"Noob" question for/about guides

Noob · 08-24-2005, 07:49 AM

I would be interested to hear from a guide or two on this topic if they would care to chime in. I have heard several times and had it suggested to me that in order to learn better/faster a river I would like to fish that I should go on a guided trip. Now here's the question. Are guides going to impart their hard earned, and living making, knowledge with some guy that wants to go with them to learn how to better fish the river? I would think their business involves putting people on the fish, not teaching. I am sure there are things I could learn just by watching, but I would feel sneaky not coming out and just saying, "Hey, I'll pay you to show me some stuff." But would that be appreciated even less? And the river is a small place, and I see a couple of guides just about every time I'm out, I pretty much keep to myself, but I don't want to be thought of as someone who tries to pull something over on anyone. I have run charter sport fishing boats and had no problem showing or teaching people how to best catch fish, but I didn't need to worry about any of them spending a vast (and I do mean vast), amount of money to come compete with me. Just curious to see what those of you who have been on guided trips have to say, and hopefully what some of you guides think.

SalmonJeff · 08-24-2005, 08:22 AM

most guides will have no problem at al they know we are all fisherman and if you have a 30 fish day you will find a way to come back. but I would bet you book another trip as well. just be honest and they will teach you what they know.

if you want some suggestions on guides check the ifish listing and if you want more P/M me and I can get you in touch with some that would love to show you around.

Silverblade · 08-24-2005, 09:35 AM

I have a Guide question too. I don't have a boat so learning how to drift down river and fish that way, while intersting (and fun) wouldn't do me much good.
Are there guides that bank fish or do they all boat (talking mainly winter steelhead here).

dogwood · 08-24-2005, 10:07 AM

I think some are a little cautious - just like most of us are when we take people. I also think that they realize that they really are not showing you a secret spot - only they are showing you how to fish it better. By doing so they are teaching you how not to screw up a good spot by fishing it wrong or more importantly - how not to screw them up while they are making their living.

I have hired a guide and will continue to do so in order to learn more about the areas that I like to fish or a specific technique. I do not have the time to put in like I used to plus it is really enjoyable fishing with a good guide.

My take on it is that I am going to be there anyway and a guided trip helps with the learning curve. I am not specifically looking for new holes to fish, but rather tips and other perspectives on fishing. Plus it is alot of fun. I have learned alot, had a great time, and will continue to hire a guide for many years to come. I have even got realestate advise from my guide.
All this, coming from a guide who knows that he will see me on the river. I do however, make it a point to not encroach on him after the trip or try and beat him to a hole that I know he is going to fish. I am sure that this would tick off anyone.

-Craig

finnedwonder · 08-24-2005, 12:11 PM

My experience is, that guides will really help give you a sense of what your gear should look like and good places to fish etc... However if you observe them you can pick up little things to that they do without even thinking about it. Most guides have no problem letting you inspect there rigs and ask them how they do stuff. But like just like anything to be great they might have to keep a few trick up there sleeve

. Me and my dad are seasoned fisherman and do fairly well in most fishing scenarios but we fish at least 2 times a year with a guide if not more just for the enjoyable experience.

GreshamFisher · 08-24-2005, 01:46 PM

Hey silverblade-

I had this same concern when I went on my first guided trip, and I hired a guide to do a banky type trip.. my next trip I did a drift boat and I'll be honest, you'll probably learn just as much in the drift boat, and you'll see a lot more holes. Not all of the fishing done from a drift boat is done by the rower, they'll stop and you'll drift fish/spinner fish holes as well, and that's where you can ask your questions like why, where, when, how, etc..

Definitely go on a guided trip and ask lots of questions, they're more then happy to help.

Kurt

5 Salt · 08-24-2005, 03:42 PM

They are some guides that are very helpful and others who are more subtle about their work. In either case I come away with a lot more knowledge than I had at the start of the day.

I would avoid being vocal about your intentions so that they stick to their normal routine. I also have a couple of personal rules: 1 Don't show up the next day or weekend at the smaller, more secret spots a guide has shown me. 2. Don't post the exact river/location of where we fished. 3. I never forget these folks make their living with the knowleadge they have worked very hard to aquire - don't be too pushy about getting it out of them.

These are courtesy's that will pay you big dividends in the long run.

That is not to say I won't fish the same river after my guide is typically off the river or the following season but I definately will not be the first one on that hole the very next day/weekend. These guys are trying to make a living and I do not want to impeed their ability to do so.

These habits have helped me develop my knowledge and skills in a relatively short period. I have a lot to learn still, so I continue to fish with guides for a tune-up every 1-2 months. That and I really enjoy fishing with these guys - the good company, its nice to not have to worry about the boat, bait, running the oars/kicker, and the fish cleaned is always a nice.

I fish exclusively with Grant Scheele, Scott and Gary Amerman and have never had a reason to shop around. Good luck.

rowmanholiday · 08-24-2005, 03:58 PM

I recently went on a guided trip on the Hoh river up on the Olympic Peninsula with a local Forks Washington guide. I told him well in advance that I have a drift boat and float the Hoh quite often. I also let him know right away what my expectations were. I wanted to learn some "new" water and ask a lot of questions about different methods of fishing and presentations. He was quite polite and said that is what he is there for. He also showed me some sweet spots that I had never fished and how to fish them. We ended up not only floating the Hoh that day, but did an afternoon trip on the Sol Duc. All in all, we fished for 11 hours that day. I fully expect that I will be up there this fall fishing that area in my boat, but also will contract him to take me fishing again. The one thing I did let him know before I started asking a lot of questions was that all I wanted to do was become a better fisherman and had no intentions of becoming a guide. I guess, in short, if a guide isn't comfortable aswering your questions regarding fishing, it might be a good idea to look for another guide.

Pete · 08-24-2005, 04:14 PM

I think it's also important to have a discussion with a guide about your expectations before you go. I've hired a guide to "show me a river". He knew that with this knowledge I'd be in my own boat after that. But he gave me 12 hours of river running so I knew the subtleties of the river he taught me. Perhaps he knew I was a client he wouldn't normally have had. But it was a nice day and I've recommended him to others, based on my experience.

If you want to learn techniques or locations, let your guide know. If you want to have the best opportunity to catch fish, let him know that, too. But it's also worth asking why he chose that spot over other spots. There are a lot of issues that go into the decision and it's enlightening to understand the process someone goes through.

Finally, if you want to learn how to search out good spots, but the guide is focused on catching the most fish, you may have conflicting expectations. Better to know that before you go than to suffer in silence.

Noob · 08-24-2005, 07:50 PM

Thanks guys. I like the idea about being up front about the whole thing, it would be at least being straight with the guide, and if he wasn't interested...well, there are other guides. I know way better than to even talk about the guys imparted knowledge, if for no other reason other than I paid for it, someone else can too. As I said, I have some experience being a "guide". If you call being a charter boat guy a guide. Thanks for all the input, I appreciate it.

And 5-salt, I would probably go with one of the Amermans, I have fished around them and they seem to be very good, both with clients and with fish! Thanks for the recommendation.

blacktail519 · 08-24-2005, 08:17 PM

When ya take a guided trip, it's very easy to learn an area, just by watching where you are fishing, the depths, what your using, Just watch and learn.

HOOKUP · 08-25-2005, 08:38 AM

the main differance between a guide and a sporty is the guide has a much better ability to find fish. The techniques they use and what you use arent much different. Guides definatly have there aces they can pull in rigging that arent real well known, but finding fish is 90%+ of it, and thats why "they are always on them"

The Stallion · 08-25-2005, 01:59 PM

One guide told a client there are NO places to bank fish on the Trask.