Nets in the River

arkansasbasser · 07-13-2009, 09:42 PM

I fished the Bonny pool last Friday and there were more Indian nets out than I've ever seen there. These nets were very long and floating rather than he sunken ones I normally see.

The problem is that every decent point that one might want to fish has a net tied off to it, making it very difficult, if not impossible, to fish it. They were literally everywhere you went. There are even nets tied off to the end of the concrete at Cascade Locks launch, floating right out into the boating lane approach. I got my motor over one for a second. Thank God it came over the top without snagging in the net.

I wonder how many huge bass get caught up in these nets and then are dumped back into the river dead.

Blacktailfiend · 07-13-2009, 10:36 PM

I fished up there saturday and as you said there did appear to be nets EVERYWHERE... Not in any of the places I wanted to fish but it made navigation in all the whitecaps kind of spooky... One thing I also seen that I never seen before was lines tied off to the shore drapeing over a hundred yards out into the river.. Late in the afternoon we were on our way back down from up by wyeth and it was too windy to run the main channel so we came down the washington side where the swells were still pretty big but more navigable. So as Im pretty much jumping from wave to wave out of knowhere I see a line of small bouys about two waves in front of me so I tried to hook a sharp left at the last second to avoid hitting the net. well as it turns out the line is bowed way down river so when I seen that there would be no way to avoid hitting it at the last second I threw it in neutral killed the engine and tried to trim the motor as quick as possible. Not quick enough. End up getting stuck in the net........ All I can say is if it werent for the wind blowing so hard upriver and the bow being so big in the net line I dont know what would have happened. Thankfully since I killed the motor prior to hitting the net the net never got spun around the prop. I was able to trim the motor all the way up and go back and untangle the net from around my prop and lower unit before the line could tighten from the wind blowing upstream. I dont have a problem with them netting but that is completely dangerous. I was more than 100 yards off the bank and the net went another sixty yards past me. Ive never seen anything like that, not everywhere.. Its almost worth takeing the chance in the big swells over getting stuck in gillnets.... Atleast the fishing was pretty good...

cimfl · 07-14-2009, 10:25 PM

What makes you think they throw back the bass caught in the nets? They can keep anything but oversized or undersized sturgeon from my understanding.

Runner17 · 07-19-2009, 01:03 AM

I think maybe we should just try fishing around these nets... and if your hook gets caught in it cut the net around it to get it out... i dont have a problem with them generally but they just push and push and it has gotta stop somewhere

Green Eyes · 07-22-2009, 02:36 PM

You have to think the size of the warmwater fish, ie: bass walleye etc. would increase if the nets didn't snag all the bigger ones. We have been fighting the nets on the upper C for years and have seen abandond nets, sturgeon with net scares washed up on shore rotting,and like you said some of my favorite points and rocky structure have nets tied to them. The navigation issue is hard to believe, dodging old rotten foam floats when the water is a little up is almost impossible. We also have to pre run areas for water sports before the kids and us can play or run the risk of getting the prop or worse yet one of the kids tangled in them. Then if you really want some horror stories talk to the wind surfers, one told me of falling and while trying to get back on his board the current carried him into a gill net and then started to pull him under. Lucky for him he was able to escape with only minor injuries but could just as easily drowned. But then he would have just been considered by-catch and thrown back in the river to rot.

Tar Heel · 07-25-2009, 03:03 PM

I had the same experince--very close call--last Sunday in the whitecaps up river of the Stephenson launch. I had my kids and girlfriend with me, and we all were a bit spooked navigating the slalom course of nets. All so we can buy salmon off the back of the truck at the Charburger parking lot. And I wonder how much allowing them to sell fish has incresed the harvest, when it was meant to be a way for them to utilize the surplus catch they didnt need for sustainance? The whole thing is out of control-brings a tear to my eye.

Stadir · 07-29-2009, 09:51 AM

I don't want to sound Politically Incorrect, but why are there people in the "United" States of America that have special fishing and hunting rights over regular citizens? Now I am not white, I came from a different country and became a naturalized citizen. I joined the military and did my part for my country and its freedoms. So why are some people allowed to have special provisions and others are not, based on their race? This is a form of segregation that should be done away with. I thought all of this was worked out with the civil rights movements in the 60's "All men/women are created equal". But I don't want to turn this into a civil rights issue, this is a fishing and hunting issue.

It is unfortunate that the government enacts these regulations to placate a subset of our population, that effects all of us. Everyone effected should write your congressman and let them know that all American should live by the same rules.

Bluknight · 07-29-2009, 10:10 AM

Thanks for all the info on the nets. At least that narrows down my fishing options. I'll just stick to the lower river until things clear up. They do clear up eventually right??????

sucker · 07-29-2009, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stadir

I don't want to sound Politically Incorrect, but why are there people in the "United" States of America that have special fishing and hunting rights over regular citizens? Now I am not white, I came from a different country and became a naturalized citizen. I joined the military and did my part for my country and its freedoms. So why are some people allowed to have special provisions and others are not, based on their race? This is a form of segregation that should be done away with. I thought all of this was worked out with the civil rights movements in the 60's "All men/women are created equal". But I don't want to turn this into a civil rights issue, this is a fishing and hunting issue.

It is unfortunate that the government enacts these regulations to placate a subset of our population, that effects all of us. Everyone effected should write your congressman and let them know that all American should live by the same rules.

The native americans have rights layed out in their treaties with the US government as the treaty tribes are independent nations inside the US. The issue of fishing rights heated up with a federal judge finding that " to fish in common" meant the tribes were entitled to 50% of the fish.

arkansasbasser · 07-29-2009, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluknight

Thanks for all the info on the nets. At least that narrows down my fishing options. I'll just stick to the lower river until things clear up. They do clear up eventually right??????

Twothirteen and I were up there last week and the long floating nets are gone and back to the normal sunken ones.

Tar Heel · 08-01-2009, 02:06 PM

It's true that Native American fishing rights are pretty much off limits, due to a line of Federal Court cases. I have often wondered if the Tribes would consider selling some share of their fishing rights back to sportsmen. I would imagine there have been some discussions on this in other forums, if you did a search. An intersting area of the law, and very frustarting for sports fishers.

mkwerx · 08-02-2009, 12:07 PM

The whole deal with the tribes is out of hand and out dated. They no longer rely on these fish or fishing for sustenance. It's nothing more than commercial harvest for them - not like there are not other jobs to be had. The idea that the indian nations are "sovereign" is a farce. They're not sovereign - they have to run things through the federal government for permission, and Federal law enforcement agencies have jurisdiction there, over the tribal cops. It is seriously time that we push congress to do away with those old treaties. Back when they were signed, no one realized what things would be like today. Typical short sightedness of the times. If a Federal Judge can grant "rights" to the tribes, then a Federal Judge or Congress can just as easily take those same "rights" back.

If the Indians were truely sovereign, they wouldn't need permission to build casinos would they? And the map would be carved up and the US would have quite a few island nations that it surrounded entirely. We would be required to have passports to travel to and from the indian lands like we need for Mexico and Canada now. The indian nations are no more sovereign than a US military base or corrections facility is. It's just a big tract of land, with people who have been given special privileges more so than the average US citizen - people who are generations detached from those who actually fought against the US and drew up these silly treaties.

They shouldn't be allowed to gillnet the river, they shouldn't be allowed to keep anything that swims that anyone else with an angling license could not do so. We also should not need special permits or licenses to fish "reservation" waters - then again, there should not BE anymore reservations. The whole reservation system is a very bad joke, and was designed as defacto prisons for the indians anyway. It was a racist move then, and it's stupid to continue that "tradition" now. They can practice their spiritual beliefs and much of their 'old ways' on or off a reservation. They just don't need special hunting or fishing privileges. Buy the proper license and tags like every other citizen, and we'll be a-okay.

I've driven the gorge half a dozen times in the last week - and it is heart breaking and maddening to see all the buoy's marking all the nets in the river, some of them seem to stretch halfway out into the river! They are already a navigation hazard - would not bring a tear to my eye at all to have the USCG or state troopers remove the offending nets, then slap their owners with a bigazz fine for creating a navigation hazard.

Duz · 08-02-2009, 03:15 PM

I fish there anyways and if i catch a net i bring it in sometimes and cut a chunk out to get my lure.. I am part Cherokee and i dont try to even use my rights because its down right retarded.. the indians/gilnets down there are just horrible... wish we could ban netting on the inland rivers foreveer

saltchucker · 08-03-2009, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mkwerx

The whole deal with the tribes is out of hand and out dated. They no longer rely on these fish or fishing for sustenance. It's nothing more than commercial harvest for them - not like there are not other jobs to be had. The idea that the indian nations are "sovereign" is a farce. They're not sovereign - they have to run things through the federal government for permission, and Federal law enforcement agencies have jurisdiction there, over the tribal cops. It is seriously time that we push congress to do away with those old treaties. Back when they were signed, no one realized what things would be like today. Typical short sightedness of the times. If a Federal Judge can grant "rights" to the tribes, then a Federal Judge or Congress can just as easily take those same "rights" back.

If the Indians were truely sovereign, they wouldn't need permission to build casinos would they? And the map would be carved up and the US would have quite a few island nations that it surrounded entirely. We would be required to have passports to travel to and from the indian lands like we need for Mexico and Canada now. The indian nations are no more sovereign than a US military base or corrections facility is. It's just a big tract of land, with people who have been given special privileges more so than the average US citizen - people who are generations detached from those who actually fought against the US and drew up these silly treaties.

They shouldn't be allowed to gillnet the river, they shouldn't be allowed to keep anything that swims that anyone else with an angling license could not do so. We also should not need special permits or licenses to fish "reservation" waters - then again, there should not BE anymore reservations. The whole reservation system is a very bad joke, and was designed as defacto prisons for the indians anyway. It was a racist move then, and it's stupid to continue that "tradition" now. They can practice their spiritual beliefs and much of their 'old ways' on or off a reservation. They just don't need special hunting or fishing privileges. Buy the proper license and tags like every other citizen, and we'll be a-okay.

I've driven the gorge half a dozen times in the last week - and it is heart breaking and maddening to see all the buoy's marking all the nets in the river, some of them seem to stretch halfway out into the river! They are already a navigation hazard - would not bring a tear to my eye at all to have the USCG or state troopers remove the offending nets, then slap their owners with a bigazz fine for creating a navigation hazard.

You should get into the law, it sounds like you have a lot to teach. A couple of points: I am pretty sure that tribes do not need permission to open casinos on their reservations, they need permission to open casinos OFF reservation. Ergo they do have a governmental system that is sovereign at least as far as states are concerned. There is a rather complicated relationship they have with the federal government via Bureau of Indian Affairs (BIA) which is under Dept of Interior and the FBI which has law enforcement responsibility on many reservations. The feds can't tax em or enforce fireworks rules on reservations unless the tribe agrees. Suffice it say it is complicated.

The federal ruling on fishing rights recognized an existing right that was retained by tribes that had been ignored for decades. Some tribes explicitly reserved rights to half of the fish runs in return for reliquishing their existing claims on other lands. IF they did not have legitimate claims then one wonders why their treaties got ratified by congress?

I think it would be great if we could buy or lease tribal fishing rights. A big part of it is that tribal members value their right to fish very very highly and killing a box full of fish for sale, trade or personal use is something that they have been doing for a long time. I suspect we could lease fishing rights if we paid enough, but ya never know. It would be a great idea and has been suggested by a lot of people. I have a friend, now deceased, who allegedly stormed into a meetings of mucky mucks in the BPA building (ODFW, NMFS, USFW, BPA etc...) and threw two very large wild steelhead on the table, loudly informed them he had just paid 2.50 /lb for them and suggested that if they could get there heads to where they could see light maybe they should 'buy em' before they got killed.....I don't think his intrusion was well received.

Whatever IT is it ain't simple!

WR

Tar Heel · 08-08-2009, 08:43 PM

The "tear to my eye" reference was to an add that ran on TV in the 70's showing a native American cry as a car drove by and toss litter out of a car window. Who's tossing the litter now? Complicated, yes, but nontheless a sad state of affairs.

12244 · 08-08-2009, 09:53 PM

Time might tell if enough people wake up to the abuse of the resource that is currently going on. Its disgusting.

Here is the ad. Who is crying now?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4ozVMxzNAA

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tar Heel

The "tear to my eye" reference was to an add that ran on TV in the 70's showing a native American cry as a car drove by and toss litter out of a car window. Who's tossing the litter now? Complicated, yes, but nontheless a sad state of affairs.

Tar Heel · 08-09-2009, 08:17 AM

My goodness, it's true, you can find anything on the internet! That's the one allright. A very effective add campaign indeed. I had forgotten about the canoe, factories....

magic79 · 08-10-2009, 09:38 PM

I have gotten caught in the nets TWICE out of Stevenson. Both times were big waves and white caps. You can't see the nets because they're too cheap to buy floats of the proper size, so they barely float at all. Plus, 90% use white floats, which are nearly invisible with white caps.

So far I've cut the devil out of my hand getting out of the net and almost sunk the boat the second time.

These nets are WAY out of control. If they had proper size float in Dayglo Orange, it would improve things a lot.

As someone said, they are pushing and pushing...