Life In General - One Texans Opinion

Cool Texan · 07-31-2003, 01:06 PM

I've been coming to iFish for a couple of years now, and have frequented this board (mainly lurk on the fishing board since I dont get to fish too often). Over this period of time, I have come to realize some things.

iFish is a very unique site in that there is a very strong sense of community here. Its not just a bunch of people talking about fishing, but rather a bunch of friends discussing fishing, life, religion, selling things, etc. All in all, its a wonderful site.

But there is a dark side to the site, or at least to L.I.G. All to often, in the course of a discussion on a particular topic, the threads seem to inevitably swing from a discussion of the facts or mutually respected opinions to a mud-slinging series of direct or veiled personal jabs, insults, and other negative comments. If that is not the case, then its someone merely commenting on what an idiot this or that president is/was, and the usual series of pointless politics which do not help to discuss the original spirit of the thread.

September 11th taught us that we are one country, one people, and that the world is or should be one community. Why should that not continue on here? Why does it seem that we iFishers are unable to politely, professionally, and maturely discuss or debate (an exchange of facts and opinions with mutual respect) certains topics as they arise on here? On so many threads, the discussions are exactly as I would imagine a group of friends and strangers discussing things. On some though, the veil of the internet seems to open things up to a battleground mentality, where you must have the last word, lob one last insult, or make some other negative comment in reply to another. Why cant we apply the rules of our daily lives to ALL threads here on iFish?

OceanBlue summed it up perfectly the other day when she said (rough quote, not exact) that you will have you opinion, I will have mine, and neither is right or wrong. If you missed the post, I would urge you to go read it (dont have a link to share, sorry). There is no need to argue on here, but rather to try to understand what other people believe to be true. If you disagree, disagree on the facts, cite where and why you disagree, cite relevant external examples, etc. But do not resort to ridicule, name calling, and insults whether direct or hidden.

I realize I have been guilty of this in the past, and I realize I am not alone. However, I can only adjust myself. Here is my pledge to Jennie, to iFish, and to the Mod-Squad... From this point forward, any debates will be handled as if I am debating a topic with my father, my boss and my minister.

Sorry for the long rant. Just needed to get it out of my system.

Carry on.

Abalone · 07-31-2003, 01:16 PM

When ever there is a conflict between two people it can be determined who the aggressor is by
identifying who used the " You " word first.

" You" is a very provocative word. Remove it from a sentence and the animosity goes away.

OceanBlue · 07-31-2003, 01:22 PM

[img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img]

When discussing Ifish with a fisher at the cleaning station in Newport in the wee hours of the morning (do you have any idea how long it takes to clean 37 tuna?), he said something along the lines of, "I read it sometimes, but I don't know about joining... they have all these rules. I'm just not sure I could remember them all so I don't get thrown out."

My response to him was (besides the part about advertising or bashing businesses that advertise on the site), "As a general rule, you're probably safe as long as you don't say anything you wouldn't say in church." Now, even if you're not a church-goer, unless you have no social skills at all, I think it's pretty clear what that means, right?

And CT - here is the passage I believe you are referring to - My views are my views. My convictions and my beliefs are mine. If I honor you by opening up and sharing them, I would expect that you honor me by respecting my opinion.

The full thread is here: http://www.ifish.net/ubb/ultimatebb....4;t=001713;p=2

Abalone - you are absolutely right. We have a required class where I work. It is called "Constructive Confrontation." That is definitely a "rule of engagement." Take the word "You" out of the equations. Make "I" statements. It's hard, but if one works at it, it is amazing how much more amicable things are.

lost_sailor · 07-31-2003, 01:48 PM

I'm afraid it probably reads like we're taking it more seriously than we really think we are.

It's kind of a sport, as far as I'm concerned. You play hard, you talk some trash, you win or lose, but at least you had a workout.

I think for the most part, we've made a good effort at remaining semi-civil (it's the Internet, it's NOT church!) and the mods have done a good job of keeping the animals inside the corral.

OceanBlue · 07-31-2003, 01:52 PM

Lost-Sailor - I'm thinking if one wants a workout, one should probably find a playground or hit the gym. If you want a mental workout or enjoy making a sport out of debate, perhaps a debate club is the place to be. The point I'm trying to make is that if we exercise some self-control and self-moderation, perhaps the mods wouldn't be so overworked.

And who knows? Maybe the world will become a nicer place as a result? Seriously, if you exercise positive skills here, they can be applied anywhere in your life to achieve better results.

No, this isn't church. Better than that, it's Jennie's house. We should have at least as much respect for it.

[ 07-31-2003, 02:57 PM: Message edited by: OceanBlue ]

lost_sailor · 07-31-2003, 02:13 PM

One can hardly disagree with those comments.

But if it gets all sanitized, it's like watching a football game where the teams take turns on the field with no defense. Not very interesting, after a while.

Sorry for the sports analogies, not sure where that's coming from.

Maybe there SHOULD be a separate board for hopeless political wrangling, and L.I.G. can just be jokes and cute stuff our dogs do. That would work.

[ 07-31-2003, 03:18 PM: Message edited by: lost_sailor ]

Cool Texan · 07-31-2003, 02:19 PM

I can appreciate Trash Talking as much, if not more, than the next guy. However, I never trash-talk with strangers, as the humor and the innocence is lost on them, and the outcome is frequently heated.

Then again, perhaps that is just what we need...a good "yo mama" joke thread. :grin:

OceanBlue · 07-31-2003, 02:27 PM

I'm sure there are lots of discussion boards out there for those who enjoy "wrangling."

Healthy debate is a good thing. And if people present their opinions respectfully, their views are bound to be considered more thoughfully.

I know that when I read a well thought-out and respectful opinion that differs from mine, I'm much more likely to chew on it and understand that point of view. When I read something that is heated and un-constructive, I tend to dig my heels in and completely disregard the actual content of the message.

Food for thought.

Thumper · 07-31-2003, 03:05 PM

I think your moustaches are all quite handsome.

Kidding!!!! :grin:

OceanBlue · 07-31-2003, 05:37 PM

Awww Thumper... Don't you know that commenting on a woman's moustache is insulting? :grin:

crabbait · 08-01-2003, 02:18 AM

People may think that the "sparring" is all in good fun. It isn't, and it certainly isn't viewed that way by people who read our posts and don't know any of us.

If you don't think that is the case, ask yourself how many times you have thought, "man, that guy is permanently off my open seat list" after reading an insulting or disrespectful post.

Then I meet the guy and realize that the whole person is a lot different than their party affiliation, political views or their taste in 2-strokes and jet sleds.

I am no saint. I have been known to toss a snide remark or a belittling comment (no, really). It is easy to get caught up in the discussion, feel disrespected, and lash out. I do my best to curb that impulse.

At one point, LIG got so hostile that we seriously discussed doing away with it all together. Instead, we decided to try to more strictly enforce the AUP in an effort to get back to treating each other with respect, even when we disagree with each other.

I am not sure what the "cure" is. I like what CT and OB had to say and I will continue to do my best to make the board a place where people can feel welcome to express differing opinions.

Like I said, I cannot accurately know someone just by what I read in their posts. Come to ifishtock. Shake some hands. Put some faces to these monikers. Share a meal and a smile and a story.

It's much harder to disrespect a friend.