No Gore in the election???

[CATCH AND EAT]

Gore decides not to run again? Darn, I wanted to harp on the recount again.

Now that I revield what side of the podiem I stand by I am however interested in who you think would make a good canidate for the Democrats. And yes, this is a serious question. Please do not quote the article from todays Oregonian. There has got to be a good and worthy entry from the Democrats. What do you think? :smile:

[Lipripper]

[img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img] :grin: :grin: [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img]

[Cool Texan]

Just so long as Tipper promises to never go away and to continue to tell me how I should live my life and which music I shouldnt listen to. [img]graemlins/berry.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/berry.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/berry.gif[/img]

[The Fishing Geek]

Bradley would probably be a front-runner again; however, they Demos have left a very sour taste in my mouth lately so to be quite honest I haven't been keeping track of them much as far as presidential hopefulls.

[northriver1]

Big Bill, The first black president should have three terms to make up for my grandfathers past sins.

[OneLastCast]

I haven't heard much about Bradley but I would imagine he would be a possibility. I think we are going to see a strong push by Lieberman now that Gore has backed out. As well as many Tom, Dicks and Marys from that side of the aisle. They already seem to be lining up.

There is always Hillary, now that would be a smart choice.

OneLastCast

[The Fishing Geek]

Lieberman would be a Democratic nightmare. That man is more right than even Bill and Al were in the last administration. Lieberman is like that kid back in high school that everyone knew was gay except him. One day Lieberman is going to change parties to Republican and the rest of us will go "DUH!"

[walkersteelhead]

Maybe ole Al is getting ready to invent something like the internet.

[Lipripper]

If Gore ever gets elected to president you can bet he will look out for his old friend Hilary. and appoint her to Supreme Court Justice where she can continue her evil ways(she is pro choice). Bush may not be everyone's of choice for president but at least he is trying to undo the murder of innocent unborn children.

[The Fishing Geek]

How pleasantly myopic.

[DanS]

And now the can o' worms is WIDE open.

[CATCH AND EAT]

Okay, bringing it back to the original question. If you are a Democrat, (and I will not ridicule you) who would be your choice to run and why. Seriously, I am interested. (yes I am a republican but that should'nt matter since I am asking for your opinion.)

Now we are back on track with the question.

[walkersteelhead]

I am not a Democrat but lately with all the press he is getting they should recruit Jimmy Carter. But someone the people like would make to much sense.

[Mad Mikey]

That's a toughie, since Rush is way too liberal for me I guess I must be one of them frothing at the mouth right wingers that everyone is scared of :shocked: so I guess I'd want a democrat that is easy to beat. :grin:
But seriously, are any of the "bluedog" democrats still around??? They seemed to be more like what the democratic party used to be before it became a hodge-podge of splinter groups, special interests, "new dealers" etc. Kind of like the "working mans' conservative".
Or were they gone in the late nineties????

[1pump]

Fishing Geek, LMAO! :grin:

Lieberman doesn't stand a chance. He's Jewish, which unfortunately is an issue for a lot of people. And no, I'm not one of them. Not to mention he will be forever linked to Gore. And that name. President Lieberman? Yeesh. It shouldn't be that way but that's the sad reality. You have to look good and sound good to win an election. If you look like the captain of the Congressional audio-visual squad you're not gonna cut it.
Bradley is about as exciting as your average soapdish but he's the logical choice. About this time next year things should be a little clearer. If the economy doesn't turn around soon Bush will be in serious trouble. If you would have told me in '91 that his dad wouldn't get re-elected I would have issued you a tinfoil hat and sent you in for a drug test. But the economy torpedoed him in '92 and that was the end of him. George W. will be following in his footsteps in '04 unless he can pull a rabbit out in time. Good luck.

[Fishrite]

I don't think that it matters who runs in 2004 on the Democratic ticket. :grin: Noone will beat Bush!
We finally have a President that brings integrity, honesty, and a respect to the highest office in the land. I think that the American people are enjoying a president that they can believe. [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img] Fishrite

[J.Slay]

RipLipper - I would concur that the Demo candidate would likely work keep the existing abortion rights in place. If you think Bush is trying to do away with these rigths, then he must be doing it quietly, because I have not heard him say that....and if he does come clean to this stance, no way in hell he gets elected again. Abortion opinions should not be connected as being either Democratic or Republican.

Fishrite - "integrity, honesty, and respect...finally?" Moreso than Ford, Carter or Bush Sr.(amoung most others)? I would think a cocaine snorting(albeit for a short period of time), drunk, oil industrialist would not be on the the top of anyone's list of people of integrity, honesty, and respect, but you are entitled to your opinion. As soon as Bush get's away from his "war" (hello, it's an invasion) and turns back to the problems at home he will soon find he is way out of touch with America, and his ultra-conservative policies will cost him the 2004 election. Just my opinion.

[Sturgeon Tom]

After reading J. Slayer I thing we should all go back to fishing and talk about thngs we really enjoy. I did not know this was a political forum.

[The Fishing Geek]

Originally posted by fishrite:
I don't think that it matters who runs in 2004 on the Democratic ticket. :grin: Noone will beat Bush!
We finally have a President that brings integrity, honesty, and a respect to the highest office in the land. I think that the American people are enjoying a president that they can believe. [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img] Fishrite

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">Fishrite:

I'm going to pretend that there was an intended sarcasm in your statement about George W Bush. If there was not, then please let me know and I'll be happy to provide with you plenty of information that will make you think otherwise. And if I end up doing that, then PLEASE don't think that the justification for the Bush pillaging of America is that Clinton wasn't exactly a Boy Scout. Clinton was horrible with what he did (in and out of office), but Bush is outright sickening. Trust me. You don't want to go there.

Sturgeon Tom:

You might be lost, sir. This is the General Chat forum, where we can discuss things that are not fishing-related. I'm not saying that we don't need to go fishing, I'm just saying that this is the place for non-fishing discussion.

[24 on/ 48 off]

I hear dead horses being beaten all over the Northwest.

--spud-- :smile:

[The Fishing Geek]

[Dancin' Bear]

Fishrite - I agree with you 100%. George W is a true leader that leads with passion and a true conviction in what he believes. Our last president (Slick Willy) based his convictions and beliefs on the latest opinion polls. Thank god we finally have a leader who we can all look to and KNOW

[Dancin' Bear]

that he truly believes in what he is telling us. I think the American people have been hungry for his type of honest leadership and have also been hungry for the conservative beliefs that had been missing for the past 8 years. Just my opinion...

[crabbait]

You heard it here first: Our next president will be a war hero from Massachusetts named John. Sound familiar??

John Kerry - George Jr's worst nightmare.

And thanks for the laughs about Mr. Integrity, Gorge Busch! Thought I was gonna wet myself!!

[I Fred]

I would vote for Peter DeFazio in a heart beat. Seems honest, straight forward, and has common sense. Unfortunately he has no national reputation, comes from a small electoral state and has bad hair. If you have ever listened to him I think you would be impressed. He's a centrist Democrat which I like to think I am. HeeeeHaw!!!!! B.M. -----------P.S. Happy Birthday

[ 12-16-2002, 12:45 PM: Message edited by: bouyant minnow ]

[sinker]

Gore was just at a Costco up here for a book signing. I guess no one showed up and they had a hard time giving the books away to people passing by. :grin: :grin:

I think Gore can look at Bush's approval rating and know that he doesn't stand a chance.

[The Fishing Geek]

sinker:

Gore deciding not to run had nothing to do with an inflated presidential approval rating and everything to do with his recent toe-dipping back into the political arena. He had made himself more visible as of late to see what the reaction of the Democratic party would be, and the reation was a collective *yawn*. He has no charisma whatsoever, and that hurts him greatly.

During the height of the Persian Gulf war Bush II had a very high presidential approval rating. It didn't take long for that to go away once the flag waving stopped and people realized what a dark, dark man he was.

[GutshotApe]

Geek - Its all relative. Bush jr. and Bush sr. aren't perfect but who is?

I heard AlGore on the radio making the announcement that he is pulling out of the 2004 race and probably won't run again. I had never heard him sound more real, more relaxed, more personable at any previous occasion. Its as if now, for the first time, he can move on and quit trying to live up to his father's expectations.

[Straydog]

Historicaly, Bush will be looked upon as one of the most harmful Presidents ever.

The body count will be huge, the deficits will be huge and America will be a poorer place when he gets run out of Washington in '04.

I don't care to keep hashing over what Clinton and Gore did and am frankly tired of hearing about it. GGeezz, we couldn't wait to get them gone but can't stop talking about them!?!?!

Bush is killing us softly with his 'compassionate (my butt!) conservatism.

[ 12-17-2002, 07:28 AM: Message edited by: Straydog ]

[The Fishing Geek]

Ape:

I'm not asking for perfection. I'm asking that the President not set out to actively screw the private citizen for the benefit of their wealthy supporters. That shouldn't be so much to ask.

[You Betcha]

Fishing Geek:
Well put, on not sticking it to the average man while taking care of his BIG friends. He was "bought and paid for" before we knew he was running for president.

[CATCH AND EAT]

Interesting, so far I have had two responces to my question in this forum. Thank you Crabbait and bouyant Minnow. At least you answered the question. CB as far as smack though, you might want to spend a little more time at the Lucky Lab and refine your K-9 skills.

This was not supposed to be a thread on Bush sucks, Gore's a quitter, Leibermans Jewish and his name sounds funny. This post was to give those of the Democrat persuation a chance to voice who they would like to see run against Bush.

Now with the silence as to who might make a good Democratic canidate I take it that there are none? :whazzup: Come on there has to be others besides DeFazio and Kerry!

[GutshotApe]

I don't buy into the pessimism about Bush #2 (or #1 either). W's not out to screw the little guy in order to help out his rich friends. When you're worth millions already, got the ranch in Texas, got the good looking wife, got the two good looking but airheaded daughters, occupy the highest office in the land, why would Bush not want to do the right thing? He's a good man and eventually all but the most liberal democrats [img]graemlins/stupid.gif[/img] will figure it out.

And, as much as we would all like to just ignore it and hope it goes away, the threat to this country from radical islamic terrorism is quite real and may get a lot worse before its over. I'm glad Bush is in the WhiteHouse as CinC. I'm also glad the R's control congress and hope Bush & Co. rectify some of the excesses foisted on the U.S. by 8 years of Clinton/Gore.

Overall, life is good. :grin:

[Sturgeon Tom]

Gore will be back after the next election for his next run, rember he was raised to be president.
Geek all talk. Talk numbers after his last tax decrese the top 1% pays 24% thats 1% pays 24% of all taxes. Sounds like the average man is getting the short end of the stick. :whazzup:
He also has a very high rating right now, not low as sugested.
I am a little different, I have voted for both parties. I try to vote for the man and not the party.
As to the question I don't think there is a front runner in the demo party. No one person stands out at this moment.

[The Fishing Geek]

Originally posted by GutshotApe:
I don't buy into the pessimism about Bush #2 (or #1 either). W's not out to screw the little guy in order to help out his rich friends. When you're worth millions already, got the ranch in Texas, got the good looking wife, got the two good looking but airheaded daughters, occupy the highest office in the land, why would Bush not want to do the right thing? He's a good man and eventually all but the most liberal democrats [img]graemlins/stupid.gif[/img] will figure it out.

And, as much as we would all like to just ignore it and hope it goes away, the threat to this country from radical islamic terrorism is quite real and may get a lot worse before its over. I'm glad Bush is in the WhiteHouse as CinC. I'm also glad the R's control congress and hope Bush & Co. rectify some of the excesses foisted on the U.S. by 8 years of Clinton/Gore.

Overall, life is good. :grin:

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">Can you say all that without snickering? If you can, then you're not paying attention.

If you would like to start a thread about the workings of the Bush Administration then we'll talk about it there. Otherwise, I'll remind Catch and Eat that I *did* suggest Bradley.

[crabbait]

GSA - You gotta stop, man, you are killing me! ROTFLMAO!!!

Can you say greed? How outraged would we be at the Iraqi regime is there were no oil involved? Take a long look at North Korean for the answer.

C&E: K-E-R-R-Y, you don't need any other names. He will easily beat our appointed leader who could not even rally enough votes to beat Al Gore (who could not be lamer).

I figure old Al asked the DNC how they were coming on his next bid for president and they told him that if he was running he was running without them. Bye, Al.

So the top 1% pay 24% of the taxes. You are right, that is kinda low considering that the top 5% have 95% of the money. When are they going to start carrying their share of the load??

With George's economic plan, a Ralph Nader/Al Sharpton ticket would beat him.

Start getting used to calling John Kerry Mr. President.

[Straydog]

GSA,

Life is good?

Tell that to the mothers who's kids are about to start coming home in body bags.

Tell that to your Oregon neighbors.... highest unemployment rate in the country and unemployment is high nation wide.

Tell that to the parents and kids I see weekly who's dad and husband is in Egypt sightseeing while they try to figure out who is going to pack the wood, pay the bills and be there for Christmas.

Tell that to people who's sons were killed looking for Osama...... hell, as one comedian said, the guy has more videos than most rock stars and we can't even find and eliminate him!

Tell that to the arms producers that are wallowing in money now that Bush is office...... oh yea, they don't need to hear it, life is indeed good for them.....

Your myopic view of the world goes well beyond the Timber Industry I am learning.

[Sturgeon Tom]

Straydog; Send your last post to the victims of 9-11 and see the response you get. What let osama go? I don't think so. I know victims of 9-11 and they want his head.
I hope we kick the living *&^% out of The Iraq regime.
God bless the USA and all those who fight for us and Freedom for all.

[Straydog]

Sturgeon,

You missed my point..... I guess I didn't present it well.

I no way want to let Osama go..... I want us to finish that job and really concentrate on terrorisim rather than engage in a war over oil with Irag. We have no business moving to Iraq when we haven't taken care of the business in finding and punishing those that instigated the 9-11 attacks. While we are looking at Iraq, Osama is busy plotting his next act of terror.....

I know, we like our cheap oil but it isn't cheap to those whose kids get killed for it.

[speyfly]

DB, did you know that the BUSH family has been doing and still is doing business with the Ben Laudin (sp?) family for over 20 years. Did you know that the Talliban had meetings with Enron in Houston and in Afganistan (prior to the war) about a oil and gas pipe line through Afganistan. It's not about US being safe. It's about oil. Did you know that Bush 2 used the Enron private jet for his election campaign, flew to Houston to attend the opening game at Enron Field to watch Kenny Boy through out the fist pitch and then turned around and lied about knowing Ken Lay. Thats our President, a lier and our Commander in THIEF. I think that you need to do your home work.

Back on the subject. John Kerry will make a fine President. Sorry Bush but the truth will come out.

[Dancin' Bear]

Oh, and I think that the DNC should elect Sean Penn or Susan Sarandon to run against Bush. :smile:

[The Fishing Geek]

Originally posted by DanS:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="verdana,arial,helv">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv"> thnk the democrat run press

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">The Democrats run the press? Really?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">My mother in-law runs a printing press and is very much a Democrat, so...yes.

[DanS]

Well, geez, Dave......then tell her to only run the presses when there is bad news about the GOP.

She DOES own ALL the presses out there, doesn't she?

[The Fishing Geek]

Dancin' Bear:

Adding to the Bush and Bin Laden family ties for a moment, before Bush bought his small fraction of the Texas Rangers, what business was Señor Arbusto in? I gave you a hint there. Oil. Guess who he had business ties to? Hmmmm....

How about Dick Cheney? Who was he CEO for prior to being VeePee? Haliburton. Who owns the contract for taking care of feeding and supplying the millitary when our forces are overseas? A subsidiary of Haliburton. Who did Dick Cheney have in the private summit that he held to decide the nation's energy policy? Sorry, I don't know either. He refused to supply that information to the GAO after they requested it, which is against the law. Why didn't he want anyone to know who was there? By law it's not supposed to be a secret.

Iraq is so much about oil that it is scary. The rest of the world sees that, otherwise they wouldn't have been so wary about going into Iraq in the first place. Is the rest of the world just jealous of our power? Is that it? I don't think so. Would Saddam use a nuclear device on the US if he got it? Not likely. He knows that would be suicide, and he's no suicide bomber.

People keep bringing up what Saddam did to the Kurds as reason to take him out. Why is it such a big deal now and it wasn't a big deal when Don Rumsfeld went to Iraq in the late 80's, right after Saddam gassed the Kurds (and America knew about it) to try and get our embassy reopened so that we could re-establish trade?

Bush Inc. is just looking for reasons to go into Iraq, and he's reaching. Unfortunately for him Iraq is giving him everything that he wants as far as inspections and other demands. Of course, Bush will likely use the fact that there are nuclear plants in Iraq as reason enough to attack.

Well, gee. I wonder who put those nuclear plants there...?

[The Fishing Geek]

Originally posted by DanS:
Well, geez, Dave......then tell her to only run the presses when there is bad news about the GOP.

She DOES own ALL the presses out there, doesn't she?

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">It's been 16 months since I've talked to her for a reason. I'd rather not break that very relaxing string, thanks.

[J.Slay]

C&E,

Sorry we did stray from your original question. Seems like there never are too many great Demo candidates. I was thinking Gephard and Daschale, but you don't really win the nomination by promising to pull in Iowa and S Dakota do you? (or whatever mid west states they are from) Bradley, Kerry are good thoughts I guess. At least they are not the liberals we used to see.

I just want to say that I am an Oregonian above anything else, and when I see people in this fishing forum lauding our conservative president for all of this great conservatism he brings back to the White House, I have to wonder if Oregon's interests are anywhere in their hearts. I just cannot comprehend it. George Bush is ULTRA-conservative. I feel he is way out of touch with the west, in terms of energy, water, and the environment. Do you think he would give a damn about say, The Deshutes basin and that pristine fishery if he knew it was rich in Uranium (or whatever)? Hell no! The guy has little education or concern for the matters facing the west, so he allows his staff and fellow conservitives to formulate legislation affecting us(the same way Reagan ran things..which is fine). But to bring in an EPA director from hell who has rescinded Clinton environmental regulations, given loopholes to polluters, gone against the western governor's proposals for western needs, and pushed to drill for oil in the arctic refuge....you should question what ISSUES you feel strongly about and not simply your overall VALUES, and then see how GW stacks up. If you think Bush is benefitting Oregon and our fisheries in any way then please speak up.

[Dancin' Bear]

I will address each of your points in capitals to distinguish mine from yours....

Originally posted by speyfly:
DB, did you know that the BUSH family has been doing and still is doing business with the Ben Laudin (sp?) family for over 20 years. I HAVE NEVER HEARD THIS AND NO NEWS AGENCY HAS REPORTED THIS. SOUNDS LIKE AN INTERNET URBAN LEGEND TO ME. YOU NEED TO GIVE ME PROOF OF THIS ONE. Did you know that the Talliban had meetings with Enron in Houston and in Afganistan (prior to the war) about a oil and gas pipe line through Afganistan. SO?? WHAT DOES THIS HAVE TO DO WITH BUSH?? SOUNDS LIKE A BUSINESS DOING BUSINESS OVERSEAS. HAPPENS EVERYDAY. ENRON WAS A POORLY RUN COMPANY MAKING POOR DECISIONS. NOTHING TO DO WITH OUR PRESIDENT. It's not about US being safe. It's about oil. Did you know that Bush 2 used the Enron private jet for his election campaign, flew to Houston to attend the opening game at Enron Field to watch Kenny Boy through out the fist pitch and then turned around and lied about knowing Ken Lay. WELL THIS SOUNDS LIKE A DEBATE ON CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM. NOT ABOUT OIL, NATIONAL SECURITY, AND TERRORISM. TAKE A LOOK AT OUR LAST ADMINISTRATION. THEY WERE THE KINGS (GORE/CLINTON) OF CAMPAIGN FINANCE ABUSE. Thats our President, a lier and our Commander in THIEF. I think that you need to do your home work. I THINK WE SHOULD STICK TO FACTS. I THINK YOU NEED TO BROADEN YOUR NEWS GATHERING TO SOMETHING OTHER THAN DAN RATHER, BROKAW AND JENNINGS, AND THE OTHER LIBERAL BIASED MEDIA SOURCES. TRY READING http://www.worldnetdaily.com/. IT IS NON PARTISAN AND NO SPIN.

Back on the subject. John Kerry will make a fine President. Sorry Bush but the truth will come out.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">I am curious... if it was Gore (as I shudder at the thought) that became our President, and HE made the decision to invade Afghanistan and to try and get rid of a maniac in Iraq (though I know he would not have made that decision before conducting 48 opinion polls - he doesn't have the heart to make a decision on what HE THINKS is the right thing to do), would you all be as suspicious and cynical??

What about Gore and Armond Hammer?
What about Alien Rectal Probes?

[Dancin' Bear]

Originally posted by The Fishing Geek:
Dancin' Bear:

Iraq is so much about oil that it is scary. The rest of the world sees that, otherwise they wouldn't have been so wary about going into Iraq in the first place. Is the rest of the world just jealous of our power? Is that it? I don't think so. Would Saddam use a nuclear device on the US if he got it? Not likely. He knows that would be suicide, and he's no suicide bomber.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">Fishing Geek - It is not about Saddam using a nuclear device on US soil. It is about the fact that if he is allowed to develop a nuclear device then all of a sudden the situation drastically changes over there. If he decided to invade Saudi Arabia to get there oil then how would he be stopped? He would eventually be stopped, but at the cost of a nuclear exchange I would think. And I think we all know how he feels about Isreal - what would stop him from trying to eliminate them from the face of the earth? Again, he would be stopped, but at a huge price. A huge price. I know we can't look into the future, but past actions are a good predictor of future actions. If Saddam is allowed to continue, then there is no telling what he would try and do if he had the power of a nuke in his arsenal.
And yes, I do think the rest of the world is jealous of the US. We are unfortunately the police of the world. If the US (Bush) did not have the conviction to stand for what is right, then who would? France?? Germany?? I think not.

[speyfly]

Talk about spin. If you don't know about the Bin Ladin/ Bush connection you are very uninformed. The site that you linked to sounds just like FOX but I will read it all and see for myself but will take some time. Now if you don't think that Bush and Enron are connected at the hip well your just blind to the facts. Now about Bush lying to the public about the Bush/Lay relationship, I think that it should be impeachable at the very least. Hi moral standards are lacking in the current White House adminstation. Please don't bring up the Clinton BJ because I would take that over what our current White house folks are doing.

[ 12-17-2002, 02:11 PM: Message edited by: speyfly ]

[The Fishing Geek]

Originally posted by Keta:
What about Gore and Armond Hammer?
What about Alien Rectal Probes?

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">What you do in the privacy of your own home is your business, Keta.

[The Fishing Geek]

Dancin' Bear:

One of the things learned by the Cold War is that nuclear armament is a huge deterrant to the use of nuclear arms. Therefore, one of the first things that would keep Iraq from using nuclear weaponry on America or Israel is the knowledge that they would certainly retaliate swiftly and entirely.

One of the things that would keep Iraq from nuking Saudi Arabia is Mecca. Another is that Saudi Arabia is pretty chummy with Iraq, at least on the ground level. Saudi Arabia is probably within a couple generations from complete upheaval due to the contrasting views of the ruling family and the populace on the whole. I could see Iraq funding an overthrow, but it wouldn't include nuclear weaponry.

For Iraq, having nuclear weaponry gives them a (false) sense of safety from the larger nuclear powers.

[lost_sailor]

Crikey! You Bush-ites really have taken the bait HOOK LINE AND SINKER!!

Good little fascists you are!

Sieg, heil!!

[Dancin' Bear]

Fishing Geek - Your point is well taken and is good in theory. The problem is that Iraq and the former Soviet Union are entirely different. With the Soviet Union and the cold war we were dealing with a fairly stable government and leaders. I use the term fairly stable because when you compare Iraq and the former Soviet Union, Iraq does make them look pretty darn stable. Saddam relishes in seeing how far he can go in situations... when nuclear is involved and Israel (and there existance as a nation and a people) is involved, then all rational thought and old cold war thinking are thrown out the window.

Also, if I remember correctly during the Gulf War, Iraq launched scuds on Saudia Arabia. I don't think they have a relationship at all and if they do have one it is based on mutual hate. We all know that if the US did not lead the Gulf War, then Saddam's next invasion would have been Saudia Arabia.

p.s. nobody has answered my question that if it was Gore in the White House, would there still be the suspicion and cynacism if it was him that toppled the Taliban and to possibly invade Iraq?

[speyfly]

Amen and well said Lost_Sailor.

[Dancin' Bear]

Originally posted by lost_sailor:
Crikey! You Bush-ites really have taken the bait HOOK LINE AND SINKER!!

Good little fascists you are!

Sieg, heil!!

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">You know that I actually enjoy hearing about these other opinions and also am enjoying this debate. It does bother me though when I read the above quote and then the agreement and acknowledgment from Speyfly.
I have not attacked anyone for there opinions during this debate and I won't. People should not take what is said here personally. It is healthy and fun to hear other people's beliefs and opinions. That's what makes this country the best place in the world to live no matter if we have a republican or a democrat in the White House.
Hell, during the Clinton/Gore era I still loved this place. Though a few times there I felt like running off up to the Yukon and becoming a hermit... :smile:

[speyfly]

Dancing Bear, I do know this. If Gore were to be in the White House he would not be allowed to be so secretive by the Republican’s in both the House and Senate nor would we even consider a preemptive invasion of another sovereign nation without a real threat to the World the world community behind us. Right now we have a coalition of 2 (US and GB) and it would not take much for GB to back out on us (not very popular the Britt’s). We would have public debate in both Houses and individuals that choose to speak out would not be called non- PATRIOTS when they choose dissent over just going along. BTW I think a true patriot is one that always questions the motives of any government. Dissent is the obligation of a free society.

[Dancin' Bear]

Speyfly, I agree with your last comment about a true patriot being one who speaks out. Well said...

[lost_sailor]

[Dancin' Bear]

Lost_Sailor - I have to give you props on that one... :grin: [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img]

though of course I don't agree with your implication, but funny none the less :smile: