Life raft

[Bluefinn]

I was thinking about buying a Cal June life raft.These are the rigid orange life raft you see on some charter boats.I checked a few places for price and the cheapest I can find them for is about $700.00 any info or comments? THX RR [img]graemlins/1zhelp.gif[/img]

[Redbull]

I would also check on www.latitude38.com which is the best sailing mag on the west coast. There is a classifieds section. People often do one ocean race over to Hawaii and then sell all the required safety gear after the race.

Just a thought.

joby

[Bluefinn]

Thanks I checked out the site I did not find anything.I will keep checking.I really thought some of you old salts would have some input on this.ie.if it is a good idea to carry one of these.It just sounded like a good idea to me,Maybe iam Blackballed for some reason.Or just not one of the "boys" yet? :whazzup:

[Pilar]

Dunno about that RR. I think that it's just not too busy here lately.

What boat would you put this raft aboard? Why would you choose a bulky rigid raft and not the space efficient suitcase type? Just curious. I would have to get a bigger boat to put any kind of raft on it.

[OceanBlue]

We learned in Capt. Kujo's class last weekend that unless you have other survival gear (ie; Rockit Wear) a raft alone isn't going to do you much good. You would have to first survive hitting the cold water, then manage enough strength to get into the raft, then survive hypothermia.

Considering the $$ and space, I'd go with a suit rather than a raft.

[corrirod]

RR, it's just quiet on the board during the winter.

Liferafts are excellent to have aboard. I'm with Pilar on the smaller suitcase rafts though. They are spendy but if you keep a close eye on the different classifieds and ebay, you'll eventually find one at a good price.

Don't ever let anyone tell you that less safety equipment is better! I don't care what it is, a pfd, drysuit, raft, immersion suit, you can never have enough when the time comes. That being said, put whatever you can afford and have the space for on your vessel.

[Bluefinn]

26' marlin the raft itself is preety small it is 51"x37" made out of the same met.as the throw rings.has heavy duty netting on the bottom and looped ropes on the side.pretty small but at least you would have something to hang onto or maybe a place to keep a waterproof box with maybe some emergency supplies.I thought I would put it on the bow on long offshore trips or maybe on top of the hard top?

[Bluefinn]

I am going to buy a suit for sure the class really got me thinking about sitting out there waiting for help.Let me see rocket suit,small raft,a few emergency supplies,a Pocket fisherman I would be pretty happy.

[corrirod]

If you get that raft then you'll have to have a suit of some sort. I have immersion suits but quite frankly they are "THE" last resort. My biggest problem with them is the fact that once I get it on, I can't do anything but float! The mitten gloves do not allow for enough flexibility to do precise things, such as open a ditch bag and turn on a handheld vhf or gps. Not much good to have a ditch bag if you can't get in it!

If you have $700 to spend, I'd spend it on an actual life raft and not the bouyant device. The raft will keep you out of the water which is where you die. Not too many times are you going to be far enough off shore, in a liferaft, and someone not spot you before you parish. Clinging to a bouyancy device in 5+ foot swells in the middle of an ocean is a lot less visible. Also, the bouyancy device needs to be unstrapped from the deck vs. the raft will auto-inflate upon submersion or can be manually inflated with the pull of a cord.

Just my $.02.

[fish assassin]

Another 2 cents worth ... There are two types of true survival suits. One is
the "gumby" style suit that covers you head to toe and makes it difficult to
move around, let alone operate any small devices. The other type is the "work
suit" style that has gloves that pull on and is more comfortable to move around
in.

Both styles qualify as USCG approved. The work suits are often called
"Mustangs". These are NOT dry suits. They are heavily insulated floatation
devices. You can check 'em out on the web by searching for "survival suits".
You can oft times get 'em used for as little as $100.

-assAssin-

[Ken, USCG FV Safety]

Looking back at commercial FV fatalities over the past decade off OR and WA where an individual entered the water because of a vessel loss, about 9 times out of 10 they are not wearing a survival suit at the time (read this as the CG-approved orange neoprene gumby). Once in the water, it is too late to try to get into a suit (besides, the Canadians have shown that as little as 1 liter of seawater in the suit can degrade the thermal protection by up to 50%). Unless these folks have an inflatable liferaft that has deployed, they die. The rigid "raft" you mentioned is actually either a lifefloat or a buoyant apparatus, which can help keep you afloat but will not let you get out of the sea. Without a survival suit or other protective gear in our waters, these devices are pretty good for providing closure to your family, because if you tie into one, someone will find your remains.

That said, you have (in my mind, at least) two choices: carry an inflatable raft to get you out of the water, or continuously wear a survival suit or other protective garment (I love my drysuit and exotherm).

There are several reputable manufacturers that make rafts intended for recreational boaters, that may or may not be CG-approved but are essentially identical to their other models that do carry the approval. An educated consumer can be his own best lifesaver. Also, consider the cost of servicing, as well as the cost of the initial purchase. Most rafts can be bought nearly at cost, because the suppliers make money on the repacking. Look at the lifecycle cost over a ten or fifteen year period, rather than just what it costs today.

Anyway, my $0.02.

[tailchaser]

Another note I got from the class however is if you're trying to buy yourself a couple of hours a raft will do that. It's going to be uncomfortable, but will buy time whether you have to jump in the water first or not, it's better than being "IN" the water for an extended time. You have to consider the situation you're in and the closest help that can get to you. My dad and I sat down after I got back from the meeting and did this. Our worst case scenario was about 2 hours coming from the Coasties. We never go without a wingman that far out, so most of the time we'd be 30 min. out from help. Looking at that a quality inflatable raft that self inflates up to a 5 man would work pretty well for us. We have all of the other equipment (waterproof handheld vhf, gps, and flares) in a waterproof bag ready for a quick exit. I'd like to get an EBIRP also, but that's on the to do list right now.

Basically you have to accurately access your risks and timeframes out there to get the gear that will suite your needs. If we went alone I'm sure the suites would be more in the ballpark for us.

tc

[andiamo]

If you are going to be out of sight of other boats, I would go with a running mate. Actually, I think the biggest value of this website is to hook up with partners for running offshore. The best "life boat" one can ask for is one that "immediately comes to get you", can get you dry and out of the wind, has a VHF radio, and has a lot of horse power. (My 3-cents) Oh yeah, always where you life preserver because a running mate 10' away may not be able to get you fast enough if you hit the water without one.

[Reel Creel]

Im going to put my money on a self-inflating raft, today there was something in the paper about the number of deaths here in oregon waters. I didnt read the whole thing but they (Bill Monroe) said that it was up from last year from 14 to 16. Was the wreck just out of T-Bay last year inclued? and how many people lost there lives on that thing? And were those #'s in that count? With all the people fishing your chances i think are slim to even to get in that spot. no matter what the number of deaths is its not good.
To spend all day in that suit would drive me crazy. First of all i try not to go out when its so choppy that im pushing the limits of my boat,and to spend $500 on a suit then lather it up in tuna smag. I still have some spots in my driveway from tuna smag when i brought them home to clean them, so you know your not going to keep the thing clean long if you care. Thats not the big factor for me.
What the CG said was that at 50 miles off shore and with a Gbirp it would be four hours until you would see a CG boat. I could see hitting a log or somthing that damages the boat, or it catching on fire then deploy your raft and jump in. on the way out grab your gbirp and ditch bag.
Thats my plan if you care.

[ 01-29-2004, 05:05 PM: Message edited by: Reel Creel ]

[CAPT KUJO]

U.S.I.A. is a distributor of Winslow Liferafts I carry two of them on The Black Rocket

CAPT KUJO

[Reel Creel]

Capt Kujo,
Thanks you gotta wonder whats best in the life raft. So ill keep doing homework.

[ 01-29-2004, 09:02 PM: Message edited by: Reel Creel ]

[Bluefinn]

Thanks for all the input I feel a small rigid raft would a least give you something to may be crawl up on with your rocket suit of course and get out of the water.You would not have to rely on something inflating.You could throw your ditch bag in there and have a platform to collect your thoughts and plan your next move get a flare ready or try to reach someone on a hand held vhf etc,It would also be a place to bring other victims to aid etc.

[corrirod]

RR,

I don't think those devices are made to get up on are they? I thought the webbing was just a place to put your ditch bag or other equipment?

[Mark Mc]

Rod's right. The ring with the mesh in it is not designed to get inside. When people try this, and there's any weather at all, they almost always tip over, and folks end up in even more trouble.

[Mr. Fisherman]

KJ, how much for a 4 man unit?

[BUGLEMAN]

About how much does an EBIRP cost?

I would think a guy would always want to wear a water proff, hand held VHF on his hip at all times.

In the heat of the tuna battle does your wingman always stay within visual range? If not, you are relying on your radio and GPS and from what I have observed, when on the hunt, the pack can be spread out over 10 miles. That is the weak link of the wingman principle.

[Marty]

They just sold a nice Zodiac 4 person USGC approved life raft on E-bay for $510.00. That is about as cheap as you are going to every see on E-bay. Epirbs (the newest ones), the 406's sell for $750.00 to $1,200.00. The biggest difference is the ones that are automatically deployed or are manually deployed. The Pain Wessex units sell for a little less than the ACR's. If you spend the money on a new Epirb, get one with the GPS unit built in. A quote from Consumers Marine Electronics in comparing the GPS unit and the non-GPS Epirbs.

In a non-GPS Epirb..."The average time to SAR (satellite system that picks up epirb signals) notification is 1 hour and the search area can be located within 12.5nm2."

In a GPS Epirb....."The average time to SAR notification is 5 minutes and the search area can be located within .05 nm2."

This is a no brainer to me when you compare the notification time and search area difference. Also take into consideration that the lithium battery's in these units are good for 5 years, but cost about $250.00 to replace. If you average the costs out over a ten year period, it is the cheapest insurance policy that you will ever buy.


Marty

[corrirod]

Marty is right on. Don't bother with the EPIRB, get the GPIRB. For another $200 you make it easy for the Coasties to find you.

[BUGLEMAN]

A GPIRB seems more important than a life raft to me.....

[Reel Creel]

The GPIRB is about $900 and a new six man inflatable life raft with a kit,top and a rain water catch is about $1500. When they are rated for four they really mean two adults and a kid so it seems. Id get the next size up...six man i was told that its going to weigh about sixty five pounds, in a soft bag.

Capt Kujo, or anybody that might know, Do you know what the % of failure there is in these things (self inflating rafts)?

[Bluefinn]

I assumed the rigid raft i was talking about was designrd so that you could crawl into it maybe not though the one i was talking about says it is a 8 man but that must meen 8 people could hang onto it.I will check out the web site and let everyone know.Thanks again for all the input you guys are a wealth of info.

[Bluefinn]

Iam not having any luck finding a site for caljune life bouy mdl.1308

[Mark Mc]

Switlik is quite reputable. Check out:

http://www.switlik.com/

then click on 'life rafts' at left.

The "rescue pod" is the most "economical" model...about $1700. at this random vendor that Google spat out:

http://www.sailnet.com/store/item.cfm?pid=19577

[Bluefinn]

web page I think this is it.