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Old 09-07-2009, 02:22 AM   #1
HappyTunafisherman
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Default Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Most of us have to rely on charts to make a decison on where to fish. Are you interested particiating in an exercise to see if charts are very useful in picking Tuna fishing grounds?

Hope you are interested in getting the answer to this question because it will require participation of any Salty Dog who goes fishing for Tuna on Tuesday(9/8) or Wednesday (9/9). Have chosen those dates because the weather outlook looks favorable that many boats wil be hunting and catching Tuna on these dates and that not many boats will be out tomorrow to point the way to the Tuna fishing grounds. Also, the warm water has moved considerably closer to shore over the last few days and the question is, "Has the Tuna moved with the warm water?"

EXERCISE:


Question: What is the best port in Oregon to launch from to catch Tuna next Tuesday (9/8) or Wednesday (9/9), considering range. Objective is to have highest probabilty of catching the most Tuna within the shortest miles from the Port.

If you want to participate in this exercise please look at the charts and add your answer to this question at the end of this thread (your choice for best Port and the number of miles to Tuna grounds from the port/bar).

If you would like to tell us why or how you arrived at your answer it will probably be useful to all of this in understanding how to interpret charts.

I plan to tally the submitted answers at the end this thread. Each Port will be given 1 point for each person who selects that port. We will also know the average estimanted miles from the port/bar to the tuna. Best chosen port has the highest number of points.

This Wednesday another thread will be started to ask Salty Dogs to reply with the actual of numbers of Tunas they caught on Tuesday or Wednesday and the average miles from the ports that they traveled from the port/bar to catch the Tuna.

Any suggestions on how to decide which port was the best port to leave from from would be appreciated.

We will all see if the forecast pointed to the right port and if not how far off was the forescast.

The Happy Tuna Fisherman (Gil)

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Old 09-07-2009, 08:22 AM   #2
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Simple...they're a very important tool. They will no doubt help you find fish or at the very minimum the most logical place to look for fish.

The two main services we use up here are Terrafin and Rip Charts...$200 a year for information any serious tuna fisherman can't live without.
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Old 09-07-2009, 11:46 AM   #3
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Thanks to Salty Dog Dylan's tutorial I have been using Coastwatch and like the ability to have the SST and the chlor. results on the same page. The temperature contour lines that show the highest temperature gradients in blue water look very helpful. But don't really know whether average days old data (because of cloud coverage) help one get to the best area to fish.

It's great that Salty Dogs, like Dylan, share their knowledge and spend their valuable time writing tutorials to help new Salty Puppys. This education is very helpful to "serious" fisherman, like me, who are new to Oregon Tuna fishing.

Plan to give my answers to the excercise tonight, after I have looked at the Coastwath charts one more time.

Appreciate you pointing out the other services; however, I'm happy with Coastwatch charts, especially after Sunday 9/7, when a friend showed me the current charts from Terrafin. Happened to notice that the Terrafin charts were not showing the same detail that the Coastwatch charts showed and it led me to wonder if anyone had tried to validate that the charts pointed to the best place to fish, considering constraints like boat range and the reality of using days old data, because of cloud coverage

If you thought I was trying to get free information that you pay for, then I must not have done a good job of writing-up the reason for the exercise. Just trying to add to the education of others and pay back for all of the help that I received from Salty Dogs, by spending my time to tally the results of the excercise and publish them.

The Happy Tuna Fisherman (Gil)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seelicious View Post
Simple...they're a very important tool. They will no doubt help you find fish or at the very minimum the most logical place to look for fish.

The two main services we use up here are Terrafin and Rip Charts...$200 a year for information any serious tuna fisherman can't live without.
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Old 09-07-2009, 01:03 PM   #4
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Did not think you were after something for nothing...if I understood the question "are charts very useful when picking Tuna fishing grounds?"

They're a real plus in finding fish. Do you have to subscribe to a service to be a "serious" tuna fisherman...I think yes...but who cares? It's your time and money, enjoy!

Good luck with the data collection!

Peace
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Old 09-07-2009, 07:39 PM   #5
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Based solely on analysis of the charts, Charleston appears to be best port to launch from to fish for Tuna on Tuesday if range is a contraint. Looks like one could find Tuna within approx 18 to 20 miles from the port, around the following coordinates.

43 degrees 25 min / 124 degrees 36 minutes
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Old 09-07-2009, 08:14 PM   #6
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTunafisherman View Post
Based solely on analysis of the charts, Charleston appears to be best port to launch from to fish for Tuna on Tuesday if range is a contraint. Looks like one could find Tuna within approx 18 to 20 miles from the port, around the following coordinates.

43 degrees 25 min / 124 degrees 36 minutes
Seems to me that unless you have a boat in every port, there are other factors to consider. Such as where your boat is, where your crew is, what bar or water conditions you face in each port, what waters you are familiar, and especially, what the fishing reports have been. So unless the question is just, "where is the closest warm water to a coastal port?", then I think the answer as to the best port to launch from on Tuesday is "It depends." I have a boat sitting in Cabo, does that count? Maybe I just don't understand the exercise...
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Old 09-07-2009, 08:23 PM   #7
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

As Seelicious says, they are a good tool that any serious tuna fisherman will use.

This time of year? Find the bait and the daily temp break and you'll most likely find the active fish. By this time of year the fish have been hanging around the same areas for awhile.
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Old 09-07-2009, 10:38 PM   #8
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

I have had this same question: how good is a 3 day old composite shot when you head out Saturday morning? (Especially if it is Tues/Wed/Thurs.) The answer - in my opinion -- not that good. . .but a heck of a lot better than nothing. It seems that the Coastwatch updates around noon -- so make your plot after that. Terrafin and Ripcharts have some useful features too. Many better fisherman than me use them exclusively or in conjunction with Coastwatch.

Up here, with our weather, we have a lot of cloud cover. So pretty often, the day before was cloudy and we don't have recent good data.

Your study sounds interesting but I think it might work better on a weekend when more guys are fishing.
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Old 09-08-2009, 10:14 AM   #9
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Thanks for responding Dylan.

I agree that other factors are also just as important as charts. For example, last weeks reports from this area were that the fish were not hitting trolling lines and that the tuna were small. The report from up North were much more positive, but one had to have a range capability to get to the fish.

Our home port is Florence so going up to Newport or down to Charleston is not a major factor for us. Being a serious fisherman, we would even drive up to Little Italy if the fish were within our range and the weather was good so that we could safely get to the tuna in our 19 foot boat.

We will find out, ourselves, if the charts pays off on Wed. 9/9. Leaving out of Charleston and will be start trolling approx at the same coordinates (after looking at the charts today). Plan to troll northwest and fish the blue side of the blue/green line, hopefully in 60-62F degree water.

If anyone fished this area today would apprecite if you shared how you did.

Wish us luck. We will publish our trip report when we return and hope it helps others.

The Happy Tuna Fisherman (Gil)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dylan View Post
I have had this same question: how good is a 3 day old composite shot when you head out Saturday morning? (Especially if it is Tues/Wed/Thurs.) The answer - in my opinion -- not that good. . .but a heck of a lot better than nothing. It seems that the Coastwatch updates around noon -- so make your plot after that. Terrafin and Ripcharts have some useful features too. Many better fisherman than me use them exclusively or in conjunction with Coastwatch.

Up here, with our weather, we have a lot of cloud cover. So pretty often, the day before was cloudy and we don't have recent good data.

Your study sounds interesting but I think it might work better on a weekend when more guys are fishing.
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Old 09-08-2009, 11:22 AM   #10
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Coastwatch works well, if you are familiar with how to use it. The data all comes from the same satelites, whether you pay for it or not.
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Old 09-08-2009, 12:54 PM   #11
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?



The value of the composite shot is to fill in the gaps over a 2-3 day period.

We print out color copies of these charts and take them with us...and we've seen real consistency with what the charts say and what the water conditions really are.
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Old 09-10-2009, 06:29 AM   #12
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

The coordinates below were approximately 19 miles from where the Tuna were found on Wednesday. I was out there on Wed and started hunting for Tuna at the location below. My hunt for Tuna was headed for the place where tuna were actually caught, but spent too much time trolling for tuna in unproductive areas and only came within 10 miles from the coordinates below.

Black Bolt and several other experiened Salty dogs caught the Tuna around lat 43 degrees 40 minutes, long 124 degrees 50 minutes.

It turned out that both Windy bar and Charleston were about the same distance to these Tuna Grounds.

The SST/Chlor charts are a good starting point for identifying the relatively small area to hunt for tuna, but this area could be large to cover by one boat within the fishing part of the day. Have started another thread asking for hints on how one hunts for Tuna within a realtively small area.

Hope that this new thread helps all the new Salty Dogs.

The Happy Tuna Fisherman (Gil)

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTunafisherman View Post
Based solely on analysis of the charts, Charleston appears to be best port to launch from to fish for Tuna on Tuesday if range is a contraint. Looks like one could find Tuna within approx 18 to 20 miles from the port, around the following coordinates.

43 degrees 25 min / 124 degrees 36 minutes
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Old 09-10-2009, 07:31 AM   #13
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Hi HappyTunaFisherman







There are nuances to this topic that are way beyond my current knowledge level, but I'm happy to share what I think about when planning a tuna trip, using yesterday fishing out of Newport 9/9 as an example.
  1. We had some of the best (5-star) terrafin reports of the season for 9/8. Hank & I studied these independently, put our thoughts together early in the morning, plotted out a zone with very promising temp and chlorophyl breaks
  2. We looked for an area with lots of other good spots nearby, in case our first thoughts didn't pan out
  3. We laid out a search pattern, with some ideas about temp and color breaks. Every time we saw or caught fish, we would mark the location. By mid-morning we had a very effective troll pattern on Hank's purple cedar plugs, and we also caught lots of jumpers casting 3" swim baits (blue back/white belly and black back/white belly worked well yesterday on 1.5 oz. jig heads; the fish were loaded with 2" silver/black bait fish; keep your swim baits small; match the hatch for tuna when you can)
  4. This time of year the fish are surface feeding a lot. Although we found nice looking water with good temp several miles closer than our target, we didn't actually start fishing until we saw some bird action. We hooked up right away on swim baits, although it was a windy, snotty ocean early on
  5. With the rough conditions, we changed our initial strategy (run & gun), broke out the cedar plugs, and caught a bunch while trolling 8mph in between casting to jumpers. Both methods were very effective
  6. It was often difficult early to spot jumpers (wind/swells/chop), but if you could spot even a few birds circling a ways out there, often we would find tuna. On Hank's beautiful 24' North River "Silver Bullet", I spent most of my day standing on the highest vantage looking for birds.
  7. One tip that has worked for me this year goes against some conventional tuna wisdom "don't leave tuna to find tuna"; where we first started catching fish, there were other boats in the area, the fish were a bit skittish, and too often the jumpers were closer to another boat. We went back to our terrafin charts (printed and on board), headed towards our next pre-defined target, and found a bunch of tuna with no other boat pressure. I have done this a couple of times this year, and it has worked well for me. Find your own fish, it is more fun and (for me) has been very productive
  8. If you want to see specifically what we were looking at on Terrafin, the center of our search pattern was around 45.02/125.03. Excellent temp, good color breaks, lots of other very good water nearby if that location didn't pan out. We actually started catching jumpers just short of this location, caught several just past this location, and saw a bunch of jumpers while cruising in late in the afternoon with a pretty full load of nice grade tuna (23, which was about all we wanted).
Good Luck! And Good Fishing!

Rod Lathrop
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Old 09-13-2009, 01:19 PM   #14
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Wink Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Thanks Rod,

Thanks for your reply

I'm still trying learning how to pick the area to use and did look at the CoastalWatch charts around 45.02/125.03. Best I could get was a 3 day average centered on 9/8. Your spot did look good. To me there was another spot east of 125.03 that also looked good on this 3 day average chart.

I'ver tried to attach the chart to this message. Not sure if it will show up.

The Happy Tuna Fisherman (Gil)

http://coastwatch.pfeg.noaa.gov/coas...animationFPS=2







Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Rotten View Post
Hi HappyTunaFisherman










There are nuances to this topic that are way beyond my current knowledge level, but I'm happy to share what I think about when planning a tuna trip, using yesterday fishing out of Newport 9/9 as an example.
  1. We had some of the best (5-star) terrafin reports of the season for 9/8. Hank & I studied these independently, put our thoughts together early in the morning, plotted out a zone with very promising temp and chlorophyl breaks
  2. We looked for an area with lots of other good spots nearby, in case our first thoughts didn't pan out
  3. We laid out a search pattern, with some ideas about temp and color breaks. Every time we saw or caught fish, we would mark the location. By mid-morning we had a very effective troll pattern on Hank's purple cedar plugs, and we also caught lots of jumpers casting 3" swim baits (blue back/white belly and black back/white belly worked well yesterday on 1.5 oz. jig heads; the fish were loaded with 2" silver/black bait fish; keep your swim baits small; match the hatch for tuna when you can)
  4. This time of year the fish are surface feeding a lot. Although we found nice looking water with good temp several miles closer than our target, we didn't actually start fishing until we saw some bird action. We hooked up right away on swim baits, although it was a windy, snotty ocean early on
  5. With the rough conditions, we changed our initial strategy (run & gun), broke out the cedar plugs, and caught a bunch while trolling 8mph in between casting to jumpers. Both methods were very effective
  6. It was often difficult early to spot jumpers (wind/swells/chop), but if you could spot even a few birds circling a ways out there, often we would find tuna. On Hank's beautiful 24' North River "Silver Bullet", I spent most of my day standing on the highest vantage looking for birds.
  7. One tip that has worked for me this year goes against some conventional tuna wisdom "don't leave tuna to find tuna"; where we first started catching fish, there were other boats in the area, the fish were a bit skittish, and too often the jumpers were closer to another boat. We went back to our terrafin charts (printed and on board), headed towards our next pre-defined target, and found a bunch of tuna with no other boat pressure. I have done this a couple of times this year, and it has worked well for me. Find your own fish, it is more fun and (for me) has been very productive
  8. If you want to see specifically what we were looking at on Terrafin, the center of our search pattern was around 45.02/125.03. Excellent temp, good color breaks, lots of other very good water nearby if that location didn't pan out. We actually started catching jumpers just short of this location, caught several just past this location, and saw a bunch of jumpers while cruising in late in the afternoon with a pretty full load of nice grade tuna (23, which was about all we wanted).
Good Luck! And Good Fishing!

Rod Lathrop
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Old 09-13-2009, 02:18 PM   #15
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Trying again to attach a chart. Left click on the thumbnail several times to enlarge it.

What do you think of location 124.75 degrees (124 degrees 45 minutes) and Lat 125.1 degrees (124 degrees 6 minutes) as another fishing area if 45.02/125.03 didn't produce?



Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTunafisherman View Post
Thanks Rod,

Thanks for your reply

I'm still trying learning how to pick the area to use and did look at the CoastalWatch charts around 45.02/125.03. Best I could get was a 3 day average centered on 9/8. Your spot did look good. To me there was another spot east of 125.03 that also looked good on this 3 day average chart.

I'ver tried to attach the chart to this message. Not sure if it will show up.

The Happy Tuna Fisherman (Gil)

http://coastwatch.pfeg.noaa.gov/coas...animationFPS=2
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Old 09-13-2009, 02:22 PM   #16
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Sorry meant 45 degrees 6 minutes/ 124 45 minutes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyTunafisherman View Post
Trying again to attach a chart. Left click on the thumbnail several times to enlarge it.

What do you think of location 124.75 degrees (124 degrees 45 minutes) and Lat 45.1=.1 degrees (45 degrees 6 minutes) as another fishing area if 45.02/125.03 didn't produce?
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Old 09-13-2009, 03:09 PM   #17
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

To start with, this is my first year tuna fishing. I've learned a lot very quickly but I'm still now.

I notice that you seem to concentrate on the chloro charts. I understand that they often corespond to temp charts but not always. The last time I went out in my boat we caught fish all day in green water. The temp was right but the water never got even close to nice and blue. I've also noticed that our biggest fish were caught in greener water trolling. We catch more small fish in jumping territory but they are typically smaller.

When I look at the charts, I tend to look at the temperature more than anything and it has gotten us fish every time I've had any part of the decision making process. Granted, fish have been pletiful this year from what I understand.

I also wait until we hit 60 degree water or jumpers. Every time we've put rods in early in lower temps like 58, we waste an hour or so trolling and then pull up the lines and head to warmer waters where we hook up quickly.

Do you watch the OSU site? That seems to be one of the best free sites for tuna and its geared specifically for tuna.

http://agate.coas.oregonstate.edu/da...a_nowcast.html

Thanks for the discussion. And thanks Rod for the detailed information.

Matching the hatch is one thing I'm having trouble doing because I can't find small metal jigs to cast that look like the small fish they are feeding on. I decided to try making some of my own today for Tuesdays fishing. I plasma cut some fish shaped jigs out of some polished 1/8" stainless. I'll put a hook on the bottom and a swivel on the top and see how they do. They are about the size of the bait fish I've been seeing and they have blue around the outside where the torch heated the metal. Hope they work!

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Old 09-13-2009, 04:19 PM   #18
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Default Re: Are you interested in seeing how good are SST and Chlor. charts?

Fish are more or less plentifull most all years - you still have to find them. The chloro charts are helpfull in that tuna prefer "cleaner water" for the most part - BUT come into the "dirty" water to feed. Often the larger fish are caught just over the edge so to speak. Big fish feed more often, or at least require more food. But of course if the feed is plentifull in the cleaner water - no need to move. Tuna prefer chloro levels from .2 to .8, or so I've read (here). It helps to cover as many bases as posible....... Hope this helps - and feel free, someone, to correct me.......And of course you already know how important the temp is......If you can get (or find) a good temp break AND a good chloro break together - now you have an even better place to start.

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