Rainshadow rods

Steeleywhopper · 01-24-2010, 01:37 PM

I am wanting to have a new steelhead casting rod built for drift fishing. I already have a devoted float rod so I don't really think i would use it for this. My question is this:
What would be the pro's and cons of having the XST1084c 9" over the XST1143F 9"6'. Both rods are rated 8-12lb and both are fast action. Would there be any stiffness differences between the two rods being that one is longer than the other. I'm just wondering if anyone has gone through this same issue and could point me in the direction they went and why. Only want to do this once.
Thanks

Spawnin & Yawnin · 01-24-2010, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steeleywhopper

I am wanting to have a new steelhead casting rod built for drift fishing. I already have a devoted float rod so I don't really think i would use it for this. My question is this:
What would be the pro's and cons of having the XST1084c 9" over the XST1143F 9"6'. Both rods are rated 8-12lb and both are fast action. Would there be any stiffness differences between the two rods being that one is longer than the other. I'm just wondering if anyone has gone through this same issue and could point me in the direction they went and why. Only want to do this once.
Thanks

Fish it until it breaks...then buy a Loomis

E. Harry · 01-24-2010, 03:49 PM

The XST1084 is 108 inches long (9 feet) and a little faster action than the XST1143 which is 114 inches long (9 feet 6 inches).
Both are excellent Steelhead blanks for smaller river winter fish or for summer fish. For winter fish in the larger rivers I would recommend the XST1085. The XST1085 is rated 10 to 17 pound test.

In response to Spawnin and Yawnin,
I think that you are out of date.
In my opinion the XST Rainshadow blanks are superior to any Loomis blank made for a number of reasons including:
1. Loomis switched back to glass scrim in the IMX and GLX because they could not make a straight blank which means they are using the same technology as most of the other blanks on the market.
2. The Loomis blanks are at least twice as expensive as other comparable blanks.
3. The Loomis blanks do not employ the mixed modulus technology that the Rainshadow XST blanks employ.
Plus Loomis does not sell blanks any longer so you will not be able to get custom built rods built on Loomis blanks any longer.

mtalmadgeoregon · 01-24-2010, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E. Harry

The XST1084 is 108 inches long (9 feet) and a little faster action than the XST1143 which is 114 inches long (9 feet 6 inches).
Both are excellent Steelhead blanks for smaller river winter fish or for summer fish. For winter fish in the larger rivers I would recommend the XST1085. The XST1085 is rated 10 to 17 pound test.

In response to Spawnin and Yawnin,
I think that you are out of date.
In my opinion the XST Rainshadow blanks are superior to any Loomis blank made for a number of reasons including:
1. Loomis switched back to glass scrim in the IMX and GLX because they could not make a straight blank which means they are using the same technology as most of the other blanks on the market.
2. The Loomis blanks are at least twice as expensive as other comparable blanks.
3. The Loomis blanks do not employ the mixed modulus technology that the Rainshadow XST blanks employ.
Plus Loomis does not sell blanks any longer so you will not be able to get custom built rods built on Loomis blanks any longer.

I agree with E. Harry 100%

Rakkasan · 01-24-2010, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mtalmadgeoregon

I agree with E. Harry 100%

Yes I have to agree too.

David Banaka

silver slayer · 01-25-2010, 06:40 AM

I agree to. I like rainshadow alot more than loomis. I have two loomis at the house broken that I never sent in just replaced them with rainshadow.

Cap'n Ron · 01-26-2010, 03:41 PM

Do you drift fish only or do you side drift and boondog too?

The 1143(spin) is my go to side drifter but I've made a couple 1085 casting rods for drift fishing. The XST makes for a terrific drift fishing rod!

hooked_on_chrome · 01-27-2010, 07:59 AM

I had the IST1082, XST1085 IST1025 and a couple IST1024's I will be replacing everyone of them. The 1024 is by far my favorite rod of all time for steelhead. I have nothing but great things to say about Rainshadow or any of the Baston products for that matter.

Kent St. Clair

Steeleywhopper · 01-27-2010, 09:45 PM

This rod will be used for drift fishing and maybe some boat use. I don't get out in the boat, but once or twice a year.

dlgobeavs · 01-28-2010, 08:51 AM

This thread is so timely for a decision I am trying to make. I have seriously been considering Rainshadow!!

I was all ready to build my own rod. Then I had an infant introduced into my life 4 months ago... and that project just had to take a back seat.

So here I am today looking for either finished rod to purchase... or someone to build me at least one rod... if not two.

I too am looking for a steelhead rod. I was hoping to find one that would work for drift fishing... and side-drifting.

Is this a reality?

How much am I looking at $$ wise to have someone build me a relatively basic rod with the blanks mentioned above?

I might consider two rods if one really can't do both.

Thoughts... offers to build??

Rakkasan · 01-28-2010, 11:06 AM

Go with rainshadow. That is all I use and have mainly built on for customers. I have seen to many Loomis rods break on the river and yes, I understand why and all of the tech stuff with rod blanks. You cannot go wrong with Rainshadow. You will pay almost half the price and get an equal or better product not to mention the Batson family's great customers service. I can honestly say I have never owned a Loomis rod and never will. I am not saying they are bad rods. I am just going on my experiences.

Dave

ned · 02-06-2010, 02:45 PM

Anything but Loomis...which isn't even Gary Loomis anymore. In 1997, Shimano bought Loomis, and since GL left, the factory tied, blanks, and customer service have gone to hell. Next time you're in a store, pick up a $300 "G Shimano" and aim it at the sky. I'd bet a $5 it has a 3/4" or better bow in it.

The only broken custom/blank I ever sent in to them was not honored, even when I offered to BUY the parts.

Too bad Shimano is tarnishing the name of one of the great NW rod engineers of all time.

Nor Cal Drifter · 02-08-2010, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E. Harry

1. Loomis switched back to glass scrim in the IMX and GLX because they could not make a straight blank which means they are using the same technology as most of the other blanks on the market.

E Harry -

I asked you this once before in a different thread and you did not repond, but could you please post the source for this statement about Loomis changing the scrim on their IMX rods? I had a discussion as recent as 3 weeks ago with a high level employee of Shimano/Loomis and he confirmed what I suspected - nothing has changed in the materials or the design of Loomis rods since Shimano took over. An IMX today is made of the same materials and in the same way, on the same equipment that they were 10+ years ago. So..again, where are you getting your info? Or is it an attempt to knock Loomis off of their well-deserved throne as best rod on the market?

Intersting to me that Loomis is bashed repeatedly by rod builders in an effort to prop up Rainshadow, which, coincedentally, can only be custom built by said rod builders. Hmmm...conflict of interst?

E. Harry · 02-08-2010, 12:52 PM

Nor Cal Drifter,
Frankly, I do not want to be specific here about where I heard this. I also heard it from a very high level employee at Loomis but I am not going to use his name on this forum. If you e-mail me directly I will tell you who I got the information from.
I think that you misunderstand why some custom rod builders on occasion criticise Loomis. In my case it is mainly a price versus performance issue plus a question of the level of support that the companies give custom rod builders. Loomis gives custom rod builders almost no support as evidenced by the fact that they are no longer selling blanks to custom rod builders. Other companies like Lamiglas, St. Croix and Batson Enterprises give custom rod builders excellent support. Batson Enterprises does not make rods they only make blanks so custom rod builders and OEM's are their whole market. They are now probably the biggest blank supplier in the US, mainly in my judgment, because of price versus performance and their outstanding service and support.
I think that maybe you should look closely at the blanks made by some of the other manufacturers particularly the Rainshadow blanks and compare them closely with the Loomis blanks like I have. You might come to the same conclusion that I have. But if you want to pay two or three times as much for 10 year old technology (your number not mine) then I guess that is your business.

Kerry Hansen · 02-08-2010, 02:46 PM

Many years ago I used to purchase some Loomis blanks before shimano bought them out. At that time they treated me ok when I had an issue however I had better from Lamiglas. My favorite old IM6 9 1/2' 8-12Lb Stealhead rod that I built about 25 years ago is still going strong and is a Loomis. However when Simano bought out Loomis and stopped offering all the blank models that they make their rods from like the GL4 and not totally supporting the custom builder like Gary Loomis did, I stopped buying their blanks and went 100% with the other blank manufactures (mainly Lamiglas) that I had been doing business with because of how I was treated and what was offered for costs.

Nor Cal Drifter · 02-08-2010, 03:30 PM

E. Harry -

I am not discounting Batson - I know they make a quality product and provide good service. If I were a rod builder I would probably use their product. BUT..I would not feel the need to publicly bash the competition. I am a firm believer that a quality product will find success (if it is indeed quality) without having to put down the competition.

Loomis is and has been for a long time the gold standard by which all other rods are judged. It's true - if it weren't we would not even be having this dicussion. I may pay double for a Loomis, but here is what I get in return. (1) the best rod on the market for my chosen application. (2) Great customer service and a product backed by one of, if not the, largest tackle manufacturers in the world (Shimano), (3) incredible resale value should I decide to try something else, (4) A great warranty program.

And the icing on the cake...if something goes wrong with my fishing rod, I pay $50 and a BRAND NEW one is on my doorstep in 2-3 days. No hassle, minimal lost fishing time, no need to contact (and pay!) the rod builder to re-wrap the blank. Just a brand new rod - no questions asked. Tell me a custom rod builder that can match that waranty and maybe I'll make the switch from production rods.

Listen, I respect the rod building business and wish I posessed the talent. My issue is the repeated bashing of Loomis by custom rod builders. If your product is that good, you should not have to put down the competition...

E. Harry · 02-08-2010, 04:01 PM

Nor Cal Drifter,
I will agree that their exchange program is an excellent one for Loomis rod buyers. But you are paying for that replacement when you buy the initial rod.
Your attitude about Loomis rods and their performance relative to other rods was true 10-15 years ago. Then Loomis was clearly leading the pack but that is no longer true. Take a close look at the new mixed modulus Rainshadow blanks or if you are a Bass fisherman look at their new RX8+ blanks. By the way, the RX8+ do have graphite scrim.

FCJ · 02-08-2010, 05:26 PM

I have been attending custom rod building seminars in Woodland since 1994 and only ONCE was there a person from Loomis in attendance and she was an employee. I support the people that support rod building. These days Lamiglas opens their doors and basically shuts down production for the Build Your Own Blank program. During this weekend there are also companies that on Monday morning that will be competing with Lamiglas for the market share. G. Loomis did set the standard but some other manufactures have surpassed the standard. Maybe Gary's new company will raise the bar up again.

E. Harry · 02-08-2010, 06:33 PM

FCJ,
You said "I support the people that support rod building". I think that is well said and I would like to second it. And I think that the two companies that sell blanks that go all out to support custom rod building are Lamiglas and Batson Enterprises. They are very different types of companies but they both do a great job of supporting custom rod building.
I also agree with you about how gracious Lamiglas is with the annual rod building get together that they sponsor. They even invite other competing companies to come to the event and show their products. This event was held once up in Sequim at the Batson facilities as well and they were also very gracious but I think that everyone felt that Sequim was a little far for most people to travel.

Nor Cal Drifter · 02-08-2010, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E. Harry

Nor Cal Drifter,
Your attitude about Loomis rods and their performance relative to other rods was true 10-15 years ago. Then Loomis was clearly leading the pack but that is no longer true.

E. Harry -

I guess I need to just realize I am in a rod building forum and Loomis has made the decision to not be in the business of supplying blanks to builders any longer. Before I go, however, I have to take issue with your statement above...GLoomis is still very much the leader of the pack when it comes to production rods. All you have to do is go to the Salmon/Steelhead Board and do a search for "Best Drift Rod"...Loomis is the hands down favorite. Don't believe me? Do the search, and try it on other boards as well. Time and again, when it comes to what the guys on the water (those with hands on experience) consider to be the best drift rod available, GLoomis is the clear favorite. These are not 10-15 year old threads I am referring to either...as recent as last month.

Rakkasan · 02-09-2010, 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nor Cal Drifter

E. Harry -

I guess I need to just realize I am in a rod building forum and Loomis has made the decision to not be in the business of supplying blanks to builders any longer. Before I go, however, I have to take issue with your statement above...GLoomis is still very much the leader of the pack when it comes to production rods. All you have to do is go to the Salmon/Steelhead Board and do a search for "Best Drift Rod"...Loomis is the hands down favorite. Don't believe me? Do the search, and try it on other boards as well. Time and again, when it comes to what the guys on the water (those with hands on experience) consider to be the best drift rod available, GLoomis is the clear favorite. These are not 10-15 year old threads I am referring to either...as recent as last month.

Nor Cal Drifter,

I am sorry you feel that way. There is alot of experience here on building rods and alot of fisherman here who fish these rods as well. Take another look and listen sometime.

David Banaka

Cap'n Ron · 02-09-2010, 07:40 AM

Nor cal, you may have missed the part where Emory said GLoomis is hands down the leader in production rods. Seems like your last post was a violent agreement with E. Harrys' statement.

Nor Cal Drifter · 02-09-2010, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DSRods

Nor Cal Drifter,

I am sorry you feel that way. There is alot of experience here on building rods and alot of fisherman here who fish these rods as well. Take another look and listen sometime.

David Banaka

Hi David -

No hard feelings...I totally respect the art of building rods. Wish I possessed the talent. Right now, at this point in my life, I don't have the time to build my own rods, so I have to rely on production rods. For that niche, I think GLoomis makes an outstanding rod. To me it is an investment...I pay more up front, but I get an amazing warranty program and fast service to go with a great product. That is what meets my needs at this point in my life, so it is worth the cost. Hope that helps clarify.

Nor Cal Drifter · 02-09-2010, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cap'n Ron

Nor cal, you may have missed the part where Emory said GLoomis is hands down the leader in production rods. Seems like your last post was a violent agreement with E. Harrys' statement.

Yes I did miss that part of his post. Where is it?

Cap'n Ron · 02-09-2010, 04:24 PM

Oops..i misattributed the quote!

du pont spinner · 02-09-2010, 05:45 PM

Reading this thread makes me want to puke! there are many great rod manufactuers out there, two of which are rainshadow and loomis, now we may not all agree beacause of one thing or another, but i KNOW for a fact most of the hoopla about loomis is nothing more than the general concencus of fisherpeople think that its better for nothing more than a name or price tag, and lets not forget about all that fancy advertising, stickers, shirts, hats ect. none of this helps you out in the quality aspect of this matter. Mr. loomis and his company has spent a great deal of time and effort on the social aspect of fishing, so those of you that are into that keep supporting loomis, but those who want a great product for a great price, oh lets not forget great customer service! LOOK AT RAINSHADOW! I was in question also about rainshadow about six years ago but since then i have purchased about twenty, not all for me but i do own twelve. I see that some talk about breaking these rods, let me tell you i have only broke one, after smashing it on a gunnel, my fault toatally, replaced free of charge, im not going to go on to tell you how great rainshadows are, go see for yourself, you be the judge, thats only if you can live with not flashing that big ol G- LOOMIS emblem around the riverbank. good luck!,and happy bickering...... RCB

Nor Cal Drifter · 02-09-2010, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by du pont spinner

there are many great rod manufactuers out there, two of which are rainshadow and loomis,

Let's just leave it at that. Problem solved...no more bickering.

StickFish · 02-10-2010, 05:25 AM

Loomis Rainshadow, Lamiglas, Calstar, Sage, the list goes on and on. The one thing I will say about Loomis is you can't build a rod on a Loomis blank anymore and I have not had reason to for a long time.

Cap'n Ron · 02-10-2010, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nor Cal Drifter

Let's just leave it at that. Problem solved...no more bickering.

amen!

Fishin Magician · 02-11-2010, 06:39 PM

I heard today from a friend that Loomis is no longer going to make IMX...now will be SAR...that will change things for me!!! I personally own several....well ok many of both kinds ( IMX and Rainshadow) but am leaning towards getting some more rainshadows built... I cant tell the difference between the two, and thats a honest unbias opinion. Quality is quality regardless of a name!!!

John Barth

Nor Cal Drifter · 02-16-2010, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fishin Magician

I heard today from a friend that Loomis is no longer going to make IMX...now will be SAR...that will change things for me!!! I personally own several....well ok many of both kinds ( IMX and Rainshadow) but am leaning towards getting some more rainshadows built... I cant tell the difference between the two, and thats a honest unbias opinion. Quality is quality regardless of a name!!!

John Barth

What's "SAR?"

CRD4Liberty · 02-18-2010, 06:19 PM

SAR at G Loomis always was an abbreviation for salmon rod. The IMX material from the start of the 70's if I remember right. The equivalent material, IM 700 from Lamiglas was improved upon many years ago with the Esprit rods than again with the XMG 50s. It's about time they stepped up if indeed they are. They improved the durability of the IMX rods when they went to the use of glass scrim some years ago.

classicriverrunner · 02-19-2010, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by E. Harry

The XST1084 is 108 inches long (9 feet) and a little faster action than the XST1143 which is 114 inches long (9 feet 6 inches).
Both are excellent Steelhead blanks for smaller river winter fish or for summer fish. For winter fish in the larger rivers I would recommend the XST1085. The XST1085 is rated 10 to 17 pound test.

In response to Spawnin and Yawnin,
I think that you are out of date.
In my opinion the XST Rainshadow blanks are superior to any Loomis blank made for a number of reasons including:
1. Loomis switched back to glass scrim in the IMX and GLX because they could not make a straight blank which means they are using the same technology as most of the other blanks on the market.
2. The Loomis blanks are at least twice as expensive as other comparable blanks.
3. The Loomis blanks do not employ the mixed modulus technology that the Rainshadow XST blanks employ.
Plus Loomis does not sell blanks any longer so you will not be able to get custom built rods built on Loomis blanks any longer.

I AGREE - rainshadow is a great blank - I wrap rods and use lots of rainshadows -- and for my personal use I use these same blanks when I am not using a HARRINGTON.