Sex offender in the neighborhood... Scary

[Jennie@ifish]

If you are a woman, fishing alone, I wouldn't go up the other side of the Kilchis river by yourself.
I know I can't do it anymore. :depressed:

The Sherrif stopped by with an alert and told me that there was a risk for me, and that is why he was there.

Can you imagine more of this, should we not pass 28?

He's just across the river from me, and up a bit. It scares me, to even fish up the river now, in the summertime, alone. I used to wade up to the park. Uh huh! No more!

He used a gun, the sherrif said, to **** his victim.

Scary world. This, and what has happened at the Sherwood High School really has me shaking my head. Who can you trust?

Jen

[Grantspastor]

That's terrible Jen! Did he just get out of jail or something? Hopefully all the other neighbors are aware of his presence...especially those with kids. I used to volunteer as a Chaplain in a maximum security prison, and his kind are looked down on even by the cons.

[RvW]

Jen..

Its very disheartening to hear this, and I am very sorry you associate fear with fishing.
I dont think anyone should have to live in fear like this, but according to a parole board, this person has payed thier debt to society, and now must mingle amongst us. Doesnt seem fair, but its how the system works.

Get yourself a stun gun or some pepper spray or both, learn how to use them, or buy a handgun and pay the 50 bucks to the sherrifs office for a concealed weapons permit.

Seems extreme, but I dont think any woman at risk should be without one.

[AuntyM]

This makes me so mad!

I know your feelings on this but I wish you would get a handgun and learn to use it. What about your right to your pursuit of happiness?

Too many psychos out there.

[Jennie@ifish]

We have guns... I know how to use em, if I have to.

I'd rather just carry a thing of pepper spray though.

Good idea.

You know, the more I think about it, this is pretty wild country, and we do have cougar all around us. A gun might not be a bad idea, in certain circumstances... I was spooked today. Kilchis was growling real mean at SOMETHING in the woods. Then I found prints that looked like.... well.... a cougar! YIKES!

Jen

[poshie]

Since I don't know the area, shouldn't there
be some kind of alert for anyone fishing in that
area? Do you know whether or not the profile is for children or women?

[AuntyM]

Jennie, I know you are busy, but when you get the chance, check out this pic that Marty posted today. Noise behind you

If that isn't a good enough reason to pack a handgun, I don't know what is!

I would imagine the Deputy would not have bothered you unless he was worried about the creep re-offending. The guy likely won't bother you if Kilchis is nearby though.

[crabbait]

If a cat that size wanted you, you would never know it...........

[STGRule]

Warning… EXTREMELY sexist statements to follow… I am tired of having to lock the doors when I’m in my truck. I am tired of being somewhat concerned being in my own home when my husband is gone. I tired of having to think twice about where I am and having to be aware at all times. I am tired of having to worry about my children and grandchildren. I am tired of men who I have never met having that much influence on my everyday life. I cannot even articulate my solution to the problem. Suffice it to say that we would need many fewer prisons. The male ones wouldn’t be needed ever again. Those few women that need incarceration would still be locked up or dealt with in the same manner. It would be nice to only think of these things once in a while instead of every day. :depressed:

[thankful]

That person was what he was before he went to prison and he can be the same coming out of prison. Our experts says he is rehabilated. Can we take the chance? That person coming down the road with his wife and kids, can he be a pervert of some sort while his family isn't looking. Anyone can be that evil person, so are we to be afraid and arm ourselves to protect ourselves. You betcha! Come Molly bring me my shot gun, I think there is a rapist posing as a sheriff at the door!............just kidding....

[Snapset]

I am sorry to hear about your new neighbor.If you can't fish with a trusted friend, then keep that dog with you. He will let you know if somebody is around. A gun does you no good in your handbag, if the other person is already pointing a gun at you.

Even then, I don't know how much good a gun can do, because it would not be pleasant to grab at it every time you see a man walking the river, just in case. I guess if you knew who the guy was, then you wouldn't have to worry. I hope someone out there has solutions to this problem. I am afraid I kind of agree with STGRule on this one.

[RvW]

I think a few things are being effectively ignored here.

First, the man did 6 or seven years for his crime, and I would assume there is a prerequisite to his release...some sort of counseling and such where someone needs to be convinced that this guy is no longer a risk.

Second, I cant imagine a person who just spent 7 years in prison would be more focused on ways to re-offend than on his new freedom. Lets be realistic, and apply the old addage that its allways the person you least suspect. And considering a river bank with a dog, out in the open, this guy is not going to risk his freedom for a chance to re-offend in those circumstances. I just watched a segment of news the other day that said California law enforcement lost track of 70,000 sex offenders in thier state! Its the people you DONT know that you need to werry about!

With that I would also add that I would imagine 99.9% of us "men" are not naturally or instinctlively on the offensive. I feel as though myself, and everyone I have met are always aware and alert to the prospect of defending the vulnerable. In fact, I was charged with assualt and sued for beating the hell out of a guy who I found beating the hell out of his wife. Thankfully the judge found a loophole in the system, and threw the entire case out, twice (criminal, and civil).

Im not trying to say that you folks need to be less worried, I am saying that the worry needs to incorporate some realistic circumstances. I think the "worry" is in most cases the real problem, and I agree, who the heck wants to be concerned about this sort of thing?

Just be prepared, and be confident that you can handle a situation if it arrises and pre-program. Of course you cant never know if and when you might be confronted by a person with bad intentions, remember that even if this person didnt live near Jennie, there is allways the prospect of someone else out there capable of doing the same thing who ISNT being watched, who is somehow stupid enough to think they will not be shot, or pepper sprayed, or cought....or confronted by someone like me , and the majority of people out there who will not tollerate any form of abuse, neglect assault or anything else. It is meant to be public knowledge that this person lives in her neighborhood not in an effort to humiliate, or degrade this person. Nor is it an effort to to convince this person that his behavior is not tollerable and he should move.
It is an effort to arm the neighborhood with knowledge, and to plant a seed in this guys head that eveyone knows, and he will be watched like a hawk.
Prevention is the key here. this guy was cought once, and inprisoned...its the people who have not been caught, who somehow think they wont be, who need to be focused on.
Prevention in any case is the goal.
Take whatever steps need to be taken to build the confidence that nobody is going to see you as an easy target!
I would suggest, if tension and worry are to be eased in Jennies situation, that a legal way to let this guy know the neighborhood is aware of his crime, and each individual in the neighborhood who is at risk has implemented ways to protect themselves and each other from him, and anyone else like him.
Then Jennie, and everyone else can fish without fear spoiling the good time, but remember, anyone at risk is always at risk, and all victims have one thing in common. They didnt think they had a thing to worry about!

Jennie, I really hope you find a way to put this in the back of your mind, and fish wherever you want to fish, without a bad feeling like this ruining you trip.
I would just like to say that even if this guy didnt live in your neighborhood, you, and everyone else need to ALWAYS keep it in the furthest reaches of your mind that there are people out there capable of this sort of attrocity, and arm yoursleves with effective ways to prevent it.

Always tell someonewhere you are going to be, or leave a note or a voice mail for someone.

Defensive tools are a good start, and though in some cases may be inneffective, what you say, and the confidence you have if ever faced to face with a person such as Jennies neighbor can often be the silver bullet...a cell phone with speed dial, and a comment that someone knows exactly where you are and knows that the offender lives in the area...a comment that a freind is just down the river in shouting distance, a comment that you have armed yourself with a gun, and self defense training will all have an effect.

We cant eliminate the people like Jennies neighbor, they will always be there, but we can eliminate the potential victims. Isnt that the goal? NO more victims?

Just my two cents, I hope it helps someone.

[GutshotApe]

The new Atlas of Oregon has a Crime & Prison section on page 56-57. One map shows the residences of all criminal offenders in the Eugene-Springfield area with a small red dot and the residences of registered sex offenders with an orange dot. There are hundreds of dots. The array of dots closely parallel the overall population densities of the two cities and the offenders lived in virtually every residential neighborhood.

In 2000, there were 31,000 supervised criminal offenders (parolees and probationers of all types) in Oregon, or about 1% of the state population and more than three times the number of inmates still in state prisons. :depressed:

[The Fishing Geek]

Two points:

1) Once a sexual predator serves their time, they get out. Doesn't matter if they are "reformed" or not, as there are folks released from prison that have the dubious label of "probable reoffender". Sorry, but that's how the law works. If we're not keeping them in long enough, or if we're not doing a good job of rehabbing them, then we need to fix it.

2) The longer they are in prison, the MORE likely they are that they will reoffend. Many social deviants who spend long periods in prison find out that they cannot function outside of prison, so they do whatever is necessary to get back in. And why not do what they like?

Sorry to be so grim, but the truth is very grim.

[TheRogue]

This strikes incredibly close to home. Our daughter brought a letter from the school home a few days ago. The letter stated that a registered sex offender had just moved to within a few blocks of the school, and it detailed things kids should and should not do (which is pretty much what they should and shouldn't do anyway). This was extremely upsetting, especially when it went on to detail something even scarier...that the state parol board only distributed notices to homes within 1500 feet of the residence. Thank goodness the school is close enough to get a notice!

In response to this, the playground and basketball courts behind the school are said to be off-limiits after class is over...used to be a great place for kids to play after school was out. So, consequently, people have to adjust their lives to correspond to someone's right to live where they want.

I don't know what the crime was. Having been on a few juries, and not completely naive , I realize that there are a lot of extenuating circumstances behind a lot of cases. However, since we can find out very little about a person's crimes without a lot of work, it's very easy to assume the worst. Especially when there's big red signs that say "STOP...SEX OFFENDER" plastered on a house on the main street next to the school.

What do you suppose the percentage of sex offenders is who repeat their crimes, and often escalate the virility of them?? Seems like most of what we hear on the news stems from a sicko who has been charged with some sort of similar crime before.

I've always felt that if someone is dangerous enough to be labeled and followed for life because of the possibility (real or not) of them offending again, then they have no business being in public anyway.

TR

[ 01-10-2003, 08:55 AM: Message edited by: TheRogue ]

[RvW]

Two good points...the bottom line is information!
All this needs to be shared with everyone.

Theres an eliment of truth to your statements Geek, but if you look at the post above yours, these people are out there, and are not re-offending. Theres more than one reason why they dont, and I honestly think why the WONT is what needs to be focused on, rather than "if" its "likely" they will.

If we are prepared, and steps are taken in a preventative effort, the victims will be reduced. That is the most important thing.
I refuse to suggest to Jennie that she throw her arms in the air and quit fishing in her back yard.

Its ironic but not three days ago, I was standing in bi-mart chatting with a friend I have not seen in a few years.
I had asked about an old fishing buddy who both he and I used to fish with. I was SHOCKED to hear that this guy "Ben" had been convicted of child molestation and sentanced to 22 years in prison.
Maybe some of you heard of this case in Lincoln county, I guess it happened about a year ago?
Anyway, as I looked back, I think I could have called a few questionables into play, I remember dropping off two fish at his house once, (the only time I was ever there) and seeing his daughter , who was about 8 with two of her freinds at a "sleepover" party.

It makes me SICK to think that I could have opened my eyes and noticed something innapropriate about the arrangement..three young girls running around in thier underwear, and an adult male there alone with them. Of course hindsight is always 20/20 ..Though I had no idea there wasnt a "wife" or adult female around, and in a situation like that, I guess you would have to assume these kids parents were close freinds of "Ben". The point is prevention, Would you let your daughter stay at a single mans house over night? Not me, I dont care how well I think I know a person.
So the bottom line isnt trying to detect who is and who isnt capable of offending or reoffending, its prevention, keeping women and children out of situations like the above, and preparing them as to how to react to a situation before it happens.

I cant imagine the parents of these kids spent a whole lot of time explaining what to look for, how to respond or react to an assault of any type. its amazing to me that discussions about these types of things are not regular weekly family meetings.
Parents and indivuals at risk have a responsibilty to arm themselves and their children with knowledge. And the parents have a responsibility to follow through and make an effort to as much as they possibly can!..I dont think theres such a thing as "too much effort" when it comes to things like this.

I think thats the whole idea behind the Sherrif telling Jenny theres a sex offender in her neighborhood.

[ 01-10-2003, 09:33 AM: Message edited by: cirrhosis-of-the-river ]

[RvW]

In response to this, the playground and basketball courts behind the school are said to be off-limiits after class is over...used to be a great place for kids to play after school was out. So, consequently, people have to adjust their lives to correspond to someone's right to live where they want.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">This really "P"s me off! I see no good reason why the children need to adjust their lives to accomidate for a sex offender in the neighborhood! Just as I see no good reason why Jennie cannot fish in her own back yard!

If I were you, I would find a way to have a town meeting, and find an adult willing to play with the children, of course you cannot arm the kids with guns and pepper spray, so is it impossible to right a wrong here?

The injustice of the kids not being able to play in the school yard is insane, yet I dont hear anyone putting as much effort into finding a way to continue the after school activities than I do the complaints of the fact that they cant!.

If you look at the big picture, the school board who innitiated this policy are COWARDS if you ask me, and I have to wonder if they gave a moments thought to where the kids will be if they are not in numbers, in public, at a school where adults are present.

Nice way to cover their ***** and put the responsibilty on someone else.

[ 01-10-2003, 09:59 AM: Message edited by: cirrhosis-of-the-river ]

[AuntyM]

TFG is not far off. I worked as a volunteer for my local Sheriff on the Registered Sex Offender notification program. I think a few folks might have some misconceptions here. Oregon may be slightly different than Washington.

A person convicted of a sex crime may HAVE to submit himself/herself to treatment while in prison, but often, they do it with contempt and barely participate. During that process, it is determined what risk level the offender is. Sometimes, the determination may be made by a parole board, law enforcement or corrections staff. The type of sex crime, weapons or type of force used, and the level of cooperation in treatment are taken into consideration when authorities determine the risk level of an offender. In any case;

Low risk to re-offend in the community, level 1. Level 1 offenders MAY NOT be the subject of general public notification.

Moderate risk to re-offend in the community, level 2. Level 2 offenders MAY be the subject of general public notification.

High risk to re-offend in the community, level 3. At level 3, relevant, accurate and necessary information concerning offenders classified as risk Level 3 may be disclosed to the public at large

I am assuming Jennie was notified about a level 3 offender. At level 3, it usually isn't a question of IF, but WHEN this guy will commit another sex crime.

There is a reason the law requires sex offenders be registered in every state in the country.

I sincerely hope Jennie will take whatever measures make her feel safe. Under no circumstances would I hide in my home though. Get out there and enjoy yourself Jennie!

[Thumper]

Speak softly ..... and carry a Kel-Tec P32. It weighs about 6 ounces, fits in your shirt or vest pocket, and has a one-hit stopping percentage of over 90% with Silvertips. No macho thing. Just very cheap insurance.

[ryleysmom]

Jen
That is terrible.. There is no reason for you to have to live your life in fear becouse of this sick minded creap.. Why to they think they are rehabilitated, once a sicko like that does a act like he did, he is going to do it agian.. I would defenitly carry pepper spray or go invest in a stun gun... It is true a handgun is a good idea but like another ifish member said what good is that if the gun is in your back pack or tackle box , also, are you going to feel the need to have to have your hand on it everytime you see someone of the other sex walking down the river...

You would think they would have shown you a picture of this creap...
Did the officer do so and show a pic?
Then at least you would now what he looks like...

[lost_sailor]

I'm curious if any of you gun nuts have ever used your gun to get out of a threatening situation.

If someone has a gun in your face, are you really going to grab for your piece and blow them away? Seriously? Or your pepper spray for that matter ...

Or do you just shoot them as a preventative measure?

[STGRule]

While I’m sure the suggestions are all good ones for some people. I don’t want to carry a gun. I don’t want to HAVE to carry a gun. I don’t want to HAVE to carry pepper spray or a stun gun. I don’t want to HAVE to think about it all the time. I don’t want to have to hope somebody can come to my assistance. I don’t want to NEED assistance. I know, not gonna happen. Sigh.

[The Fishing Geek]

Originally posted by STGRule:
While I’m sure the suggestions are all good ones for some people. I don’t want to carry a gun. I don’t want to HAVE to carry a gun. I don’t want to HAVE to carry pepper spray or a stun gun. I don’t want to HAVE to think about it all the time. I don’t want to have to hope somebody can come to my assistance. I don’t want to NEED assistance. I know, not gonna happen. Sigh.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">Do they have sturgeon in Canada?

Go watch "Bowling for Columbine". All of you, regardless of your stand on guns. Interesting movie.

[TheRogue]

[img]graemlins/berry.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/berry.gif[/img]

[Boedy]

Rather have a gun and not need it then need a gun and not have it!

I have had to use a gun for self defense before and it saved my life I’m sure. I didn’t pull the trigger as just the sight of the handgun was enough to end the problem. I do my best to say out of situations that could lead to a problem but sometimes you can’t avoid them and I feel better if I am armed and able to defend myself and my loved ones.

You don’t need a permit for concealed carry if you are fishing in Oregon last time I checked..

[ 01-10-2003, 03:20 PM: Message edited by: Boedy ]

[STGRule]

Geek: yes, a few.
Even without the guns, Canada still has rapists, pedophiles, wife beaters, gangs, robbery, kidnapping, and murder.

[Jennie@ifish]

Yes, I have a picture here of him.
I will not lose my freedom to fish here. I refuse to be afraid. Cautious, yes, and always, but not afraid.

Jen

Very lost_sailor,

I'm curious if any of you gun nuts have ever used your gun to get out of a threatening situation.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">Why do you use "gun nuts" here?

If I chose to wear a PFD when on the water am I a "Life Vest Nut"

Guns are tools and nothing more. If you feel the need to have one do so. Just remember that you have responsibilities that me with carrying and using one. I usualy don't see any need to.

And by the way I have had to use a firearm to defend myself, my family and my belongings from both two and four legged varmints.

[ 01-11-2003, 09:06 AM: Message edited by: Keta ]

[cannonball]

I would Imagine Kilchis would have some impact on a person threating you. He may not stop that person, but he would at least cause hesatation. With the correct response from you, usually a combination of force and flight, an attacker can be overcome. Its important to remember that any use of a weapon should be accompanied by self defense traning. If you are not ready to use a weapon, it will more than likely be used on you.

[lost_sailor]

I will call anybody who "packs heat" a "gun nut" (unless it's your job) - not talking about hunting.

I only intend it in a MILDLY derogatory manner [img]graemlins/eek13.gif[/img]

I grew up with guns and hunting, and my dad felt more secure with a pistol in the drawer ... I can handle a gun, but I don't have any. In 43 years of life in Oregon, I have never wished I was packin'. My reality includes my dead brother-in-law, killed by his roommate at the age of 20 ... 9mm hollow-point at point-blank range OOOPS!

It just seems like if the bad guy pulls a gun on you, you would have to be quite the quick-draw artist. And going for your piece would be just the thing to scare him into dropping the hammer.

Well, OK, I was fishing at Fall River among a lot of fresh cougar tracks, I might have felt a little better with some heat ...

The "Nuts" are usualy weeded out with the conceled carry training. I know many that have guns around and they aren't nuts. If they were "nuts" there would be many more shootings. I have more problems with people with atitudes like yours than with people that carry a gun.

My reality includes my dead brother-in-law, killed by his roommate at the age of 20 ... 9mm hollow-point at point-blank range OOOPS!

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">This sound more like a drug or alcohol problem rather than a gun problem.

[Norski]

Some time ago about 10 years ago we hade a proublem over here in south county Deschutes, I wont say who was involved but when I found out that it hade to do with a family member being stalked, and this person went to jail, I went down to the jail and told the people who run our system that:::
LET"S CUT THE FAT!!!!!!
ALL WE NEED IS A SHOVEL
To this day they remember ME.
Was foolish to say but to the people who run our system over here but I need to say something as the people over here were tired of this person running amuck, To this day this person is stell in our aera, than I heard he is no longer a proublem as he has moved on to somewhere else. [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img]

[lost_sailor]

"This sound more like a drug or alcohol problem rather than a gun problem."

It was actually a STUPIDITY problem. It came with the "right" to have a gun without knowing the first thing about gun safety.

I admit I am attempting to provoke, but simply as a means to understand another point of view. I don't think my actual "attitude" should cause Keta problem - I will support your choice to carry a gun if you are competent to have the power to kill another person at your fingertips. And you may respect my choice to not take on that responsibility. I don't feel safer when a gun is part of any situation.

I usualy don't have guns with me as there is no need. I'm sure that there would be situations where you would like to have a gun handy. With all "Rights" come responsibilities. "Rights" can't be forced on those that choose not to use them, unfortunately the other way around happens too often.

[AuntyM]

I live out in the sticks. In a rural county with a limited amount of Deputy's available, and a resonse time of at least 30 minutes, it is up to me to protect myself.

The logistics are such that criminals find my neighborhood attractive and we lead the state in certain types of crimes. We are still close enough to the big cities to be attractive to those criminals. At the same time, we DO have wildlife that could also pose a danger here. So, in order to protect myself while I am alone, I am armed.

Any one who has a problem with THAT, can jump in a very deep lake with a heavy anchor duct taped to their middle.

AuntyM, AuntyM,
Definitely not in Kansas you say :smile:

If more people learned to rely on themselves and not government we would have a stronger and better country.

[AuntyM]

Keta, you are 100% correct sir!

I did want to toss in one final word and then I will shut up.

Teach your children! Tell them NO ONE should ever touch them inappropriately. Tell them never to be alone in a place they can be harmed, and to fight and scream if they are ever grabbed. Mothers, make SURE your children understand that threats made by older siblings or adults to keep quiet about the abuse are lies and that your children need not have fear if they come to you.

When we think about sexual predators, we conjure up the image of nasty looking older men. Sorry folks, but we have many juvenile and female sexual predators out there. In fact, both juveniles and women are handled with kid gloves compared to men and they may actually comprise 40% of the offenders out there. Women **** children and other women too!

Why is it wrong for a male teacher to molest a 15 year old girl but OK for a female teacher to molest a 15 year old boy? It isn't OK.

We need to change our perceptions! Children victimize other children all the time. It isn't harmless play, and it often leads to repeat offenses as the offender ages.

OK... I am done preaching all. Thanks for letting me vent. [img]graemlins/dork.gif[/img]

[bigshark]

The whole story is too long to tell but the shortest version goes like this. About 25 yrs ago the wife and a buddy were with me and we had been bowhunting. We were in Wallawa co. Or. The wife came rushing back to camp( we were sleeping on the ground without a tent) and said she could hear someone walking while she was paying a visit to the girls room area. She got in the truck and locked the doors. Joe and I remained in out sleepingbags. Two guys walked in on us both carring those long brush knives the army surplus stores use to carry. They came from different directions but at the same time. We laid in out bags and answered a few questions like what are we doing there. My wife rolled down the window of the rig and they could see she had my sidearm in her hand. Their attitude changed quickly and said they had a small sawmill in the area (whiskey creek) and they were just checking us out as they didn't want any trouble. The next day we hunted and returned to camp to find everything gone. Reported it to Wallawa Sheriff Office who told us we were damn lucky as several drug growing groups were growing there stuff in the area. There were no mills in that area only a few shacks built on public land and most were abandon as soon as they were found. Were we in any danger? We will never know for sure but I " carry" since then when I'm in the camp at night and I don't think I'm a nut nor is my wife.

[Norski]

Big Shark,
I am with you,4 years ago down at sheers bridg I was fishing I was talking to a indian who wanted to sell me some eggs, and at the time I hade all I needed, so I told him no thanks, it was getting dark and I got into my truck to come home and when I was leaving the area, 2 guys came up to the truck I thought they need help(NOT) I asked them if they needed help one grabed my arm (left) and tryied to pull me out of the drivers door, the other tryed to get into the passanger door (lock) when I got the truck into nutrual and the brake on I grabed my 40 and stuck it in the nose of the guy that hade my arm he let go, and so did the pistol they got in there truck and smoked there tires, to get away, I stell fish there but I don't care I PACK ALL THE TIME.

[justdave]

These types of situations are upsetting to all. Don't let this get in the way of your love for the ourdoors. Being aware is the main key. Many of us do this without realizing. I'm not so intent on my fishing that I don't notice the ducks flying over, the sea gulls dining on the dead salmon carcass, a deer crossing the river, a person fishing on the next hole. I'm sure, being a man, my fears and concerns are far different than yours. Arming myself with more than my pocket knife and rod has not often crossed my mind. My son wants to start packin' when he's fishing the back country. I guess I woudn't mind that. I might even consider it myself, but it wouldn't be for two legged predators. I don't know anything about stunn guns, but aren't they an eletrical charge? Water? Your rod alone would deter quite a few folks if brandished in a defensive mode. I wouldn't be afraid to use mine on four legged critters as well. Your valley is too beautiful not to enjoy when you want, just be aware and let your fear subside. There's fish in that river that want you to catch 'em today.

Just Dave

I could have gone on and on, but choose not to.

[Fishrite]

Very-lost sailor: I hope you have the picture now. "Guns don't kill people......people do". My friend Damon Coates is fighting for his life, as we speak, because of a 15 year old boy who has a very serious drug problem. He was shot in the face with a .45 Cal. handgun at point blank range. The gun did not pull the trigger... the boy did. He came from a very mixed up home....both parents do drugs as well. The problems in our society are not people who carry guns....most problems go back to the home and parents that do not teach their children properly to respect others.

Jennie....hang in there.....don't let this sex offender change your life....but take extra care and those of us who fish....let band together to help look out for each other... [img]graemlins/hearton.gif[/img] .. God bless, Fishrite

[lost_sailor]

ehhhh ... they both had guns, now they're both in the hospital all messed up. So, it's good to have a gun.

[STGRule]

fishrite: Are you speculating on drugs or do you have some inside information? The boy has some severe mental problems and his mother had tried to get him committed the day before the shooting and was denied as "he didn't appear to be a threat to himself or others".

[TheRogue]

The office shot was actually involved in a little piece of fishing history recently. Anyone remember the "first springer" off the clack a few years back?? Turned out it was a 20+ lb winter steelie?? I was told yesterday that he's the person who caught it!

Here's to hoping he recovers to make that same mistake again!!

TR