Wilson River Salmon Fly Tactics

Surfnsully · 11-09-2009, 06:10 PM

I am heading out to float the Wilson, never been there before, and would like advice on what tactics and flies work well on this river for salmon? Any guidance would be appreciated.

Thanks,

camA · 11-09-2009, 06:28 PM

best bet is to swing flies. any type of streamer that will get down should work

seamslayer · 11-09-2009, 06:47 PM

Dredge the river bottom with big streamers if targeting chinook. The most common chinook flies all resemble your common leach patterns except these will be really guady. Heavy sink tips, heavy flies, and a strong rod and strong drag. A good presentation is a dead drift ending in a dwonstream swing as this gives your fly a good bit of time to sink and offers fish two different presentations in one. Not at all pretty, but pretty much the name of the game due to chinook holding preferences. As for coho you can use steelhead swining tactics or casting and retriving flash flies etc.

Ladyangler · 11-10-2009, 09:25 AM

Stay away frome the spawning areas. Some would like to think that fishing in these areas is ok, not quite.

Ladyangler · 11-10-2009, 12:48 PM

If the shoe fits. Seems to me this time of year any place you find fall Chinook holding generally indicates fish ready to spawn or are spawning. The other holding spot was tidewater, that was until the rain came. The big thing is be aware of the areas you fish and yes there are quite a few anglers that target these areas with little regard.

Paman · 11-10-2009, 06:22 PM

New to flyfishing for salmon, but are not the spawning areas above the off limit area on the Wilson , which is above Elk Creek?

Ladyangler · 11-11-2009, 07:31 AM

Paman, the spawning area for the Fall Chinook starts above tidewater and goes all the way through the system. I am surprised none of the other experts were able to tell you this.

Ryan, I have witnessed the total disregard of the spawning fish for 4 decades. Most of us have made the mistake of fishing in these zones but quickly figured out the problem. Todays sport is not receiving the same education as in the past. Today it seems that the new group is all about the number of fish caught not the quality. If it means fishing on spawning fish the more the merrier.

Ladyangler · 11-11-2009, 01:44 PM

Rich, yes it would be nice to see ODFW actually become more aware of this precious resource. Closing the fishery off would be a boost for the next generation of fish but not for ODFW. Even marking the spawning areas and creating an awareness program would help in the education of the new anglers just learning and even those who refuse to change. Our fisheries today are at a very fragile stage, to think that the continuation of business as usual is going to work, I think we all know the outcome.

If we all do our part we can make a difference.

Paman · 11-15-2009, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ladyangler

Rich, yes it would be nice to see ODFW actually become more aware of this precious resource. Closing the fishery off would be a boost for the next generation of fish but not for ODFW. Even marking the spawning areas and creating an awareness program would help in the education of the new anglers just learning and even those who refuse to change. Our fisheries today are at a very fragile stage, to think that the continuation of business as usual is going to work, I think we all know the outcome.

If we all do our part we can make a difference.

Thanks for the info and will agree that the upper Wilson should be closed during spawning, but only if they open it again in December for the winter steelhead.

Maupinate · 11-15-2009, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orange Heron

Ladyangler,
We mave have crossed paths if it has been 4 decades. Yes, Chinook are mainstream spawners. It would be nice to see ODFW shut down above tidewater around November 15th to let these fish spawn in peace. It would help the fisheries a bunch. Anymore, I fly fish them in the estuaries. They are super chrome bright too! If an angler wants for fish them up in freshwater just fish the deeper runs and holes. As you say, if you see them in shallow water they are spawning. Don't mess with them for sure. Most fly fishers are good river stewards and care about the fisheries.

Rich

BTW Rich,
I am shocked that you promoted the targeting of Kilchis and Miami river chum salmon on your website.
That certainly is not being a good steward is it?

hooksetter1 · 11-15-2009, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maupinate

BTW Rich,
I am shocked that you promoted the targeting of Kilchis and Miami river chum salmon on your website.
That certainly is not being a good steward is it?

I looked over Rich's site and couldn't find where he does... care to cite this claim, or put your name to it?

Maupinate · 11-15-2009, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hooksetter1

I looked over Rich's site and couldn't find where he does... care to cite this claim, or put your name to it?

He removed it

Ladyangler · 11-16-2009, 07:07 AM

Paman, closing the upper river only protects a small percentage of the fall return. On most of the districts rivers the large majority of the fall return are spawning in the lower sections of the rivers. These areas are less gradient and contain a larger amount of spawning gravel than the upper river. The big problem is that the areas are also in the anyone can float sections of the river. These areas are targeted by every sport on the planet.

Rich, it is also good to hear that someone else actually cares. I can understand Maupinate's frustration in the continued miss-information being thrown out. With the invention of the Internet the chances of any fish-runs being left alone is almost impossible.

Ladyangler · 11-16-2009, 09:14 AM

This past year there were several proposals targeted at closing off the Kilchis and Miami during the chum return and spawning cycle. Those wonderful facilitators at ODFW decided it was in their best interest to round-file these proposals and deal with the decline as it comes.

As for the signatures I never saw any of them at the many meetings that I attended. As a matter of fact I saw very few if any people attending the final meeting dealing with the cutthroat.

The problem with closing any of the fisheries off that are in trouble is the amount of boat-payments and truck payments that would be late if the ----- couldn't fish. When you are up to your neck in debt the last thing to be saved is the resource. Think of all the crying that would happen and the lack of presure. At this point in time they are still giving reasons for keeping the fall chinook hens even with the poooooooooooooooor returns.

garyk · 11-17-2009, 07:48 PM

Orange Heron, you do not need ANY petition to propose a regulation change - most are made by a single individual. The cycle is three years now, and your next chance will be 2011.

Whether for or against, petitions are no substitute for direct involvement by individuals. And the time to be involved is at the regional meetings when the proposals are aired publicly. By time the question is before the Commission, it's too late.

Maupinate · 11-17-2009, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by garyk

Orange Heron, you do not need ANY petition to propose a regulation change - most are made by a single individual. The cycle is three years now, and your next chance will be 2011.

Whether for or against, petitions are no substitute for direct involvement by individuals. And the time to be involved is at the regional meetings when the proposals are aired publicly. By time the question is before the Commission, it's too late.

Are you sure it's 3 years now Gary? I had not heard that but sincerely hope it's true.

Ed Fast · 11-20-2009, 10:38 AM

way before there was any internet,

made my first trip to the Tilly rivers in 1989. I was a fly fishing only snob living in Seattle back then and about 22 years old. I had heard that if I wanted big nooks on the fly, Tillamook was the place to be. How did I learn this? ....chatting with a guy at the sporsman's show in the Kingdome and then reading it in two different, large, established flyfishing magazines.

Well, we hit the Trask around Loren's and saw lots of fly guys lined up casting to the far brush line. Every so often someone was hooked up and we'd see one roll every so often. Cool! I think, and we wade out to get a spot. Well, when we reallized everyone was fishing SPAWNERS we got the hell out of there. We went way upstream and found an area with gear guys fishing spawners. Drove downstream a little and found a place that looked like good holding water and reallized that is was too deep and fast for our fly gear.

Just around the bend we saw some people and walked downstream looking for a travel lane to swing flies in. Sure enough a guy downstream was hooked up along a brush line and turns out a fly guide had two clients there. We watched for awhile as the guide coached the obviously new to this type of fishing client on how to work his big 'nook. We asked the other guy where they hooked the fish and he pointed to the brush line where we could clearly see redds and big black fish chasing each other around the area. I look downstream and the big heavy, steady pull on the guys rod starts lurching downstream and the fish rolls and you can clearly see it's a big darky. I'm thinking, nows the time to tell that guy to point his rod at the fish, clamp down on his spool and bust him off. Nope! 'We're gonna have to follow him! You'd better get to the bank and chase him!' Unreal,

.

We got out of there and started discussing our options. The little newspaper thingy from Tillamook had an article about the unsung chum fishery on the Miami and Kilchis, so we went to check that out. We got to the bridge where everyone fishes there and marvelled at the chinook fishery going on at that hole! Wow! That's alot of guys and gals with some huge bobbers and lots of guys drift fishing too. What a zoo, we think, so we drive up the road a little and found where all the fly guys were chum fishing! Great, we think. What a pretty little river and looks like guys are hooked up. We wade out to check it out and Yep, you guessed it, guys lined up fishing spawners. Everyone was having a good time, too. We kept moving around and ended up on the Miami, which we were a day late for. It was obviously a littlle too low and clear and all we could find were spawners. If I knew what I do now, we probably could have found holding areas for some fresh fish, but being new to the area that day, all we found was what I just described.

What is the point of this lame little story? Way before the internet and the fly only guys were not the best stewards. Man, I was a damn good flosser back then. A famous guy tought me how and I didn't even reallize I was doing it for quite awhile. I had my suspicions, I just didn't think it was possible at the time. I figured it out eventually

Ed

ps.

LA, I am a guide and don't allow the retention of hens unless they are chrome and it is a good return year. So, this year they will go back. Also, I would NEVER fish a spawning area and have LITERALLY been in fist fights over challenging guys breaking laws and 'unwritten' rules on the river. When I see someone fishing spawners, I politely tell them what they are doing (some new fishermen have no idea) and suggest a good place to fish for fresh fish. If they tell me to mind my own business, I remind them that it is ILLEGAL to harass fish and that it is better for the fishery to leave them alone to make new fish for all of us. If that doesn't work, I tell them I will call the warden as I pull my phone out. What do you want, to close everything? No sportfishermen means no one caring for the resource and protecting it. If the fish runs are too low? close it for that fishery. I have no problem with that. Where I have fished on the coast, there are plenty of fish for the light pressure they are receiving and there is already a one fish a day and 5 for the season limit. I'm sorry if it sounds like i'm yelling at you. I'm not. It sounds like you are passionate about our fisheries and if we met while fishing dry flies for cutties, I bet we'd like each other and become friends.

Ed

garyk · 11-20-2009, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maupinate

Are you sure it's 3 years now Gary? I had not heard that but sincerely hope it's true.

Yup. A few years ago, they changed the interval of the public-angling-regulation-proposal process from two years to three.

To clarify... what I mean by a 'petition' isn't necessary is that you don't have to collect dozens or hundreds of names in order to initiate a regulation proposal. It's a simple single page form that you as an individual can submit - during the time they're being accepted.

Of course the next step is you DO NEED enough public and preferably ODFW staff support to push it through the process, and have the ODFW Commission approve it.