Second hand smoke and kids...arrrrghhh

[TheRogue]

First off....if ya want to smoke, go ahead!! I've bummed a few myself I firmly believe that government should not be doing such things as restricting smoking in bars, casinos, etc., or banning smoking all together. If you work in a bar, and don't like the smoke, pretty simple, don't work there!!!! [img]graemlins/berry.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/berry.gif[/img]

HOWEVER!!! What really bugs me is what I saw 2x yesterday. Two different cars, full of kids, with an "adult" at the wheel, puffing on a cigarette....with the windows closed. The second person I saw rolled down her window long enough to toss the butt out, and light another. Ya wanna bet the house they live in is filled with smoke clouds as well??

There are lots of studies out there detailing the problems with second hand smoke. Many of these studies tend to show that second-hand smoke is worse than filtered inhaled smoke. The tobacco industry has fought these with everything they've got....as expected.

I don't know how you would enforce a law, but, I would happily be involved in legislation that states it is considered a form of "physical child abuse" to smoke cigarettes in an enclosed space with anyone under the age of 18.

Sorry, but obviously, this really bugs me!!!

TR

[ 02-09-2003, 09:08 AM: Message edited by: TheRogue ]

[Kruechief]

I know Kyle,

It is tough when one thinks about how much you love and nurture your own kids and wouldn't think of putting them in harm's way.

While working in the prisons one or two variables were found to be probable. I could explain then in a casual effect statement but instead will use two of my mom's old adages.

One bad apple DOES spoil the whole bunch.

And, the nut doesn’t fall far from the tree.

On visiting days I would sit and shake my head as I pondered the gene pools. It was amazing that the kids were still alive.

My mom could have made a fortune doing sociological research instead of some da with a masters.

Nice meeting you yesterday!

Loren

[Silver Hilton]

Originally posted by TheRogue:
There are lots of studies out there detailing the problems with second hand smoke. Many of these studies tend to show that second-hand smoke is worse than filtered inhaled smoke. The tobacco industry has fought these with everything they've got....as expected.

I don't know how you would enforce a law, but, I would happily be involved in legislation that states it is considered a form of "physical child abuse" to smoke cigarettes in an enclosed space with anyone under the age of 18.

TR

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">Um, I haven't seen the studies, but doesn't that strike you as a bit unlikely, that second hand smoke could be worse than first hand smoke? Let's count the ways:

1) It's less dense, simply because it's dispersed
2) It's cooled, so it doesn't damage with hot gases
3) The nicotine has been reduced, because it was absorbed by the smoker
4) The tars and other carcinogens have been reduced, because they have been absorbed by the smoker.

So, how could second hand smoke be worse for you than first hand smoke? At worst it could be as bad as first hand smoke, and then, only if you somehow maintained the concentration.

As to defining it to be a form of child abuse, I think that's overreacting. Consider the precedent it would set. The most carcinogenic thing most of us encounter in our regular lives is the smoke from burning meat, as in barbecued steak. This contains chemicals that have been shown to be much more carcinogenic than the products from tobacco. Should we make barbecuing hamburgers a form of child abuse as well?

I think making people put up with sidestream smoke is discourteous, and I always avoided doing so, and never smoked in the presence of my children. But making it a crime? I think that's going a bit far.

[Straydog]

It drives me nuts too Kyle.

However, it seems to me it has been pretty well proven that you can not legislate stupidity away.

It is, unfortunatley, here to stay.

While your idea has merit on the surface, given the budget situation we have I doubt, or would hope, that smoke patrol would be a high priority and I fear someone so stupid as to commit the 'crime', may be inclined to take their aggravtion of a ticket out on the child when home alone with them.

[Kruechief]

and I always avoided doing so, and never smoked in the presence of my children.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">[img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img]

I feel like TR on this, it is poor parenting to fill a car with smoke while your child is in the backseat. But abuse... I don't know about that?

It is too bad that we simply don't have a category of punishment under laws. Like dumba$$ rules. These would be like the "flags" Gallagher, the comedian, talked about. Do you remember? He said that once a person accumulated x-amount of flags on their cars they would be cited for being stupid (sort of the jest of it). Or perhaps you are then subject to a punishment to fit the behavior?

I like to smoke a cigar once in a while, but it is out in the garage or when I am out of eyesight. my four year old boy came and took my hand the other day and said, "Daddy, you shouldn't smoke."

Dang kids anyway!

Loren

[ 02-09-2003, 10:08 AM: Message edited by: kruechief ]

[bigfishon]

I agree fully that it should be kept from kids, their lungs are much more sensitive than an adults and I would have to think damaged much more quickly. I think it is all to easy to keep it away from them and let them be healthy. When they tell us to quit we should listen to them, they want us to be there for them as long as possible and they know we are slowly killing ourselves with our smokeing. Just cause they are kids does not make them stupid, they are smarter than given credit for allot of times, listen to them and look into their eyes when you do, they care about us and our self destruction hurts them even when we take it outside. Look it up on the net, there are sites that explain why second hand smoke is worse than first hand smoke, and the results are from scientific studies with equipment that can determin what is carried in the smoke. I am a smoker, I do not and will not smoke in my house or my wifes car at all at any time, or my vehicle when my wife or kids are in it with me or anyone who does not smoke simply because I know it is harmfull to them and and for adults who chose not to smoke I have allot of respect for the fact that are taking better care of their bodies than I am mine. I also even though I smoke do not think smokeing should be allowed in any public building out of respect for those who do choose not to poisen their bodies with this substance, we can take our bad habits outside and blow them into the air away from others. I believe it is selfish of those of us who smoke to say if others do not like it to go elswhere for recreation, if it is unhealthy for those who do not do it then we should take it outside. I do not like to go to bars, casinos, and the like because all the smoke in the closed areas bothers me and I smoke a pack plus a day myself, not to metion my wife hates the smell of them, I shower, brush my teeth, wash hands & face every nite just to smell good for her when we go to bed and do not smoke till I leave for work in the morning, if we go out I clean up before we leave and do not smoke the whole time we are out just to help her have a more enjoyable time (it does not bother me to go without for while to help others have a good time). I know how much she dislikes it and I should drop them to make life for us both better and to make my life healthyer not to mention at $4.00 a pack and over $30.00 a week on smokes I could start up quite the college fund for my kids. I hear allot of smokers who say "well if they don't like it they can leave" thats a bad attitude when the non-smokers are being subject to our unhealthy habit and not doing anything that is physicaly hurting us, we are a health hazzard and should not be so stuborn about pushing it down the throats of others. Just my thoughts.

[HeavyMetal BankFisherman]

If you want to smoke. You should keep it away from those who are offended by it. I smoke on occasion. A fine cigar and a single malt scotch or that cigarette after having that second pint.

I have always taken the view that it was my responsibility to partake in my tobacco endeavours without intruding on the clean air of others. If you want to light up you choose to do so. Those around you did not get the opportuinty to make that choice.

Under no circumstances should you smoke around children. The second hand smoke is bad enough. It's not a good lesson to be teaching to children. They should be taught the dangers of tobacco. They should not see adults relishing in the consumption of it.