Presidential Candidate Fears Free Speech

The McCane/Fiengold Incumbent Reelection Act is almost as bad as the Patriot Act
John Kerry

[Hoosier Daddy]

I dunno. I don't want the AFLCIO or someone like that broadcasting the liberal spin 24/7 either.

[Straydog]

"Free" Speech?

Please, when was anything "free" about the NRA??

This is not about Free Speech, this is about buying media by a "non-profit".

[Albacore Tuna Captain]

What about all the so called religious stations that are obviously "politcally motivated"??

I have no problem with anyone having their own station to broadcast their line. You can't tell me that any media station is without bias.

I have no problem with the NRA buying their own station or anyone else because I have control of the on-off switch. :smile:

[Hoosier Daddy]

a couple other things....
1) Likely, only folks that agree with NRA issues will watch. And most of them have their minds made up beforehand.

2) It may backfire by giving NRA opponents ample opportunity to collect ammunition..

[Straydog]

Originally posted by Albacore Tuna Captain:
What about all the so called religious stations that are obviously "politcally motivated"??

I have no problem with anyone having their own station to broadcast their line. You can't tell me that any media station is without bias.

I have no problem with the NRA buying their own station or anyone else because I have control of the on-off switch. :smile:

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">I am not arguing for or against this. I am simply saying it has nothing to do with free speech which is how the original poster attempted to spin it.........

[Lured In]

Unless I have been under a rock for way too long, there are many aspects of the Campaign Finance Reform Bill, that are highly questionable and also impact private citizens. Hence the reason that both the NRA and ACLU ( :shocked: ) are taking this before the courts. I will see what I can dig up on it.

This is the only way that any political group, other than the “news media” , can exercise their right to free speech and put out their message due to the McCain/Feingold Incumbent Reelection Act.
One has to wonder why both the ACLU and the NRA were opposed to this unconstitutional law.

The NRA as well as the DNC had the right to express their political ideas before McCain/Fiengold. They have been forced by McCain/Fiengold to become "News Media" to get out their message.

Some socialists foam at the mouth at what the NRA has to say, no mater what the socialists think, it's Constitutionally guaranteed "Free Speech", just like the irrational slogan chanting and hatred spewing from the far left is "Free Speech"

I was just pointing out how much fear one of the Democrat presidential candidates has for "Free Speech".

It doesn't matter anyway, Kerry hasn’t got a chance of getting the nomination.

[img]graemlins/dork.gif[/img] Dean/Sharpton '04 [img]graemlins/dork.gif[/img]

[ 12-11-2003, 09:25 AM: Message edited by: crabbait ]

[Lured In]

Here is a more detailed run down. Note the list of cooperating orgnaization.

"Campaign finance reform is not about big dollars influencing elections. It's not about crooked politicians and a tainted process. It's not about corruption. It's not about untoward influence. It's not about fixing a broken system.

It is about who will control information to the electorate. It is about the big media and incumbent politicians having a total lock on speech, ideas and political thought in America. It is about a television/radio blackout of truth, opinions and beliefs of individual Americans who pool their power by choosing to belong to organizations like the NRA--organizations that give them the collective clout they need to reach millions of voters through paid issue advocacy.

In short, campaign finance reform as proposed could put the NRA out of business when it comes to influencing federal elections and public policy. If NRA cannot be your voice in politics, then open season on the Second Amendment will follow.

The Letter Of The Law

The truth in understanding any legislation is not in what the mainstream media claim, nor is it even in what its proponents claim. The truth is in the black letter of the law--and what the law really does.

After 11 days of debate, with scores of amendments considered and many accepted, the black letter of the McCain-Feingold Act demands:

That all violations of the legislation are criminal offenses calling for federal prison sentences and steep fines. Such violations in S. 27 run the gamut from numerous possible filing and paperwork errors, to placing television and radio "issue" advertisements that don't meet a government standard, to having normal lobbying discussions construed as illegal campaign "coordination" activities. Any of these could mean prison terms for officials of organizations like the NRA and their employees simply for attempting to exercise the group's collective First Amendment rights.

A ban on broadcast, cable, or satellite television and radio issue advertising by groups like the NRA. The electronic media blackout would be enforced 60 days before a general election and 30 days before a primary election (or runoff) if the government determined that the advertising content "refers" to a federal candidate.

Massive reporting and notification of "disbursements" and "expenditures" by lobbying organizations such as the NRA. This requirement is so burdensome that during a hot political year, thousands of reports would have to be filed--literally by the minute, on the minute. For some issue organizations, the reporting requirements alone could be impossible to meet. Again, there is criminal liability for employees of such issue organizations who fail to prepare accurate reports on exacting deadlines.

Meeting legal hurdles under the guise of avoiding "coordination" with candidates for organizations using corporate or member-donated funds. These new hurdles would make "independent expenditures" all-but-impossible--effectively killing the real power in grassroots political campaigns. If the government were to declare that door-to-door campaigning, phone banks, get-out-the-vote rallies or even posting yard signs were even vaguely "coordinated" with a candidate or political party, these activities could be declared illegal, making such expenditures subject to criminal prosecution.

These are just some of the more egregious parts of the legislation in terms of shutting you and the grassroots lobby groups you support out of the electoral and political processes.

Fighting For Freedom

The fight against McCain-Feingold was led in the Senate by Mitch McConnell (R-KY), who called the legislation a "target rich environment for challenge in court." Soon after Senate passage, Sen. McConnell met with a free speech coalition, of which NRA is a member. Included are the American Civil Liberties Union, the Christian Coalition, the Business-Industry Political Action Committee, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, the National Right to Life Committee, the National Association of Manufacturers and the National Rural Letter Carriers Association. This fast-growing confederation of groups is pooling talent and resources to fight McCain-Feingold on Capitol Hill and in the courts. Unions, such as the AFL-CIO, face the same harsh "issue advocacy" restrictions and oppose S. 27.

Under the legislation, literally every non-profit lobbying institution in the nation is affected in the same way. S. 27 will silence all of the voices of all of the individuals who support virtually every cause during elections through organized "issue advocacy."

Complete article: http://www.nra.org/frame.cfm?title=N...www.nraila.org

I just saw on the news that the Supreme Court has handed down its decision regarding this issue. 300+ pages. It will interesting to see what made it through.

[id. painter]

Personally , I dont trust John Kerry any farther than I can punt kick him. I just dont trust him.
id. painter

[24 on/ 48 off]

Here is John Kerry's views on Gun ownership issues:

John Kerry is a gun owner and hunter, and he believes that law-abiding American adults have the right to own guns. But like all of our rights, gun rights come with responsibilities, and those rights allow for reasonable restrictions to keep guns out of the wrong hands. John Kerry strongly supports all of the federal gun laws on the books, and he would take steps to ensure that they are vigorously enforced, cracking down hard on the gun runners, corrupt dealers, straw buyers, and thieves that are putting guns into the hands of criminals in the first place. He will also close the gun show loophole, which is allowing criminals to get access to guns at gun shows without background checks, fix the background check system, which is in a serious state of disrepair, and require that all handguns be sold with a child safety lock.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">From http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/crime/

Does that sound so bad?

--spud-- :smile:

[lost_sailor]

1. It's really scary how important TELEVISION is in our election process. Like 1950's science fiction come true.

2. I'm not sure, but I think the "exemption" the NRA is looking for is the law that requires broadcasters to provide equal time - that is, if they sell time to gun nuts they must also sell comparable time (same price?) to anti-gun nuts, if the nuts so desire. "News" is exempt, because they would have to give free time to everyone everytime someone made the news ... 30 seconds of Bush carrying the decorative turkey platter --&gt; John Kerry with mashed potatoes, Lieberman with gravy, Kucinich with tofu, Dean with ham, etc. etc.

[Lured In]

From 24's, link...
"I’m a hunter and a gun owner, but I’ve never gone hunting with an AK-47. I’ll stand up to the NRA when they call law enforcement officers ‘jackbooted thugs’ or stand in the way of common sense efforts to keep the most dangerous weapons out of the hands of felons and children. The Democratic Party will never be the choice of the NRA—and I’m not looking to be the candidate of the NRA." - John Kerry

Mr. Kerry shows his true colors in this statement. Both by making an overt statement regarding hunting with "AK-47's" and by proclaiming that somehow gun registration keeps "dangerous weapons" out of the hand of felons and children. First of which no person with any brains would ever use 'hunting' as a reason for de-criminalizing automatic weapons. All of the NRA's arguments are based on the 2nd ammendment as a primary foundation. Secondly, Mr. Kerry is clearly propogating the party line on weapons legistlation, 'by regulating law abiding citizens, felons won't get guns and kids won't find them'. (Wrong)

As best as I can tell from the NRA's complaints (as well at the ACLU, and many others) they are most upset over not being able to broadcast 'issue based commercials' before elections. So it essentially ties their hands from being able to communicate via TV what candidates support which organization.

While I can certainly appreciate a more peaceful pre-election commercial run, explain to me how this is "soft money" or in any way 'reforming campaign finance'. Sure candidates would love to see other organizations out marketing them, but who is to say you have to get approval to do so.

Additionally, if you 'organize' a group of folks to support a candidate, you may find yourself in violation, as well. :shocked:

[ 12-10-2003, 06:37 PM: Message edited by: Lured In ]

[Cool Texan]

Its the beauty of politics, and of life in America. Rules are made, and loopholes created. Exploiting them is just how it goes....we all do it from time to time.

As for the NRA, I'm not a supporter of them, but I am a supporter of the Freedom of Speech. More power to them, cuz with the good comes the bad.

[lost_sailor]

A reporter on the news last night put it pretty well: "The new campaign finance laws have been upheld by the highest court, and the search for new loopholes is well underway."

[Lured In]

LS...

[fishbane]

Everyone has right to free speach and TV.
NRA, Naacp, afl cio, Christians and satanists.
If you don't like it change the channel.