Oregon Tuna Regulations

[Nofish]

Have any of you folks thought about encouraging a change in the Oregon regs so that carking at sea is legal for albacore? I know thanks to Chum King, some progress was made with the tuna regs. For those of us that lack space for fish storage, being able cark at sea would be a real plus. I know it is legal in California, not sure about Washington. Any thoughts on this? Happy New Year...Bob

[Mark Mc]

Hi Bob,

Oh yea, I've thought about this. Actually, the existing regs may allow for it now, if we could get an interpretation in writing from someone in authority at ODFW. The reason I say the regs may "allow" it: the regs say you can not bring a fish to port that is "mutilated" to a point such that the species can not be identified, and also the length determined, if a length limit applies.

So let's say you get 10 tuna. You come back to port with exactly 40 loins, and you have 10 tuna heads in a trash can. A warden or ODFW officer could look at that and, if he/she knew what tuna meat looked like, and tuna skin (assuming you left small patches), and say "no problem. It's obvious these are tuna." (especially with the 10 tuna heads on board). But another official could come to a different conclusion. Maybe he/she is not familiar with tuna meat & skin. Or simply has a real strict interpretation of "condition such that it may be identified" (i.e., may believe that the fish must be whole, even though the regs do not specifically state this).

I for one would be very interested & willing, as a starter, to ask for an interpretation in writing that says loining of tuna at sea is acceptable, as long as certain conditions were met. The question to everyone is, what conditions would we agree to? I think we would have to compromise to make it palatable to ODFW. Some ideas:

1.A. Heads of tuna must be retained (first choice)
1.B. Entire carcass (head, backbone, tail) must be retained (less favorable than just head).

2.A. A patch of skin (one square inch minimum) must be left on each loin (first choice)
2.B. All skin must be left on loin (less favorable)

3. Loins must be intact (i.e. 4 loins per fish; no cutting them up into little pieces).

We could also say that we are willing to eat a raw piece from each loin, if still in doubt. That could be a lot of sashimi though.

What do y'all think? - Mark Mc

p.s. Happy New Year to all!

[WP]

It would seem to me that loining out the albacore and retaining the heads would be adequate. The limit is high enough and the integrity of the loins eazy enough to see, that it would not worth trying to circumvent the limits. It would also save disposal, on shore and insure higher quality meat. I definately would like to see this either written into the law or a clearly written inturpertation given that allows this practice. The less "proof" the better. This all reminds me of dealing with the INS..guilty until proven innocent.

Dave

I'd rather cut the heads and tails off and ice them down.

[Mark Mc]

Good evening Dave.

Hi Keta.... "blocking" them as you describe is not a bad idea at all. That would reduce the chilled storage size quite a bit...maybe 50%? If you could make a cut so that the long fin stays on the body, that would seem pretty proof-positive that it's an albie. Although the "normal" way to cut behind the head takes the pectoral with it...we'll have to experiment with that. Maybe one option is to land them blocked and now you don't need to save the head??

Also, blocking & gutting would allow for faster core chilling than whole....which means a little bit easier to loin later on than a normal whole fish. A fringe benefit.

I like this as an option to add to the list. Keep that thinking cap on!!

[crabbait]

I agree with Keta. Seems like the heads take up a lot of space and are inedible. Would rather carc the head and entrails and leave the rest of the carcass whole and iced.

[Mark Mc]

Hey Crabbait, with your moniker, you of all people should know that the heads are very edible, to a certain non-human critter. Couldn't resist! Later........ MM

[WP]

Blocking the tuna would expose more flesh to water absorbtion wouldn't it? I strive to minimise the eat able portions contact with water as it is not good for the meat quality (at least until I am ready to process it!) Maybe this is less of a worry than I think it is! Interested in others thoughts. The tails are also handy fish handling devices...one of the best grips around. Dave :smile:

[ 01-02-2004, 12:58 AM: Message edited by: WP ]

[skein]

I actually worry more about slashing while I'm splashing - carking with a suitably sharp knife on a rocking, rolling boat while at any moment more lines could go off is kind of a spooky thing. However, I carked some from the Swordfish trip with a Kershaw game shear that does a great - and safe - job.

I specifically named the Kershaw tool because of the shape. Its curved shape makes it much more efficient than the other shears I've used IMHO.

Dave, I hear you about the water contacting the flesh. What would be wrong with bagging them up in heavy-duty freezer storage bags - say two loins to a bag, and icing them that way?

Skein

[ 01-02-2004, 03:17 AM: Message edited by: skein ]

[Nofish]

Thanks everyone for the great input on this. Mark - I think it would be a great start to get an interpretation on the current regulations. Do you have a contact with ODFW or OSP?

I would like the flexibility to mutilate an albacore in just about any fashion. Head and tail removal if the ocean is kinda lumpy, loining out if the seas are flat. Since albacore have no size limit, all we really need to be able to have to have is the ability for an enforcement person to ID the fish (patch of skin) and get a count on the number landed.

As a Californian living near the border, I probably spend more days recreating in Oregon (can you blame me?). I for one am very impressed by the way ODFW responds (quickly) to regulation issues. Cheers...Bob

WP,
What I did last year when I was burnt out carking was to cut the heads off by cutting at the top of the gill forward and to the center trying to expose as little meat as possible. I left the tail on for handling the fish. Then I put then in the cooler completely surrounded and stuffed with ice Water absorbtion wasn't a problem. as I drained the cooler to keep the ice melt off of the fish.

Removing the heads made the tuna fit my coolers better.

[Mark Mc]

Hey WP, you're right on about the exposed-flesh thing. I was wondering the same thing regarding cutting the head off. There would be a relatively large area of exposed flesh there, compared to the tail. Gutting is not a problem though, since there is a "membrane" that covers the inside of the belly. We already do this & pack the belly with ice. The trick on gutting is to use a very short knife to minimize the chances of cutting the flesh along the spine (or hold a longer knife at a very shallow angle).

Skein, I would agree that cutting fish on the water can be risky. However, it is something that experienced folks do all the time without a problem. It's critical to have the right setups (i.e. trough, table). You don't want fish sliding all over an engine hatch.

I'll find out if Chum King is in the office today. He would be a great starting point.

[Mark Mc]

Keta, so on that cut, it sounds like you left the gill collar on, right? And that would leave the pectoral fins on right? So the exposed meat area is only around the spine? Sounds interesting....

The exposed meat is on top of the head. If it does get waterlogged or contaminated it isn't much meat wasted.

[Mark Mc]

Update... I posed the question to someone at ODFW, and am waiting for a call back from "the right person." Stay tuned....

[HOGGEMIN]

Thanks Mark for this topic and work to get this going let us know what we can do to help if at all possible, the squeeky wheel might get some greese.

[8knots]

Thanks for bringing this up. With the slow speed of my boat, the four to five hours in would allow us to have all the fish cleaned by the time we got back to port. A productive use of our time. Otherwise, it adds hours to an already very long day unless you are a Samurai cleaner like Keta.

[WP]

My charking time is about equal to my running time and about equal to my fishing time (a third each) If I could combine charking into trolling and running time, I could fish WAY more :smile:
Dave

[skein]

WP said:
My charking time is about equal to my running time and about equal to my fishing time (a third each) If I could combine charking into trolling and running time, I could fish WAY more

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helv">...And use a lot less ice for the fish you catch. Less ice = less weight and expense.

Skein

[Miss B Haven]

Albis' don't cark well until and unless they are well iced/chilled. Fully loining them at sea would result in a lot of torn up meat.
Being able to take the heads off would be much preferable IMHO. With no heads you can get at least 50% more fish in a cooler. The large coolers just aren't long enough to stack them properly with the heads on.

[Bill Monroe]

The fish and wildlife commission will do a four-year review of regulations this year and adopt new and revised rules in September. This would be the time to get some changes made if you're going to...

[Chum King]

As Bill stated, this is the year for changes to the sport fishing rules. If you are seriously interested in making a proposal for "carking" albacore prior to landing, then you will need to submit a regulation proposal to ODFW. More information on the process and a downloadable regulation application form are available at 2005 Regulation Development

This issue was discussed when the other changes to the tuna and offshore pelagic species regulations were being developed, and both ODFW staff and OSP were in agreement that we did not want to have fish being dressed at sea beyond gilling and gutting. I would expect that we would continue to support that same standard, and would most likely oppose any change.

Mark Mc: If you tried to reach me on Friday, my apologies for not getting back to you. I was out with the flu, but will be back at the office on Monday.

[Mark Mc]

Hi Eric,

Please check your e-mail (that is, the e-mail you have linked to i-fish).

Thanks,

MArk

[WP]

Miss B has a point...about them carking better cold! I think maybe a rule allowing beheading and gutting would be adequate. Who is a good legal writter...Mark?, Chum King? If this were to be added, it would certainly make life easier! I would be more than willing to attend any meetings where this would be discussed if someone has the skills to writwe it into a proposal. Let me know what and where I can support this effort!
Dave

[edsr]

Miss B - is right. I saved a whole fish last season to show civilains what a fish really looks like, they thought they came all nicely quartered ready to eat. After a night on ice it really did clean much easier than fresh ones.
edsr