Yamaha 4 stroke, 150 or 200?

Killertraylor · 03-01-2004, 10:00 AM

I'm thinking about swapping out the 01'Yamaha 250 Saltwater series for a big 4 stroke. I've got a 22 foot Northriver Seahawk. I just really like the new 4 stroke motors. The problem is that I have a custom splashwell on the boat that is only as big as the 250 that's on there. The cowlings on the 200's and 225 4 strokes are huge and I'm not sure if they'll fit (not sure I'll be able to tilt them all the way up without the cowling hitting the tiny splashwell).

If I can't fit a 200 on there, I'm thinking about the 150, which I know will fit. Does anyone have the new Yamaha (or Honda?)150 four stroke on this big of a boat? My boat has a full hardtop and 95 gallon fuel tank, so it weighs around 3000-3500 lbs. I'm concerned that I'll really regret downsizing from 250 to 150. I guess I'd just really like to hear from someone with the new 150 4 stroke to see how it performs. I'm particularly concerned that I'll have to run it at really high RPM's which would shorten the motor life.

Thanks in advance.

Joe

Fish Hawg · 03-01-2004, 10:12 AM

I would not like loseing any hp at all. We had a 150hp on or 20' glasply. then we put a 200hp yamaha on it. You cant belive what 50 more hp at the prop can do :shocked: . The more the better. What you need to do is put the new yamaha 300 hpdi V Max on the back.

Then you can give those little bass boats a run for their money :grin: .....Ross

5-Cents · 03-01-2004, 10:27 AM

Joe dont loose the horses... I've read some industry news on the new outboards coming out this year and you may want to wait a few months. I guess the newer 4-strokes will have more weight to power ratio than the 2's! Do some research.

Oh and you should go with Merc :tongue:

Ivana Fishalot · 03-01-2004, 12:10 PM

This whole supercharger thing is unreal. I know that it is not popular amongst a group of fisherpeople but I still love my watercraft. Has anyone seen the 215 horse supercharged fourstroke Sea Doo? :shocked: My watercraft will reach 58-59 in a good long run and it only has 110 horse.

Mr. Carp · 03-01-2004, 12:51 PM

We don't want this to become a "bash Merc's" thread, but I have some good stories to throw some fuel to the fire. hehehe

:grin: [img]graemlins/dork.gif[/img]

5-Cents · 03-01-2004, 12:59 PM

After what Ivana had to say Ivana really have a couple for my tub now :grin:

weekend warrior · 03-01-2004, 01:23 PM

This is kinda off the topic but while I was in Bellingham over the weekend I saw a guy with some serious money to burn. He had a 25' Trophy(I think) and he had twin Merc 225's on it with twin 9.9 on both sides. Looked really impressive, but man thats a alota dough.
Joe you can never have enough power. You like to be able to get up and go when your heading out to the CR and losing 100hp is quite a bit. But what do I know I just have a DB with a 9.9 on it.
Good luck

Killertraylor · 03-01-2004, 04:16 PM

Just got off the phone with Northriver and they agreed - 150 is just too underpowered. I think I can get a pretty good deal on a F225 right now and they think it will fit....decisions, decisions....

Mojo · 03-01-2004, 06:32 PM

Joe,
My rule has always been, get as many horses as you can afford. 225 ought to do o.k., but you'll miss the 25 that left the pasture. When are the Verado's coming out?

Get Bent · 03-01-2004, 07:11 PM

YAMAHA F225TXRC

Denali · 03-01-2004, 07:38 PM

The Verado's are out. Initially the only way you'll get one is on the back of a new boat(package). I think the 275 is close to 700lbs!

Joe,

Still think your overlooking the HPDI.

Killertraylor · 03-01-2004, 11:00 PM

Shane, you'll never see my boat with a BBND hangin' off the back. Twin BBND's maybe....

I've got Northriver measuring the cowlings to see if a 225 4 stroke will fit on there - if not, I think I'm just keeping the 250. Although I haven't got a quote yet, I'm guessing that an upgrade to a F225 is going to be at least $6,000. I can buy a lot of gas and 2 stroke oil for $6,000...

Ivana Fishalot · 03-01-2004, 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 5-Cents:
Joe dont loose the horses... I've read some industry news on the new outboards coming out this year and you may want to wait a few months. I guess the newer 4-strokes will have more weight to power ratio than the 2's! Do some research.

Oh and you should go with Merc :tongue:

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">I just read about the Verados from Mercury. :shocked:

Can you say supercharged?

Way outta my league (I was trying to decide between a 40 and a 50 fourstroke) but very impressive.

5-Cents · 03-01-2004, 11:47 PM

Ya those Verado's look awesome! :shocked: Maybe some day I can have twin 200 Verado's on the back of my boat [img]graemlins/idea.gif[/img]

I read some reviews in a couple magazines saying that these engines will revolutionize outboards as we know them today... I guess Merc is going to stop using Yamaha heads now :grin:

Killertraylor · 03-02-2004, 09:18 AM

Denali - I looked at the performance numbers for the HPDI - they get just over 1/2 of the fuel economy of a 4 stroke of the same HP on a boat that weighs as much as mine. (I think numbers were like 9 gph at cruising speed for the HPDI vs 5 gph for the 4 stroke.) If I wanted a good 2 stroke, I'd probably just keep the one I have, assuming it's repairable. I'll post more on the damage issue later today after I find out how the dealer is going to treat me on the trade.

Mojo · 03-02-2004, 10:30 AM

Jim,
700 pounds is nothing. Heck, I weigh almost that much already, plus you throw in a cooler of Moose Drool, all my gear, and you are there.

275 ought to push the added weight just fine. Didn't see the tiller option on Merc's website though... :grin:

Killertraylor · 03-02-2004, 12:07 PM

TUNA!You know it, Denali!

I just got off the phone with Northriver. Seems it's going to cost me $6600 to "upgrade" from my 01' Saltwater series to a F225 4 stroke. The HPDI 250 is a $6400 upgrade. I'm thinking that's just too much. I've only got 147 hours on the saltwater series. I'd be gaining a new motor with a 5 year warranty and better fuel economy, but that's a lot of cash to spend when I've already got a very capable motor.

The damage issue is this. I took the boat in last fall to have a broken cavitation plate fixed. Northriver sent it out to be welded and the company that did the welding didn't put lower unit oil back in the motor when they put the lower unit back on! :shocked: I was out running the boat on Saturday and it all seized up and just died on me. Northriver is going to put a new lower unit on it for me and make sure nothing else was damaged, all on their nickel. Northriver tells me all will be fine with my 250, and they will warranty the repair. I'm thinking that for $6600 I can buy a new TR1, a new Garmin Chartplotter, and still have about $4000 in my pocket to buy gas and oil. The saltwater series always ran great and I've taken really good care of it, so I'm leaning towards keeping it.

I looked at the Honda but it's about $800 more than the F225, plus I'd have to replace all my controls, controlbox, etc. which means I'd probably be in the $8000 range to upgrade to a Honda.

Whoever said boats were expensive wasn't joking....

5-Cents · 03-02-2004, 02:29 PM

Joe what is that... a few more hours here and there and bingo you got your motor!

Muddy Water · 03-02-2004, 02:59 PM

Killertraylor,
I'm glad you decided not to get the 150. NR was selling the 21' Seahawk with the 150, and I thought that was a little under-powered. I ordered a 22 with the offshore bracket and the F200. I changed my order some days ago to a F225. I figured it was cheap hp, but probably not necessary. Are you having issues with range, or does the saltwater series eat a lot of gas, or smoke?

I gotta tell you, I'm putting my Garmin 188C, (combo chartplotter/sounder) on the Seahawk, and it is worth it's weight in gold. The TR-1 is next.

What's your custom cowling all about? Do you have the offshore bracket?

My opinion: Keep the 250, which must be an awesome powerplant, and add more goodies.

Killertraylor · 03-02-2004, 03:06 PM

Muddy - I've got a custom transom/splashwell that is only as big as the motor (you can walk back on both sides of the outboard to get fish around it. The outboard is mounted to the stern, no bracket. I had them design the splashwell just big enough for the big motor and because the cowlings are so big on the 4 strokes, I'm concerned the cowling will hit the splaswell and break when I have the motor tilted up.

I like 4 strokes for the same reasons everyone else does, I just don't think they are $6600 better than what I have right now. That 250 saltwater series treated me very well up until they forgot to put lower unit oil in it. :shocked:

Shane - you should talk...

Muddy Water · 03-02-2004, 03:29 PM

The 250 will be fine. I'm glad NR is taking care of it. What would have happened if you took it offshore?

:blush:

Did you check out 5 cents new graphics?

orsturgeon · 03-02-2004, 09:14 PM

Whoever said that boats were expensive weren't kidding. I have a 20' Boulton sea skiff it came with the 115 Yamaha 4stroke. The motor has under 40 hours on it. Was thinking that I needed a little more power so looked into the Yamaha six cylinder 150. New the motor will cost me 10,600. The Yamaha 200 is 14,000. Then the bad news - trade in value for a brand new motor that has had a dealer performed 20 hour service, IS UNDER 6,000. They tell me that if I can get 7,000 on the street I will be lucky. That is some devaluation. Bottom line 3,500 more for the 150 and 7,000 for the 200. Too rich for my blood. Anyone got a slightly used f200??

orsturgeon

Denali · 03-02-2004, 11:40 PM

KT,

Ya got the tuna fever. Sorry to hear about engine damage. How about the Honda 225? Doesn't that have a narrower profile then the Yam. Ofcourse new gages etc may make that cost prohibitive.

Kamalot · 03-03-2004, 04:31 PM

Joe,

I was at NR on Tuesday A.M. and saw your rig, very nice. I did notice your Prop was missing!!! I suspect that your Transom is one-of-a-kind so I suspected it was yours. I was there to put my down $$ on a 23' Seahawk and finalize some option decisions. In your shoe's I'd do the same and spend any extra $ on items that will assist your fishing, of which a good FF & TR-1 will surely do. Not to add these motors are just going to continue to improve with time!!!

Cory

Killertraylor · 03-03-2004, 04:41 PM

Thanks, Cory. You will love your boat! I've had mine offshore several times and they are wonderful in rough water. They said that they took the prop off but were having trouble getting the lower unit off. Apparently those gears really seize up when you don't add lower unit oil! Are you getting an outboard? Offshore bracket? I really like the offshore bracket but was worried about getting fish around the motor so had the custom splashwell built instead.

Kamalot · 03-03-2004, 05:03 PM

Joe

Yes, I'm going with the offshore bracket and F225 I mainly fish Big Lakes (no sharks) in North Idaho and just climb out on the bracket for to net the big ones! I also made the mistake of showing my wife some pics of the hardtop with fishdrop like yours, so now digging in a little deeper in the pockets!

Cory

Killertraylor · 03-03-2004, 05:09 PM

That hardtop is awesome! Don't have to worry about storing your canvas or ripping it while towing and you can get out of the sun or rain and it never leaks! I love it. By fishdrop do you mean the fishbox on the front? I had that custom done by a local guy - Northriver wanted $2500 to add a fishbox after I had the boat for a year - if you want a fishbox from them, definitely add it to your order now (I think it was only a $500 option when I ordered the boat). If you have any more questions about the Seahawk, feel free to email me or give me a call (503)803-5988. I'm excited for you, I remember the anticipation of getting my boat very well even though it was 3+ years ago! If you ever bring it down to the coast and need an ocean running mate, give me a call - that boat was built for the ocean!

Kamalot · 03-03-2004, 05:20 PM

Joe,

Just might take you up on that, same goes if you'd like to try our Kamloops or Macks! I should be getting mine in late June. But by the fishdrop I ment the curtain in the back (or did yours have the alaskan bulkhead door)?. I'll be getting a fishbox in the Transom (new opt) and the one in the floor. Probably be using one of them for a cooler!!!

Cory