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Old 01-03-2018, 11:07 AM   #1
ron m
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Default Info on bottomfish and other regs

Lots of questions have been posted about the limits for bottom fish and the types of trips we can do. Hopefully the limits we have now will be in place all year, but sometimes changes occur. Questions about salmon and halibut also come up during the year. Below is a link that will have the answers to those questions, there is a clear explanation of the types of bottom fish trips available to us. The link also has info on signing up for updates that can be delivered to you via either email or texts to your phone.

http://www.dfw.state.or.us/MRP/

MRP is the Marine Resources Program, the salt water portion of ODFW. Besides the obvious links provided via the pictures, scroll down for more info. You can find links to photos and descriptions of all or almost all of the fish that can be caught in our waters.
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Old 01-03-2018, 12:14 PM   #2
Don G Baldi
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

They still haven't clarified there is a daily aggregate rock fish limit regardless of which rules you use. Until they do, there is a valid argument that someone can participate in both fishies as long as they are separate trips; 10 from LL rules (Offshore Midwater Fishery) and 5+2 from marine species rules (Marine Fish). Between trips you must offload (land) your catch and store them on shore before heading back out.

From their own chart on the midwater fishery:

Must use Longleader gear. Cannot be combined with any other bottomfish, flatfish, or Pacific halibut on the same trip.

http://www.dfw.state.or.us/MRP/finfi...port/index.asp
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Old 01-03-2018, 12:48 PM   #3
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

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Originally Posted by Don G Baldi View Post
They still haven't clarified there is a daily aggregate rock fish limit regardless of which rules you use. Until they do, there is a valid argument that someone can participate in both fishies as long as they are separate trips; 10 from LL rules (Offshore Midwater Fishery) and 5+2 from marine species rules (Marine Fish). Between trips you must offload (land) your catch and store them on shore before heading back out.

From their own chart on the midwater fishery:

Must use Longleader gear. Cannot be combined with any other bottomfish, flatfish, or Pacific halibut on the same trip.

http://www.dfw.state.or.us/MRP/finfi...port/index.asp
The way I interpret it, you can do two (or more) separate trips in one day, but the bag limit is described as a daily bag limit, so no more than 10 rockfish total for two (or more) trips in one day.
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Old 01-03-2018, 12:55 PM   #4
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Very confusing. From October until March I can keep my 2 ling cod and either 5 rock fish or 10 mid water fish that may include some rock fish? Canary is one that comes to mind. Is there other species that you can catch on the bottom that fit into the mid water fishery? Why I am asking is it possible to go out and fish for ling cod but before you get to the bottom or on the bottom you catch your 10 mid water fish.
From October to March do we need to use the 30ft leader. We are impacting the YE when we are fishing for the ling cod at all depth. If you see a cloud of fish in the mid water why not fish them with out descending to the bottom. I can sort of understand when we are in the months from March to October. I guess the YE take over spots that were traditional ling spots and have now chased the ling cod out and are being caught be the halibut fishermen.
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Old 01-03-2018, 01:16 PM   #5
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don G Baldi View Post
They still haven't clarified there is a daily aggregate rock fish limit regardless of which rules you use. Until they do, there is a valid argument that someone can participate in both fishies as long as they are separate trips; 10 from LL rules (Offshore Midwater Fishery) and 5+2 from marine species rules (Marine Fish). Between trips you must offload (land) your catch and store them on shore before heading back out.

From their own chart on the midwater fishery:

Must use Longleader gear. Cannot be combined with any other bottomfish, flatfish, or Pacific halibut on the same trip.

http://www.dfw.state.or.us/MRP/finfi...port/index.asp

Do you really see this as a problem?

Are many people really going to go out to >40 fathoms, catch 10 rockfish that are likely to be larger than they will catch inside 40, then drop them off in port and go back out to catch 5 rockfish and 2 ling cod?
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Old 01-03-2018, 02:42 PM   #6
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

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Originally Posted by Gun Rod Bow View Post
Do you really see this as a problem?

Are many people really going to go out to >40 fathoms, catch 10 rockfish that are likely to be larger than they will catch inside 40, then drop them off in port and go back out to catch 5 rockfish and 2 ling cod?
It looks like ODFW fixed their lack of information in one spot that just went up on their site. It was created on 12/29/17: https://myodfw.com/sites/default/fil...n%202018_0.pdf

The last footnote in each rock fish section says:

"Anglers may keep one general marine fish daily bag limit of up to 5 fish
on a bottomfish trip, and do a separate offshore midwater fishery trip
on the same day, but may have no more than 10 fish in total per day"

Good. Now if they would update their other online publications to reflect that maybe it will put the issue to bed.
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Old 01-03-2018, 05:56 PM   #7
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don G Baldi View Post
It looks like ODFW fixed their lack of information in one spot that just went up on their site. It was created on 12/29/17: https://myodfw.com/sites/default/fil...n%202018_0.pdf

The last footnote in each rock fish section says:

"Anglers may keep one general marine fish daily bag limit of up to 5 fish
on a bottomfish trip, and do a separate offshore midwater fishery trip
on the same day, but may have no more than 10 fish in total per day"

Good. Now if they would update their other online publications to reflect that maybe it will put the issue to bed.


I thought it was you can keep 10 rockfish total and 2 lings as long as you unloaded the 10 LL fish first before going out to fish for the 2 ling? The above description of “10 fish in total per day” seems to say otherwise?
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Old 01-03-2018, 07:05 PM   #8
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

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Originally Posted by InTheVault View Post
I thought it was you can keep 10 rockfish total and 2 lings as long as you unloaded the 10 LL fish first before going out to fish for the 2 ling? The above description of “10 fish in total per day” seems to say otherwise?
If you want to get 10 rock fish under the LL rules and drop them off you can go back out for 2 lings. Or go get 5 rock fish plus your 2 lings, drop them off and then go back out under LL rules to get the other 5 rock fish. Don't show up at the dock with 10 rock fish and 2 lings in the box.

It's a mix and match kind of thing. And you need to watch the species of rock fish doing the LL thing; black/blue/deacon are not allowed.
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Old 01-04-2018, 06:46 PM   #9
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

So kind of asked this in the long leader thread and got shuffled out. So after looking at the ODFW two page regs on rock fish and other stuff it appears that if you are fishing in waters 40 fathoms or deeper you are restricted to fishing all lures and methods as defined by the long leader requirements? Meaning no fishing for lingcod on those deeper areas to lessen impacts on yelloweye?
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:02 PM   #10
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

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Originally Posted by Umpquanuts View Post
So kind of asked this in the long leader thread and got shuffled out. So after looking at the ODFW two page regs on rock fish and other stuff it appears that if you are fishing in waters 40 fathoms or deeper you are restricted to fishing all lures and methods as defined by the long leader requirements? Meaning no fishing for lingcod on those deeper areas to lessen impacts on yelloweye?
The best way for you to get answers is to call 541-867-4741 and ask to speak with Lynne. She is the Marine Bio that is writing these regulations. She will happily answer all your questions...
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Old 01-05-2018, 05:51 AM   #11
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Howdy Paul,

There is so much outdated and temporary angling regs, and brochures out there now.

I think once the LL fishery is approved and runs year round, then things will make more sense.
Then we will have a winter outside 40 season, which you can keep 2 lings, but less rock fish if you choose.

If I understand your question...
It is legal at this time to go outside 40; and fish any method you want, jigs, big herring, and you can drag it right on the bottom.......and catch 2 lings and 5 rockfish........or you can keep it off the bottom with LL gear, and for doing so you can keep 10 rockfish.

Come summertime, is when the LL will make more sense.

Not to make it more complicated...but.... say we went LL fishing, and each had five rockfish, and couldn’t catch another.....we could put bait on and go to the bottom and get our lings......

Say I we were fishing LL and you had 4 rockfish and then you caught a 40 pound lingcod.... you could catch one more rockfish and quit.

Basically you only need LL and a float when catching your last 5 rockfish....as long as no lings are onboard......but we must fish the same method....you can not fish for lings and me LL in the same boat.....we could tie two boats together and it would be ok.


Right now everything is in the process of change, and now that they think there are twice as many YE as previously , there should be more changes in the next few years.....I hope.

Hope your cows are wintering well....mooooooooo!
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Old 01-05-2018, 09:06 AM   #12
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Dan,
Thanks for trying to explain...cows seem to be doing well...I may now be even more confused....but that is normal...just seeing the note on ODFW two pager saying long leader tech only on those 40 fathom fisheries is my interp that lures need to be at least 30 feet off the bottom.
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Old 01-05-2018, 10:00 AM   #13
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Umpquanuts View Post
So kind of asked this in the long leader thread and got shuffled out. So after looking at the ODFW two page regs on rock fish and other stuff it appears that if you are fishing in waters 40 fathoms or deeper you are restricted to fishing all lures and methods as defined by the long leader requirements? Meaning no fishing for lingcod on those deeper areas to lessen impacts on yelloweye?
Here are the three ODFW offerings I've managed to find:

https://myodfw.com/sites/default/fil...n%202018_0.pdf

https://myodfw.com/sport-groundfish-seasons

https://myodfw.com/sites/default/fil...ry%20FAQ_0.pdf

There are two separate fisheries with rules that apply to each including which species of fish you can harvest. Until April Fools Day you can fish whatever type of gear you want, anywhere you want, as long as you don't take more than 5 rockfish and two lings. After April 1st the 30 fathom line goes back into effect for the 5+2 species and you can use whatever gear you want, LL or leadheads.

If you want more than 5 rockfish - go outside the 40f line and restrict your harvest to those species allowed using LL gear. That fishery ends on April 1st unless ODFW changes the season. Comments are now being accepted - a link to that is in another thread.

The rule of thumb is until April 1st you can fish whatever gear you want anywhere you want until you catch and keep a species not allowed in the LL fishery. Once you do, you are bound by the 5+2 rules.

I hope that helps.
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Old 01-05-2018, 10:44 AM   #14
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Thanks.....I still interp (from ODFW posted stuff) that maybe fishing the 40 fathom area one would be restricted to fishing long leader gear and not be dinging the bottom for lings. Too much yelloweye blowing their air bladder and needing to be descended with google eyes etc . As guided from another post I have a question into the "lead" person at ODFW seeking clarification.
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Old 01-05-2018, 11:00 AM   #15
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

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Originally Posted by Umpquanuts View Post
Thanks.....I still interp (from ODFW posted stuff) that maybe fishing the 40 fathom area one would be restricted to fishing long leader gear and not be dinging the bottom for lings. Too much yelloweye blowing their air bladder and needing to be descended with google eyes etc . As guided from another post I have a question into the "lead" person at ODFW seeking clarification.
After April 1st that's true. Until then you can fish on the bottom at any depth with any gear for 5 rockfish and 2 lings.
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Old 01-05-2018, 11:09 AM   #16
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Thanks.....I still interp (from ODFW posted stuff) that maybe fishing the 40 fathom area one would be restricted to fishing long leader gear and not be dinging the bottom for lings. Too much yelloweye blowing their air bladder and needing to be descended with google eyes etc . As guided from another post I have a question into the "lead" person at ODFW seeking clarification.
So I got a rapid resonse from Lynn Mattes of ODFW regarding all this rock fish and lingcod depths fishing stuff. The e-mail indicated you could fish rock fish and lingcod as usual now through March at all depths keeping 5 rock fish and 2 lingcod. Then all the other jazz goes into play come April 1. Guess you still have the long leader fishing out deep (40 fathoms) allowing 10 rock fish meeting the criteria and no lingcod on board. I hope Lynn sends the note to ifish so it can be put on the board....I do not have enough good gray matter left to post up Lynn's note back to me.
Ding the bottom if you like I guess....watch out for those pipe jigs fish!!!
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Old 01-06-2018, 06:12 AM   #17
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Paul, I am pretty sure that info has been posted several times, but maybe needs brought to the top again.

Welcome to another chapter, in....”What doesn’t make sense “
In the past 15 years of micro managing the fisheries, there became so many regulations adopted for a individual species, certain depths, tackle requirements, long term goals, short term goals, and so on and many of these regulations overlap one another, thus the sarcasm.



The LL fishery needs approval, and then can be made modified to make more sense.... because right now we can run out as buddy boats, and I tie up to your boat....I can fish the bottom with a 12” herring, and you cant get within 30 feet of it and not exceed a five inch artificial lure.
I can keep the same first five fish as you, and if I don’t catch a ling, I can clip on my LL gear and catch the same 10 fish.



As so many pointed out.....this only makes sense as a summertime fishery.

Now based on the last assement, which is the same old data, calculated differently....they are under the assumption that there are twice as many YE as previously believed. The models could have been ran to show this data 15 years .....this is where it gets political.
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Old 01-06-2018, 08:50 AM   #18
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Of course it has to be confusing.
Why not put a limit on each fish like we use to have in the confused years.
Like 5 of the mid water fish, then 5 canary not to exceed 10 canary(humor), or just 5 off the bottom and 5 off the mid water.
I know there was a lot of time put into this new fishery which I think most of us didn't even know existed. Maybe some of us would have reeled up and caught them. But make it interesting and cut the 30 foot leader and figure we can do it. I believe that is a lot of the issue, they can't trust us to manage our catch or what we should catch. Which is true in some regards I have seen folks out halibut fishing dropping YE back into the water without a descending device.
It would be easy to catch our 5 on the bottom while catching our 2 lings and release all YE with descending device. Then reel up your bait or lures and catch 5 mid water fish. 10 fish 2 lings and nothing more. That would bring the large number of fishing people out past the 40 fathom line to catch that many fish and give the inner reefs a break. I know 2 fish gluttons that would love to take advantage of that. But they are not interested in going out for the 10 long line because of the idea of a 30 foot leader and not being able to keep ling cod. Frustrating.
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Old 01-06-2018, 09:10 AM   #19
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Umpquanuts View Post
So I got a rapid resonse from Lynn Mattes of ODFW regarding all this rock fish and lingcod depths fishing stuff. The e-mail indicated you could fish rock fish and lingcod as usual now through March at all depths keeping 5 rock fish and 2 lingcod. Then all the other jazz goes into play come April 1. Guess you still have the long leader fishing out deep (40 fathoms) allowing 10 rock fish meeting the criteria and no lingcod on board. I hope Lynn sends the note to ifish so it can be put on the board....I do not have enough good gray matter left to post up Lynn's note back to me.
Ding the bottom if you like I guess....watch out for those pipe jigs fish!!!
Thanks, that explains it for me.
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Old 01-11-2018, 04:03 PM   #20
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

For the first time is a long while I feel that quite possibly, the odfw has acted somewhat appropriately. They are taking the lemons "gifted" to them by the fed's added a twist and have made reasonable lemonade out of them with their position taken on the 2018 ground-fish regulations.

As I read it (please correct me if I am wrong) if one takes full advantage of 2018 ground-fish regulations.... Apr 1. through Oct 31. (abet any in season closures) your catchable daily ground-fish quota (including lings) could/will increase by approx 71%. Just remember the 5 "P's" to success.
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Old 01-11-2018, 04:14 PM   #21
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For the first time is a long while I feel that quite possibly, the odfw has acted somewhat appropriately. They are taking the lemons "gifted" to them by the fed's added a twist and have made reasonable lemonade out of them with their position taken on the 2018 ground-fish regulations.

As I read it (please correct me if I am wrong) if one takes full advantage of 2018 ground-fish regulations.... Apr 1. through Oct 31. (abet any in season closures) your catchable daily ground-fish quota (including lings) could/will increase by approx 71%. Just remember the 5 "P's" to success.
Unless the LL regs change to allow a summer fishery, the daily quota is cut from 7 to 5. And if the summer LL fishery is approved it would take two separate trips to max out.

I'm tickled that the regs have pretty much eliminated the sub-bag limits, cabazon being the exception. And I'm happy to see the LL winter fishery, just wish we could get a couple lings in there when the 30f line is erased. But it is what it is and I agree we are ahead of the game compared to last year.
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Old 01-11-2018, 04:17 PM   #22
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unless the ll regs change to allow a summer fishery, the daily quota is cut from 7 to 5. And if the summer ll fishery is approved it would take two separate trips to max out.

I'm tickled that the regs have pretty much eliminated the sub-bag limits, cabazon being the exception. And i'm happy to see the ll winter fishery, just wish we could get a couple lings in there when the 30f line is erased. But it is what it is and i agree we are ahead of the game compared to last year.

yep...
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Old 01-18-2018, 02:41 PM   #23
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Default Re: Info on bottomfish and other regs

Seems a little confusing but beats a total closure like last year. Thanks for the info
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