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Old 07-23-2019, 08:32 AM   #1
bigdawgwill44
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Default Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

Looking on opinions for Gas vs Diesel truck for towing a travel trailer. We are looking to get a travel trailer that is too big for my F-150 to tow, it can pull the weight but the payload would be well maxed out. Looking at the F-250 or F-350 but torn between a gasser or diesel. The trailer will be about 30-33' and weigh around 9-10k pounds. Only thing that is deterring me from a diesel is it wont be a daily driver. I may drive it once during the week and on weekends. I was told this is bad as a diesel needs to be used and not just sit in the driveway. What are your thoughts?

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Old 07-23-2019, 08:36 AM   #2
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

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Looking on opinions for Gas vs Diesel truck for towing a travel trailer. We are looking to get a travel trailer that is too big for my F-150 to tow, it can pull the weight but the payload would be well maxed out. Looking at the F-250 or F-350 but torn between a gasser or diesel. The trailer will be about 30-33' and weigh around 9-10k pounds. Only thing that is deterring me from a diesel is it wont be a daily driver. I may drive it once during the week and on weekends. I was told this is bad as a diesel needs to be used and not just sit in the driveway. What are your thoughts?
Huh?!? Whoever told you that about the diesel is flat wrong. You will be miserable pulling a 10,000 trailer with a gas rig I don’t care how HD the chassis is. Aside from having to stop at every fuel station to fuel up.
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Old 07-23-2019, 08:38 AM   #3
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

At that weight, with the sole purpose being towing, I would say diesel. Love my F250 with the 6.2, have zero regrets, but I'm towing lighter than that. Currently I'm at 60/40 driving/towing.

Average 14.5 mpg driving, 10 mpg towing 5-6k

If I was towing 10k I would feel different I'm sure.

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Old 07-23-2019, 09:04 AM   #4
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

IMO 8Kish is where having a gas engine starts to become annoying. You are well within the capacity of the vehicle (say an F250), but the constant downshifts and high rpm become tiresome. At the same time, a single non-warranty diesel repair could eliminate any fuel savings for years to come. Are you looking at new or used?
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Old 07-23-2019, 09:05 AM   #5
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

By being used, when a diesel is driven it needs to be driven far enough and/or with enough load to get it up to operating temperature. Using them as a daily driver for short commutes with light loads is bad, but sitting is no worse for them than it is any other rig.
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Old 07-23-2019, 09:13 AM   #6
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

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IMO 8Kish is where having a gas engine starts to become annoying. You are well within the capacity of the vehicle (say an F250), but the constant downshifts and high rpm become tiresome. At the same time, a single non-warranty diesel repair could eliminate any fuel savings for years to come. Are you looking at new or used?
Used, 2015 and newer with less than 60,000 miles is what I was thinking.
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Old 07-23-2019, 09:14 AM   #7
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

My 1ton diesel sits in the driveway all week hooked up to a trailer. Rarely driven empty or as a grocery getter. Driving them once weekly is not bad on them. Driving them for 5 minutes then shutting them off is bad for them. The best thing you can do for a diesel truck is use it as it was intended. Towing. IMO the cost of a diesel never pencils out. But I wouldn't want to tow 10k with a gasser. Get yourself a nice used 1ton long bed diesel and your set. When you get a 5th wheel down the road you will be glad you got the right truck from the get go
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Old 07-23-2019, 09:28 AM   #8
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My Duramax gets 25 mpg on the free way and 16 around town. I inevitably do a lot of hill climbing - hells canyon and crossing the rocky mts to go to Montana Idaho or Wyoming. It takes a diesel to do the high speed limit in those states when your towing. I also have some big steep hills in my neighborhood and that exhaust brake button is golden especially if its slick.
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Old 07-23-2019, 09:29 AM   #9
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

My diesel truck sits most of the time. It only gets used a few times a month. If I know it will be a bunch of errands, I make sure to start it 10-15 minutes before leaving to get temps up. I will also try to do a longer trip the same day or during the weekend to burn it out. Letting them sit isn't going to hurt them, using them for running around town and not opening them up is what kills them.

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Old 07-23-2019, 09:31 AM   #10
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

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At that weight, with the sole purpose being towing, I would say diesel. Love my F250 with the 6.2, have zero regrets, but I'm towing lighter than that. Currently I'm at 60/40 driving/towing.

Average 14.5 mpg driving, 10 mpg towing 5-6k

If I was towing 10k I would feel different I'm sure.

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I am in the same situation and totally agree.
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Old 07-23-2019, 09:31 AM   #11
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

Diesel. Ram 3500. Can't go wrong with a Cummins. Look into Dave Smith in Idaho. I have bought 2 trucks from them. One war a 3/4 Ton 24 valve. Drove it for 15 years 200K miles. Rode the best with my camper on while pulling my boat. Drove like a caddy down the freeway. Now all I pull is my boat. I went with a 1500 Ram. No regrets from either truck. Repair bills on the diesel is why I got a new one. My next truck will be a 1 ton Ram with a Cummins.
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Old 07-23-2019, 09:34 AM   #12
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

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My Duramax gets 25 mpg on the free way and 16 around town. I inevitably do a lot of hill climbing - hells canyon and crossing the rocky mts to go to Montana Idaho or Wyoming. It takes a diesel to do the high speed limit in those states when your towing. I also have some big steep hills in my neighborhood and that exhaust brake button is golden especially if its slick.
The turbo brake in my Dodge was great this summer on our road trip. Saved me from having to ride the brakes on the down grades. I was pulling a travel trailer with about a 7000# loaded weight.

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Old 07-23-2019, 09:41 AM   #13
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

I just went through this, I had a 04 ram 3500 diesel that was my daily driver then after 10 years I bought a tundra since we no longer used a slide in camper and now tow a bumper pull trailer loaded weight about 7700 the tundra pulled any hill I wanted and did fine but I was spoiled by the cummins fuel efficiency when towing the tundra likes fuel as most gassers will now I’m back in a ram 3500 diesel after 1 year of tundra mpg, I just couldn’t wrap my head around the 7.4 mpg when traveling it basically added 125-150 bucks to my fishing trips to the coast fill up before I take off and fill up when I get home with a 38 gallon tank that got old fast! But it was my daily driver so it always wanted fuel
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Old 07-23-2019, 10:13 AM   #14
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

Diesel, it cost more per gallon, economy not as good as the new gassers, plus many other negatives you'll hear on this subject of Gas vs Diesel. But,,,, a diesel truck will pull anything hooked to it and get roughly 9-11 mpg no matter the wt. Gas vs Diesel is not something to try and make out on paper, bean counters do that and are wrong most times because we live in a real world that has the law of physics they never consider. 33' five'r I'm guessing, don't look at RV MFG. posted wts. it'll be more after you load things up, even if they have a posted cargo wt. I've been down this road myself, we couldn't afford a diesel truck for a few years after buying a all steel 29' 4 horse trailer with bunk house/tack room,, not living qtrs.,, and had to deal with the 1 ton Dually gasser hell, and as the miles piled on the gasser started to show its faults when trying to pull hills and really bad in our hot Delta summer temps down here. Finally we managed to get a diesel, I have never looked back, I love the Ram 3500 Dually Cummins with 29k tow capacity. My wife was heavy into horse training and she hauled 4 horses every time going to all the shows. I always had to worry about the grades she pulled and if the gas truck was going to overheat. And this started at 80k miles, other then the grades the truck ran great and got 5-6mpg loaded. This is the real world, not figures on a sheet of paper. Coming back home from Coos, the Cummins runs up the Ashland grade with my 5klbs Artic Fox cabover towing my 7klbs boat and trailer 55-60 mph relaxed and with a piece of mind, plus there is more peddle left to pass trucks, that alone has value. I only put 8k a year on my truck, sits for days, that is not a issue, its the soft foot and slow driving that is bad. It's bad for the emissions on todays Diesel truck, the Cummings is very happy at 1500-1600rpms, but the *** emissions need higher exhaust temps to keep from throwing codes,,,gregg

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Old 07-23-2019, 10:18 AM   #15
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

I think it depends on how much heavy towing you will do and how long you plan to keep the truck. The more heavy towing and the longer you keep the truck, the more it makes sense to spend more up front on a diesel. You will certainly be happier with the diesel. The only advantage of the gas truck is that it will be cheaper upfront. At the end of the day, they will both get the job done.
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Old 07-23-2019, 10:47 AM   #16
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I think it depends on how much heavy towing you will do and how long you plan to keep the truck. The more heavy towing and the longer you keep the truck, the more it makes sense to spend more up front on a diesel. You will certainly be happier with the diesel. The only advantage of the gas truck is that it will be cheaper upfront. At the end of the day, they will both get the job done.


True!^^^^

If you’re looking used, the gasser will be half the price-ish, due to lower upfront cost, as well as poor resale. Say you save $15K on a gasser. How long will that take to pay off with a diesel? None of the 3/4 ton gas rigs will have a hard time with 8-10k trailer if you find one with lower geared axles.


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Old 07-23-2019, 10:48 AM   #17
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

With that little mileage being put on the truck, it probably makes more economic sense to go gas. Sure, it will guzzle fuel, but it will be much cheaper to purchase the truck vs. a diesel (particularly if you are buying used). Filling up a gas guzzling pickup hurts, but that extra $50 bucks spent on fuel per trip may never add up enough to equal the $8000 diesel engine price premium.

For occasional use tow rigs pulling moderate loads, gas 3/4 and 1 tons are pretty compelling from an economic standpoint. For frequent heavy towing, or a rig that is going to rack up a lot of miles, diesel starts to win out. Resale is obviously much stronger on the diesel, but major repairs can also cost a lot more (particularly on certain engines, like the Ford 6.0.)

I love my 06' GMC Duramax, but during the summer it is typically hauling a 2000# camper while towing a 7500# boat at the same time, and it racks up 8-10k miles per year. If I were just using it to tow the boat, or driving it significantly less (like 5k or less), a gasser would make more economic sense for me.
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Old 07-23-2019, 12:34 PM   #18
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

I am not too concerned with fuel economy. If i were to go with a 3/4 or 1-ton gas I just want to make sure it has enough power to tow 8-10k trailer with the truck bed full of gear and the cab full with a family and dog and still be able to climb all the mountain ranges in Oregon sufficiently.
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Old 07-23-2019, 12:43 PM   #19
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I pull 12000 pound trailer with 6L Chev gasser. 5 spd stick with 4.10 gears. Need to downshift to 3rd when going up mountains, but no problem keeping at 55-60 when towing through the hills. It's all about the rear end gears whether you'll have much difficulty pulling that weight.

A friend just mentioned yesterday that she is selling her ex-husband's V10 dually Dodge (2003???) with only 68K miles for around $10K, if I recall. That thing is a towing beast and the V10s have reputation for reliability.
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Old 07-23-2019, 02:01 PM   #20
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My Duramax gets 25 mpg on the free way and 16 around town. I inevitably do a lot of hill climbing - hells canyon and crossing the rocky mts to go to Montana Idaho or Wyoming. It takes a diesel to do the high speed limit in those states when your towing. I also have some big steep hills in my neighborhood and that exhaust brake button is golden especially if its slick.


Wow 25 mpg what year is it? I’m lucky to get 20 with my 06.


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Old 07-23-2019, 04:02 PM   #21
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Default Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

I have a 3500 Ram diesel. I bought for pulling my boat and trailer. I would never go back to a gas rig for towing! I was always leery of the cost of diesel so I shied away from them for years. Now I am a believer!
I ran over to Bend the other day, averaged 24 mpg over and back. When I run up I5, I get upwards of 30 mpg. Around town stop and go, 18 mpg. Pulling my 29’ boat or my 30’ 5th wheel my mileage drops down to 15 over the pass. Still better than any gas rig I have owned!
Pulling over the passes I am not winding out, just comfortable cruising... As far as mileage goes, it does pencil out!


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Old 07-23-2019, 04:14 PM   #22
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Wow 25 mpg what year is it? I’m lucky to get 20 with my 06.


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Its a 2019 company car The on board computer calculates the gas mileage every 50 miles and pretty much sticks between 22-25 on long trips on the freeway without the trailer. The new 2020 will be lighter with a 10 speed tranny. That should be pretty fuel efficient.
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Old 07-23-2019, 04:27 PM   #23
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After having every great engine/tranny combo from ford, I would never go back to gas for towing anything significant. My current 7.3 diesel doesn't even notice our 5th wheel,either in power or mileage. Until ford releases their 7.3 gas, don't expect consistency with a gas motor. Other than having to relearn mechanickin skills to work on a diesel, I love them!
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Old 07-23-2019, 06:14 PM   #24
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Diesels don’t typically pencil out for most people. Between initial outlay and increased maintenance and repair costs and the usual timeframe of ownership ( you have to own one for over ten years before it starts making sense) gas is cheaper. Not to mention, they flat out suck in Offroad situations. My current ‘18 F350 with the FX4 package (skid plates and locking rear diff ) can almost not get stuck. That front end is HEAVY
Having said that , if I can afford it I’ll be owning diesels. Tow so much better and feels more sure footed.



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Old 07-23-2019, 07:10 PM   #25
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

Diesel, no question about it. The exhaust brake alone on new diesel trucks is worth it.
Also, when I bought my used 2017 Ram 2500 last year the average price difference between gas/diesel was about $4-5k.

I can haul 8k up cabbage hill at 55mph with plenty of power to spare, and then safely come down with the exhaust brake on and hardly touch the brake pedal. Any gas engine will need to shift in to a low gear at a high RPM to go up, then you’ll be stomping on the brakes all the way down.
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Old 07-23-2019, 07:52 PM   #26
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

I went through the same process last year. I was pulling a 32 ft 5th wheel with a gas engine. And drove alot of mountain roads. Changing to diesel was night and day difference in pulling power.

I was on the road this last month and stayed next to a guy who had a gas truck. Pulling same trailer He used my truck and went out and bought a new diesel that afternoon. It was easier to pull in Florida where is was flat. NOt as good in the mountains with gas

SO now my wife and I try to guess whether the person we are passing is diesel based on how it is performing on hills.
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Old 07-23-2019, 09:40 PM   #27
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I've owned both diesel and gassers and I use the big trucks almost exclusively for towing. The bottom line is, once you tow with a diesel you won't be happy towing with a gasser. My 3500 sits in the driveway most of the time--It's a 2008 and I've got 78000 miles on it. I drive it once every couple of weeks if I don't need to pull a load (I live on top of a mountain, so no problem getting it warmed up on the climb home). So far, I've replaced the tires (twice), did the brakes and replaced a shaft seal. That's it, except for oil, filters, etc. I deleted the truck when the warranty ended, but that might not be an option for you, depending on where you live.

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Old 07-23-2019, 10:06 PM   #28
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I pull 12000 pound trailer with 6L Chev gasser. 5 spd stick with 4.10 gears. Need to downshift to 3rd when going up mountains, but no problem keeping at 55-60 when towing through the hills. It's all about the rear end gears whether you'll have much difficulty pulling that weight.

A friend just mentioned yesterday that she is selling her ex-husband's V10 dually Dodge (2003???) with only 68K miles for around $10K, if I recall. That thing is a towing beast and the V10s have reputation for reliability.
That is a super buy. Even though it isn't a diesel, I'd jump all over that if I needed a truck. I'll bet you can get more than 10K trading in that truck in eastern Oregon, with dealers slobbering all over it. Buy it, tow with it, and if you absolutely hate it, trade it in on a diesel.
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Old 07-23-2019, 11:56 PM   #29
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

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By being used, when a diesel is driven it needs to be driven far enough and/or with enough load to get it up to operating temperature. Using them as a daily driver for short commutes with light loads is bad, but sitting is no worse for them than it is any other rig.
I agree that to be relatively accurate in general, but 2015 and newer truck are much better with that compared to the earlier DPF/EGR trucks.

Gas engine trucks have a different issue with short trip/not warming up operation..... which is rooted in corrosion and fuel in oil. Diesels can also have these problems, but fuel in the oil is not as big of deal with them.

My vote for the OP is to get a diesel. There are enough things for a private citizen driver to worry about when towing over 10k lbs. Trying to do it with an under powered or overloaded vehicle makes it all worse.
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Old 07-23-2019, 11:58 PM   #30
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I have a 3500 Ram diesel. I bought for pulling my boat and trailer. I would never go back to a gas rig for towing! I was always leery of the cost of diesel so I shied away from them for years. Now I am a believer!
I ran over to Bend the other day, averaged 24 mpg over and back. When I run up I5, I get upwards of 30 mpg. Around town stop and go, 18 mpg. Pulling my 29’ boat or my 30’ 5th wheel my mileage drops down to 15 over the pass. Still better than any gas rig I have owned!
Pulling over the passes I am not winding out, just comfortable cruising... As far as mileage goes, it does pencil out!


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Would it be safe to assume that you modified some emissions equipment to get that mileage......... I'm not being critical, I just want to make a reader of this understands where the exceptional mileage figures come from.
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Old 07-24-2019, 06:19 AM   #31
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Yeah, I got a ram and get nowhere near that mpg. No hd diesel gets 30 mpg. These trucks weigh 8000 pounds and are not aerodynamic.


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Old 07-24-2019, 06:31 AM   #32
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Default Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

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Would it be safe to assume that you modified some emissions equipment to get that mileage......... I'm not being critical, I just want to make a reader of this understands where the exceptional mileage figures come from.


Straight from the factory, no chip or any other mod’s. You pay attention to the power band and learn how to drive it. I ran up to Portland from Salem twice last week to Take my wife for tests (she was diagnosed with cancer) going up I was getting right at 30 mpg. Then stop $ go brought me down to 22 mpg. The trip home took the average back up to 24 and it was still climbing. Not my numbers, the numbers put out by the trucks computer.


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Old 07-24-2019, 08:10 AM   #33
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

Mileage computers are notoriously optimistic. When you get the pencil and paper out along the mile markers, the vision starts to become clear. Just a couple weeks ago I finally convinced a buddy that his 2015 Cummins with 35" mud terrains wasn't getting 25mpg on the highway. Turns out it wasn't even 20, and the speedo is corrected for tire size.
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Old 07-24-2019, 10:11 AM   #34
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My 07 5.9 diesel gets 16.5mpg not towing. tank after tank. Stock no big tires or chips. On I5 in cruise at 62mph it will get 20. On flat land. The trip computer is generally 1/2 mpg off, high. I see the trip computer reading 16.8 on tank after tank. Calculator regularly shows 16.3 to 16.6
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Old 07-24-2019, 10:27 AM   #35
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No offense, but you are not getting any where near 30 mpg in a 3/4 or 1 ton diesel (nor even 25 mpg). The small GM Colorado's and Canyons with 4 cylinder diesels aren't getting that kind of mileage. My 06' Duramax, with no emissions devices and less weight than the 2019 trucks, is lucky to get 22 on the highway completely unloaded, and keeping speed below 65.

Download the Fuelly App for you phone and start tracking your mileage by hand at each fill up. You can see what other users have tracked for your particular make and model on their web site. The average for 2019 GM 3/4 tons with the 6.6 diesel seems to be in the 12-18 mpg range, across 10 different trucks and 129 fill ups tracked. The lowest is 9, the highest is 22... a lot of contractors/fleet managers use this app, so the low results are likely towing heavy. 2018 Ram 2500 w/ diesel average is 15-19, with the highest at 23 and the lowest at 8. 2006 Ram w/ the old 5.9 Cummins is 12-18, with a high of 20 and low of of 9.

The overhead computers are put in trucks to make people feel good. Mine will claim my truck is getting 20 mpg towing 7500# while hauling 4000# of camper, gear, and people. When I track it with Fuelly, I'm actually getting 12-14.
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Old 07-24-2019, 05:05 PM   #36
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No brainer. Go industrial and get yourself a gen3 Cummins. When you want to sell it in 10-15 years down the road, you’ll get your return on investment.
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Old 07-24-2019, 09:39 PM   #37
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

My brother and I have towed a 38’ fifth wheel toy hauler to the same spot near Lucerne, CA for years, with the same truck.

Trailer weighs ~16,000# the way we boogie, and the truck is a 2012 Ferd F-350 with 6.7 Powerstroke.

When the truck was 100% stock, we would pull right near 10MPG. Hand calculating every tank over a 2,100 mile round trip.
$2,500 worth of EGR delete, exhaust, and tuner later, we’re up to 42 MPG.

Shoot. That’s not true. We get 11 now.

The truck would pull Tehachapi at about 50-55 stock. We can do it at 60 now, and wouldn’t want to do more with the corners... It is more fun to drive, but it’ll take two lifetimes for that mileage difference to pay off...





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Old 07-25-2019, 04:34 AM   #38
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Yea only a little improvement but at least its not throwing codes I bet, freck'n Check engine light,,,gregg

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Old 07-25-2019, 05:42 AM   #39
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On my '05 Duramax the computer says I'm averaging 16.9, it never changes, has said that since day 1. Starting out from SW Beaverton, I can get to Post Falls, Idaho with at least 5 gallons still in the tank. I keep the tach at 2,000 rpm which is right at 68 mph. It's a long bed with the larger fuel tank. Next time I get fuel is Butte, MT because that's where I'm spending the night. Next fuel stop is Miles City, MT just because I don't want to have to stop somewhere else before Mott, ND, where I hunt out of. That's not a lot of fuel stops for a 1400 mile trip.
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Old 07-25-2019, 07:05 AM   #40
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

Some folks with diesels like to use the worlds best case scenarios to report fuel mileage. If I was to reset my mileage on my truck from Hood River to Portland on 84, I too would get 26-27mpg... lol. Usually empty I am 18-22 mpg if I drive 55-65mph. If I am going 75 it is going to change to about 16-19mpg. Usually towing the boat I am around 13mpg. 6k lb boat.

Towing my 14k dump trailer is usually 14mpg. Large living quarter horse trailer, 10-12mpg. Smaller bumper pull 4 horse trailer, 12-13mpg. Wind drag has a bunch to do with fuel mileage. Anyone claiming 25mpg on a 4x4 diesel is using best case scenario. Flat ground or down hill trips. Average that over 1000 miles and I bet it is no 25mpg.
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Old 07-25-2019, 07:15 AM   #41
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i got to 515 miles on a tank one time. On a hunting trip. 35 gallons got 14.71 MPG. about 400 miles was pulling my 17' tt. the rest going from camp to hunt starts. In my old gas dodge with 360, that trip would have burned 20 gallons more. with probably 1/2 hour of added towing time. The reason I own a diesel is my wife's 9100lb bumper pull travel trailer. I tried pulling it with the 360 gas d250 with 4.10 gears. It pulled lava butte on 97 south of bend at 20mph. A small grade. Then I bought an f250 with non turbo 7.3. that worked better for about 5 years. It would pull lava butte at 45mph. The 5.9 diesel will accelerate all the way up it. 70mph plus is not a problem. The 5.9 in my 07 is rated 325hp 600ftlb About the same as a gas 427 in an older vet.
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Old 07-25-2019, 07:35 AM   #42
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Good info on the 'true' gas mileage figures from folks that actually use pen and paper measurements over longer distances (rather than glancing at the silly screen readouts).

So my 6L gasser gets 9 MPG towing the 12000 pound trailer, 13 MPG when empty (towing nothing). Since I only use my truck for towing, it makes the 'better MPG' financial argument for a diesel look like a complete wash (9 MPG for gas, 10-12 MPG for diesel). I use a much higher MPG vehicle (not my pickup) for all my other non-towing driving. If my pickup was my only vehicle (therefore, lots of miles), the diesel would definitely be the choice.

Yes, a diesel will have more torque. The diesel is your 'safe choice' since you don't have to be as careful about the engine/rear-end combo you buy. The diesel will get better no-towing MPG compared to the gasser. But as others have said here, a 250 class gasser with good (4.10) rear end gears will get the towing job done too.

I've never been able to justify the initial outlay cost of a diesel for my towing-only use. But I did special order my gasser pickup to get the 4.10 gears. And the statement that a diesel will pay back in the end with a higher resale value forgets that all vehicles are a depreciating asset, not an 'investment'. That higher re-sale value will have cost you a lot of money.
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Old 07-25-2019, 08:02 AM   #43
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And the statement that a diesel will pay back in the end with a higher resale value forgets that all vehicles are a depreciating asset, not an 'investment'. That higher re-sale value will have cost you a lot of money.[/QUOTE]


Just Hauled my flat bed trailer to the job site loaded down with 8000 lb of widgets. I Invest in a brand new diesel pick up every few years and section 179 it , then work it every day for freight savings of about $300-$1000 a day 5 days a week + customer goodwill. Every other day I haul the big Tex dumper to metro saving a lot on drop box shuttle charges. It adds up and gives me economies of scale with just in time service over competitors who rely on outside LTL contractors and drop boxes. Occasionally Ill even get the chance to pull a fully loaded toy hauler so it Makes sense too me. "Big Diesels pay back in the end," - Big time Wish there was a way to section 179 that new mid engine corvette gasser.

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Old 07-25-2019, 08:26 AM   #44
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And the statement that a diesel will pay back in the end with a higher resale value forgets that all vehicles are a depreciating asset, not an 'investment'. That higher re-sale value will have cost you a lot of money.

Depends.
I bought my 04 dodge diesel in 2008. Had 35k on it for 14k. People were practically giving away diesel trucks. Fuel was pushing $5 a gallon. Drive that truck until last year. Had 180k trouble free miles. Killed the turbo and trans Memorial Day weekend and the rear end acted like it chipped a tooth. Sold it with known issues for 17k. No issues and I have no doubt I would have gotten 23-25k for it
Buy the right truck at the right time and take care of it and you can negate a lot of costs. Most people want what they want and get new trucks often. If you spend some time in it and take care of it you can do ok



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Old 07-25-2019, 08:52 AM   #45
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On my '05 Duramax the computer says I'm averaging 16.9, it never changes, has said that since day 1. Starting out from SW Beaverton, I can get to Post Falls, Idaho with at least 5 gallons still in the tank. I keep the tach at 2,000 rpm which is right at 68 mph. It's a long bed with the larger fuel tank. Next time I get fuel is Butte, MT because that's where I'm spending the night. Next fuel stop is Miles City, MT just because I don't want to have to stop somewhere else before Mott, ND, where I hunt out of. That's not a lot of fuel stops for a 1400 mile trip.
I have measured my fuel mileage many times on the freeway/highway on my 05 stock Duramax since it was new until earlier this year. Hand calculated with seeing liquid fuel-not foam- at the top of the neck of the fuel tank at the gas station, beginning and end of trips. Not towing anything. Worst was 16.0. Best was 16.2 I'm glad to see that I am not the only guy(maybe it is just you and me) that gets 5-10mpg less than everybody else in the world.
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Old 07-25-2019, 08:55 AM   #46
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I am not too concerned with fuel economy. If i were to go with a 3/4 or 1-ton gas I just want to make sure it has enough power to tow 8-10k trailer with the truck bed full of gear and the cab full with a family and dog and still be able to climb all the mountain ranges in Oregon sufficiently.
Look for an F350 with the 6.2 gas and 4.30 gears, you will be impressed.
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Old 07-25-2019, 09:53 AM   #47
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The diesel is your 'safe choice' since you don't have to be as careful about the engine/rear-end combo you buy.
+1 to this.

When I hear guys complain about how their gas rigs pull, they usually have no idea what rear end gears they are running. Gas engines produce half the torque of an equivalent displacement diesel, and need the mechanical advantage of low gearing in the rear end to compensate for it. Get a 4.30 or 4.10 rear end and gassers do ok. Get a truck w 3.55 or 3.73 rear end gearing and you won't be happy. Of course it's a trade off, the lower gearing you have back there the worse the fuel economy gets.

But I also agree w/ Bradly (at least when it comes to certain make/model trucks). A Dodge with the 5.9 Cummins in the "best years" for decent trannies, a 1999-2003 Ford w/ the 7.3, or a 2006-2007.5 GM with the 6.6 LBZ are always going to command high resale values. But... not all diesels do (*cough* Ford 6.0 *cough*).

IMO, the obscene pricing on the very latest year model trucks has more to do with diesel pickups becoming redneck BMW's more than their build quality or performance. When the next recession hits, there are going to be an awful lot of blinged out $60-80k diesel trucks that have never towed anything heaver than a couple yards of compost for sale at cut-rate prices
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Old 07-25-2019, 09:55 AM   #48
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Look for an F350 with the 6.2 gas and 4.30 gears, you will be impressed.
This is what I have and it pulls my 25 foot travel trailer fully loaded just fine. The MPG's aren't nearly as good as a diesel when towing but I can buy a lot of fuel for the difference in price between a gas rig and a diesel rig. I had a Chevy with the 6 liter gas motor and you had to keep that thing revved up high to get any power out of it. The 6.2 liter Ford cruises just fine at much lower rpm's. I had no problem going up the Warm Springs grade on the Mt. Hood side at 55 mph.
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Old 07-25-2019, 10:57 AM   #49
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... The 5.9 in my 07 is rated 325hp 600ftlb About the same as a gas 427 in an older vet.
With that torque coming at about 2000 rpms lower!
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Old 07-25-2019, 11:47 AM   #50
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Torque and horsepower measurements are calculated at full throttle, not how we drive our vehicles. The advertised number don't mean a whole lot if anything at all. If we constantly drove our vehicles utilizing 600 ft. lbs. of torque, the motor and entire drive train would give up in no time at all.


If measurements were calculated at half throttle or less, they would mean a whole lot more.


When I mentioned my computer mileage I said 16.9. Should have said, 16.7. Maybe someday I'll return to zero and let it recalculate. Honestly, I don't care what the mileage is as long as it isn't in the toilet. 14 would certainly qualify for the flush.
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Old 07-25-2019, 03:19 PM   #51
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Torque and horsepower measurements are calculated at full throttle, not how we drive our vehicles. The advertised number don't mean a whole lot if anything at all.
Sure they do. That's why you can drive to the grocery store, or pull 12,000lbs at 1500rpm in your Duramax.

We have a fairly long, steep hill on the way to our house. Our Toyota V8 would come to a stop if I asked it to pull the hill at 1500rpm empty. My Duramax does it at 1500rpm pulling 7000lbs, and that's certainly not at full throttle. The power ratings and rpm they are delivered at are relevant in day to day driving situations, especially towing trailers, which is what this thread is about.
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Old 07-25-2019, 03:44 PM   #52
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These threads go sideways so fast it's hilarious...
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Old 07-25-2019, 04:00 PM   #53
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Looking on opinions for Gas vs Diesel truck for towing a travel trailer. We are looking to get a travel trailer that is too big for my F-150 to tow, it can pull the weight but the payload would be well maxed out. Looking at the F-250 or F-350 but torn between a gasser or diesel. The trailer will be about 30-33' and weigh around 9-10k pounds. Only thing that is deterring me from a diesel is it wont be a daily driver. I may drive it once during the week and on weekends. I was told this is bad as a diesel needs to be used and not just sit in the driveway. What are your thoughts?


I'm running a 16 350 with the exhaust brake. It tows a decent sized sled (29') with 130 gallons of fuel. I get roughly 13 towing, up to 18-19 empty. It is lifted though and that will account for some loss. The current generation of diesels are dreams to tow with. My only real complaint is the cost of an oil and filter change. ITs super simple but about 90 in parts. The only real advantage to diesels especially the latest generation is they don't care what's behind them. I have hauled way over what the truck is rated for. Trans temp never rises, coolant temp never rises, oil temp never rises.





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Old 07-28-2019, 01:17 PM   #54
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I have a 2019 GMC crewcab Denali. Just returned from a trip to Flaming Gorge. 2300 miles at 11 mpg. Lots of winds. 80 mph speed limit across the salt flats, I ran 62 because of the winds. Has a 2800# Cirrus Camper and towing the 4500# boat/trailer. Did not have a problem going up hills, and some were steep. This is 2nd diesel, replaced an 04 Chevy. Brand new, driving from Dave Smith to home, got 18.5 mpg for the trip. Most of the trip at 70 mph. If I drove like my brother, slow, I would probably get 23 mpg. He gets 22 on his Duramax van.
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Old 07-28-2019, 10:38 PM   #55
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

As this thread got weird........

I'll throw out a couple of data points and fade back into the scenery:

1.) My Ram 3500 with the 6.7L Cummins, 37" tires, no emissions equipment, and access to computer controls that few others have........ gets 22mpg on the highway, unloaded. Towing a 16.5k lbs. boat/trailer from North Plains to LI, it got 17mpg.

2.) My completely unmodified 2018 F-350 averages 15mpg in the Portland combined drive cycle. Towing the same boat, it gets 14.1mpg. That being said, the gears are too low for my use case..... slightly larger tires will correct it.
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Old 07-29-2019, 06:28 AM   #56
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[QUOTE=dog;16070493]I have measured my fuel mileage many times on the freeway/highway on my 05 stock Duramax since it was new until earlier this year. Hand calculated with seeing liquid fuel-not foam- at the top of the neck of the fuel tank at the gas station, beginning and end of trips. Not towing anything. Worst was 16.0. Best was 16.2 I'm glad to see that I am not the only guy(maybe it is just you and me) that gets 5-10mpg less than everybody else in the world.

I wondered when someone would say how they fill a tank.
Can get 2 extra gal in mine if I fill it at Pacific Pride.
Funny how my mileage jumps .
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Old 07-30-2019, 06:10 AM   #57
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Default Re: Gas vs Diesel Truck for Trailer

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As this thread got weird........

I'll throw out a couple of data points and fade back into the scenery:

1.) My Ram 3500 with the 6.7L Cummins, 37" tires, no emissions equipment, and access to computer controls that few others have........ gets 22mpg on the highway, unloaded. Towing a 16.5k lbs. boat/trailer from North Plains to LI, it got 17mpg.

2.) My completely unmodified 2018 F-350 averages 15mpg in the Portland combined drive cycle. Towing the same boat, it gets 14.1mpg. That being said, the gears are too low for my use case..... slightly larger tires will correct it.
I would have to see the 37s getting 22 mph at freeway speeds to believe it. The same truck getting 17 mpg pulling 16.5 k is even more far fetched and I cannot fathom what “engine controls” you have access to that the rest of the industry doesn’t already know about.
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Old 07-31-2019, 12:53 AM   #58
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I would have to see the 37s getting 22 mph at freeway speeds to believe it. The same truck getting 17 mpg pulling 16.5 k is even more far fetched and I cannot fathom what “engine controls” you have access to that the rest of the industry doesn’t already know about.
If I still had the truck, I would be happy to demonstrate.......... Unfortunate;y, the truck wrapped around that drivetrain is terrible.

Without explaining too much about what I did and how I did it.......... It involves a RAM (acronym, not a brand) ECM and the hex code. Insert some relationship based tech. knowledge and a software editing suite, equates to me being able to due things tuners can't as they are reverse engineering things.
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Old 08-05-2019, 07:49 AM   #59
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...Download the Fuelly App for you phone and start tracking your mileage by hand at each fill up...
Thanks for sharing this. This is a pretty cool App. Have used it for a short time with my 2010 F150 and can see that my truck's mileage calculator is off slightly, in favor of better mileage than the actual.
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Old 08-05-2019, 09:07 AM   #60
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Thanks for sharing this. This is a pretty cool App. Have used it for a short time with my 2010 F150 and can see that my truck's mileage calculator is off slightly, in favor of better mileage than the actual.
Yep, when it comes to believing the overhead computer, better to think of it as a lie-o-meter.

What year model was the 22 mpg Ram w/ the 6.7? Looking at Fuelly, the average data for those trucks since 2014 seems to be around 15.5 mpg.
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