on the best information we have.

Am I being bribed? This is pretty common in private business. I didn't realize how greedy I was...

Edit; Heck, even one took me and a few of my team members to a Blazer game. We never gave them business.

Last edited by skahorse; 02-11-2015 at 09:13 AM.
skahorse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 09:25 AM   #26
crabbait
King Salmon
 
crabbait's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Jose, Costa Rica
Posts: 36,733
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoryDrifter View Post
I'd hardly say that offering to bring breakfast or lunch into a Doctors office to discuss a new product that may be beneficial to her clients would be considered "lining her pocket". The government regulations that have been imposed over that past 10 years have already clamped down hard on what the Phamacutical reps can and cannot do as it relates to promoting their products. $13.85 doesn't seem to me to be a "big kickback", but then again, I live in the real world.
So the problem lies somewhere between $13.85 and $24,000,000,000. Got it...
__________________
The government you elect is the government you deserve. - Thomas Jefferson
crabbait is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 09:35 AM   #27
12pulls
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Just east of Poverty Gulch
Posts: 6,873
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Some medical groups have ethics and do not allow such behavior. No different than where I worked, we could not accept anything from a vendor besides literature and perhaps a demonstration on how their product worked.

If one believes that gifts don't change things then no proof will convince you. It's not about demonizing big pharma or that there is not a need for them, it's about ethical behavior and undue influence. If gifting and other such behavior didn't work, why do they spend so much money on advertising and influence peddling? I have little hope for improvement or even a small improvement in ethical behavior in our society, the road is narrow and most are unwilling if it doesn't fill their purses. After all, isn't the entire American ethos about selfishness and self concern? About freedom to grind others into sand if it benefits me? It all boils down to the promise the serpent made Eve, to become the capital I.
12pulls is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 09:38 AM   #28
SHJunky
Tuna!
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,577
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

These threads regarding pharma, healthcare, Obamacare, bring out the best in people's opinions and personal agendas. If you spend any time at all on ifish, opinions are predictable (including mine).

What it really does is prove the complexity of the issue. It also proves that politicians and corporations WANT it complicated because it makes arguing their point easier when the general public can't believe anything they hear; or conversely believe EVERYTHING they hear from their brand of political bent.

I happen to be in the unique position of helping to manage self-insured employer health plans and can tell you that pharma advertising DOES make a huge difference in prescription drug spend. I point out these plans are self-insured because it takes the insurance company out of the argument. These companies simply pay an adminstrator to administer the plan according to their specifications.

You can argue it's direct to consumer advertising or the more sinister direct to consumer via your trusted Dr. that has the biggest effect but the truth is that it's the combination of everything that is so detrimental. Think about three layers:

- the potential patient (purchaser) sees the advertisement on the TV over and over and over convincing them they NEED drug because they are tired, or depressed, or need too much lab work etc etc etc.

- the Dr. simultaneously gets convinced by the pharm rep that their product has better efficacy, the pharma rep is smoking hot (not you pharmseller- yuck), or they get a trip to the Bahamas. It doesn't really matter. Every Dr. has their own trigger and it's the pharma reps job to figure out that trigger as it is any good salesperson's job.

- the third layer and probably the one that will get most of you on this thread the most riled up is our beloved Federal Government. They are in the process of systematically convincing our citizens we have the RIGHT to the best care and the best drugs. Not only do we have the RIGHT to it but if we can't afford it, we have the RIGHT to receive it at a reduced cost or no cost.

I can't watch 30 minutes of TV without our government promoting welfare programs through advertising. Yes, folks, when you take money from some people and distribut it via government sponsored benefits to other people based on income that is by definition and welfare program. Right or wrong, we have it and our government is now advertising to promote it.

That, my friends, is the triple threat to pharma costs. Yes, there are many other complexities that add or subtract from the equation but those are the top three.

My job is to analyze data for my clients. With very few exceptions I can predict the pharma data before I even see it. I can tell you with 100% certainty that advertising (both kinds) DOES drive pharm costs. It is also a FACT that the less the drug costs to the end user (think free healthcare), the higher the utilization. This is a fact.

So my questions to all of you that are upset because your doctor (or any doctor) is getting "paid" by pharma:

Which one of YOU are going to give up your medication?

Which one of YOU are going to go back to an older drug that is considerably less expensive and only slightly less effective?

Which one of YOU are going to tell your wife or child they shouldn't be taking the latest and greatest drug?

Which one of YOU are going to tell your spouse's or child's doctor that you don't need the latest and greatest drug?

Which one of YOU are going to call your legislator today and demand that we introduce anti-pharma legislation preventing direct to consumer advertising?

We did it with big tobacco. Why not pharma?
SHJunky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 09:59 AM   #29
loper
King Salmon
 
loper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Salem, OR
Posts: 5,543
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SlipKnot View Post
Which one of YOU are going to tell your wife or child they shouldn't be taking the latest and greatest drug?
Looks like there are a few on the mandatory immunization thread who do it quite often.

And they don't just tell; they don't allow.
__________________
OHA Capitol Chapter (Life Member)
RMEF Life Member, OR-FNAWS Life Member, Pheasants Forever, Inland Northwest Wildlife Council, NW Predator Hunters Association, OBH, Oregon Shed Hunters, BHA
loper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 10:01 AM   #30
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

I am smokin' hot.

Just not by conventional standards.




P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 10:13 AM   #31
Spewnman
Cutthroat
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 27
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Here's some of what I see so far:

"This doc here, and that doc there only get a couple bucks, here and there...hardly cause for bribery concern."

[Ignoring the many cases where docs get $thousands, or in some cases over a $million, which would obviously never sway an unscrupulous doctor from over-prescribing or wrongly prescribing...that doesn't happen like the thousands of cases that have been reported/prosecuted.]

"These are just a few dollars, to get their foot in the door and chat to a doctor about why that doctor should be prescribing the product."

[Even though these reps pitching to the doctor have no medical training, know nothing about the drug and its true effects, outside of the brochure-equivalent given to them by the company that wants to make a ton of money from it (as does the rep), so their pitch to a doctor about why they 'should' be prescribing anything is usually ignorant, baseless, a complete waste of a doctors time and possibly outright dangerous to any prospective patient/citizen.]

"We need to stamp down hard on dangerous drug abuse, bring us the War on Drugs, prosecute drug abusers, drug pushers and drug-related crime hard! Drug effects cause people to commit all kinds of crimes and harm! Oh, and anywhere near a school, especially...think of the children."

[But only the drug effects of meth, marijuana, heroin, LSD, cocaine, PCP, etc. cause dangerous effects in people, causing them to steal and hurt people. All those other drugs are regulated and researched, so we 'know' that even though the prescription drugs are made from the same/similar stuff, and cause the same/similar effects, costing a bunch of money people might be unable to afford as similar motivation to steal/sell stuff just like those illegal drugs, they won't cause those same sorts of crimes/harm. So allow Pharma to advertise, market and sell to whoever and however they want..doctors and those TV adds with butterflies and cute animated creatures...my kids love those.]

"These things are regulated and require prescription."

[Ignorning the FDA scientists that have testified before Congress about the scientific frauds, physician frauds, ommissions, coercion, conflicts of interest, catering to business profit interest above consumer safety. Ignoring the pharmeceutical employees that have testified to same. Ignoring the actual testimony of several that the 'regulatory' process that is FDA/Pharma/Physician oversight is rife with corrupted practice and completely broken. Ignoring the many physician malpractice cases showing prescription abuse/illegality, motivated by monetary gain from pharmaceutical incentives.]

"We need 3 strikes laws and imprison for life repeat offenders; get those criminals off the streets!"

[Well, except for criminality by the FDA or Glaxo, or Pfizer, etc., just fine them for each offense, no matter how many, and allow them to keep doing business. Allow them time to find new ways to circumvent...we'll just be sure to keep watching and fine them again for any wrongdoing...over, and over, as long as it takes. Don't worry, they're penalized less $ than they're profiting, the process is working.]

Mind boggling.
Spewnman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 10:54 AM   #32
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Sorry to cherry pick, but I know more about my products than most providers do. I would support the argument that most reps do.

For clarity's sake, from whence do you make these allegations? I'm not attacking, I'm just trying to understand the basis for your statements.



P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 11:14 AM   #33
Thumper
King Salmon
 
Thumper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Vancouver, WA
Posts: 12,322
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spewnman View Post
[Even though these reps pitching to the doctor have no medical training, know nothing about the drug and its true effects, outside of the brochure-equivalent given to them by the company that wants to make a ton of money from it (as does the rep), so their pitch to a doctor about why they 'should' be prescribing anything is usually ignorant, baseless, a complete waste of a doctors time and possibly outright dangerous to any prospective patient/citizen.]

.

I don't think you are aware of any of this. Pharmaceutical reps are trained far better than you might think.
__________________
Jack

Tillamook Anglers!!! Good people doing great things!
Thumper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 11:15 AM   #34
Private-Aye-Fish
Ifish Nate
 
Private-Aye-Fish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Grandview (Culver), Oregon
Posts: 2,927
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Good Thread but a reminder as some posts are being alerted:

  • inflammatory posts. A post, or statement in a post, which serves only to fire up negative emotions or generate anger will be edited or deleted at the discretion of the moderators. Multiple offenses will result in private moderation, or banning.
  • Personal/racial attacks. Avoid negative comments regarding individuals. Racial slurs will not be tolerated. Harassment will not be tolerated. You can disagree with other members without resorting to personal attacks.
Some members have suggested closing the thread. Hate to see it come to that as it has been entertaining minus a couple small AUP violations.
__________________

Don't ask me, I'm just the bait boy.
Private-Aye-Fish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 11:19 AM   #35
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thumper View Post
I don't think you are aware of any of this. Pharmaceutical reps are trained far better than you might think.
I prefer "educated" but I'll take trained.




P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 11:42 AM   #36
Root Hog or Die
Sturgeon
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Land of Misfit Toys
Posts: 4,133
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by skahorse View Post
I am not in the medical industry. But I am in a position that sales reps want to bring me and my team bagels, donuts, take us out to lunch, etc (equivalent $10-$15 type stuff).

I welcome these treats for me and my team. However, it does nothing to impact our decision making process when selecting a vendor. We look at cold hard facts, examine all options, and make educated decisions based on the best information we have.

Am I being bribed? This is pretty common in private business. I didn't realize how greedy I was...

Edit; Heck, even one took me and a few of my team members to a Blazer game. We never gave them business.
Pretty much the way it is in my job also.

The Manufacturer's Reps provide information their new and existing products, provide training on how to properly use those products, provide a conduit for our feedback to the manufacture on any problems with the product, are a resource to assist you.

Yes this sometimes involves a lunch, sometimes a bit more. But there is no quid pro quo, although, from the outside looking in I suppose it could look that way. You know why the Reps that take me out to lunch and whatnot, are sometimes the one that I specify the most? Because those generally are also the ones you can get on the phone when you have a question or a problem with their product, those are ones that will replace a defective part free of charge to keep my clients happy, those are the ones that will go out to a job site to make sure their products is functioning properly, etc. They are the ones that allow me serve my clients better.

Is that the way it works in medicine? I don't know we will have to ask Pharmy. Pharmy do you provide education to your clients on the proper use and also when not to use the products you represent? Can a client call you if he has a question on the products, and do you do your best to answer him. If a client calls you and says he may be seeing a side effect, do you respond honestly and provide information that may help them assess the situation? If you are hearing about some possible side effects do you have the ability to pass this information back to the manufacture? Are you a vital link in the chain of getting good medical care to the people?

My guess is that Pharmy does these things or something very similar.

My guess it that he doesn't just wine and dine people and shove big dog-choking wads of cash in his pockets. But I don't know. If that is all he does, then I guess some of you are right. And I guess I am in the wrong profession. Any job openings your way Pharmy?

Last edited by Root Hog or Die; 02-11-2015 at 11:45 AM. Reason: correct a couple of probably countless spelling errors
Root Hog or Die is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 11:52 AM   #37
lamb3947
Chromer
 
lamb3947's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 857
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Pharmseller,
What are the laws regarding pharmaceutical sales and selling to physicians?
lamb3947 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 12:08 PM   #38
Root Hog or Die
Sturgeon
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Land of Misfit Toys
Posts: 4,133
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spewnman View Post
Here's some of what I see so far:..............


[Even though these reps pitching to the doctor have no medical training, know nothing about the drug and its true effects, outside of the brochure-equivalent given to them by the company that wants to make a ton of money from it (as does the rep), so their pitch to a doctor about why they 'should' be prescribing anything is usually ignorant, baseless, a complete waste of a doctors time and possibly outright dangerous to any prospective patient/citizen.]..............
I'll try to phase this in a way that complies with the rules of ifish.

Have you ever made a post where you didn't assume complete and utter ignorance of everyone other than yourself?
Root Hog or Die is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 12:08 PM   #39
El-Kabong
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Out on the edge of an empty highway, Howling at the blood on the moon
Posts: 5,775
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoryDrifter View Post
I'd hardly say that offering to bring breakfast or lunch into a Doctors office to discuss a new product that may be beneficial to her clients would be considered "lining her pocket". The government regulations that have been imposed over that past 10 years have already clamped down hard on what the Phamacutical reps can and cannot do as it relates to promoting their products. $13.85 doesn't seem to me to be a "big kickback", but then again, I live in the real world.

So, I pulled down the data and did some number crunching. Let's start with who is PAYING A LOT to Dr.s


E.R. Squibb & Sons, L.L.C. $22,026,336.61
Pfizer Inc. $18,286,714.72
GlaxoSmithKline, LLC. $15,848,527.53
Incyte Corporation $10.834.901.95
Merck Sharp & Dohme Corporation $10,126,896.91
Genentech, Inc. $7616623.27
Millennium Pharmaceuticals, Inc. $5909087.60
Janssen Research & Development, LLC $4608570.69
Takeda Development Center Americas, Inc. $3246404.74
ELI LILLY AND COMPANY $3231863.66
Allergan Inc. $3057405.02
Seattle Genetics, Inc. $2840275.46
Celgene Corporation $2822086.09
SANOFI US SERVICES INC. $2686405.80
Evofem Inc. $2653927.57
AstraZeneca Pharmaceuticals LP $2090760.06
IMCLONE SYSTEMS, LLC $1827333.89
Novartis Pharmaceuticals Corporation $1814796.06
Edwards Lifesciences Corporation $1532436.12
Bausch and Lomb Inc. $1526099.67
United Therapeutics Corporation $1481497.01
FOREST RESEARCH INSTITUTE, INC. $1423017.16
Amgen Inc. $1308023.11
Actelion Pharmaceuticals US, Inc. $1180652.60
MedImmune, LLC $1164189.79
Alcon Research Ltd $1160703.69
Daiichi Sankyo Inc. $1130439.67
Otsuka Pharmaceutical Development & Commercialization, Inc. $1115982.71
Otsuka America Pharmaceutical, Inc. $1084868.22
BIOTRONIK INC. $1036210.61
ARIAD Pharmaceuticals, Inc. $1023817.13
Roche TCRC, Inc. $978012.88
Jazz Pharmaceuticals Inc. $856,818.50
ViiV Healthcare Company $818,205.04

so while those in the industry are quick retort " $13.85 doesn't seem to me to be a "big kickback", but then again, I live in the real world." This is BIG MONEY being paid out by companies who like to get Big Government money to help them out cause, it is so expensive to create new drugs..; blah blah BS, the big government handouts are used to pay off Drs. but that must be happening in some other "real world"

This is the top of the list. I am not going to format them all, but the lowest on this list is over $800,000
__________________
Team Savage
Team Gregor
Team Rye Whiskey
Team Backcountry Hunters and Anglers
El-Kabong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 12:53 PM   #40
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Root Hog or Die View Post
Pretty much the way it is in my job also.

The Manufacturer's Reps provide information their new and existing products, provide training on how to properly use those products, provide a conduit for our feedback to the manufacture on any problems with the product, are a resource to assist you.

Yes this sometimes involves a lunch, sometimes a bit more. But there is no quid pro quo, although, from the outside looking in I suppose it could look that way. You know why the Reps that take me out to lunch and whatnot, are sometimes the one that I specify the most? Because those generally are also the ones you can get on the phone when you have a question or a problem with their product, those are ones that will replace a defective part free of charge to keep my clients happy, those are the ones that will go out to a job site to make sure their products is functioning properly, etc. They are the ones that allow me serve my clients better.

Is that the way it works in medicine? I don't know we will have to ask Pharmy. Pharmy do you provide education to your clients on the proper use and also when not to use the products you represent? Can a client call you if he has a question on the products, and do you do your best to answer him. If a client calls you and says he may be seeing a side effect, do you respond honestly and provide information that may help them assess the situation? If you are hearing about some possible side effects do you have the ability to pass this information back to the manufacture? Are you a vital link in the chain of getting good medical care to the people?

My guess is that Pharmy does these things or something very similar.

My guess it that he doesn't just wine and dine people and shove big dog-choking wads of cash in his pockets. But I don't know. If that is all he does, then I guess some of you are right. And I guess I am in the wrong profession. Any job openings your way Pharmy?
In my job I seek to develop trust with my providers. To that end, all I have is my integrity.

My products are not for everyone and I'm not shy to point that out. I want each provider to make the decision based on what's right for the patient. If that's my product, great, if not, great.

The term is "fair balance." I have to talk about the bad with the good. And reporting side effects is crucial.

At the end of the day I aspire to be an asset, an information resource that providers use (in part) to make decisions on patient care. That's my job.



P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 12:58 PM   #41
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lamb3947 View Post
Pharmseller,
What are the laws regarding pharmaceutical sales and selling to physicians?
Google PhRMA code.


P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 02:19 PM   #42
nailyard
Tuna!
 
nailyard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hillsboro, OR
Posts: 1,559
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmseller View Post
I am smokin' hot.

Just not by conventional standards.

P
Pharm! ya got da gud stuf goin? Kewl it down a tad in da Hooka! Wheee..

nailyard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 03:07 PM   #43
Root Hog or Die
Sturgeon
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Land of Misfit Toys
Posts: 4,133
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Thanks for answer the questions about what you do Pharmy. Nice try, but I know where to get the real information:
http://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.ne...172be2f75d629e

Root Hog or Die is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 03:18 PM   #44
lingslayer
King Salmon
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: The new ecotopia
Posts: 5,327
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

If I paid my Dr. more for three visits than he made from Pharm companies last year,...

Does that make me a "bad guy" too?
__________________
Green is the new red!
Never be so open minded that your brains fall out!! And never, NEVER forget
lingslayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 03:20 PM   #45
El-Kabong
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Out on the edge of an empty highway, Howling at the blood on the moon
Posts: 5,775
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lingslayer View Post
If I paid my Dr. more for three visits than he made from Pharm companies last year,...

Does that make me a "bad guy" too?

depends, were you trying to bribe him to push your pills?
__________________
Team Savage
Team Gregor
Team Rye Whiskey
Team Backcountry Hunters and Anglers
El-Kabong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 03:22 PM   #46
lingslayer
King Salmon
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: The new ecotopia
Posts: 5,327
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by El-Kabong View Post
depends, were you trying to bribe him to push your pills?
Incontinence had nothing to do with those visits El-K.

__________________
Green is the new red!
Never be so open minded that your brains fall out!! And never, NEVER forget
lingslayer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 03:29 PM   #47
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lingslayer View Post
Incontinence had nothing to do with those visits El-K.


I can fix it!



www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5cneCgNA9U


P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 03:52 PM   #48
El-Kabong
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Out on the edge of an empty highway, Howling at the blood on the moon
Posts: 5,775
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

so many jokes, none within the AUP must resist, must resist
__________________
Team Savage
Team Gregor
Team Rye Whiskey
Team Backcountry Hunters and Anglers
El-Kabong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 04:10 PM   #49
Root Hog or Die
Sturgeon
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Land of Misfit Toys
Posts: 4,133
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by El-Kabong View Post
so many jokes, none within the AUP must resist, must resist
Come on El-Kabong, let us have it.

Root Hog or Die is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 04:14 PM   #50
ORwaterfowler
Steelhead
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 252
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmseller View Post
Sorry to cherry pick, but I know more about my products than most providers do. I would support the argument that most reps do.
P
Completely agree.
Not only that but how many Dr's do you get to speak with, how many different opinions do you hear and become better informed because of it. Medical and Pharma reps often bring new ideas to staff that never knew existed or didn't know much about to begin with, ideas that help improve patient care and patient outcomes. In an avg month a med sales rep sees 60-90 facilities/depts and how they function, the staff sees the one they work in. Who has more exposure to new ideas, the staff or the sales rep?

Med and pharma sales reps are a necessary evil that wont be going away any time soon.
ORwaterfowler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 04:29 PM   #51
willametteriveroutlaw
King Salmon
 
willametteriveroutlaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Milwaukie, OR
Posts: 8,606
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmseller View Post
I am smokin' hot.

Just not by conventional standards.




P
I'm trying to decide if you'd be a Polar Bear, or a daddy chub bear?

Even if you push death, lies, and smut for big corporate schills for a living..

I still like you .
__________________
The worst part is, now I have to agree with WRO. Which causes me much pain and grief.

-Flatfish
willametteriveroutlaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 04:36 PM   #52
willametteriveroutlaw
King Salmon
 
willametteriveroutlaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Milwaukie, OR
Posts: 8,606
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

https://www.ifish.net/board/showthread.php?t=924778

I'm chuckling right now, many of the same people calling out big Pharm on this thread are also pushing for mandatory vaccinations..

Hmmm...
__________________
The worst part is, now I have to agree with WRO. Which causes me much pain and grief.

-Flatfish
willametteriveroutlaw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 04:37 PM   #53
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by willametteriveroutlaw View Post
I'm trying to decide if you'd be a Polar Bear, or a daddy chub bear?

Even if you push death, lies, and smut for big corporate schills for a living..

I still like you .
Hugs all around.

I must say, I'm impressed by the hate exhibited by some on this board. To their credit, they're consistent. It's getting boring, but hey, whatever floats your boat.

Six times in my career I have made presentations to managed Medicaid decision makers. Each time my proposals were accepted. I have saved those programs, and I kid you not, over a million bucks, maybe twice that. Medicaid comes from tax dollars.

You're welcome.




P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 05:15 PM   #54
El-Kabong
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Out on the edge of an empty highway, Howling at the blood on the moon
Posts: 5,775
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Wow your boss must have been ****** going rogue and forgoing $2,000,000 for the good of society!

Good for You (and US)
__________________
Team Savage
Team Gregor
Team Rye Whiskey
Team Backcountry Hunters and Anglers
El-Kabong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 05:34 PM   #55
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by El-Kabong View Post
Wow your boss must have been ****** going rogue and forgoing $2,000,000 for the good of society!
Nope. Switching to my product instead of the other guy.

We carried the money we made in wheelbarrows.




P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 05:37 PM   #56
bradly11
King Salmon
 
bradly11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Sandy
Posts: 7,123
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmseller View Post
Nope. Switching to my product instead of the other guy.



We carried the money we made in wheelbarrows.









P

That's was hilarious.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
bradly11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 05:43 PM   #57
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bradly11 View Post
That's was hilarious.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Wanna hear the best part?

I used some of that money to buy El-Kabong's boat.

No joke.






P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 05:54 PM   #58
El-Kabong
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Out on the edge of an empty highway, Howling at the blood on the moon
Posts: 5,775
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

U
Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmseller View Post
Wanna hear the best part?

I used some of that money to buy El-Kabong's boat.

No joke.






P

And never once did he mentioned that the money came from such a noble source.

A mop in the rod holder?! OMG
__________________
Team Savage
Team Gregor
Team Rye Whiskey
Team Backcountry Hunters and Anglers
El-Kabong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 05:58 PM   #59
pharmseller
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Harrisburg
Posts: 19,924
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by El-Kabong View Post
U


And never once did he mentioned that the money came from such a noble source.

A mop in the rod holder?! OMG
It's a deck brush. It lives in the rod holder when moored.

And you knew I was a drug rep.




P
pharmseller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-11-2015, 06:05 PM   #60
El-Kabong
King Salmon
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Out on the edge of an empty highway, Howling at the blood on the moon
Posts: 5,775
Default Re: Is Your Dr. getting paid by Big Pharma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pharmseller View Post
It's a deck brush. It lives in the rod holder when moored.

And you kne
P
About the mop? Had I known I'd never have sold her to ya.

She is looking good, I do miss her at B10 time.
__________________
Team Savage
Team Gregor
Team Rye Whiskey
Team Backcountry Hunters and Anglers
El-Kabong is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Cast to



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 08:52 PM.

Terms of Service
 
Page generated in 0.62215 seconds with 83 queries