Good day to think about our future.....

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 07:58 AM

and consider the importance of education on Labor Day.

The power of education

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 08:38 AM

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cool Texan:

Interesting, if not disturbing attitude from one about to become a father.

Rather vivid illustration of much of our problem. Parents too absorbed in other things to care.

TheRogue · 09-01-2003, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Straydog:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Cool Texan:

Interesting, if not disturbing attitude from one about to become a father.

Rather vivid illustration of much of our problem. Parents too absorbed in other things to care. <hr /></blockquote>EXACTLY!!!

Good little article

TR

Jennie@ifish · 09-01-2003, 09:04 AM

Sad reflection on us, isn't it?

Sheesh. What is going ON in this country?

Right here at home!!!

It makes me angry. :depressed:

Jen

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 09:14 AM

It does give one pause and a bit of apprehension when considering our future and the futures of our kids and grandkids.

I guess the "me generation" is indeed alive and well, still. :depressed:

Interacting with educators and fellow school board members does give me hope though. Thank goodness some care enough to act. :smile:

[ 09-01-2003, 10:15 AM: Message edited by: Straydog ]

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 09:23 AM

Oh Stray....you read too much into a sleeping emoticon. The article, IMO, was not all that insightful. I am thankful for my education every day...so I dont need an editorial to remind me of that. Find me an exciting article, or one that discusses something new and unique, and I'll jump up and down in excitement.

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 09:33 AM

Well, whatever...........
For the record, I am not expecting or even wanting anyone to jump up and down with excitment, just trying to add some fuel for thought.

As a person that is very interested in Marketing, I did a quick search. Maybe this one will get you excited.......

Where is the concern for performance?
It seems to target "selling the sizzle"..... :whazzup:

:tongue: :grin:

[ 09-01-2003, 10:35 AM: Message edited by: Straydog ]

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 09:38 AM

Sorry Stray, not interested in Marketing at all.

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 09:41 AM

Dang. Just out of curiousity, what does move you?

Videos of Madonna and Britney, nice cars and nice vacations have been mentioned. What else?

Just curious.......

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 09:42 AM

Nothing that has any bearing on this thread. If you really care to know, feel free to email me and we'll take the discussion offline before it becomes any more immature.

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 09:46 AM

Well, ok but if I may, speaking of this thread and since I started it, know that many mature people have a passion for their kids and their kid's education.

For the sake of your child to be, I sincerely hope you are able to develop such soon. Too many people are sleeping through their children's developmental years and the education it takes to insure they get the most out of those years. :smile:

[ 09-01-2003, 10:49 AM: Message edited by: Straydog ]

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 09:47 AM

Stray, grow up dude. My initial post was one to indicate that I thought the commentary was boring.

You then degrade to trying to insult me for vacations I have taken, cars I have purchased, and other unrelated posts. That is the immature part.

Your backhanded posts are just sad.

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 09:55 AM

Call them backhanded and immature if you will but the fact remains I have seen you stand for little else..............?

Further, if you don't want negative reactions, don't post negative responses to posts. Pretty simple. If you thought the education article was boring, why not just ignore it? Why post the sleeping icon? What is the mature value that?

Speaking of mature, how many mature adults do you know that call each other "dude"?

I did not post this article looking for trouble. I have no idea what else you were looking for by posting your reaction. :whazzup: Looks like you created what you wanted.

Deal with it.

[ 09-01-2003, 10:59 AM: Message edited by: Straydog ]

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 09:58 AM

freespool · 09-01-2003, 10:44 AM

Straydog, bullseye,you hit the nail right on the head. Great article on the state of our young peoples future educational oportunities in this state. And CT that was the classic example of people posting to just say that's boring. Well here's a news flash,don't read it, and don't post borish replies. Contribute something to the thread one way or the other,but posting thats boring is just plain wrong.

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 1pump:
I didn't see anything new in that article either. We're all aware of the plight of education in this state.

I respectfully but adamatly disagree concerning the level of awareness.

Quote:

The tie-in to Labor Day was a clever "hook", but other than that, just the same rant.

Rant?? :whazzup: What in YHO constitutes a "rant"? Also, as a marketer I can tell you that strong hooks of are of the utmost of importance...sames hold true for fishermen!

Quote:

IMHO, education has never been at the top of the list of Oregon's priorities, and it suffers accordingly.

Kind of why I would like to help bring about a change in thinking.....

Quote:

We have some fine schools here, but the best talent in this state leaves after graduation from high school and attends college elsewhere. And usually winds up working elsewhere.
My nephew just left to start his second year at Purdue. He wants to be an engineer, and he would have liked to stay in state (his parents are both UO alums) but there's very little here in terms of top-flight education.

Kind of why I would like to help bring about a change in thinking....

Quote:

The article bemoans the fact that employers will recruit from elsewhere to fill vacancies. This is news?!?

It is an opinion piece, where is it written it must be hot new news??

So, tell us, is the answer to just

and work on our tans or might it make sense to put out some effort to try to bring about change to make the great state that so many migrated to even better? And if that seems like a worthy use of ones time and energy, why the negative responses (I still have been offered no other reason why CT would respond the way he did if not to instill negativity) when someone posts an opinion piece or a news article that attempts to invoke such action or at least some thought towards such action?

[ 09-01-2003, 02:18 PM: Message edited by: Straydog ]

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 01:31 PM

Stray, I'd be happy to discuss this with you offline any time you wish. Shoot me a private message some time, and we can discuss how to improve the educational structure of our fine state.

But on a sunny holiday afternoon, yeah, I'll be outside everytime, minus water breaks to cool off. I agree that efforts need to be made to make positive changes happen...but no changes will happen today, so back to the yard I go. And I'll contribute my efforts towards helping change happen each time I am allowed to vote. Further, when my children are in school (likely to be private school for high school years), I will certainly be volunteering to help out where I can.

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 01:44 PM

CT,

Thanks for the offer but I post this stuff to reach many more people than just you. It just so happened you are the one that posted the negative reply and irritated me.....

I have no interest in taking this up with you off line as it seems to me you would prefer to be part of the problem rather than part of the solution to our public education woes. I say this only based on your self proclaimed boredom of the topic, your predisposed notion that you will send your child to private school (you have either given up or have no desire to make things better in the time you have before your child enters highschool it appears)and the false notion that by simply voting you are "doing your part." I suppose if one is satisfied with the very least possible to get by, then you are doing your part. I set higher standards for myself. Therefore, I will spend my time on more useful endeavors, like informing as many of those that are not aware of the needs of public education and the consequences of ignoring the same that I can, rather than those that don't seem to care.

[ 09-01-2003, 02:46 PM: Message edited by: Straydog ]

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 01:54 PM

Fair enough Stray.

Regarding private school, if the system is still messed up by then, then yes, I will send my children to a private school. Its called a backup plan.

You want to help educate the masses on improving the school systems, that's great. I'd support you 100% every time. However, you simply posted a link to an editorial which had, for me, nothing new to say. If you want to help broad collections of people become more informed on the issues as well as how to get involved in fixing them, then by all means please post the specifics (facts, not opinions) for us to read. This is not a sarcastic post...show us what the reported problems are. Show us all the areas for involvement, etc. Right now, I work full time and am pursuing an MBA at night. Doesn't leave a lot of extra time to do much else than simply vote on the issues and vote for candidates which I think will help Oregon improve in the future. There's only so many hours in a week.

If you dont want to take it up offline, that is fine. But you cant then accuse me of "giving up". Not arguing with you, simply trying to get more substance than editorial articles.

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 02:43 PM

Backup plan is not how it was presented, it was presented as the most likely plan with no prefered plan described. It's called backpeddling, Cool.

You and I went round and round on the specifics of this in the past. Been there done that....

I posted a date specific opinion piece based on today being labor day. I had no intentions of reiterating what I said months ago to you or anyone else.

You have succesfully taken all emphasis away from the intent of my post.

Thus, again, making yourself part of the problem in my honest opinion.

Birdnest · 09-01-2003, 02:45 PM

[img]graemlins/icon_argue.gif[/img]

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 02:52 PM

No Stray, that is how you interpreted it while making no effort to see if you were sure on what I was really saying. Notice how I said "likely to be"...that should cause a rational person to realize there could be more behind that statement. Its called an Internet Message Board. There is no possible way to communicate all information all the time about all angles of all topics.

Anyway, this thread has become silly at this point.

Happy Labor Day Stray!

1pump · 09-01-2003, 02:57 PM

Dog, I'm certainly not disputing the accuracy of the opinion piece. I'm just getting a little tired of everybody crying about the state of the school system (not on ifish, just in the media and elsewhere) and doing little or nothing about it. Seems hypocritical for me to be saying that while taking no action myself, but other than my vote I don't have a lot of say in the fight for education. I don't have a degree, which makes me uneducated white trash in a lot of people's opinion. The legislators in Salem don't want to hear from me, even though they're supposed to be accountable.
Like you, I'd like to see a change in thinking, and I honestly believe that a lot of freshman legislators head to Salem thinking that they can make a difference. But then they get overwhelmed by the cynicism of partisan politics and the grind of a session that lasts nearly eight months, and the results are way too predictable.

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 03:01 PM

1pump, we're in a similar boat here. We both care, we're both tired of hearing the mindless complaining, and are looking for something we can grab hold of in terms of how to make the right changes happen, aside from voting. There seems to be little of that around the media or elsewhere unfortunately.

[ 09-01-2003, 04:02 PM: Message edited by: Cool Texan ]

Thumper · 09-01-2003, 05:17 PM

Man! Youse guys git up on the wrong side of the bed this morning? Chill!!!!

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 05:58 PM

1 Pump, Ct,

I can't tell anyone else how to be an activist as we all have our own strengths, weaknesses and passions.

I am very passionate about Fish and Kids.

I write letters to the editor and guest opinions. I communicate with all of my State Legislators and Senator on a regular basis, via email, phone and public meetings. One pump is right, often they don't want to hear from you if you don't agree with they are doing. However, it is most imperitive that they do hear from you on those issues. Atta boys are good and should be given but we can not expect them do what we feel should be done if we do not let them know.

I also communicate with others in and out of politics and network with many, many people via email.

I attend public meetings and publicly thank my elected representatives as well as inform them of what I would like them to do.

I am involved several community and regional volunteer groups so that I can have a say on actual decisions regarding fish and education.

I think there are many things people can do besides just vote, even if it is 20 minutes to write a letter to a legislator or the editor. Did you know that the letters to the editors is the most read part of any newspaper?

It is my belief that we all have a responsibility to be involved at some level beyond just voting. I believe that is how communities and governments were meant to work, with community interaction and involvment and I am a firm believer that simple grass roots activism can bring about change.

BTW,1 pump, here is a little secret I am not proud of but is a fact, just the same. I don't have a degree either. I quit with 37 hours left to complete my bachelors degree. I honestly don't think that has any bearing on ones effectiveness as an involved citizen.

Like it says down below, "everyone can do something."

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 11:11 PM

Freespool, I am glad that you found the article to be interesting. I did not, and thus my response. Just because I disagree does not make me wrong...it simply means that there was nothing in the article that I had not either already heard before or thought about before. From there, the personal attacks by Stray started (before he edited them all).

If the commentary was insightful for you, that's great. Seriously. We should always be aware of the importance of education....just doesnt mean we should be excited by every article if that article does not present new information or insights....that's where I was coming from.

With that, I am back to the backyard to continue my studies of Cross Cultural Management....the real snoozer subject. At least its sunny so I can get a tan in the process.

freespool · 09-01-2003, 11:32 PM

CT,your response of a snoring face,meaning you find this article boring contributes nothing to ifish. In fact it only gives the impression you are bored. In my short time with ifish,I have found many of your threads boring,instead of posting and telling you so,I simply ignored them. This is called maturity.

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 11:35 PM

Go ahead and tell me they are boring to you. I do not mind the negative responses.

That said, I'll keep your words in mind in the future.

Straydog · 09-01-2003, 11:45 PM

For the record, no personal slams were edited.

1pump · 09-01-2003, 11:46 PM

I didn't see anything new in that article either. We're all aware of the plight of education in this state. The tie-in to Labor Day was a clever "hook", but other than that, just the same rant. IMHO, education has never been at the top of the list of Oregon's priorities, and it suffers accordingly. We have some fine schools here, but the best talent in this state leaves after graduation from high school and attends college elsewhere. And usually winds up working elsewhere.
My nephew just left to start his second year at Purdue. He wants to be an engineer, and he would have liked to stay in state (his parents are both UO alums) but there's very little here in terms of top-flight education. So he left, like most of the kids who want a good job when they're done with college (at least in his field).
The article bemoans the fact that employers will recruit from elsewhere to fill vacancies. This is news?!? That's been the case since 1859, when Oregon achieved statehood. Why are most people in this state from elsewhere? They didn't just throw their belongings in the trunks of their cars and head west on a whim. Cool Texan is from out of state, and while I admit I don't know what brought him here, I would guess it was his job (or his wife :grin: ) I doubt if he pinned a map of the U.S. on the wall and threw a dart at it to see where he was going to live. [img]graemlins/eek13.gif[/img]

freespool · 09-01-2003, 11:51 PM

CT,

Cool Texan · 09-01-2003, 11:56 PM

1pump, I came up here originally to interview for a job and spend a weekend in Portland. Based on that weekend, I decided this is the kind of town I wanted to live in...so the job offer was just the icing on the cake so to speak. My decision to move was due to the surroundings, not the job. Turns out I hated that job and have since changed, so its a good thing I didnt base the move decision on that. I met my wife a little over a year or so after I moved up here...just another reason to love Oregon. :grin:

AuntyM · 09-02-2003, 05:40 AM

Sheesh. Seems like this thread is really all about "I"

Straydog · 09-02-2003, 06:12 AM

Aunty M said

Quote:

Sheesh. Seems like this thread is really all about "I"

Well, one post is all about what I do to be involved, if that is your point. Of course, little of what I do in terms of involvment is about me, but I guess you didn't consider that part.

I got the impression CT and 1 Pump were wondering how to get involved and make a difference and I offered some of how I do it.

Now, I am wondering a couple of things Aunty.

I am wondering what point and purpose your post serves.

I am wondering why you came back to Ifish after accusing me of chasing you off by being so mean by reacting to rude posts such as the one you left this morning.

And I am wondering what your next whiney pee and moan will be now that I have reacted to your boorish, rude intrusion into this thread.

Jen, Pete, etal, save the emails. I am sick of being attacked on here and then reprimanded when I react. I am not one to take pot shots and not react, just not my nature. If defending myself from the likes of Aunty M is unacceptable, then ban me.

[ 09-02-2003, 07:23 AM: Message edited by: Straydog ]

Straydog · 09-02-2003, 06:29 AM

Aunty M,

Did you miss the statement below or just choose to ignore it as it would make it harder to present your rude comment towards me had you considered what was really in this thread?

Quote:

Originally posted by Cool Texan:
1pump, we're in a similar boat here...and are looking for something we can grab hold of in terms of how to make the right changes happen, aside from voting. There seems to be little of that around the media or elsewhere unfortunately.

Pete · 09-02-2003, 06:31 AM

Ok, guys, the bickering has gone far enough. This thread had value, but it's decayed to a personal level that might be better conducted by e-mail. Let's move on.