Loose lips lose fish!

[Bryan]

Hi all,

First time poster, long time lurker.

I enjoy ifish.net and all that it has to offer! But I wonder if it's too good at what it does and if it's a good thing.

Here is what I am talking about. Information! Information is KING! Those with the info have the upper hand in life. People who have information have power and should guard that jealously!

I met a guy on the banks the other day and he was knocking steelhead right and left. He and I started talking and I asked him what he was using and he said coyly, "I can't tell you my secret. I can't even trust my wife with it." My first thought was, "what an ass." As I thought about it more I respected him for that after all. Good for him. My guess is that he fished for a long time trying different things until he hit the mother load. Why should he cough up something that might become a post on some Internet board? He earned the right to catch fish through trial and error and long hours in the cold and rain.

I have spent hundreds, no thousands of hours fishing different rivers and creeks trying to find little gems that produce chrome gold. I have to wonder why in the last year or two these little gems where I once saw no one, are now lined with cars. Gosh, all I have to do is sign on to find out where the "hot" rivers are producing for any given day.

Steelheading once was a true fraternity of die hard loyalists who paid their dues to earn the fish they caught. I am not sure that is the case anymore. Don't get me wrong, there are still those die hard loyalists out there doing it in the rain and snow with frozen guides. But now I can sign on and in a flash find out where the hot rivers are and exactly how to fish and what to use.

My point is this... Why share information? It could be that the person who reads this board might just catch a steelhead that had your name on it until you posted this secret or that location. We've all be spoiled by the number of fish in this last year or two and one day there will not be as many fish and those with the information will catch fish and you won't. Is it really worth bragging or pumping your ego to give some stranger an advantage over you on the river? I think not!

I am a realist as well and I am sure that ifish.net is here to stay and as I said before I enjoy reading the information and the tips. But believe me I have taken aggressive fish on rivers because of this board. And the fish that I might have taken might have had your name on it. So thanks.

The people here are really nice and I have really liked the community feeling of this board. I was amazed by the out pouring of support and prayer for the guy having a hard time. That really touched me and we can all be proud of things like that. I like the fact that this gives us meat eaters a forum and a platform for rallying behind causes. I think that the people who run this site have done an amazing job getting information and making it available. Now if only ifish.net could make the sun come up later in the morning....
Thanks bryan

[Steelie Ben]

Now Bryan, that little comment sounds a little selfish to me. :grin: If it weren't for someone giving me a tip or two I probably would've given up on steelhead fishing a long time ago. I understand where your coming from but did you go out and learn how to catch a steelhead by yourself with no input from outside sorces? I would bet somewhere along the line that you had a mentor or a nice guy on the river that maybe helped you out a little. Another thing to consider is maybe the "tips" that are given here and other places might be a little tainted if you know what I mean. Steelheaders are not one to go out and tell you exactly where, when, how to fish. They might leave out a certain little something that you have to figure out on your own but they might get you started in the right direction. I have not caught that many steelhead in my life (all 22 years of it) but if it weren't for other anglers sharing a little information to get me going in the right direction I probably would have never got one. I thank all of those out there who are willing to share a little of their knowledge with us, without you who knows where I would be right now.

[Capin' Dan]

Bryan, Welcome, I think, Glad that we could help out. This board isn't about just passing on the hotspots or passing on information. We have done river clean-ups and there are many post on here about safety both on the rivers and on the big blue. Its about life long friends that we meet. having fun and comraderie (SP) there has been a lot of work and effort put in to make this a friendly form that is good for women, children and people from all walks of life. So if your intentions are honorable and you are here to learn information we welcome you with open arms and ask nothing else. If you are here to bash this site and stir the pot so to speak maybe you should check out some other site. (If that is your intentions)

[MasterCaster]

Well I dont know about you Brian but I luv to fish. I also luv to see others catch fish.
In fact I think I luv seeing other fisherpeople that are either just starting out or the "oldtimers" that just dont get a chance to catch many fish just as much as I luv to catch my own. If I am asked what Im using while out on the river I will NOT lie or keep it a secret. If someone comes up to me and asks what Im doing/using Ill not just tell them but if I have the stuff with me I will rig them up just exactly like I am and invite them to join me.

The only thing that makes the crowds a bad thing is the fact that there are people out there that wish the river was theirs and noone else could fish it hell there are some that think they do own the rivers lol and of course the ones that just plain hate to see others catch the fish that "should have been thiers".

But this is all my .02 take it for what it is thats all :smile: :grin: :smile: Jon

[Ryan Pultz]

I'm with Jon on this if I am getting the bight and someone ask what I'm using I will hook you up that's how I learned to fish for steelies my father in law two years ago gave me a box of stuff to fish with a nice lamaglas drift rod and took me out on the river and showed me how to do it. I love to see other catch fish one reason is if that person catches there first fish well most likely they will become hooked on fishing thus just one more person fighting to keep rivers and streams open for all of us. And the other reason I help what comes around goes around. How many times have you waded out only to drop your last role of pencil led in the drink (OK i know I am not the only one that has done this) I know I have a few times and my fishing time would have been ruined if someone fishing next to me did not offer me some led or a spinner to use instead of calling it a day. That's why I have no problem telling all on this board cause I know someone else will do the same. Its kinda like Trading fish he can have the one with my name and i get the one with their name on it.

[ 01-23-2002: Message edited by: Ryan Pultz ]</p>

[RichH]

Bryan,

Welcome to the board. Glad you decided to quit lurking and join us. That said, I'm going to have to disagree with you about posting river reports.

I don't think anyone posts anything on here that isn't readily available from other sources. In fact, you rarely see reports on some of the zipperlip rivers that are available throughout the state. Everybody that is concious knows that the Nestucca and Wilson have a buttload of fish in them this year. Same with the Clack and Sandy. I'll bet you'll find 99% of the fishing reports have to do with those 4 rivers. Even the North Fork Nehalem hasn't got much billing this year except from a couple of people.

I realize the rivers are becoming more and more crowded and it gets mighty frustrating to get to your favorite hole and find several people in it. Unfortunately thats the nature of the beast these days. Last year one of my best days was when I went to launch the boat and found 5 guys already sitting at the ramp. I went down lower on the river and found 2 fish over 20#, one in the first hole I fished.

:grin:

Now, if people were posting about some zipperlips that have small runs I too would probably have a beef. Again,it seems to me most people post about major hatchery runs so those fish are put there to be caught, more power to ya. I don't fish the Nestucca like I used to due to the pressure but thats a situation of finding my own zipperlip and spending some time. You'll never see me post the name of that river. I'll be happy to share techiniques and new things I've tried that work(like pink worms) :shocked:

Anyways, I feel like I'm starting to ramble so I'll sign off. Again, welcome and hopefully you'll find your way to share some insights that maybe others can use. Good luck and tight lines.

[Capin' Dan]

Jon, Ryan, I'm with you I have given more that one lure or jig away this year. This is what makes this board so darn good and also people taking people fishing. I can't count how many people that I have taken out in the past two years probably over twenty. I have gotten a little peeved to go out the next week and find them setting in the same hole that I had showed them the following week, but they have always moved over and we have had some great times tied up beside them. You guys should e:mail me and we could set up a trip you guys sound like the kind of people I would like to fish with.

See this is what makes this board work Brain. :grin:

[NAUTI-NOTIONS]

Welcome Bryan-
even though you used a lot of sugar your still full of crap. in a nut shell "Loser". you're a much better lurker than supporter. from reading your post I can gather if there is ever any info in any of your post it would be crap. I guess you were never taught the "golden rule". as for me, I've been turned on to a fishery i never even knew about and ended up having some of the best fishing I've ever had. directly because of this board and the people here, in turn have shared back with them. this board work becuase of people NOT like you.
And
if i offended you,, well,,,, I meant too.

[blankman]

My input is simple. I have been trying for my first steelhead for about three years. I don't have any friends that fish, so I was really happy when I found this board about a month ago. I have learned a lot from reading the posts and advice, and I am confident that these tips will help me land my first fish. I don't think anyone is giving away any great secrets (most poeple still hold the detailed spots close to thier chests). People on this board and very friendly and helpful. I only get out to fish about once or twice a month, so even when I do start catching them I doubt I am going to take all of the fish away from everyone else.

[Bait O' Eggs]

Bryan
First of all, no welcome from me will be read in any part of this message.

I listened to your point, then I thought back at all the friends I have made here on ifish. I use to think I had good friends I enjoyed hanging out with, but some of the people from ifish have become even better friends.

Quote by Bryan
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> I was amazed by the out pouring of support and prayer for the guy having a hard time. That really touched me and we can all be proud of things like that. <hr></blockquote>

You say you were touched by the outpouring of prayers for a person in need, but didnt have the character to come forth and do the same yourself. :depressed: I suppose you want us to pray for you, but you wont pray for us if we are in need. :depressed: And furthermore I am offened you used the word WE in your statement. You have nothing to be proud of, you dont appear to have any desire to be a contributing part of the community. I guess technically since you have gone thru all the trouble of telling us how stupid we are for being a good human being, you are part of the community, to bad it has to be the cancer part.

Your attitude is the same as people who milk the welfare system, The sucky attitude of "why should I put forth any effort in helping society and my fellow man" shows you are selfish. You are saying "I want to just sit here on my a$$ and get get get and give nothing back". You confess to catching fish from this board and yet have no desire to give anything back. :depressed: You can feel that way if you want, its a free country, but when you have a flat tire and need a hand, or your stuck on a muddy boat ramp, dont ask me to help you. I got no use for people who are all take and no give. For a guy who says he has spent 1000's of hours fishing, I am amazed you never learned what it is all about. :depressed: :depressed: :depressed:

[Wet_Willy]

I'd have to agree with everybody else on this. I have spent a lot of years and time reading books, watching others on the river and just flat out fishing to be successful catching steelhead. Although I too would like to have complete runs to myself and fish uninterrupted those days are pretty much over. It used to be if you had a drift boat you had an advantage over most others, now everybody has a drift boat or sled. I've learned a lot of things that can really only be learned through trial and error and getting a "feel" for how to catch fish in different conditions. My point is, you can give people instructions or details and they can follow those instructions and still not catch fish. Nothing beats time on the water. And if everybody is spending more time on the water then etiquette become VERY important. That is where I see this board being so valuable. Helping everybody understand how to be mannerly on the river. Most times bad manners could have been attributable to just not knowing how to act or what to do in certain situations on the bank or boat. I think those things are hit on repeatedly on this board which is good.

As for too many people being on the rivers as a result of the fishing reports given here. When you fish side by side with somebody, hopefully it is a good encounter as a result of what they may have learned on this board. I hooked two and landed a nice bright hen Saturday on the Sandy with a fella just to my left. He hadn't caught anything yet. I decided two opportunities were good enough for me and left to go home for breakfast and gave him the rest of my sandshrimp and told him where I hooked my two. Steelheading brings out the best and worst in certain people. I like this board because it helps bring out the best people and helps us hook up on the river. I know that fella appreciated my gesture.

Bill

[Artwo]

Bryan,
I agree......Welcome, I think. In a nut shell................there are no fishing secrets. It's all about comrodery (sp), friendships and being passionate about the things you enjoy...........it's just fishin.

JK

[Smj]

Bumper_Chrome & BOE, Your type of responses to Bryans post are the reason people lurk.(insert frownie face here). Sorry Bryan.

Smj

[Bob Barthlow]

Bryan, or is it Shipyardidiot? All I can say this ***** was posted on Bob's Piscatorial Pursuits forum the last 2 days, topic Nooch Update posted by Yarf'em...check it out....a little more sugar today but same *****.......

[Cool Texan]

Agreed...God forbid anyone new gets into this hobby. There are only a few million fish, and a couple thousand fisherman. What would we do if that ratio went from 700 fish per person to only 600!! HOLY CRAP the world would end!! So for the planets sake, DONT tell anyone where you fish, how you fish, what you fish with or when to fish. Lets burn all the books and shut down all the web sites!!!

While we're at it, screw the poor people too! If they dont have any money, tough crap! I'm not gonna tell them how to help themselves or get started rebuilding their lives. Lets shut down unemployment, no more social security, welfare is over!!

Oh my God...I forgot about foreign aid. Screw that too!!

Yes, this post is 100% sarcasm...but the spirit of it is not. EVERYONE one this board and on the rivers needed help getting started at some point, whether it was your father, brother, mother, sister, a guide, whatever. To then gather this insight and horde it away is just stupid.

Personally, I am thankful that the members of this board have helped me get started into steelhead fishing, and surely that will turn into salmon fishing as well. And if I catch 2 or 200 fish this year, will anyone care? Doubtful. Will it hurt your chances of catching fish? Definately not.

Spread the wealth, spread the knowledge, keep fishing fun. Who knows, you could be giving good fishing techniques to a snagger who fishes that way because it catches fish and he just doesnt know any other way....yet.

[Kwiky]

You know, it is replies like that from Bumper_Chrome and BOE that turned me from a contributor to a saddened, infrequent onlooker.

Regarding praying for the person in need: I too prayed for that person, but did not post on that thread professing I did (or was doing) so. The thread was getting long already, and many had expressed my same sentiments. I was not aware we needed to broadcast our intentions to pray in order for God to hear it.

Please do realize that I don't agree with Bryan. Thick-N-Thin says it well in the next post: friends do share, and the vast majority here have benefited from shared info. I know I have.

[ 01-23-2002: Message edited by: Kwiky ]

[ 01-23-2002: Message edited by: Kwiky ]</p>

[Thick-N-Thin]

I have to agree with wet willy. I have learned many techniques that would have otherwise taken me several years or some good hard cash to learn. What I have learned in the last year from my I-fish comrads may have taken several years to learn on my own. Even with the information I have gathered from I-Fish I still have lots to learn about actually catching fish.

The one thing I think you may have not thought about Bryan is that friends do share and to be a good friend you share back. It's a two way street on the rivers too! That is what sportsman are about. If it was all just about the catch I believe there would be less of us actually fishing or hunting!

[DanS]

It wasn't that many years ago that steelhead and salmon didn't have a friend in the world. We fished for them in relative solitude and nobody payed them much mind. It's only since the explosion in the poularity of fishing that fish were given any consideration in the political world. This is a good thing because when PETA comes to Washington to try to stop fishing with their "Fishing Hurts" campaign, there will be opposition, due in part to the increased popularity of fishing.

The byproduct is more company on the river. The good thing is, you can make the company a good thing or a bad thing. If you wanna **** and moan when you have to share water, that's up to you. But you might as well face the fact that if you want solitude, you won't be able to drive there anymore. These days, you're going to have to walk.

I was fortunate enough to be taught steelheading by an experienced and knowledgeable angler. He didn't mind teaching me because I think he enjoyed watching me catch fish more than he liked catching them himself. His instruction, combined with 25+ years of pounding the water, made me into a pretty good steelheader. If I can give advice to get somebody started on their way, then I don't mind.

I don't consider fellow anglers my competition, I consider them an ally in the fight to keep fish and fishing a part of American life. I consider the fish my competition.........

[finclipped]

I catch more fish, because I share information, and the information is usually returned in kind. Lets face it, your going to cover more water with 5 guys fishing and sharing information, than trying to do it all by yourself. I don't have any "secret" spots. Maybe if I had one, my opinion would be different. Places that I fish are used by all, but sometimes I can find a pocket of fish and share that info.

[BW]

Dan, I think that just about says it all........

[smoky]

Bryan:

If it was not for the info from this board, I would not be fishing. That means:

1. I would not be stopping my boat along the Clack to collect and haul garbage.

2.Making special trips to Rivermill dam to hike in and out with 40#s of trash.

3.Donating $$$$$ to the Nestuca Broodstock program.

4.Giving dry socks to the guy who fell in the Wilson last week while launching his boat.

5.Helping to keep IFISH guides in business.

6.Give fish to people that can not afford it.

This board brings good people to the sport who can make a difference. You do make a well spoken point, but the good outweighs the harm.

Ill stop fishing and sharing info, if you'll committ to cleaning up the spots I do, donate your share and mine to programs, and send Marty and Dave a check once and a while.

[BigSpinner]

Bryan I dont really know what to think about you. Your first post and it is crap like that. I think most of the people in here are great. They are nice a care about other fishermen/women. So if you are going to come in here and say stuff like that. It might be better if you just look and dont type anymore of your bright ideas.

ps. everyone take it slow out there, with the snow on the roads and all. Be safe and be nice to other people.

Jeremy,

[On a mission]

Its ok to disagree with a guy, but no name calling. He just asked a question for disscuision i don't agree with him but it was just a question for dicussion, he attacked no one let it be. Just agree to disagree.

[Jennie@ifish]

Welcome Bryan!
There is something to the fact that rivers may be exploited, secrets that took years to develop may be released, all that stuff.
I've been down crowded rivers where people say to me, "Well! I guess the internet is doing it's job!"
:smile:
It hurts a bit, but that is the way of today.
There is a lot of good here to be found.
I guess it's just how you look at things. Half full? Half empty?
Regardless, welcome to ifish, and I hope that you meet many friends here.
We'll change your mind pretty quickly about the benefits of a fishing board, I'm sure.

:smile:
Jen

[Pilar]

Well, crap! Hey first of all I think all of us have thought about the crowding on the rivers at one time or another. For me it is the driving force behind my obsession with deep sea fishing. The bar weeds out most of the idiots and the ocean finishes off the rest. I still walk the bank but less and less all the time.

Bryan just stated what some of us have thought to ourselves. Yes it seems selfish but admit it you have thought the same thoughts .... At least he had the stones to state it out loud.

As far as 'giving' it away on Ifish goes ... duh! That is what this place is all about. As stated above most of the sensitve areas are pointedly not mentioned to prevent a stampede and destruction of limited runs and small waterways. All of the information shared here is given without any hope of payment or return. Some of it pure BS with the perpetrators misdirecting the readers away from their 'hot' river or spot.

Caveat Emptor - let the buyer beware. I figure if you have the ambition to learn about your sport then you can't be all bad.

And Bryan don't let the people shouting you down, shut you up. I know you know something that the rest of us would like to learn ... I dare you to share it. I don't want to know where you fish, so don't tell me.

It feels good helping other people. Maybe it's time for you to discover the joy of helping a clueless fisher find a bent rod with a hot tip or a hunk of tackle. Leave the attitude at home and move over if a guy wants to fish your drift. He'll snag or birdnest his reel soon enough and you'll both get to fish the drift.

Last point, converting some lurkers to posters is a difficult thing ... doubly so when you dissagree with them and drag their flaming first post corpse through the streets. So give the new guy a chance to get a clue.

You have to admit that the more you learn about fishing the more you want to pass it on. A selfish fisher is often a clueless fisher.

Just my $0.02.

[will_e_fish]

It is like that old saying what goes around comes around. I appreciate honesty and opinions here on Ifish. I try to live by the golden rule too bad everyone does not. Treating everyone with respect, and remebering we are all here to share and get along. Now whether we agree or not that is where the beauty of honesty lies. In my heart I know I try to help those I can. By listening to those with more knowledge and giving it away to makes me feel good even if they can get more fish than me, I realize most people get more fish than me and there are always more fish.

Try to set good examples for our future and our future generations.Teach a kid to fish and take them fishing.

My first IFish experience after long time lurking was a jetty Fish-In. With BOE hosting, sharing, teaching and gee what a great time all the way around. What I had taken away was hope and a feeling that I too will someday be able to put on a BBQ/tell stories & jokes/teach fishing tricks=good time&fun. I can't say enough good things for BOE and good IFishers I met since first posted. I need to mention Ramstrong, I worked with him and he has incredible amounts of knowledge that he has shared,with both computers & fishing. I have gone fishing with him. His kid will be blessed if he likes fishing or computers.

I never had opportunity to fish with any great salmon/steelhead fishing people when I was learning it was the hard way -trial and error, still is pretty much that. I often think things would be different if I had a Fishing-guru. I fish alone usually because of my schedule. If someone asks me for pencil lead and I have 2 rolls I give them 1. I taught a sales guy at GI Joes how to tie a egg loop. Sharing and learning has always been a part of me. Doesn't always happen here because there are too many fast talented people on Ifish, but when I can and when it is appropiate.

Welcome to IFish if you know it all teach us something...if you are learning, ask and listen! One way or another we all benefit.

[choppers]

hi guys, i'm pretty new to the board. i can only hope that with one bad thought more good thoughs prevail and show that fisherman are good hearted.

when your fishing and a guy comes up and ask to fish the hole next to you i can't imagine saying no. just work together guy down river cast first thing.

i was pretty lucky an old timer out on the deschutes took me a side after loosing a bunch of blue fox spinners and told me i was ******* in the wind. good guy, i started smacking more steelhead in the choppers and have cept thinking about gail ever since. you can't miss him with all his marlboro decals since he sells the stuf. hope your still fishing.

that's my 2 cents.

[WaterDog]

I guess I have never understood a "lurker". As has already been said, EVERYONE has something to offer. To just sit back and read all the posts and never contribute is like being on welfare. It's a drain on the system. BUT, if your willing to work your @$$ off, darn right I'll help you out and I'll respect you for it too. :smile:

And if your scared to post stuff because your afraid of getting your felling hurt , I'd have to ask if you ever get out of the house and away from the computer. That's life. Get a set :shocked: and jump in.

I dont care who thinks I'm a cracker or not.

[dogfishboy]

Bryan, Bryan, Bryan,
After reading Ifisher's response to your first post, I hope you take a moment to reflect on your original post.

Bryan, This IS the fraternity you referred to.
It has good and bad elements, attitudes, hang-ups, egos and insecurities. Most importantly, it’s becoming a family, and I hope to get to know some of my relatives, so to speak, better in the months and years to come. Like any family that’s easier for some than others. It’s been hard for me, but I think I’ve gained enough confidence; respect and appreciation for what everyone has created here to try. Enough about me…back to you.

People may be able to learn what to use, how to use it, and when and where, but it ends there. Now they have to go out and discover, by trial and error, the things ifishers can't give them. Things like how to handle the sticks, telling the difference between a rock and a pickup, how to fill a slot in a hog line, and many, many others.

OK, back to me. I spent a couple years in the early '80s freezing in waist deep water on the Sandy with ice crusted beard and guides trying to get my first steelhead. It wasn't until a couple years later that a good friend took me "under his arm" on the upper Molalla before I got it. Personally, I enjoy helping friends and folks I meet streamside, in a hog line or dockside with information and techniques. I want them to experience the same joy I get from a hookup and as often as possible. Otherwise it's all about me...and that's one of the problems with society these days.

Now back to you. I hope you reread the above posts and the ones I’m sure are to come several times, maybe than you’ll truly understand what Jen and everyone else has created here.

Maybe you just misspoke…or not. Either way I think you need to turn up the volume on your set so you can hear better, I think you missed an important part of the program.

dfb

[ 01-23-2002: Message edited by: dogfishboy ]</p>

[willametteriveroutlaw]

Bryan, you make a valid point. I am a tad tight lipped on my secrets as well. I enjoy taking new guys as well as the next guy, But showing him the tricks and methods that took me two years to figure out... Not as likely, many people don't respect the amount of time i spend doing trial and error, or the years I spent fishing the nestucca getting 1 or 2 fish a year. Now finally figuring it out, I don't want my semi secret set up, or special drift being used on the rare occasion I get to fish. If you want to do somthing nice, when you see a little kid, or a newbie at your hole, Hand off your rod when you have a fish on. It will make someones day. Or help them with technique, share bait, and just set a good example and pick up some trash.

[Pilar]

You are a good sport Waterdog. I think Bait O Eggs is 'compensating' for his cracker abilities by changing the subject to you. Hey Roy, are you going to catch a springer this year? :grin: :shocked:

[Pilar]

Roy, We live in a decadent society. How else can you explain the way we tolerate the motivationally challenged?

Mayhap Bryan's point was to call out the members of the 'Darwinian Aid Society' (Thanks Puffin for the metaphor). That is those of us that think that species improvement through survival of the fittest is too slow. DAS members believe that Darwin needs to be helped with Natural selection and not frustrated by our society's efforts to tax the ambitious and coddle the lazy and weak.

I guarantee you that when the world ends, a whole slew of 'Takers' will die a slow death of starvation waiting for the handout that no longer comes. Archeologists will believe thousands of years hence that the piles of bones they found at the mysterious 'Safeway' site are the result of some bizarre suicide ritual. They will completely miss the fact that those folks were simply not smart enough to cooperate with their peers. They died of starvation waiting for Safeway to open again.

Whew, huge sidetrack /// Hand me my bubbler ....

[Bob Barthlow]

BOE,......DIDDO........

[NAUTI-NOTIONS]

WOW PILAR:
where did you go to get that? read three times and still in Awww,
thou I don't care for Bryan's first post I am impressed with the number replys. I have yet to even come close. After reading thru the replys I felt I should edit my comments, however upon rereading the oringal post it left me feeling the same way as when i first read it, I almost feel drawn-in and somewhere there's a guy laughing saying look at all those sucker,,, Boy they hate me haa haa hee hee.

[Damien]

I believe that this has been a touchy subject for a long time. I believing in sharing information but not giving everything away. I have areas that I love to fish and don't want to see crowds there when I try to have a nice day on the river or lake. But I have been introduced to many a great fisheries that I might not have ever tried unless they showed me or took me there. I think that you have to tread lightly on someone who gives up information and be respectful. If you hear of a spot that someone is hunting in and seeing game you don't bring 10 of your buddies and light em up. I'll give advice or information to trusted sources. I like seeing others be successfull in the outdoors. Just my 2 cents.

[Jennie@ifish]

I have some very special private spots that I don't tell ANYONE about!
But....
I WOULD NEVER mislead anyone on purpose... EVER!!!!!
REALLY! Ever!!!
:grin:

[ 01-23-2002: Message edited by: Jennie@ifish ]</p>

[Bryan]

I understand where your coming from but did you go out and learn how to catch a steelhead by yourself with no input from outside sorces? I would bet somewhere along the line that you had a mentor or a nice guy on the river that maybe helped you out a little.

[Bryan]

I understand where your coming from but did you go out and learn how to catch a steelhead by yourself with no input from outside sorces? I would bet somewhere along the line that you had a mentor or a nice guy on the river that maybe helped you out a little.

[Pilar]

Hi Bryan, welcome back.

I stumbled for years on steelhead until one fine day in Jan. 1993. Until then I had never spent the cash for a decent rod and was on team 'yellow pole', eagle claw or whatever. I fished that day with a new graphite (LCI) rod I got for Xmas. After hours of frustration at the Josie hole on the Wilson an older gentleman came over and gave me a few tips.

He started out by telling me that I had already had several hits and didn't even know it. The old gent explained to me what I was looking for, a hesitation or wiggle instead of a tap, tap, tap. He then helped me adjust my reel to stop the backlashing. One more tip on the leader length and weight and I was casting much better.

Prior to that day it was all guesswork. I caught steelies while trout fishing in the summer and landed none of them.

Back to the Wilson. I ignored the advice about casting to the near shore seam and began to cast at the seam on the far shore. I finally hit it and about 10 seconds into the drift the line stopped. I ran backwards up the bank and proceeded to yard on the first fish at that hole that day.

A 10# hen, clipped and bonk on the head. Extremely excited now I ran back down and immediately got the tree over the far bank. 20 minutes later I calmed down enough to hit that far shore drift again. It was an instant replay of the first.

I looked back and the old man was laughing and grinning. I think he got a huge charge out of helping me out. By the time I got fish #2 to the bank I looked around and he was gone. An 8# buck, clipped also and bonk! That guy needed thanking but did not stick around.

If you're reading this now and you're the guy, thanks. I changed my mind about helping people that day. It costs nothing and makes it better for everyone.

So, Bryan share what you know. Those guys that clog your favorite hole read the Oregonian, answer the frantic phone call from their buddy, see all the cars on the side of the road or read Ifish. All the same they end up at your favorite hole. There are just alot of fishers and a limited amount of water.

Just a thought .. share what you know .. make a better fisher out of some poor dumb slob.

[Flatfish]

Hello,
my name is Mark.I like to fish.I like this board.I don't agree with everyone about everything.I don't yell at people,even if I don't agree with them.Lets share some fishing info instead of this stuff.This year my wife and I moved back to PDX from Bend.We are fishing buds and with any luck at all,we will see more of you folks on the river this year.
Have a nice day.
Mark

[Jennie@ifish]

Skoal, Flatfish!
-- Or however you spell that Norwegian word!
Jen

[Flatfish]

Hey Jen,
Nice to meet ya.Actually I have seen you before on the crik but didn't know who ya were.See ya in March.
Bubbye
Mark

[corky23]

this topic is growing like some thing RT would start :shocked: the next step bryan should take is pouring gallon's of oil paint in the river to foil your fellow fishermen
sorry to bring up a sore spot but i am still angry about the STS article
later
kris

[Bryan]

Where to begin?

First off, Bait O'Eggs writes,
"You say you were touched by the outpouring of prayers for a person in need, but didn't have the character to come forth and do the same yourself. I suppose you want us to pray for you, but you wont pray for us if we are in need. And furthermore I am offend you used the word WE in your statement. You have nothing to be proud of, you don't appear to have any desire to be a contributing part of the community."

I was not aware that God in His omnipotence needed ifish.net to help channel prayer to Himself. Because I didn't post a public prayer in a forum I am new to, does not mean God didn't hear my prayer. Perhaps you should revisit why Luther nailed his grievances on the Catholic church door.

As for the rest of your post Bait O'Eggs it's pathetic! Your analogy to my post about the welfare system is a poor one indeed! Perhaps you should have drawn this parallel, "I ain't got no time for you rich people who make all the money and don't want to pay your fair share of taxes blah blah...." You see it would have been a stronger point because I do catch a lot of fish as I stated. Where your rant fell apart was that I was trying to drain the system because I can't make it on my own without help from the government (ifish.net)..... Oh and you can thank me for using spell check on your above quote.

To compare me to cancer I think is a bit much! Let's look at the most damning statement I made, "Is it really worth bragging or pumping your ego to give some stranger an advantage over you on the river? I think not!" I think that this is perhaps the most daring sentence I wrote. To give advice or not to give advice on a world wide message board, that is the question... And this, the heart of my post, would cause you to refer to me as a cancer, assumed that I called everyone on the board stupid for sharing info, saying I mock your prayers and thus mocking God Himself, question my character, liken me to a welfare case, tell me that you would never help with a flat tire or a muddy boat ramp and then tell me that you have no time for people like me... All of this rage because I question if sharing hot information on a world wide message board is a good thing? Bait O'Eggs I would look into like, anger management or some kind of aroma therapy or maybe even a nice bath with some of those soothing bath beads. I especially like those bath beads. I can slip in to a hot tub and all the cares of the world fade away! That might help.

Over looked were the MANY positive things I said about ifish.com. I would objectively say that there where many more good things said than bad but there is no sympathy for the devil is there? Is floating an honest question even a bad thing?

Someone asked if anyone helped me learn to fish and the answer is basically no. I am not going to go into the details of my life especially with the out pouring of love I ran into here but I taught myself. Did I ever say that I don't share information on the banks? No! Did I ever say that I don't help new people on the banks who are trying and failing? No!

Many of you all made the comment of, "You just don't get what fishing is about." You all surmised that from the post I made? Amazing! A very narrow and focused question on my part illicits responses of hate and rage? Because I question if a world wide message board is a good thing you all assume you know me?

To ask an honest question without insulting anyone personally and get the responses I have ... is sad for those who took the low road. As I said in my FIRST post, "The people here are really nice and I have really liked the community feeling of this board. I like the fact that this gives us meat eaters a forum and a platform for rallying behind causes. I think that the people who run this site have done an amazing job getting information and making it available." I still for the most part believe it.

Bryan :whazzup: :whazzup:

Gone fishing.

[Pilar]

Thanks ******, how do you do that?

[Snapset]

Welcome to the board, Bryan. Don't take the harsh words to heart, dude. This is one of the fastest growing threads I have seen in a long time. Good job on your first post and steer clear of the soap opera crap that sometimes dominates.

A couple of thoughts:
I still get a thrill every time a steelhead starts slamming on my line. I get a much greater thrill when I help someone experience that for the first time.

I will rattle on for hours about effective techniques, types fo water, time of day to fish, ect. You won't often see me post where I am going to fish tomorrow, however.

If someone shares a fishing spot that has special significance to them, I will never bring another person to that spot without permission. I will not talk about it either. However,..........
If I go to the trouble of learning a new fishery, or just stumble upon a honey hole through dumb luck, I feel that I have full rights to share that information however I see fit. If I find a great honey hole populated by a bunch of surly mongrels,I might even post it on the internet.

[Jennie@ifish]

Galllllllllllllllllee!
I'm not quite sure how to welcome this.
:shocked:
Jen

[Salmonator]

Bryan, I took no offence to your post and agree with much of it. The internet will cut down the steelhead learning curve tremendously and I guess it's up to each individual to decide whether that's a good thing or not. I can see where some guys here might have picked up more info in the last year here on ifish than they would have by starting from scratch in 5 years and would disagree with your opinion. But i'm not sure where the personal attacks fit since all you did was state an opinion. There's tons of info a guy can give out to a newbie w/out disclosing a few hard earned trade secrets. I see the internet as a huge advantage as I can find river levels updated at 15 minute intervals, or watch a radar showing exactly where the rain is falling in a watershed and know if i'm going fishing in the morning or not. Shoot if anything maybe the internet could be contributed to reducing atmospheric carbon monoxide levels by eliminating wasted road trips. I do see a few zipperlips becoming the next eagle creek or NF Alsea. Maybe it's just speeding up the inevitable. Anyways, good post imho... Joe

[ 01-23-2002: Message edited by: Salmonator ]</p>

[Bait O' Eggs]

Bryan
I am glad you are still with us. :smile: I did come down on you pretty hard because of what you said in your post. Maybe I got out of bed on the wrong side, or it is quite possible I didn't understand your intentions. If I did not understand them, there was more than me that took the same stance I did and posted like information. I did not give you allowance for the good things you said, and you did say some nice things about ifish. :smile:

If you were strictly asking if what we are doing is correct, I got no problem with that. We all need to analyze what we do from time to time. I did not read from your post that you were just asking a question.

In your last post you say your most damning statement is "Is it really worth bragging or pumping your ego to give some stranger an advantage over you on the river" I don't think that is what I took offense to. The following statements and the perceived attitude is what bothered me:

1. "People who have information have power and should guard that jealously!"
2. You were impressed by a guy who wouldn't tell you what he caught his fish on.
3. "I have taken aggressive fish on rivers because of this board"

I keyed in on those statements and came to the following conclusions. First, that you think information should not be shared and all information should be kept to yourself, (conclusion -lets keep the uneducated in the dark and not help them out) Second you are impressed with guys who don't share information. (Conclusion - you are not impressed with us because we do tell what we catch our fish on). Third, You have caught fish from information you have learned here, but as in number 1 above you have no intention of sharing any yourself, you guard your information jealously.

Now I may be wrong but it would be the first time is several years But that is the attitude I saw from your post and did not particularly like it. I don't tell about my zipperlip rivers either and I don't believe we should tell which rock to fish behind. But you will not find that information being posted by anybody here (rare exception if you do). You will see people saying they fished the Clack from Barton to Carver and caught a steelie while drifting a pink corky. You will see people saying they fished from Mills bridge to Sollie Smith bridge on the Wilson and caught a steelie on a #30 green pirate hot shot. Buoy 10 and a cut plug is no secret. I don't think I have really seen to many spots mentioned that most don't already know about. I cannot think of one time off hand I have seen a post describing a spot that is not hugely known. Basic techniques to rig up rods are not that secret, some of the advanced information is shared on rigging techniques and when people do share it makes us all a better fisherman. I don't believe I would have used a 7 foot leader right off behind a delta diver to get the proper roll of a herring at buoy 10 if somebody did not tell me. I am just not keyed into using that long of a leader for anything.

I am a huge believer in sharing information that will help people out. How would the beginner know which rod to get unless he bought 10 of them and found out only one really works for what he does. How would anybody know the smelt are almost 2 months earlier this year than last year unless somebody told you they are in. If you have never dipped on the cowlitz I can assure you the masses at buoy 10 has nothing over the smelt dippers. I have fished with some real masters from ifish, and I have taken people out who have never bobber fished and did not know you were suppose to put a bobber stop on a sliding bobber until I asked why their bobber was laying on its side like that and not drifting.

I can assure none of us know it all. We all have something to learn, and I hope you do share some of your information. :smile:

Some advise, When people read written words they have no idea what mood you are in, and lots of things can be taken in more than one way. You get 8 emoticons per post. Stick a smile or a frown in there once in a while to pass on your emotion. I cant see the squint in your face thru my machine. :tongue:

There was a guy who I did not like on this board, and he did not like my opinions either and we disagreed on several things. We met for lunch to talk about why we felt the way we do, then went fishing later. He is truly a good friend and he called me today and wanted to set up our fifth fishing trip in less than a year. A friend is somebody you just have not met yet. I have a lot of friends here on ifish, some I have met, some I have not.

Bryan thanks for the spell check on my post, I will think of you as Bryan Webster.

Peace

[Salmonator]

Corky, I think RT was hardly serious about the paint. Yes, maybe a poor joke but not serious.

[DF]

I really enjoy the secrets that are shared here :smile:
before some good people took me under their wings and showed me how to fish, before I started reading this board, I would listen to people talk about fishing and think to myself.. " what the heck is a corky? "
:grin:

[Navigator]

It is not crowded when you know everyone!

[Bait O' Eggs]

Pilar
You are right Waterdog is a good sport. :smile: He is one of the guys I referred to in my earlier post about being a good friend. I would risk my life to go tow him and his boat back across the bar should it become disabled at sea. :smile: We have fished several times together and I suspect we will spend more quality time on the water, because he not only takes, he gives back. I chose my friends on character and quality, Waterdog goes and helps fin clip at the Whiskey Creek hatchery every year. He has done more for sturgeon conservations than any of the good fishers who actually take sturgeon home.

I have met and fished with a lot of quality people on ifish, and I can honestly say I learned something from every one of them. I use to think I caught a lot of fish, and had it pretty much figured out. The more I learn from others the more I realize I have tons more to learn. Their are so many fish and ways to fish for them that it is baffling. Somebody can be a good steelheader and fill the tag with steelhead, but that doesnt make them a good fisherman, it makes them a good steelheader. I strive to be a good fisherman, I would like to be able to fluently catch every species on the planet with any method, fly, bait, hardware, spear etc......

Waterdog and I were just having a conversation last week about people who only post their success on ifish. You only occasionally see people who will post their bad days, you know the times the boat fell off the trailer, you busted a pole and came home with no fish. Or maybe the poor guy who fished 42 mornings before work and couldnt buy a springer bite

And the answer to your question :tongue:
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr> Hey Roy, are you going to catch a springer this year? <hr></blockquote>

I sure hope so

I still feel the same way about Bryan that I did when I first read his post. Until he tells me I didnt understand his post and explain how I mis-understood his post I cant read anything more into it than I have already. I read his post a couple times and can only see a guy who thinks it is OK to take from something and not give something back. Something that has led to a lot of problems in society. I hope he comes back and helps educate me, telling me I didnt understand his post. I am always willing to learn something, thats why I am here.

I not the person that ever wants to run off the new poster who will teach me my next trick.

[Seefood Man]

Hi Bryan; Sorry you miss the entire point of fishing. Fishing is a method of bonding quality people first,,,,catching a fish is a bonus.

Example; In 93 I met a guy at Dabney boat ramp, who I told, I knew nothing about this type of fishing. He started to teach me,,,,after two months I caught my first steelhead. After seven years he was the best man at my wedding. All of my friends, I met fishing. Yes, we have the same intrest. But more then that, they have the quality morals and ethics that I perfer to be around. So, you see,,,If this person didn't want to teach me how to fish, a great friendship would never have developed.

[Uncle Bob]

So there you have it.

Pete did a good job of soming it up.

Now can we move on - PLEASE

UB