Theo Roosevelt

FastActionRodTip · 11-15-2005, 01:05 PM

"In the first place we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or origin. But this is predicated upon the man's becoming in very fact an American, and nothing but an American...There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag, and this excludes the red flag, which symbolizes all wars against liberty and civilization, just as much as it excludes any foreign flag of a nation to which we are hostile...We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language...and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people."

Theodore Roosevelt 1907

wannacatchem · 11-15-2005, 01:09 PM

here, here!

now I'll just :lurk:

On a mission · 11-15-2005, 01:18 PM

If only we would do this? How much would we save in time, money, fighting amongst our selves, saving "the true American culture". WE could celeberate Christmas in the schools? We could sing real Christmas songs. It wouldn't be celeberating everthing but the traditions of the United States of America. DON'T GET ME GOING!

JustCallMeDave · 11-15-2005, 01:24 PM

*trigger finger twitching*

Cool Texan · 11-15-2005, 01:30 PM

I have a friend from Pakistan who is an American citizen now, but still speaks Paki-language and who still loves Pakistan.

So...you're saying he's not an American?? You're saying that he's not welcome in 'your' country? You're saying you are a better American than him? Actually, I dont know what you're trying to say on this thread.

(yes, I know they are TR's words but you posted them with no other comment, so....)

FastActionRodTip · 11-15-2005, 01:33 PM

just got that one and this one today, thought they were interesting...take it for what it's worth

[racist rant removed - cb]

I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG, OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AND TO THE REPUBLIC, FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL!

On a mission · 11-15-2005, 01:38 PM

No problem. Just what Pesident Rosevelt said was that if your an American you should honor the American ideal and culture first. My friends also speak more than one language. It just seems to me that we are over doing the diversity thing and throwing out all the things we started in OUR country for all the incoming folks. I'm not sure thats all good. No anger here just wanting whats equal to "ALL".

Cool Texan · 11-15-2005, 01:41 PM

Uh, its not from Rooney...its from someone who feels tough enough to say this but needs to hide his real identity.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/rooney4.asp

FastActionRodTip · 11-15-2005, 01:45 PM

oh well, interesting nonetheless....turn down the sensitivity meter dude, it's LIG afterall

bcanini · 11-15-2005, 02:06 PM

I agree, does that make me bad? no! I believe you come here speak the language, I shouldn't have to learn a 2nd language just to communicate w/ an American citizen.
Granted there are people here that came to America and wholly contribute and make this country what it was founded on and there are some well.. that don't including naturalized Americans.
I think people are just afraid to say how they really feel about things anymore.

Brian :grin:

Pescadote · 11-15-2005, 02:19 PM

Take a few deep breaths, calm down, don't say anything you will regret!

OK, just a little bit of history. My Great Grandparents didn't ever learn to speak English even though they moved here when they were teenagers. My Grandparents were fully bilingual. My Dad spoke German in his home until he got to high school. I didn't learn any German from my father because his family stopped speaking it when all of the kids got to school. Do you see a pattern here?

I believe if you look at the history of immigrants to our country, you see a gradual move towards English speaking and away from the native language. It's not easy to learn to fully function in another language - have any of you every tried it? I learned Spanish in my thirties, and I tell you that it was not easy. I also had the advantages of knowing how to read, a good educational background, and a time and place to study. Most linguists believe that it takes 5 - 7 years of of language study and immersion to become fully bilingual. Notice the word "study" because many immigrants are so busy working menial jobs that they do not have the time to study.

I currently work as a teacher to English Language Learners. I have never, ever, heard a student of mine say that English was not important to their survival in the United States.

So, I don't want to be the P.C. police here, or appear overly sensitive, but I felt that I needed to reply to some of the previous posts which I believe crossed the line into overt racism or at least misinformation. I am, after all, the great grandson of economic immigrants.

Pescadote

On a mission · 11-15-2005, 02:26 PM

I don't think anyone crossed the line. Talk about taking a breath.

Salmo trutta · 11-15-2005, 02:37 PM

Theodore Roosevelt was a great President. Probably the last great Republican President. It's just a shame that todays policios don't have the [petunias] that this guy had.

JustCallMeDave · 11-15-2005, 02:50 PM

Based on the Acceptable Use Policy of Ifish the line has thusfar been crossed twice and towed a bit more. Another will lock this thread and have your birthday taken away.

Silver Hilton · 11-15-2005, 03:22 PM

Quote:

"...Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all..."

Good words, in context, expecially if you consider lumping the terms "democrat" and "republican" into the mix with "french", "german", and "spanish".

bcanini · 11-15-2005, 06:29 PM

My great grandparents came to America in the 1800's they learned English and communicated in English when needed, my granparents, they spoke English and Italian, same deal. I just think that alot of people don't try.
I would like to communicate in English in America, If I went somewhere to work and live, I'd learn the language well enough to communicate effectively.

Brian

STGRule · 11-15-2005, 06:33 PM

In Europe most citizens of a lot of those countries are not just bi-lingual, they are multi-lingual. They all learn how in school. As I found out when I visited close relatives in Norway. This arrogant American (that would be me) watched a clerk at the grocery store speak 3 languages to three different customers. Including English to me because I hadn't taken the time or effort to learn anything else. Somehow I doubt that made her less a Norwegian. That just plain made her a better person than me.

ampersat · 11-15-2005, 07:09 PM

Just because someone speaks more languages than you do does not make them a better person, regardless of the circumstances. I'll bet you can catch far more sturgeon than that store clerk. Does that make you a better person?

The unfortunate reality (or fortunate, depending on your point of view) is that with the internationalization of the world as a whole, countries become increasingly meaningless. If a person can move to another country and become a citizen there by passing a few tests and "swearing" allegiance, what good is there in having countries? What does it mean to be an American citizen, or an Italian citizen, or a Canadian citizen or what have you, if anyone can do it? Once you pass the tests and "swear" allegiance, you're free to speak whatever language you like and practice whatever customs or rituals you so choose. There is nothing in the American citizenship ritual that specifies what you must believe or how you must behave.

If there are no borders, and increasingly in our world economy (in every sense of the word) there are no borders, then effectively there are no countries.

Getting back to the original post:

Quote:

just as much as it excludes any foreign flag of a nation to which we are hostile

So, swearing allegiance to the US flag but displaying the British flag is just fine? I believe this is a quote which must be put back into context to be fully understood in its meaning.

Is it tea time yet? That scone sure looks good.

STGRule · 11-15-2005, 07:14 PM

Okay, not a better person, but it does make her a better human. We sit here in out little borders thinking we are better than everybody else. It simply isn't true. We just do things different, not better. To me, it's the same as all the stupid cliques in highschool. I was one of the lucky ones and fit in where ever I was, with whomever I was with. I also saw what it did to those that didn't. I kind of lost faith all the way back then. :depressed:

wishin · 11-15-2005, 07:50 PM

Gosh STGRule, that is kind of cynical. I am not sure that I read any of the posts above saying that any one individual is better than another. But, we can darn sure be extremely proud of our country. The USA is a fantastic country. A land of freedom and opportunity. And yup, I think that it is the greatest country in the world! Does that make me better than anyone else. Nope, just lucky to be here.

Don't confuse patriotism with arrogance. We should not be ashamed to take pride in our country.

wishin

STGRule · 11-15-2005, 07:57 PM

Pride in our country will never be a problem, especially when we do good things. And we do good things. Every once in awhile we do things that are not good because we think we know better. I just wish there was less of that. I'm proud of where I live, just not proud of us all the time.