This Thurs. - Gillnetters v. Anglers, St.Helens

Phunybonz · 10-26-2005, 08:47 PM

http://wdfw.wa.gov/com/nov0305.htm
That was a link to the days festivities. It has been noted that public testimony will not be given. However, I think it is important for us sportsfishers to stand and be counted. A good showing by our side will go a long way in helping our cause. Let's keep the pressure on, it's working! We have been noticed these past 2 meetings. I refuse to lose to a group that hides behind the church lady.
I have taken that day off and will be thier in support of our cause, any others?
How about making some signage?
How about a pre meeting meeting on Nov. 1st or 2nd?
Now is the time to put up or take what they give us.

garyk · 10-26-2005, 09:56 PM

Thanks for the reminder....planning to be there.

Could meet on a prior evening. Thanks again

fish-r-on · 10-26-2005, 11:50 PM

I'll hold a sign if it will help.

Ron

ICFish · 10-27-2005, 12:13 AM

I should be there. what day of the week is it. These last 2 meetings were my first. The more I goto and the more I learn. I see how important these meetings are. Come on people we need to pack the place.

Phunybonz · 10-27-2005, 12:29 AM

It late and I'm gonna donate another 10 drink tickets. We are gonna meet before the 3rd aren't we? Pick a spot or one will be picked for you. How's the future feel? Wow, did I just say that? Scary.......

BCF · 10-27-2005, 06:14 AM

Quote:

I'll hold a sign if it will help.

Ron

I'll do a body tatoo, We could get a lot written but people will get dizzy going round and round trying to read every word. Besides they might think we beached a whale to write our message on it and were harming the resources.

I'll try to be there for this one. I might not be able to do it this time.

BCF

P.S. Fight the five year plan

flywrapper · 10-27-2005, 06:15 AM

Hey Mod, could this go to the top to replace the post on past meeting?
We sportfishers need to be at ALL these meetings in big numbers. The gillnetters want LARGER allocations of the springer run and sturgion catch, and they want the larger allocations for 5 years!
I'm a political newbee, but the "North of Falcon process" is fact gathering followed by citizen input (spelled interest), I think. If we don't provide our voice, it will not be heard, and we are out of the decision loop. Looking to organizations (other groups of folks) to do the voicing is to give up our power and responsability. The only reason that 150 hobby netters still ply the C with gear banned as being non-discriminatory in most other fisheries is because few others opposed them.
Salmon fishing on the C has been described as "difficult" because it takes around 4 days to catch one salmon. Factor in lower returns and larger commercial catch and fishing will absolutely positively guaranteed SUCK.
Be there or dust off the pasture pool sticks.
My 2c

Phunybonz · 10-27-2005, 08:56 AM

At the very least we should have something that sets us apart from the opposition. It was definately a wierd feeling walking in to the Cathlamete meeting. It took awhile to find fellow ifishers. With a little fore thought we could all walk in as a group.

freespool · 10-27-2005, 02:20 PM

One thing that might set us apart is our clothing and head gear.
Fish print shirts, North River-Ifish-GLoomis hats.
Dress for success, and show your fishing colors.
With this being a no public comment type meeting, we need to stand out in the crowd.

salmon hugger
Just say no to the five year plan.

Kevin Newell · 10-27-2005, 09:20 PM

I'm planning on being there! I'm looking forward to meeting some more Ifishers!

thumbar · 10-28-2005, 03:00 AM

my daughter and i would love to go :grin:

it would be our first meet'n. if we could hitch a ride with someone it would be great

we would like to meet some of the folkshere on ifish

Jennie@ifish · 10-28-2005, 05:43 AM

I'm sending Ampersat some name tags and he will be there. Please look for Amp to get your name tags, so that you can recognize ifishers.

Jen

Jennie@ifish · 10-28-2005, 02:24 PM

Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife
Contact: Brad Wurfel (503) 947-6020
Internet: www.dfw.state.or.us Fax: (503) 947-6009

For Immediate Release Friday, Oct. 28, 2005

Fish and Wildlife Commission to meet in St. Helens

SALEM - The Oregon Fish and Wildlife Commission today announced important changes to its Nov. 3-4 monthly meeting in St. Helens.

The Commission will host its scheduled Nov. 3 joint meeting with the Washington Fish and Wildlife Commission to discuss Columbia River fisheries. Topics will include salmon and sturgeon harvest, allocation and other co-management issues. The meeting is scheduled from 10 a.m. to 3 p.m. at the Columbia County Fairgrounds Pavilion, 58892 Sausler Road.

However, anticipated action at the Nov. 4 meeting to revise Oregon's Wolf Conservation Plan has been removed from the Commission's Friday agenda. The decision was made after the Union County Cattlemen, the Oregon Cattlemen's Association and the Union County Board of Commissioners made formal requests, pursuant to ORS 183.335. The law provides for an agency extension of its intended rulemaking action at the request of interested parties.

With the new timeline, the Oregon Fish and Wildlife Commission is scheduled to make a final rulemaking decision on the proposed wolf plan revisions and associated administrative rules beginning at 1 p.m. during the Commission's meeting Thursday, Dec. 1, in Salem.
Also removed from the Friday agenda is a proposed amendment to requirements for wildlife rehabilitators' holding permits. ODFW staff requested a more detailed review of the proposal.

The Friday Commission meeting at the Columbia County Fairgrounds Pavilion will include discussion and possible adoption of administrative rule to establish a limited entry system for the commercial bay clam dive fishery. Also on the agenda is an informational presentation on fish passage rules.

The Commission is the policy making body for fish and wildlife issues in the state. The seven-member panel meets monthly. Agenda item exhibits may be requested by calling the ODFW Director's Office at 800-720-6339 or 503-947-6044. Agenda items also can be found on ODFW's Web site at www.dfw.state.or.us/agency/commission/minutes/.

Public testimony is invited. Sign-up sheets will be available in the hallway outside the meeting room the day of the meeting for persons who want to testify on scheduled agenda items. Persons seeking to testify on issues not on the formal agenda may do so by making arrangements with the ODFW Director's Office, at least 24 hours in advance, by calling 800-720-6339 or 503-947-6044.

All non-agenda testimony, also called "unscheduled testimony," begins at 1 p.m. and is limited to about six speakers for up to five minutes each.
Reasonable accommodations will be provided as needed for individuals requesting assistive hearing devices, sign language interpreters or large-print materials. Individuals needing these types of accommodations may call the ODFW Director's Office at 800-720-6339 or 503-947-6044 at least 24 hours in advance of the meeting.
###

Splash · 10-28-2005, 02:42 PM

OK I'm confused on this one after reading the update. Is their going to be public testimony taken at the Nov. 3rd meeting (please, please, please, please, please)?

Anybody needing a gas sharing passenger from Vancouver please pm me.

Phunybonz · 10-28-2005, 05:06 PM

Bring a few copies of your testimony and give it to those you deem fit. What are they gonna do? what's the worst that could happen? I will be giving hand outs myself, bring yours . Just be nice and ask if they could read your information. See you there!

jimsbuddy · 10-30-2005, 08:26 AM

well ive never attended meetings like this for fishing or other things, but with recent developments in the fishing budgets/ regulations and such, I feel compelled to show up... add one more voice to the crowd...

Bill Monroe · 10-31-2005, 06:14 AM

Quote:

OK I'm confused on this one after reading the update. Is their going to be public testimony taken at the Nov. 3rd meeting (please, please, please, please, please)?

Anybody needing a gas sharing passenger from Vancouver please pm me.

No public testimony Thursday...it's only for both commissions to hear the same stuff at the same time from their staffs. They're the only ones who will listen and ask questions, then will talk with each other.

slabhunter · 10-31-2005, 09:05 AM

Anyone have directions for the meeting?

I'd like to attend if possible.

Phunybonz · 10-31-2005, 05:31 PM

Phunybonz · 10-31-2005, 05:57 PM

Thursday, November 3, 2005; 10:00 a.m.
Joint Meeting of the Oregon and Washington Fish and Wildlife Commissions
Columbia County Fairgrounds, Pavilion
58892 Saulser Road
St. Helens, Oregon
Please mapquest it, I'm not smart enough to get it to here.
I think it's time to really start pushing for some bodies.

garyk · 10-31-2005, 08:06 PM

The horse's are being fed and saddled. Come Thursday, the South-County-North-Slough posse will be there

Seefood Man · 11-01-2005, 06:52 AM

We should have a tailgate party and fill the stadium

slabhunter · 11-01-2005, 09:20 AM

Thanks for the effort to post a link.

I hope to see lots of friedly people at the meeting. :grin:

Fshklr · 11-01-2005, 10:32 AM

The Cathlamet meeting was taped live..it is airing NOW in public access tv.

Channel 11 for Adelphia users

No Bail · 11-01-2005, 05:41 PM

I just got off the phone with the Columbia Cable Access office, and they explained that they are a non-profit with no cash on the books. They want about $125 to video four hours of the joint Commission meeting. They will show it on channel 29 in the Columbia County area, and agreed to offer the tape to another provider so it could be shown in Portland.

I admit that I'm surprised by the cost, but I'm willing to put up $25 to see the testimony, as I have to work that day.

What do you think? Is it worth the cost to have their crew video the meeting? I think it would add more pressure and public exposure to the process. Much to be said for a transparant process in government.

Obviously if anyone agrees with me, I need to put this together tomorrow. Let me know what your thoughts are on the video charge.

Ichthyoid

Phunybonz · 11-01-2005, 08:17 PM

Book em. I got 25 and I'm sure the rest will chip in. This has been a process that works under the cover of darkness. I'm sure shedding some light on the issues will be monies well spent on our behalf.
I would like to meet before the meeting for coffee, anyone have a spot they think will work?

garyk · 11-01-2005, 09:07 PM

I'll see your $25.

Splash · 11-02-2005, 07:49 AM

Ditto the $25. Remember there is no testimony at this meeting.

I fully agree that airing video of the meetings can help enlighten others about how a perceived "closed process" actually works.

My only concern is that some may think since it is getting air time that there is no need to attend the meetings. Attendance in numbers and testimony is the best way for the decision makers to know where people stand on an issue.

garyk · 11-02-2005, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Remember there is no testimony at this meeting.

Apparantly no oral comments.

However you can submit written testimony to the ODFW Commissioners at any time. This is a good opportunity to submit your written comments to the meeting's secretary.

No Bail · 11-02-2005, 04:20 PM

I'll call Columbia Cable to see if I can set it up, and send PM's to those that indicated a willingness to chip in. If they want the funds up front I cannot get to their office in time. Hopefully they will take my word for a check in the mail.

Ichthyoid

I called and left a message. If they call back this evening I'll set up the coverage.

OK, Mark from Columbia Community Cable will cover this event, and it will air about a week from tomorrow if he has time to edit it. Me is working hard to make the coverage, and I'll stop by and give him my check Saturday at their new space in St. Helens.

If some one were to offer him a nice fish shirt to wear, he would probably put it on. It would be nice to see a sportsman camera for the joint meetings. No pressure!

Wish I could make it, I'll have to watch on TV.

Ichthyoid

garyk · 11-02-2005, 05:11 PM

GOOD work

flywrapper · 11-02-2005, 05:43 PM

Have 3 xtra seats. Leaving Vancouver Mall 8;45am PM me if you need a ride. Will read and call by 7:00am
Rick

Pete · 11-02-2005, 06:37 PM

I'm really distressed that I can't attend. New job and no time off earned yet. Please, please, please make a good showing and let the powers that be aware of the importance of sportfishing to the culture, history, economy and future of the Pacific Northwest. I know there's no opportunity for comment, but the testimony of numbers is very important. After Cathlamet, the netters will be out in force. Please show the team colors! I'll be with you in spirit!

fish-n-alot · 11-02-2005, 07:02 PM

Both of these meetings look very interesting and if members could make it to both it would be great BUT if not at least make it to one or the other so that you can sign up as a sport fisherman vs. gill netter. The way I read this series of emails is: Vancouver is a listen and not a comment meeting. The St. Helens is a meeting where we can provide comments. I am going to make it to at least the Friday morning St. Helens meeting and if I can call into my meetings tomorrow I will go and listen in Vancouver. QUESTION: Is anyone from iFish going to provide comment on Friday and if so do you want help or ?? if so send me a separate email I'm available..... :smile:

garyk · 11-02-2005, 08:00 PM

Fish Alot, tomorrow Thursday is the meeting where the staff brief the commissioners on the angler/gillnetter allocations.

Follow the link to see Friday's agenda. Sports angling isn't on it:

http://www.dfw.state.or.us/agency/co...inutes/05/Nov/

Hope you can make it on Thursday!

ampersat · 11-02-2005, 09:32 PM

Look for the hat, folks. I'll be out front handing out Ifish "my name is" labels. Get your label and show your support!

Steelie Chaser · 11-03-2005, 05:26 PM

Hoping it got taped. I'll gladly contribute $25 to cover the cost as well. Unfortunately I'm stuck at home and did not make the meeting today.

No Bail · 11-03-2005, 05:51 PM

The Columbia Community videographer called me in the morning and told me that a crew from Olympia was set up with three cameras and an audio feed to capture the entire event. He exchanged info with them and they will trade tapes with him so it can be aired in Columbia County. He will send me an email as to the day and time. I'll try to get the tape to other cable outlets in Portland.

Thanks to all that offered $25, but it will not be necessary. I'm still gonna give a small donation to Columbia for his time to show up. They are a non-profit after all.

Ichthyoid

Ethical hunter · 11-05-2005, 11:58 AM

We are like a pack of rats furiously fighting over the scaps BPA leaves.

Gillnetters are NOT what is limiting salmonid recovery; nor are snaggers. Poor land and river use practices ARE limiting salmonid recovery. The commercials are in this fight WITH us not against us.

HB

freespool · 11-05-2005, 12:32 PM

Quote:

The commercials are in this fight WITH us not against us.

HB

Then why do we keep getting that shafted feeling year after year? :blush:
How about a season where we get to keep fishing and the commericals get to go home?

I for one, would like to see what that feels like.

Don't look now Harry, the sleeping giant is starting to wake up, and I think he's real PO'd. :grin:

salmon hugger

Ethical hunter · 11-05-2005, 01:25 PM

Liz, I know that as executive director of NSIA the bottom line for your organization, and to a degree yourself, is directly related to the length of sport fishing seasons. But, we both know that we are squabbling over the scaps. Combating the netters and making them the "poster child" of blame for all that is wrong with columbia river salmonids is misguided.

How can one user group that has a significant impact on endangered salmonids target, and wish to limit or exterminate, another user group BECAUSE that group too has an impact. Do you see the "conflict of interest" beacon flashing - or perhaps that very conflict of interst is what blinds.

HB

freespool · 11-05-2005, 01:59 PM

Joe, be it as it may, we are going to stand up for the 200k fishing license holders, who expect a full season. If we keep shutting them off, they will soon stop buying fishing licenses. The paying public has a right to expect a full season, period.
And as far as scraps goes, Judge Redden seems to be getting a handle on that.

See ya at the next meeting, hope it's a large venue, I feel a big crowd coming on.

salmon hugger

salmon hugger

Bill Monroe · 11-05-2005, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Liz, I know that as executive director of NSIA the bottom line for your organization, and to a degree yourself, is directly related to the length of sport fishing seasons. But, we both know that we are squabbling over the scaps. Combating the netters and making them the "poster child" of blame for all that is wrong with columbia river salmonids is misguided.

How can one user group that has a significant impact on endangered salmonids target, and wish to limit or exterminate, another user group BECAUSE that group too has an impact. Do you see the "conflict of interest" beacon flashing - or perhaps that very conflict of interst is what blinds.

HB

Liz...this what I would write in a column...may still, in fact.
We should all be careful that the feds don't decide sea lions should get some of the non-tribal allocation.

garyk · 11-05-2005, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Combating the netters and making them the "poster child" of blame for all that is wrong with columbia river salmonids is misguided.

That'd be true, IF IT ACTUALLY HAPPENED. Nobody is doing that though - except in your post which is a gross mischaracterization.

Those of us who attended the Vancouver, St.Helens meeting & evening reception, and especially the Cathlamet meeting found them to be real eye-openers as to what the gillnet industry is all about.

Over-harvest of ESA stocks IS a significant factor hampering salmon recovery. The gillnetters with their non-selective method are part of this problem.

Add to that, the gillnetters lobbying to triple the kill of sensitive lower Columbia steelhead stocks, refusal to move to more selective techniques, killiing the wild coho that anglers release, hostility to on-board observors, and illegal activities, and I'll go find other "allies". The fish can't afford friends like that.

Ethical hunter · 11-05-2005, 02:30 PM

Liz, as executive director of NSIA are you stating that "full sport fishing seasons" are the most important issue to NSIA. Obviously, salmonid recovery is a secondary issue at best. We know where NSIA stands on targeting the oversize below Bonny - in clear opposition to the biological opinion.

Biology before industry!

As an avid sportfisher, I am satisfied with the abundant fishing oppritunities the columbia river provides. I have no problem with the current allocation. I am happy with what I have. So, dont include me in the 200k, its 199,999 at best

HB

PS in case you didnt catch this - Biology before industry!

Ethical hunter · 11-05-2005, 02:50 PM

Over-harvest of ESA stocks IS a significant factor hampering salmon recovery. The gillnetters (and sportfishers) with their non-selective method are part of this problem.

My point exactly Gary. Notice how you forgot to include sportfishers with the non - selective crowd. The very nature of hook and line fishing is non - selective. There is no way to establish what you have until that fish is boatside, hatchery or native. Under the best of conditions 10% of those released will die - that number is much higher in the real world. We as sportfishers are a significant factor in the recovery of ESA listed salmonids.

Why do we want the gillnetters off the river again - oh, I remember; they have a significant impact on ESA listed salmonids. But.....But, dont sportfishers have an ampact on ESA listed salmonids also?

HB

Biology before industry!

Beefcake · 11-05-2005, 03:00 PM

Harry (and Bill),

I agree that BPA is the major culprit on the river, but that isn't what this is about. This is about allocations. The commission has substituted the word "equal" for the word "equitable" in their interpretation of fishing rights. Right now, the fight is to get our fair share of the fish (which based on number of fishermen, or license tag revenues, or local economic impact, or whatever yardstick you want to use would show that we deserve 90-95% of the fish outside of the terminal areas).

By the way, why are you targeting Liz / NSIA? Aside from debates during the allocation, I have seen them work with the gillnetters more than against them. In fact, I have heard their representatives say that they believe that without the gillnetters all federal hatchery funding would cease, so they consider them allies. If you want to argue the gillnetters' case, you might direct it toward those of us that think they are rapists of the resource and inherintly disrespectful of the law.

The commission is extremely pro-gillnet, and there are several issues that we need to nip in the bud. For instance, the issue keeps coming up at these meetings that the netters think that all tributary-caught sport fish should go against our allocation, but that the fish they catch in the terminal areas shouldn't (last I read, nearly 40% of their catch comes from the terminal areas; why not enhance those areas and move all gillnetting there so that they aren't significantly impacting ESA runs?). The issue of incidental mortality for the sportfishermen is addressed using well documented studies, but the panel at the Vancouver meeting admitted that there wer no similar studies of commercial net mortality (and none proposed! just mention the word "dropout" at a meeting and watch them scramble). The commission sets the springer netting dates at the beginning of the run when the ESA steelhead are in the river for the purpose of getting a higher price for the netters (before the ocean commercial troll-caught fish hit the market in the spring). Oh yeah, and the commercial catch is estimated based on sales to processors along with the number of fish the netters admit to selling off the docks, but doesn't include any they keep for themselves, give away or sell to neighbors, or otherwise neglect to report. Why don't they do like the do to us; count the high-boat's catch at the dock then multiply it by the number of boats fishing (I do know how ignorant this sounds, but I am not convinced that their sport counting methods are any more accurate than this). Why are they allowed to keep native coho when escapement won't be met? Why don't they require resuscitation boxes other than in the spring (perhaps because they don't work)? Oh, and if this is such a vital fishery, why do 2/3 of the permit holders feel that it is not economically viable to participate?

If you want to convince me that gillnets aren't doing more harm to the resource than sportfishing, why not move their seasons to daylight hours so that we can monitor them? Or require them to have observers on board and increase their landing fees to pay for it? Why not have fish counters at the docks when they come in? How about mortality studies done by divers for dropout rates? What about the overstressed fish that swim away after release but then become floaters an hour later or absorb their eggs / milt sacks? If the steelhead excluder panels work, why not require them on all nets rather than making them voluntary? So many questions that nobody is willing to answer.

snaggedagain · 11-05-2005, 05:16 PM

this is just a thought and not ment 2 provoke anyone but the gill netters have lawers and labiests and large funds for fighting and making sure there fish are going 2 be there why can't we join them and use there high priced influenses to help the over all cause after all we are all fisherman

freespool · 11-05-2005, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Liz, as executive director of NSIA are you stating that "full sport fishing seasons" are the most important issue to NSIA. Obviously, salmonid recovery is a secondary issue at best. We know where NSIA stands on targeting the oversize below Bonny - in clear opposition to the biological opinion.

Biology before industry!

Ah Harry, your not talkin to Liz, she's way nicer looking than I am.

See ya at the next meeting.

salmon hugger

slabhunter · 11-08-2005, 01:11 PM

Quote:

she's way nicer looking than I am.

Must be the long hair, has him confused.

Thanks to all the ifishers for attending these important meetings.

BCF · 11-08-2005, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Harry (and Bill),

I agree that BPA is the major culprit on the river, but that isn't what this is about. This is about allocations. The commission has substituted the word "equal" for the word "equitable" in their interpretation of fishing rights. Right now, the fight is to get our fair share of the fish (which based on number of fishermen, or license tag revenues, or local economic impact, or whatever yardstick you want to use would show that we deserve 90-95% of the fish outside of the terminal areas).

By the way, why are you targeting Liz / NSIA? Aside from debates during the allocation, I have seen them work with the gillnetters more than against them. In fact, I have heard their representatives say that they believe that without the gillnetters all federal hatchery funding would cease, so they consider them allies. If you want to argue the gillnetters' case, you might direct it toward those of us that think they are rapists of the resource and inherintly disrespectful of the law.

The commission is extremely pro-gillnet, and there are several issues that we need to nip in the bud. For instance, the issue keeps coming up at these meetings that the netters think that all tributary-caught sport fish should go against our allocation, but that the fish they catch in the terminal areas shouldn't (last I read, nearly 40% of their catch comes from the terminal areas; why not enhance those areas and move all gillnetting there so that they aren't significantly impacting ESA runs?). The issue of incidental mortality for the sportfishermen is addressed using well documented studies, but the panel at the Vancouver meeting admitted that there wer no similar studies of commercial net mortality (and none proposed! just mention the word "dropout" at a meeting and watch them scramble). The commission sets the springer netting dates at the beginning of the run when the ESA steelhead are in the river for the purpose of getting a higher price for the netters (before the ocean commercial troll-caught fish hit the market in the spring). Oh yeah, and the commercial catch is estimated based on sales to processors along with the number of fish the netters admit to selling off the docks, but doesn't include any they keep for themselves, give away or sell to neighbors, or otherwise neglect to report. Why don't they do like the do to us; count the high-boat's catch at the dock then multiply it by the number of boats fishing (I do know how ignorant this sounds, but I am not convinced that their sport counting methods are any more accurate than this). Why are they allowed to keep native coho when escapement won't be met? Why don't they require resuscitation boxes other than in the spring (perhaps because they don't work)? Oh, and if this is such a vital fishery, why do 2/3 of the permit holders feel that it is not economically viable to participate?

If you want to convince me that gillnets aren't doing more harm to the resource than sportfishing, why not move their seasons to daylight hours so that we can monitor them? Or require them to have observers on board and increase their landing fees to pay for it? Why not have fish counters at the docks when they come in? How about mortality studies done by divers for dropout rates? What about the overstressed fish that swim away after release but then become floaters an hour later or absorb their eggs / milt sacks? If the steelhead excluder panels work, why not require them on all nets rather than making them voluntary? So many questions that nobody is willing to answer.

Really a great post Beefcake. Well put together.

Thanks BCF

Metal Manipulator · 11-08-2005, 06:49 PM

If you've read the history of Columbia River Salmon you would be amazed at the Rapeing of these fish on the columbia River. Before the dams went in the canneries were already closing due to over harvest by the commercials. Read the book Salmon Fishers of the Columbia, by Courtland L. Smith. It just makes you sick what they did (the comercials) before the dams took thier toll. I would say that with out the dams we would be in the same possition we are in today. from a high of 44,000,000 lbs in 1919 31,602700 lbs in 1941 and averaged over 10,000,000 lbs untill the last entry in 1973. Bonnevill was completed in 1938. Pictures of mountains of fish in the canneries is really a shocker. It is good reading and factualy informative.

Springer43 · 11-08-2005, 08:18 PM

HBalczak -

Why do defend the gillnetters so much and try to villify the sport fishers? Are your also a gillnetter or does your family gillnet? Commercial fish? I hear you that all salmon folks should band together on hydro and habitat issues but I just don't get your position?!? Allocation is allocation? Allocation is not going to change any of the other bigger problems on the river.

I think most of the people on ifish including freespool care a whole lot about solving the big problems in the river (habitat, hydro, water quality, water quantity) but why should sport anglers not want an equitable share of the harvestable fish? The bottom line is that the public has access to many other commercial, tribal, and farmed options to access the resource. Gillnetters kill ESA fish at higher incidental mortality rates than sport anglers. In fisheries where the 200k sportsman can not access all the harvestable fish, more efficient commercial fisheries aught to be use as a tool to manage (mop up) excess hatchery fish. Otherwise, the sport angler numbers are growing and they are tired of getting shut down so we can gillnet half the fish or half the impacts just because thats the way we currently manage.

A sportfish caught salmon generates an order of magnintude more of economic benefit to the citizens of Oregon than a gillnetted salmon. I'm not just talking about one industry or another getting that economic benefit. I'm talking as a citizen of this state, a state that benefits from the generation of tax income and depends on sound economic decision making from government. I've listened to our govenor speak and he thinks the answer to our states problems is to grow the state budget. Ok so lets do just that with these types of governmental decisions.

We don't commercially harvest deer, elk, or ducks anymore. Why do you think we had to change our management of those resources as the sportsman was able to harvest all of the available deer, elk, and ducks?

Please educate me here? Help me understand where you are coming from on this?

fergy61 · 11-08-2005, 10:02 PM

Springer,

HBalczak is only here to argue. Thats all he does on these boards. Look at all his posts & try to find one where he isn't trolling for a fight.

Phunybonz · 11-08-2005, 10:15 PM

I believe in this case, I welcome his arguements. Kind of like having a sparing partner. Hey HBalczak, got any friends? Bring em on, we just love to tell the truth.

The Greek · 11-08-2005, 10:18 PM

HBalkzak...there is a new website called "igillnet.net", you might find a more sympathethic ear over there. :grin:
Chris V.

fergy61 · 11-08-2005, 10:20 PM

Quote

Liz...this what I would write in a column...may still, in
fact.
We should all be careful that the feds don't decide sea lions should get some of the non-tribal allocation.

Phunybonz · 11-08-2005, 10:26 PM

Isn't it called IGILLNET.where did all those sportsfishers come from.uh oh

The Greek · 11-08-2005, 10:33 PM

Yes sir, phunybonz

Bill Monroe · 11-09-2005, 07:30 AM

You guys.... :tongue: