Deer/Elk Management Poll - Results Summary

Lured In · 10-13-2003, 12:54 PM

I thought it would be fun to put some legs on the conversation over shooting small bucks/does and get a feel for where people believe the problem lies.

[ 10-15-2003, 08:31 AM: Message edited by: Lured In ]

tailchaser · 10-13-2003, 01:46 PM

I like the poll, but unfortunately it's hard to bundle populations on the entire state and make a decision on it as a whole instead of picking areas of concern (aka NE Oregon vs. Central vs. SE Oregon). But overall should be interesting to see what people vote for.

tc

Lured In · 10-13-2003, 01:59 PM

Tailchaser...ya i know its a little ambiguous, but like you said, it'll be interesting to see where people come down.

Wreckless · 10-13-2003, 02:23 PM

I'm a "spoiled" Blacktail hunter. I hunt private land with little or no pressure and I have been seeing less Deer every year for about the last 5 -10 years. I can't believe the number of antlerless tags that are still handed out in the NW corner of Oregon....Its sad :depressed: . The public land areas have been "cleaned out" by over harvest and predetors IMHO (I jumped a BIG kitty out of a tree Thursday afternoon, but that's a different story) and we still have 10,000 antlerless tags available it the area!!!???

hmmmmmmm I understand that nature runs in "cycles", but you think that "managers" could see the cycles and "do their stuff".

My $.02

P.S. I know it's Whitetail but why do most other states have EXPLODING Deer populations?

Firedog · 10-13-2003, 03:15 PM

You forgot to list disease. Along with decrease of habitat, Hair loss syndrome is a big reason for the decrease in the blacktail numbers.

FishinFinatic · 10-13-2003, 04:25 PM

id didn't see poaching on there. I feel for a fact that poaching is a serious cause of less quality animals.

crabbait · 10-13-2003, 06:05 PM

I would have to agree that poaching and disease are probably the two biggest causes for declining deer numbers.

TAILOUT · 10-13-2003, 08:18 PM

Every unit is different my buddies who have never brought home anything better than a 3 point (big) brought home 2 4points a large 3point and a 2x3 all on opening day coincedence I think not! This unit has been hunted by them for probobly 10 years or more!

skein · 10-14-2003, 07:39 AM

Disease is undoubtedly a much bigger problem on the west side than on the east, at least in terms of hair-loss syndrome. Poaching is a problem everywhere but in isolated places like the Trouts I doubt that is the real culprit.

I wish some biologists would weigh in and share some of their observations and knowledge with us. Somebody out there must have a good reason why herds are in decline and have an idea how to reverse the trend.

Good point about the exploding whitetail populations, Wreckless. Why are we so different?

Skein

Lured In · 10-14-2003, 08:19 AM

"Exploding Whitetail"...I think that may be an indirect reference to what happens when they meet a car. :shocked: [img]graemlins/eek13.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/1zhelp.gif[/img]

Seriously though, from what I have read regarding whitetail populations in SOME areas, the population increase is a result of a lack of doe harvest. As a result, some states have implemented mandatory doe tags. You must harvest a doe before you can harvest a buck. Additionally, other states allow several deer to be harvested, but only one buck. Again focusing on decreasing doe populations.

You will also notice that these same areas also have serious concerns over the quality of the bucks harvested. Generally they are smaller and fewer mature bucks are present. So more is not necessarily better.

Skein...for what its worth, I believe at one point we did have an exploding blacktail population. (maybe not exploding, but certainly growing.) From what I undestand that was almost exclusively a result of the ongoing logging efforts resulting in more feed, thus more fawns, etc. Of course we also have to look at the changes in predator management over the same period. Decreased logging (less feed) and more predators = less deer.

StickFish · 10-14-2003, 09:34 AM

Had to weigh in on the point restrictions as the leading method. It has been tried in the past on Oregon Deer. Most notibly Steens Mountains set a four point rule. Most who hunt that unit believe it is the lead culprit to the massive reduction on the true Steens gene pool. Biologists and hunters alike would find many less than 4 point bucks laying dead in the brush due to hunters not identifying their game first. There are still big bucks in the Steens, but not like there was before the 4 point rule.

Heavy winter snow had an effect and so has the preditor situation, but combined with the point restriction method used resulted in loss of significant numbers of critters.

This is probably the last year I'll hunt blacktail deer due to reductions in numbers. And closed off areas. The anterless tags have had an effect, but the lack of logging has impacted the herds more. I used to hunt out in the Nestucka drainage and would see lots of deer. No logging has taken place there for a few years and there are not lots of deer anymore.

I can't blame the land owners for closing off their lands. Idiots have forced them due to garbage dumping and property distruction. I make a point of cleaning up trash when I find it.

In the off season, call the owners of the properties you like to hunt and do a weekend scouting/cleaning effort for them. You will be amazed how much crap is out there. Never know the land owner may give you some hunting rights :smile:

Wreckless · 10-14-2003, 01:03 PM

I have seen many deer with the hair loss problem, I agree that IS a big problem. AND I must agree that poaching is also a HUGE problem...........Maybe I'll just chase birds this year.....it would be a shame to kill a healthy Blacktail buck

Seems like the poor Blacktails are havin' a tough time.

P.S. If you count all of the "poachers" who fill other peoples tags, it might be problem #1.

Steelie King · 10-14-2003, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lured In:
I thought it would be fun to put some legs on the conversation over shooting small bucks/does and get a feel for where people believe the problem lies.

Lured In · 10-15-2003, 08:13 AM

With the exception of omitting disease and poaching (my bad) as a factor in decreasing elk and deer popluations, it looks like we got some pretty good feedback.

Here is a general summary of the results.

1. 70% of us believe that deer populations are decreasing. Not necessarily suprising. What is interesting is that 20% (1/5) believe that deer populations are increasing or about the same.

2. Almost half (45%) of us believe that Oregon's elk herds are increasing. A total of 75% of us believe that elk herds are about the same or increasing.

3. In order of of what we believe is the largest factor contributing to the decline in herds...
- Predation (30%)
- Decrease in Logging (22%)
- Loss of Habitat (19%)

What is interesting here is that antlerless hunts and point restrictions were not considered to be a "major" problem.

Keep in mind, 23% did not know what other factor(s) may be contributing.

It would have been interesting to see where disease and poaching would have come in on this list.

4. 80% of us have participated in Antlerless hunts. That would lead you to believe these hunts are readily accessable and could be evidence of what some believe to be excessive doe/cow harvest. Personally I would have thought this number to be closer to 50%.

5. Nearly 1/4 of us would support a complete closure of our favorite unit for 2-3 years in order to improve the herd and hunting opportunity. That is awesome!

I think this is a real indicator to the level of commitment many hunters have to improving our current situtation. It always amazes me how folks who are so passionate (read crazy) about hunting would be willing to give it up for the good of the sport. I wish these types of hunter characteristics would be more widely publicized.

Combined 55% would likely support a complete closure vs. 45% who would likely not support a complete closure. Pretty evenly split.

6. Most supported management tools in order of preference...
- Antler Point Restrictions (41%)
- More Controlled Hunts (29%)
- Closed Seasons (22%)

I was not suprised to see the point restrictions win out on this. I was suprised to see both more controlled hunts and closed seasons score as high as they did. I would have expected the responses to be more evenly distributed with more support for shorter seasons and primitive weapons. Keep in mind a full 20% supported "other methods or didn't know".

So what can we take away from this.

1. Our deer herds should be our primary foucs. (Not that we can ignore the elk, but they seem to be doing well)
2. We need to focus on the BIGGEST problems. Predators, conserving habitat and improving habitat (a la logging). We also need to get a better feel for what disease and poaching are doing to herds.
3. While some ODFW experience would indicate this won't work, hunter's need to encourage ODFW to implement more point restrictions on buck/bull hunts. Additionally, ODFW needs to know that hunters would be willing to give up 'more hunting'(general seasons) for 'better hunting' via more controlled hunts.

Any other points that you folks found interesting?

Thanks for playing.

Wreckless · 10-15-2003, 12:49 PM

Thank for all of your effort....great poll

I am one of the few who think that the antlerless hunts DO have a substantial impact on the herds, but after my encounter last week with a BIG cat, maybe there is a predation problem

.

Thanks again...great conversations that shouldn't just fade away. It's great to share info with people who are "crazy" about this sport.

You have to be 1/2 crazy to like hunting Blacktail bucks :grin:

Bait O' Eggs · 10-15-2003, 01:46 PM

Lured in - What the poll tells me is there are a lot of people who dont know what they are talking about

(just kidding)

I actually found most of the general perceptions to be very interesting, and in alignment with my opinions. It was a good poll. With 72 voters I think our margin of error was only a few percent.