Hernaited disk??? Some info please

[Jetsledder]

This is question for the one that have suffered a hernaited or slipped or ruptured disk in your back. My question is if you have one of the problems above does this cause severe pain where you are unable to lift anything, stand for long periods of time. If possible please list the symptoms you had. Because i am experiencing some really tight muscles in my back and a poke of pain like some one poking me with a needle in a certain area of my back. I have beem to a chiropractor a couple of times already and i have asked if i had a disk problem or a pinched nerve and the chiropractor said no. But after the adjustments my back has not gotten any better.

[ 09-26-2003, 07:30 PM: Message edited by: Jetsledder ]

[Gone Fishin]

After doing my L4/L5 disk in this summer in Ak, I'm happy to report...IT'S GREAT! Thanks to Dr. Jeffery Johnson nuerosurgeon at St. Vincents Hospital I'm very happy to report I'm feeling perfect and absolutely no problems to report. Don't waste your time on witch doctors, go see a specialist and get the job done, you'll be a better man... I guarantee it!

[Mtn Man]

Right now my dad has some pretty serious problems with his neck, so I am up to speed on a lot of new stuff. One thing I have learned recently is about chiropractic procedures. I used to be a believer in them, but not any more. It has been proven in studies lately that they can'e physically move any of your vertebra. The popping sound that you hear (realignment) is actually just gas bubbles. It's just like popping your knuckles. Think about when you go into the office and they make the diagnosis, read the x-rays, perform the treatment and then tell you that you feel better!!

A good massage therapist will help to relieve some of the tension and then many times your back will be much better.

The next most common treatment now is steroid shots, sometimes it will take several. If that doesn't work then MAYBE surgery. I would definately be getting an orthopedics opinion if you think your back is really hurt.

Look around and do some research.

MM

[Straydog]

I ruptured L3 playing city league football while attending college, almost 25 years ago.

I went through a long, grueling rehab period but ultimatley refused surgery and started an excercise routine along with traction for a week.

Have since messed up one between my shoulders and last year got L4 mildly.

I still do my excercises daily and live with a numb spot in my foot.

I say see an orthepedic doctor or a nuerologist(sp?) ASAP and follow their advice. I really feel for you bud, it hurts and is impossible to ignore.

As for my symptoms, for the first and worst one, it was like an ice pick being driven into my left butt cheek about hip high, my left leg collapsing and excrutiating pain down my leg. It was a general "lock up", if you will. You don't want to hear the story about me going down with britches at half mask in the book store bathroom at SOU! :shocked: It weren't purty......... :grin:

As for the one in my upper back, caused by the logger dog taking a madrone sappling across the upper body :blush: , I get a "tingle" in my upper back and wake up a bit stiff and tight. Nothing bad. After rowing or fighting Salmon I feel it.

[ 09-26-2003, 09:15 PM: Message edited by: Straydog ]

[STGRule]

Go to a real doctor too and then make your mind up.

[Straydog]

Originally posted by STGRule:
Go to a real doctor too and then make your mind up.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">[img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img]

Thank you! [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img]

[ 09-26-2003, 09:26 PM: Message edited by: Straydog ]

[Maddie'sDaddy]

Jetsledder, i have had many problems with my back since 92 and seen many docters , watched many videos and went through therapy many times. I do have herniated and ruptured discs in my back. I would start with your family DR and tell him or her what you are feeling , if he or she thinks it is more serious they will guide you to the right place for a possible MRI , the only way to see a bad disc. Just remember that there are a whole lot of muscles in your back and if one knots up , you would be amazed at the pain it can cause by pulling your skeletal structure all out of wack. I too don't believe in Chiro's ,if he so called puts you back online and your muscles are still tight , it will all creep right back to were it was hurting you before. Good luck

[Killertraylor]

Worldlyme, er uh Jetsledder - I make a living reviewing medical records every day. I think I could perform a L4-5 diskectomy after reviewing the procedure a thousand times and cross-examining neurosurgeons and chiropractors who think they should be neurosurgeons.

First of all, if you have a herniated disc, it's usually only a concern if it's impinging on a nerve root - which means you'll have radiating pain into your arms, legs, feet, etc. You can have a disc lesion and not have radiating pain, and I have seen them where the patient only reports pain in the area of the herniation. You need a more thorough examination (and possibly an MRI) from a neurologist or a neurosurgeon.

I know that some people swear by their chiropractors, and there are some excellent ones out there, but there are many more who are dangerous. I wouldn't ever let them manipulate my spine after the tens of thousands of pages of their records I've reviewed - I think a bad chiro can be more traumatic on your disc spaces than an automobile accident. If you need a recommendation for a good neurosurgeon, try to get a referral to Tom Rosenbaum. Good luck, and hope your back starts feeling better.

[Conspiracy Theory]

Jetsledder,

I have an "injured" disk in the lower back (right at the belt line). That is what they called it back in the early '80s. Probably called herniated now. It has a bulge on it.

Occasionally it does what I call "hits". The hits are very short but VERY intense. When it hits it is similar to what Straydog describes for his first one. Like someone stabbing an ice pick or knife into my back at the bad disk area. Sometimes this pain drops me to my knees. Other-times is just makes me stop in my tracks and try to stand up straight very very slowly. Hitting again multiple times while attempting to stand up straight. Sometimes while walking or standing or sitting I get pains shooting down my left sciatic nerve.

If I stand for long periods, or carry heavy objects, or bend over for periods of time (don't have to be very long periods) or just getting up from a chair is when it will start hitting. Most of the time it is fine.

My left foot has started tingling a little bit lately. Probably because the injured disk hits the sciatic nerve on that leg.

At the time the doc(neurosurgeon) told me the scar tissue from the surgery would cause more pain than I was going through since it was not bothering me all the time. I haven't talked with a doctor about it since. I might soon since the left foot is starting to tingle.

Find a good doctor, then get a second opinion. Then make your decision. Fortunately surgery has come a long way since the early '80s. My wife had a cousin that had a herniated disk and had surgery in the mid to late '90s and recovered great from it.

Good luck.

[stilly bum]

Three years ago I bulged a disk while packing out a deer. I was 22 at the time and the doctors didn't want to do surgery because I was young. I had two or three periods of 2-3 months when I thought it was done, only to have it go out again. When I finally stuck to the routine recommended by a physical therapist I healed up for good. The chiropractor I saw was a joke.
Mine started as severe pain in my lower back, then in my right buttocks, then I had pains in my right thigh and knee with certain movements. Ever had your knee hurt when giving a push on the john?

[ 09-27-2003, 03:18 AM: Message edited by: stilly bum ]

[Thumper]

I would recommend that you see a neurologist. Since he doesn't do surgery he would have no bias either for or against it. He is strictly a diagnostic expert. If surgery is then warranted, he would refer you to the best surgeon he knows. If you want the name of an excellent neurologist in the Portland area, e-mail me.

[Born to Fish]

Jetsledder,

Back in '87, when I was going through some life-threatening health problems, I was advised by a nuerologist that I had a herniated disk. As I recall, his comments were something like you could have surgery [that may or may not work] or live with it. Since I had been through surgery a couple times already that year I wasn't interested in going under the knife again.

Over the years I have had many lower back episodes of pain that have been pretty bad and it seems that now, more often than not [even on a good day] I walking stooped over. It sucks! It changes your life in many ways.

As others have indicated, the chiropractors have also been a waste of time and money for me. A year or so ago I spent time with physical therapy doing the traction and exercise routine but that wasn't a total solution either.

Based on my experiences I would recommend that anyone with serious back problems of this nature get it taken care of right away - by professionals [specialists]. You'll save yourself a lot of pain and discomfort.

I'm at a point now where I need to decide if I should see if surgery is still recommended at this juncture, and if so if I want to go through that before I retire [which is just around the corner].

Best wishes and good luck.

Dean

[ 09-27-2003, 07:39 AM: Message edited by: Born to Fish ]

[Old Coot]

Been there, done that.

You could have the disc problems mentioned, you could have a condition like, foregive my spelling, spondyslolisthesis. I spent 12 years in misery, hopbbling around with a cane, gobbling prescription Motrin, Feldene, Naprosyn, Prednislone, aspirin and aclohol to kill pain. Finally caved in and transferred from an orthopedist to a Neurologist.

After a couple of appointements he suggested surgery. My wife was pregnant, I couldn't even hold a gallon of milk, much less a baby, so at the age of 37 I went for it. Bob Buza of Salem changed my entire life. I went from a crippled nasty old man to pretty much a whole person - but still nasty. I can wade over river cobbles, hunt, backpack, wrestle my now 18-year old son.

Go see a specialist.

[RichH]

I would suggest the best advice is to see your family physician. They should be able to provide you with the best advice regarding your particular situation. They will most likely do some tests and then refer you to the appropriate specialist as needed.

Each person can experience a variety of symptoms ranging from knock you to your knees pain to a numb toe. The getcha on this is that you may or may not have a fixable problem. Best of luck to you.

[id. painter]

I hate to be a story topper but.
I am now(1 1/2 year) still recovering from a life threating spinal injury due to a herniated disk.
DO NOT TAKE A HERNIATED DISK TO A CHIROPRACTOR.They can not help you.
My story is long and complicated. But, I lived with pain and numbness for 4 years .
I had an M.R.I. done and read by a neuro doc.
I was given three choices live in pain, get shots that may or may not work, or get the disk remover and my neck fused.
The last choice(sergury has a 2% chance of paralizing you) not to mention the risk of post operative infection and other complications.
I lived with it and did physical exercise. The exercise made the pain get better.
What i was doing was covering the injured spinal area with scar tissue. Later this was another hour in sergury and some worry for the doctor . The doc had to untangle the tissue which was wrapped all around my spine.He said it was like a fishing line spider web that he had to untanglel without further damage to my spine.
Living with the injury was painful but better than getting cut and never being whole again.I thought. After four years I was pretty good , I thought.
I woke up one morning with a new pain and numbness. The pain wasnt very bad this time and the numbness in my hands was different than before. So, I went back to my neuro doc. and ask if I was at risk of hurting myself (i told him i thought i had herniated a different disk) he told me the same thing as before.He also told me that the chance of me hurting myself with a herniated disk was very low ( 1 in 2000 ) . I ask if I could live normal, and he said yes. So,, I went fishing on the Columbia for my spring break.
It was the third time I pulled the anchor. Ill never forget that feeling,,,, My body went dead, not just numb but dead. My stomach, legs, arms,fingers ,,, everything. I had gone from a healthy outdoorsman to a cripple in seconds.I could hardly walk and couldnt even hold a fillet knife.
The doctor later (different doc) told my that i was in the process of shutting down. "you were within hours of being dead or in a wheel chair for ever."
I now have Hoffmans syndrome ,,all the nerves in my body are hyper reactive. If i get chilled I cant even crawl or open my hands. Im still just learning to walk again (very weak and shake) I fall down all the time cause i cant lift my left leg more than about 3 inches off the ground.People call the police on me often when they see me get out of my car, as a drunk.I had a key maker refuse to give my service cause he thought I was staggering around drunk. It sucks.
Go to real neuro specialist and dont mess around with it.Could be very costly to wait, I know. id. painter
Back to your question. I went to three different doctors before one suspected a disk. They gave me muscle relaxers and pain killers and charged me but did nothing .
The pin point pain sounds very farmiliar ,mine was in my spine ... Go get an M.R.I. done without it they can only guess , even the best doctors can only guess. If you want more info about my situation, give me an email.
Im alive and walking. This weekend Im going to my favorite deer hunting spot and try to get one . I wont be running the mountains like the days of old but, ILL BE THERE. id. painter

[fishisabonus]

My doctor can't get me approved for a specialist. My insurance is the problem. For over 5 years I have been dealing with the pain. Ya, vicodin, flexeral, several other meds, anti inflamitories until my stomach is ruined (2-3 800 ibuprofen a day), and another pill so I can sleep thru it. The insurance would rather serve me up another bottle of pills than treat me.

I wake up with my hands and arms dead. It is more than numb. It hurts. I feel like I have burning lumps of coal under my shoulder blade and along my spine. There are days when it hurts so bad, my eyes water. Now it has progressed to my arms are numb while awake... not just going dead at me when I sleep. You can see a buldge on one side of my neck and my shoulders are off because of it too. It just burns and burns. That is a good day. A bad day is when you have the shooting pain like a knife is twisting. I wish it just felt like pins and needles.

I would give just about anything to wake up one day and not hurt.

But my insurance has decided that I can live with it and won't even let my doctor send me to a specialist.

I can't hold a paint brush anymore and do detail work. I can't tie a fishing knot anymore. Someone mentioned getting cold, my hands are rendered useless.

What can I do to push the insurance to treat me? [img]graemlins/1zhelp.gif[/img]

[El Toro]

Can you feel a bulge in your back from the ruptured disc?

[id. painter]

My insurance paid for all but 6ooo $. I still make a monthly payment.
I was double covered both my wife and my self have insurance,,, and it still cost a bunch. Go get it done ,,,make a min. payment for the rest of your life. It would be worth it.
The pain in your sholder,,,I have the same pain, that pain didnt go away with the sergury.
But Im way , way better. id. painter

[Mtn Man]

Jetsledder, How's your back doing?

Keep us posted

MM

[Jetsledder]

Actaully I really dont think it is a ruptured disk after being to the chiro a couple of times.
I have a appointment to see a MD on monday. I dont have any pain like described above. My pain is like pins and needles but nothing like a knife or anything like that. The pain on a scale 1 to 10 is like 3. Also my muscles on my left side are really tight and knotted and my back wants to pop alot when I twist certain way.

[RichH]

Fishisabonus,

Your family physician can order the same tests that a specialist can. Suggest that they order an MRI and get the proof that you need to see a specialist. Good luck.

[byteme]

Don't mess with it. Get it checked out. This spring I would wake up to a stiff neck and would go away after an hour or so. After about a month I woke up one Sunday morning to excruciating pain in my shoulder. Off to the ER. They diagnose bursitis and send me to a orthepedist. He gives me a steroid shot in the shoulder for the bursitis. The next day my shoulder feels fine but the pain is now from my neck to my fingers. He orders a MRI and gives me a Medrol pack(oral steroids) which helped. The Vicadin and Demarol did nothing for the pain and screwed my stomach up so bad I could hardly stand to eat. MRI says bulged (protruding) disc C5-6 and he sends me to a Neurosurgeon. By this time I feel well enough and go back to work. NS sends me to physical therapy trying to avoid surgery. The P.T. put me back to square one, with the weakness, numbness and pain down my arm. I had a fusion done two days later and woke up pain free, less a sore neck from the surgery. I was back to work in a week and a half. I was very happy with the surgery. I should have questioned the P.T. about the exersises he had me doing. In my mind I thought they would aggravate the disc but I figured he was the expert...My bad. It's your body..Question authority!
As for Chiropractors, I went to mine throughout this expirence and he had it diagnosed the day after the severe pain started, about two weeks before the "real" doctors had it figured out. He wouldn't go near my neck with his adjustments during this time. He has helped me many times with back problems and has twice sent me elsewhere when he knew he couldn't help me. I know chiropractors can't fix everything and I'm glad mine knows that too.

[id. painter]

The amount of pain is not a good measurement tool.
The second disk rupture was almost painless for me. The pins and needles were the real telling factor. The nerves are being touched and they dont like it. Numbness and pins and needles are what I felt most on the second disk.
The first disk that went was total pain. I could only discrbe it as if someone had a fish hook hooked in my spine and every thirty seconds they would give a little tug on it. That lasted for 3 months . It went away buy me spending three days in a boat rowing for Steelhead, almost day and night . It was on the White Salmon River. The third day of rowing the pain went away and never came back . But I was still on the edge of being cripped for life. I still say go get an M.R.I.. That is the ONLY WAY YOU
WILL KNOW. Can I yell it any louder??? I had three doctors mis- diagnoes me . id. painter painter.

[Jetsledder]

Well I went and saw md and some xrays done nothing wrong with my back just some really messed up muscles.

[id. painter]

Jetsledder,, Im glad to hear that you will be o.k.. I do not want to be the negative voice here , but . In the future ,, an X-ray will only show the hard bones in your body. A disk is a soft tissue and no Doc. can tell you whats up with the soft tissues without an M.R.I.. I was told by three doctors M.D.,s that I had messed up muscles. They gave me pain killers and muscle relaxers and said Id be fine. Three years later I was crippled. Be careful with your spine ,,you only get one chance with it. id. painter

[Abalone]

What the sound of a CHIROPRACTOR ?

Quack !

[Birdnest]

I love chiropractors...job security. I can't tell you how many people come get an MRI after a good old fashioned visit to the bone cracker.

[Carver_OR]

A heat pad on my back really seems to help when it hurts and it hurts most of the time. Every day I lay on my back and stretch my lower back then do a slow rotation of my neck. I don't take any type of drug to help with the pain as it covers the real problem up, stretching helps the most to relieve the pain for me.

Pat

[SteelieSteve]

Last year I ruptured L5-S1. Went to the work recommended Dr and a month later he sent me for a MRI. Had nerve pain/damage and had to be referred to a neurosurgeon who operated in July(injury in March). Recovered and did physical therapy until November with near constant pain. I'm now 24% disabled in my low back. Do not wait. Take your back to a qualified Dr. now. Do not rely on x-rays. I can refer you to my Dr. or go see Marty's. Backs are not anything to screw around with. You like to fish don't you? I'm now pretty limited in activites and can't fish too much or long and always with a back support belt.