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Old 05-19-2012, 10:32 PM   #1
hilclimber
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Default Raffle Results

Any word? It seems to be that by now SOMEBODY would have the results to share...... I just know that it has to be time......

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Old 05-19-2012, 10:48 PM   #2
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Any word? It seems to be that by now SOMEBODY would have the results to share...... I just know that it has to be time......
I didn't even think to write them down I do know a couple people in the room got drawn
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Old 05-19-2012, 10:55 PM   #3
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Default Re: Raffle Results

Nice...Sounds Like I should have been there to up my luck....
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Old 05-20-2012, 09:08 AM   #4
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Default Re: Raffle Results

Anyone?
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Old 05-20-2012, 09:52 AM   #5
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Default Re: Raffle Results

Well heck, I forgot that was this weekend. Not only rejected in two states this week but no raffle tag either it appears. I had such a good feeling.....
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Old 05-20-2012, 01:46 PM   #6
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Default Re: Raffle Results

I know the guy who got the Western Elk tag. Only put 100 bucks in.
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Old 05-21-2012, 05:56 AM   #7
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Default Re: Raffle Results

Still no winners list?
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:18 AM   #8
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Default Re: Raffle Results

I dont know the winner but the alternate that was drawn for the western oregin elk tag was my best friend, just first loser
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:12 PM   #9
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2012 Big Game Raffle WinnersStatewide CombinationHometownWinner: Jamie JacksonKlamath Falls, OR1st Alternate: Donald MontgomeryJacksonville, OR 2nd Alternate:Mark Beard Silverton, ORStatewide DeerWinner: Gerald WarnockPortland, OR1st Alternate:Michael SkinnerJordan Valley, OR2nd Alternate:Denise RisingKlamath Falls, ORSoutheast Oregon DeerWinner: Patrick WheelerHines, OR 1st Alternate:Robert BertschyHillsboro, OR2nd Alternate:Douglas CallahanWarren, ORCentral Oregon DeerWinner:Lonnie HeislerSpringfield, OR1st Alternate:Drake AbramsBeaverton, OR2nd Alternate:Jack ReichRedmond, ORNortheast Oregon DeerWinner:Raymond WurdingerDayton, OR1st Alternate:Dennis McGantyMcMinnville, OR2nd Alternate:John WagnerTalent, ORStatewide ElkWinner:Jeffrey HamiltonKlamath Falls, OR1st Alternate:David Hale Jr.Monmouth, OR2nd Alternate:Leonard HannaHeppner, ORNortheast Oregon ElkWinner:Marvin DuncanSherwood, OR1st Alternate:Jake SpieringBeaverton, OR2nd Alternate:Thomas BakerAdams, ORSoutheast/Central ElkWinner:Michael SheetsRedmond, OR1st Alternate:Michael DingemanKeizer, OR2nd Alternate:Richard MeierKeizer, ORWestern Oregon ElkWinner:Mike McGantyMcMinnville, OR1st Alternate:Kenneth WilsonCoquille, OR 2nd Alternate:Raymond WurdingerDayton, ORRocky Mountain GoatWinner:Willame GaroutteGrants Pass, OR1st Alternate:Daniel JacksonLa Grande, OR2nd Alternate:Matthew HaggertyMoses Lake, WAPronghorn AntelopeWinner:Stanley BurkeSweet Home, OR1st Alternate:Terry JohnsonThe Dalles, OR2nd Alternate:Gregory ParrottSherwood, ORBighorn SheepWinner:Thomas SeimearsRainier, OR1st Alternate:Samuel GarroutteAptos, CA2nd Alternate:Michael CarpinitoKent, WA
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Old 05-21-2012, 01:39 PM   #10
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Default Re: Raffle Results

and there you go
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Old 05-21-2012, 04:39 PM   #11
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Default Re: Raffle Results

No not those results. I want to see the ones where I won!
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Old 05-21-2012, 07:16 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by hilclimber View Post
No not those results. I want to see the ones where I won!

Good to see some average Joe's as winners, not just high rollers.
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Old 05-21-2012, 07:35 PM   #13
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Good to see some average Joe's as winners, not just high rollers.

There are 2 perennial winners in the list.
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Old 05-21-2012, 07:58 PM   #14
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I know that several people who did not even play this year. They did not like how the Raffle counts were handled in prior years by Matt Keenan. He is playing games with tag numbers so a very very very large amount of money was left out of this years raffle maybe someday. When someone buys multiple thounsands of dollars in deer and elk raffle tickets and they are bought for that specific hunt AH hunt naming specifically either Statewide deer/elk or SE Oregon or central oregon deer or Western Oregon elk tickets they will put the number at the time they are sold. Not when he gets around too it.

Too many people do not trust ODFW to handle there 5-20k dollars of raffle tickets. To make sure all of the tickets are put in and want to put them in themselves. But So when you go and buy your tickets remember Matt is holding back lots of tickets that have been bought just not put into the drawing.

I would say that Access and habitat lost close upwards of 75k-100k in funds because of matt's games.

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Old 05-21-2012, 08:14 PM   #15
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Default Re: Raffle Results

I did not play this year because I never have, but it sounds to me like you are complaining about ODFW doing exactly what they say they will. Ticket numbers for those hunts are posted when they are entered, not when they are purchased.

But hey, let's argue about the raffle hunts again. We haven't done it for a few days, and it's always fun!

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Old 05-21-2012, 08:56 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Oregonhunt View Post
I know that several people who did not even play this year. They did not like how the Raffle counts were handled in prior years by Matt Keenan. He is playing games with tag numbers so a very very very large amount of money was left out of this years raffle maybe someday. When someone buys multiple thounsands of dollars in deer and elk raffle tickets and they are bought for that specific hunt AH hunt naming specifically either Statewide deer/elk or SE Oregon or central oregon deer or Western Oregon elk tickets they will put the number at the time they are sold. Not when he gets around too it.

Too many people do not trust ODFW to handle there 5-20k dollars of raffle tickets. To make sure all of the tickets are put in and want to put them in themselves. But So when you go and buy your tickets remember Matt is holding back lots of tickets that have been bought just not put into the drawing.

I would say that Access and habitat lost close upwards of 75k-100k in funds because of matt's games.

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If it were possible to decode your grammar and fragmented thoughts, it might be possible to determine the form of corruption of which you're accusing ODFW. If not, forget it.
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:12 PM   #17
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The english teacher always shows up along with the wanna be ifish cops.
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Old 05-22-2012, 07:32 AM   #18
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The english teacher always shows up along with the wanna be ifish cops.
EXACTLY!
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Old 05-22-2012, 09:21 AM   #19
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Default Re: Raffle Results

Dave,

I'm trying to understand exactly what you are saying here.

Are you saying that either:
1. ODFW was NOT putting all of the raffle tickets, that were pre-purchased, into the drums?
2. ODFW was NOT counting and reporting all of the raffle tickets, that were pre-purchased, to the public prior to the close of raffle ticket sales?


I know a lot of superstitious raffle ticket purchasers prefer to put them in themselves. I am not certain on how they are "required" to report ticket numbers (sold or entered). But if they truly were doing either #1 or intentionally doing #2, they would result in a huge investigation.

Is/was there an investigation? It appears that Mr. Julian didn't show up on any of the winner or alternate lists, it would be unfortunate for the A&H program if they were losing funds from supports like that.

trying to clarify.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oregonhunt View Post
I know that several people who did not even play this year. They did not like how the Raffle counts were handled in prior years by Matt Keenan. He is playing games with tag numbers so a very very very large amount of money was left out of this years raffle maybe someday. When someone buys multiple thounsands of dollars in deer and elk raffle tickets and they are bought for that specific hunt AH hunt naming specifically either Statewide deer/elk or SE Oregon or central oregon deer or Western Oregon elk tickets they will put the number at the time they are sold. Not when he gets around too it.

Too many people do not trust ODFW to handle there 5-20k dollars of raffle tickets. To make sure all of the tickets are put in and want to put them in themselves. But So when you go and buy your tickets remember Matt is holding back lots of tickets that have been bought just not put into the drawing.

I would say that Access and habitat lost close upwards of 75k-100k in funds because of matt's games.

Dave Antley
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Old 05-22-2012, 09:37 AM   #20
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Default Re: Raffle Results

Dang, I knew I should have played this year. I hope the conspiracy gets way worse.
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Old 05-22-2012, 09:51 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Blacktail10 View Post
The english teacher always shows up along with the wanna be ifish cops.
What is wrong with proper grammar and spelling? He was not being a cop. Just like him, I was trying to understand what was being said. Arguments, hurt feelings and disagreements like this start with the lack of adequate communication.

Over the years, my frustration has also grown tremendously. I cannot prove anything, but I also believe everything random at ODFW is not as random as they say it is.
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Old 05-22-2012, 04:03 PM   #22
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The "Irony" of 1 rich person complaining about another "RICHER" person really makes me think- " I don't care" Seem some people have lost touch with what many people consider REAL money problems

I WISH I could be upset that my 750 tickets didn't have as much value as I had hoped.......

Last edited by elk'unter; 05-22-2012 at 04:35 PM.
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Old 05-22-2012, 04:26 PM   #23
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WOW gosh I did not know I was rich. Pinching and scrimping for a couple of years for a few hundred dollars at a shot at a raffle tag.

But since I am rich Heck I should go on my Unimak Island brown bear hunt I got drawn for. A once in a lifetime hunt with odds of 1 in 2800 of drawing the tag. No Problem for a rich guy like me heck 18000 guide fee, three grand in Airfare, 7500 mount no problem just a drop in the bucket. Just go write a check for it all

When in all actuality.

I am passing on one of the greatest and most sought after hunts in North America. Because I am not rich. I cannot do this hunt on the cheap because a my brother in-laws friend was killed. So evertything went sideways.

I am not rich by a longshot and 750 dollars in raffle tickets is huge. When you are trying to get the best odds for your money that is what you do. Put it where your odds are the best. That is what I am complaining about.

Last edited by Oregonhunt; 05-22-2012 at 04:30 PM.
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Old 05-22-2012, 05:31 PM   #24
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Spot On
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Old 05-22-2012, 07:52 PM   #25
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Default Re: Raffle Results

If you are not buying raffle tickets as a donation then your motivation is off. Gambling is for the casino and $750 on red might turn it into $1500 or $0
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Old 05-22-2012, 08:19 PM   #26
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I am fully aware it is a donation Trust me I donate alot. Just like buying lottery tickets or Black Jack or any other game of chance. I just like having a good idea about my odds at the time. Not have them be half of what they were told to me.

What they should do is just have them all be preselected and that way we all know the odds and what they are before the draw just like sheep, antelope, or governors tag.
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Old 05-22-2012, 08:44 PM   #27
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Post hoc, ergo propter hoc.
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Old 05-23-2012, 02:03 AM   #28
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If you are not buying raffle tickets as a donation then your motivation is off.
I disagree. There are three ways to get a sheep tag: (1) draw it, (2) buy it through the auction, or (3) win it in the raffle. If you don't have a disposable $120,000, then the raffle is your only supplemental chance to the regular draw. The fact that the money is benefitting wildlife is a 'feel-good' bonus, but I wouldn't kid myself that most of those buying raffle tickets are doing it with the primary motivation being an awesome tag.

That is the sheep example, but comparable reasoning holds true for the other raffle tags.
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Old 05-23-2012, 05:19 AM   #29
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So Oregonhunt, I'm guessing you didn't draw?

If I am understanding what you are saying correctly, I agree with you. ODFW should be reporting the number of tickets sold, not the number of tickets entered.

E
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Old 05-23-2012, 11:03 AM   #30
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I could care a less about the number of tickets sold or entered. If I buy raffle tickets for any of the categories, what does it matter how many people have put in? I still just have the number of chances I purchased, that number does not change. Now I understand that if I have 100 chances and I put in for a hunt that only has 1000 sold or entered I have a 10% chance of drawing as opposed to a hunt that has 10,000 sold or entered. But I still just have 100 chances to be drawn.
Really what concerns me with the raffles is the same individuals seem to win the raffles each year. I understand they may make a substantial investment into each raffle each year, but I see where Ray Wurdinger got another raffle tag. What is that three years in a row for one of the deer or elk tags. How many tickets does it take to ensure this success? That is the number I want from ODFW and then I will make the decision on whether to spend that money of those tags.
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Old 05-23-2012, 11:30 AM   #31
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How many tickets does it take to ensure this success? That is the number I want from ODFW and then I will make the decision on whether to spend that money of those tags.
A boat load, he probably drops $7-$10K, at least that is my guess to get that much success.
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Old 05-23-2012, 02:31 PM   #32
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A boat load, he probably drops $7-$10K, at least that is my guess to get that much success.
More power to him I say. (Man, if I had that kind of dough yo'd find me on a Utah CWMU unit killing big elk.)
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Old 05-23-2012, 02:48 PM   #33
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I disagree. There are three ways to get a sheep tag: (1) draw it, (2) buy it through the auction, or (3) win it in the raffle. If you don't have a disposable $120,000, then the raffle is your only supplemental chance to the regular draw. The fact that the money is benefitting wildlife is a 'feel-good' bonus, but I wouldn't kid myself that most of those buying raffle tickets are doing it with the primary motivation being an awesome tag.

That is the sheep example, but comparable reasoning holds true for the other raffle tags.
Everyone seems to worry about odds of drawing in a raffle raising money for access and habitat. If the odds are key to your purchase of a raffle ticket, your physcology is fixated on the gambling aspect of the raffle. Not the root motivation for creating the money pool the raffle ticket purchase feeds. I do not buy ODFW raffle tickets because i think they waste the pool of cash, overpaying for access. If i did buy into it, I would tell myself my $ was spent on habitat, keeping a blind eye on the access $. Intentional self deception is what drives the gambler in all of us.
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Old 05-23-2012, 02:53 PM   #34
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A boat load, he probably drops $7-$10K, at least that is my guess to get that much success.
That's my point, I have no idea what he spends, but being a owner of a small bow shop in Salem I would guess he does not have unlimited funds to spend on unlimited raffle tickets. However, if $7,000 to $10,000 would secure a tag, then I can either decide to buy a hunt in Utah, Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, Old Mexico etc, or buy raffle tickets here in Oregon. Both at least for mule deer would be about the same cost. The former post about the money benefiting Oregon's wildlife habitat, maybe I should start making the decision to spend my money on raffle tickets, instead of out of state hunts, especially if the costs are the same.
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:01 PM   #35
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If you knew him, you wouldn't put him in the category as high roller. He owns a business many of us frequent and he is a dedicated hunter. He saves his pennies just like "oregonhunt".


Quote:
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A boat load, he probably drops $7-$10K, at least that is my guess to get that much success.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabersin View Post
......Really what concerns me with the raffles is the same individuals seem to win the raffles each year. I understand they may make a substantial investment into each raffle each year, but I see where Ray Wurdinger got another raffle tag. What is that three years in a row for one of the deer or elk tags. How many tickets does it take to ensure this success?.....
Raffle success techniques are nothing new. The point of this thread is the "credibility" of who is running the raffle and whether or not is truly within the guidelines of the DOJ raffle laws. It probably is, I have feelers out right now. And I will find out.

I am pretty certain, that if requested, after the event, ODFW would have to report how many "pre-determined" raffle tickets were purchased vs. ones that had no designation at the time of purchase. They SHOULD be save size and shape, but different colors, legally.

That being said, the issue is "Why" not disclose to purchasers "how many" tickets have been entered AND how many have been purchased and NOT yet entered. The OP is suggesting intent to deceive. Maybe just to increase ticket sales.

According to the sales results, and if the OP is correct, it looks like it has bit them in the bee's nest.
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:03 PM   #36
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If you are not buying raffle tickets as a donation then your motivation is off. Gambling is for the casino and $750 on red might turn it into $1500 or $0
If anyone is buying raffle tickets for a donation then they need to get their head examined. IMHO anyway..
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:08 PM   #37
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Rather than cut and paste all day, I will just point out that there are people who are buying those tags. Look at the names..
ODFW should have an auction if there going to do it this way..
Put us all in a room and let us bid on the hunts...
Then put a fishbowl out, one entry per person and do a REAL raffle..
No one hate more than me to go to a fundraiser and have one guy win everything he bought like 5,000 tickets and then ran around and put them in all the boxes..
Kind of ruins it for the other guys who are spending $100 and never winning anything.
In those cases, I believe you should auction stuff off. If it is a true fundraiser, then raise funds.
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Old 05-23-2012, 03:16 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Not Sponsored View Post
Rather than cut and paste all day, I will just point out that there are people who are buying those tags. Look at the names..
ODFW should have an auction if there going to do it this way..
Put us all in a room and let us bid on the hunts...
Then put a fishbowl out, one entry per person and do a REAL raffle..
No one hate more than me to go to a fundraiser and have one guy win everything he bought like 5,000 tickets and then ran around and put them in all the boxes..
Kind of ruins it for the other guys who are spending $100 and never winning anything.
In those cases, I believe you should auction stuff off. If it is a true fundraiser, then raise funds.
They do. It's the auction side of the Gov Tags
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Old 05-23-2012, 04:07 PM   #39
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They do. It's the auction side of the Gov Tags

typo, my bad, I meant an auction only.
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Old 05-24-2012, 05:57 AM   #40
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Default Re: Raffle Results

I see a familiar name on the list. Greyelk I think is his handle on here. Lucky sucker. Central deer last year. Central elk this year.
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Old 05-24-2012, 07:16 AM   #41
jasonbartosz
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Default Re: Raffle Results

If donating money is your only concern then just go to your local ODFW office and write them a check. The idea with a raffle is to motivate people to donate by offering something special. The key word is "motivate". Once the motivation is gone, people loose interest. I don't think that makes them bad people. When you play any game, you expect the sponsor of the game to play by the rules that were set before the game started. I believe the biggest problem is that ODFW has not done a good enough job of explaining the rules to everyone's satisfaction. If they want to run the raffle the way that they currently do, just say so, so people can make an informed decision going in.
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Old 05-24-2012, 08:56 AM   #42
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Default Re: Raffle Results

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Originally Posted by Not Sponsored View Post
.....
Then put a fishbowl out, one entry per person and do a REAL raffle..
.....
Hate to be the technical and legal police, but that would be called a "drawing", not a "raffle". Major difference.

I don't care to hear whining about the "poor me's" who can't afford to buy a raffle ticket because someone wins too much. Wah Wah

You don't buy them anyway or participate so big deal. Not Sponsored does bring up a great idea though. Offering at the *** a "drawing" for one and only one ticket (8$ each) and everyone who enters gets one chance. That would probably get 10%-20% response, at 30-60K tickets sold, at 8$, KaCHING!
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Old 05-24-2012, 10:32 AM   #43
BrianMaguire
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Default Re: Raffle Results

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Originally Posted by ommedia View Post
Hate to be the technical and legal police, but that would be called a "drawing", not a "raffle". Major difference.

I don't care to hear whining about the "poor me's" who can't afford to buy a raffle ticket because someone wins too much. Wah Wah

You don't buy them anyway or participate so big deal. Not Sponsored does bring up a great idea though. Offering at the *** a "drawing" for one and only one ticket (8$ each) and everyone who enters gets one chance. That would probably get 10%-20% response, at 30-60K tickets sold, at 8$, KaCHING!

And do it for every hunt, put in an extra $8 for 1 chance at that hunt. Heck I would for every tag series. But the tag is only good for that hunt.
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Old 05-24-2012, 12:53 PM   #44
Bill Monroe
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Default Re: Raffle Results

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Originally Posted by baltz526 View Post
If you are not buying raffle tickets as a donation then your motivation is off. Gambling is for the casino and $750 on red might turn it into $1500 or $0



This discussion sounds more like sour grapes...especially in the absence of any evidence (as if that's ever a factor on the Internet) that Matt Keenan is "gaming the system."
I've known Matt for a good bit and cannot believe that...Nor, in fact, can I believe ODFW would ever allow that to happen...twice, anyway. They're still very, very sensitive about the whole controlled hunt process as well as the raffles after an unfortunate splash of publicity 10 or 15 years back in which ODFW employees discovered, and used, a little-known loophole to get hunting tags. That's all done, past and cleaned up now, but the wildlife division is doing its best to get as much as possible out of every avenue open to pump more money into wildlife management and hunting opportunities for each of us.
To suggest Matt is somehow playing with the system for the benefit of others is not only preposterous, it's dangerous gamesmanship, using IFISH beyond its creator's intent to provide forums for information to benefit us all.
I've registered my feelings with the moderators as well.

Here's what I was told by the department:
  • At this time, our licensing system does not have the ability to report the number of deer and elk tickets sold for a particular regional hunt choice (i.e. Statewide Deer vs. Northeast Deer, etc.). It only reports the total number of deer and elk tickets sold. We requested deer and elk regional hunt sales reports from our licensing vendor several months ago and we hope to have that information available for the 2013 season.
  • We post raffle ticket counts on our website every week during the raffle season, beginning in February. We post the total number of tickets sold through that day, except for the regional deer and elk hunt choices. For those hunts, we physically count the number of tickets returned (submitted) to ODFW and post that information. That is the only accurate information we have regarding regional deer and elk hunt choices until the report is available in the licensing system. Again, we hope to provide raffle participants with more information in 2013.
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Old 05-24-2012, 02:13 PM   #45
ommedia
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Default Re: Raffle Results

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Originally Posted by baltz526 View Post
If you are not buying raffle tickets as a donation then your motivation is off. Gambling is for the casino and $750 on red might turn it into $1500 or $0
however, with this approach you can't write off raffle ticket purchases (legally). So a $750 donation, for this example, would be quite a donation if you truly did NOT expect any sort of accurate chance of winning anything and didn't want to write it off on your taxes. just saying.
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Old 05-25-2012, 04:58 AM   #46
Roosevelt7x7
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Default Re: Raffle Results

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Originally Posted by baltz526 View Post
If you are not buying raffle tickets as a donation then your motivation is off. Gambling is for the casino and $750 on red might turn it into $1500 or $0
As with any raffle ticket that anyone buys.....it's to win. I would say donating to ODFW is the last thing on the list when buying a raffle ticket. If that were the case, these perenial winners would stop after the first time they win and they would continue to donate...with out entering the raffle. The casino analogy doesn't hold water. I have many ways to make money....I only have two ways to draw a coveted tag.
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Old 05-25-2012, 05:05 AM   #47
gray elk
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Default Re: Raffle Results

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Originally Posted by hunterdk1 View Post
i see a familiar name on the list. Greyelk i think is his handle on here. Lucky sucker. Central deer last year. Central elk this year.
sorry!!!!!
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Old 05-25-2012, 06:13 AM   #48
nehalemguy
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sorry!!!!!
. Lucky feller.

E
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