I'm So Excited! Chum spawning redd signs!

Jennie@ifish · 10-22-2002, 06:24 PM

Rod, at Oregon Wildlife Heritage Association told me that they would pick up the cost for signs for the spawning redds on the Kilchis.
I have to talk to Rick Klumph first, to find out more, but if it's a go, it's paid for! COOL!

I'll need a crew if I can get this together and happening.

This has been bugging me for years now! I wonder if it will have an effect?

Oh yeah, also, I am posting a reminder for the Rendezvous on November 6, 7, and 8th. They have a couple seats open, and all proceeds go to the Wilson/Nestucca Broodstock programs.
I'll post full details tomorrow, both on the front page, and here.
Too dang tired tonight.... going to bed.
Have fun!
Jen

Jen

[ 10-22-2002, 07:27 PM: Message edited by: Jennie@ifish ]

10-22-2002, 07:13 PM

What will the signs say?

I think "Beware of Dogs" would be good.

Why do they alow catch and release fishing for chum when the numbers are down? Wouldn't it be better to leave them alone for a few years and then allow them to be harvested?
I don't know who would eat a dark chum but when caught in salt water they are good.

When I get it scaned I'll post a picture of the 12 pound class (1987-2000) world record chum salmon.

[ 10-22-2002, 08:15 PM: Message edited by: Keta ]

Pete · 10-22-2002, 07:18 PM

On some rivers I've seen white plastic posts implanted along the perimeter of spawning areas. This makes the areas very visible and also makes it tough to "accidentally" fish in them. I'm not sure how the posts are anchored, but they seem to tolerate heavy current well.

Gus Orviston · 10-22-2002, 08:10 PM

what has been happening that shouldn't, what will the signs say, what do you expect for an outcome.... :whazzup:

10-22-2002, 11:35 PM

I'll help out when you want to do this project Jennie.
They spawn just above the logging bridge don't they?

Gus Orviston · 10-23-2002, 12:09 PM

Okay, so we are establishes the "NO FISHING" point, or is it going to be a suggestion/informatvie sign? Sounds like that later since ODFW isn't leading the way? I hope a violator will be cited for not following the rules.?

I use to fish for them in the mid-late 80s, and I saw some abuse. Not sure why this is still open to fishing if they are proected, and eating them is ...well...not so good.

speyfly · 10-23-2002, 12:21 PM

Hi again Gus. ODFW is in the business of selling fishing licenses, NOT PROTECTING FISH. Hope this helps to answer your question about not knowing why our fishery managers still allow fishing on depressed runs of native fishes.

Gus Orviston · 10-23-2002, 12:57 PM

dang it, did my ignorance get out that time? :whazzup:

I see the issue more cleary through the Kilchis fog.

10-23-2002, 01:21 PM

Both dogs and humpies (chum and pink salmon) hatch and then head out to saltwater.
I've seen both spawning below the high tide mark. I don't know if they hatched.

I have a soft spot ( :shocked: not only the one next to the point on my head :shocked: ) for chum salmon and would like to see them reestablished in every stream where they once were :smile: .

NO ONE SHOULD WADE IN AREAS WHERE SALMON HAVE SPAWNED UNTIL AFTER THE FRY HAVE EMERGED!!!

[ 10-23-2002, 02:24 PM: Message edited by: Keta ]

Miss B Haven · 10-23-2002, 01:43 PM

Keta has it (IMHO) - I know, I was guilty of it years ago. Wading on the reds! I still have guilt from it. This was back when the runs were healthy and when the water was right (low, but high enough for the fish to be there) you could wade the flats and sight cast to the fish. :shocked:
At least I was not snagging, no need to. Those Chum hit real well (to well for survival?.) I do remember spotting a lot of fish by the corky's hanging off them though. It never dawned on me at the time that those fish were in their spawning beds. Young, stupid and hungry for rod action! [img]graemlins/stupid.gif[/img]
Sorry this came up. I'm feeling bad, the complexes are returning. Feels pretty bad to think you might have been part of the reason for the decline! :depressed:
Thank god for boards like this where people can learn before they act! [img]graemlins/idea.gif[/img]

foxer · 10-23-2002, 02:48 PM

I remember seeing fish spawning way above the big bridge(is this the logging bridge) in the flats. By that time, the fish were very dark. Very limited access too.(Had to ask a farmer for access). The only other people I saw fishing up that high were the fly guys and an occasional drift boat.

garyk · 10-23-2002, 04:26 PM

Don't mean to go off-topic here (sorry)...

Keta said - "I have a soft spot ( not only the one next to the point on my head ) for chum salmon and would like to see them reestablished in every stream where they once were."

Me too. I'm not close to the situation but I've learned the Watershed Council in Scappoose has a goal of restoring chum to a fork of Scappoose Cr. That would be quite a success!

There could be some remnant chum on the Washington side but I don't know for certain of any populations remaining on the Oregon side further upstream than Lewis&Clark River. So re-establishing them all the way up at the northern point of Sauvie Island in Scappoose Bay would be really exciting.

SandySteel · 10-23-2002, 05:37 PM

Jennie
Great job, I know we conversed about this in the past. What a super way to stay involved in the watershed.
I would say just set the date and we will get people there. I will do what I can to get there myself as well as get others to come down. Of course it wouldn't do much good if we don't get rain before the 15th of November but having the signs up is important.

Regarding fishing for chum, the majority of the run comes in well after the closure date. This give those who are fanatical about fishing for them a catch and release oportunity while still protecting the majority of the fish. I think that most of the employees in ODFW would take issue with the concept that they are only in the business of selling fishing licenses and not protecting the natural resource.

10-23-2002, 05:49 PM

garyk,
At least we can agree on some things :smile:

[ 10-23-2002, 07:02 PM: Message edited by: Keta ]

GutshotApe · 10-23-2002, 07:51 PM

garyk - Back in the early '70s I caught a 10 lb. chum salmon on a fly in tidewater on Mill Creek, a small Columbia River trib on the Washington side below Longview.

Keta - I too would like to see chum salmon runs restored to all native waters in Oregon. There were once runs as far south as Coos Bay, maybe farther, and still may be a few remnant fish in the lower Umpqua and Siuslaw. Since they are the least dependent of all all salmon on freshwater conditions, I wonder what caused their decline?

Miss B Haven · 10-23-2002, 08:05 PM

The least dependant on the water itself, but probably the most on the spawning habitat. The lower rivers have been dredged for gravel and silted in from farming and logging. Not to mention those jerks walking around on the redds (me!)
The other species have miles and miles of river and tribs to find a spot, the chum have a mile or two maybe. I truly believe that what wiped out the Wilson run was the huge dredging that ocurred at Donaldsons.

10-23-2002, 08:39 PM

Bright dogs caught in salt water kick butt.

garyk · 10-23-2002, 09:42 PM

Speaking of 'wiped out', here's the sorry scorecard for ORegon chum: (Pacific Salmon at the Crossroads, Nehlson-Williams-Lichatowich, FISHERIES March 1991)

Already extinct stocks: Umatilla River, WallaWalla, Klamath.

High risk of extinction: Elk RIver, Sixes, Coos River, Umpqua, Alsea, Yaquina, Siletz, Washougal.

All other ORegon stocks are at 'moderate risk of extinction', these being North Coast and Lower Columbia stocks.

As Mis-behavin said, a watershed's ills aggregate in its lower reaches. So the chum bear the brunt of the accumulated damage. They are also extremely dependant on estuary health. In Tillamook Bay 90% of the tidal wetlands have been lost (mostly to dairy pastures). So, of all the area's subject to our impacts the chum's narrow band of habitat is also where the damage and habitat loss is most profound.

(A sorta related fun fact is to consider how salmonids segregate themselves spatially - chums spawn lowest, silvers and chinook jostle for the mid-reaches, then the steelhead going further, and finally the 'cutts going up into the furthest rivulets. Of course there's overlap but each species claims its own spawning niche)

Point-of-Sale Clerk · 10-23-2002, 09:43 PM

GutShotApe

http://www.nwfsc.noaa.gov/pubs/tm/tm...s/08assex.html

*** Clerk

Pilar · 10-23-2002, 11:59 PM

Gus, I think the signs are to mark the spawning gravel so that no one will fish or otherwise disturb the spawning salmon.

The lower Kilches and Miami both have runs and people fish for them. What is strange about the 'dogs', thanks Keta, is that they spawn clear down in the Tidewater and low end of the rivers. Unlike the other Salmon the chum fry almost immediately get salty. Most salmon hatchelings spend part of their rearing in fresh water.

How extensive are the spawning areas Jennie?

[ 10-23-2002, 01:00 PM: Message edited by: Pilar ]