Looking for a new Duck Boat

H2Ofuzz · 01-18-2009, 04:07 PM

If every one could keep and eye out for me for a 16' or 17' Jon boat with the semi V at the bow like a Lowe, Smoker Craft, G3, War Eagle, Grizzly ect i also want a Jet pump with a minimum of 50 HP Thank you all so much. I appreciate it.

H2O

duckboy · 01-18-2009, 05:12 PM

You run a 16 foot jet OB with more than your dog and gear and 1 buddy, you will want at least a 50 hp Jet.

I ran for a while with a 60/40 Merc 2 stroke oil injected OB pump, and it was great on my 16 foot alumaweld, until you add 75 lbs of deeks, 200 lbs (or more) of buddies) and assoc gear.

If I ran 3 guys total and gear, I'd have to get the guys on the nose of the boat and hammer it to get up on plane.

My .02

QH's Paw · 01-18-2009, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H2Ofuzz

If every one could keep and eye out for me for a 16' or 17' Jon boat with the semi V at the bow like a Lowe, Smoker Craft, G3, War Eagle, Grizzly ect i also want a Jet pump with a minimum of 30 HP Thank you all so much. I appreciate it.

H2O

I'm not sure why your wanting a pump since you haven't stated it but, you have to have enough power to get on top and push your own water when the water gets "skinny". The main reason most guys want a pump/sled combo is to get through the "skinny" water spots. If you under power, your boat will be digging and never get out of the hole for the shot. There aren't too many (if any) boats that will be able to get on top with 30hp.
Honestly, if your limitation is financial take your time shopping and continue to save until you find and can afford where the right boat meets the budget. I think you'll be happier longer that way.
Another thing to think about is, the Jon boat (except large models) really isn't intended for big water.
I'll keep my eye out for you and pass anything I hear about along anyway though.
Good luck in your hunt for "the" hunting boat.

H2Ofuzz · 01-18-2009, 06:50 PM

Mike thanks for the info. I will be looking for a 50hp jet then. I want to be able to get up on step no matter what my load is. The water down in the bays and rivers is just to shallow for a prop driven motor. I have a 12 Kalamath now with a 10hp short shaft and it drafts to much for my hunting spots. As far as big water goes i don't hunt it much but if i do i am sure a 16' boat with the 24" sides will be just fine as i don't go out when its to sporty. Thanks for the information again.

H2O

H2Ofuzz · 01-18-2009, 06:53 PM

Oh Mike the other thing i was looking into was the Mud Motor boats but i can pick up a Jon with a Jet for about $3000 less and be able to do more with it. So that was my final decision to go with the Jet.

QH's Paw · 01-18-2009, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H2Ofuzz

Oh Mike the other thing i was looking into was the Mud Motor boats but i can pick up a Jon with a Jet for about $3000 less and be able to do more with it. So that was my final decision to go with the Jet.

Drew your right, those mud motors aren't that great for fishing with unless your fishin' backwaters in Louisiana swamps.

duckboy · 01-18-2009, 07:15 PM

Duckboy with a HUGE Chaw in his cheek,
spit dribbled down his arm and fron and gunnell of the boat:
"You knockin my mud buddy?

You ain't no ducker at all,
slackjawed yankee bastidge.

you are what we like to call a flat out"

...oops ran out of room

Go with What QH's Paw said, it'll do you right.

Capin' Dan · 01-18-2009, 07:27 PM

Drew, I think you will hate the pump unless your primary target is river steelhead. For ducks in the waters that we hunt where we have grass and other folage they don't cut it. You are clogging them with debree way to much. I say go with your prop and just either replace the props or get a very good prop guard for it. You will love your decision.

jnicholson · 01-18-2009, 07:31 PM

I agree. In time you'll switch back to a prop. You've got to dig enough craph out of the jet before you become a believer though. Have fun. Been there done that. Jets are for fishing not duck hunting.

John

ps .... oh and you'll really love manuevering in the wind picking up decoys with a jet!

RGB · 01-18-2009, 09:08 PM

I ran a welded 1648 G3 for years. I had a 40 hp Yamaha with a jet which gives you 28 hp at the pump. My boat was great with two guy's. With three guy's it was slower to get on plane, but it got there. Grass can be a real pain with a jet. We went out today and I got soaked digging the grass out of the intake. I'm thinking real hard about getting a small mud boat with a short tail mud motor for day's on small water. You just can't have to many boats and no one makes one that can do it all.

QH's Paw · 01-19-2009, 04:02 AM

Actually guys, the advice for pump was given from the perspective that he was comparing pumps and mud motors.
Also, if his primary use is fishing the other 9 months of the year, he will obviously be adding a trolling motor to the transom. I'm guessing in the 10hp range, which will be just fine for cutting the 10-50 feets worth of grass he'll want to pass through to get against the bank or inside the weeds.

If he's not fishing and wants to run with an extra prop, then that's another consideration.

gotZem · 01-19-2009, 05:35 AM

So, I hate to do it , but I'm selling my fishing/ duck boat. It's posted on Craigs List right now because a friend of mine isn't an ifisher and couldn't post it. It's a flat boat and is 14'8" with a 50 horse Merc- prop. It's on CL under 14' *' Aluminum Boat for sale. go take a look and contact me if you are interested. It hauls a LOT of decoys and shells, guns, dog because it's wide. Makes a very stable hunting boat.
gotZem!!!

H2Ofuzz · 01-19-2009, 09:14 AM

Gotzem I took a look at it and it's just not what I am looking for I want a tiller not the center consul. I want a jet the places that I run on the coast are about a foot deep. I could not even get to my usual spots with a prop lower unit. As far as weeds go. I NEVER get into the weeds here its all sand and mud bottom. If I ever get up to the Columbia to hunt it may be a problem but for the couple times a year that I do go up there I think I can live with it. Thanks to all.

billc_sbio · 01-19-2009, 12:52 PM

Two other thoughts on this (just thinkin out loud here) are:

A friend of mine, who's moved down here from Alaska, has his AK Duck Boat and it runs in the same rivers that typically sleds do. His boat has a Tunnel Hull and he runs his O.B. on a raised transom so the prop is mainly ABOVE the bottom of the hull. It also has a Prop Guard on it and the water intake's been modified to pick up from the bottom of the Lower Unit.

By doing this he gets plenty of thrust for a relatively small (I think his is 50 h.p. 2-stroke) motor.

The trouble with Pumps is that you lose so much thrust (equivalent H.P.) that, especially with 4-stroke motors, you keep having to go bigger (which gets HEAVIER, fast!).

Another idea is what used to be popular down in the Klamath Basin. I don't know if these are made anymore or not, but there used to be a unit called a "Jack-ass Motor Lifter" that was made/sold by Pelican Marine (if I remember correctly?) that was a bolt-on transom unit that allowed you to run your prop O.B. then used a mechanical linkage that easily raised your motor up for running in shallow water/mud.

This was before the Mud Motors became popular and it worked pretty well. I had some friends that had this setup and it allowed the best of both worlds, using your prop and running in shallow water. (This was done with a long lever and you could raise/lower your motor on the fly

)

Maybe some of the iFishers from down K-Falls way can say whether these are still around/used anymore?

I have a sled with a Jet Pump/O.B. and I can guarantee there's times when it's a LOT of work to get somewhere (how do you spell falling LEAVES on the water in sloughs?

) when Autumn's season arrives.

Hunt'nFish · 01-20-2009, 09:39 AM

There used to be a 17.5 Tracker w/ a prop'ed 50hp Merc for $2100 on Craigslist. Good deal if you ask me.
Pull the prop off and slip a pump on and your good to go.
Heck, throw the motor on a jack plate and you could switch back/forth if you like.

Regardless of what route you go, I would get the biggest HP offered in a given size motor.
By that I mean typically carburation is the only thing that differs between many motors, weight is the same for a given platform...ie 3cyc vs. 4cyc. So get the biggest HP for a given size.

Also, keep an eye on the clearance of impeller to liner. Cavatation, sand, mud, and gravel all erode the liner and increase impeller cavatation. Keep the impeller gap to ~.010" for max thrust and efficency. Move the impeller spacers from front to rear to adj gap.

Also one thing to look for in a sled that will have a pump.......make sure the boat has a trim flange.
Meaning the hull material extends 2-3" beyond the transom. This flange is bent down to adjust the natural trim of the boat and allows you to put the pump trim in the most optimium position for speed, which is typically higher than the boat will allow w/o porpiosing. I've found there seems to be a magical combination of hull trim and motor trim that puts the pump shoe just perfectly that I realize an increase in RPM's and speed. Anything less and the shoe is dragging and holding it back. But without being able to trim the hull, the boat would just porpiose and become uncontrollable.

A trim flange can and will make a lot of differance in pump efficency...and they need all the help they can get.

Mine has a 140hp motor which translates to about 115hp pumped. Even it struggles get a boat load of gear, guys, dogs, etc on plane at times. (course all the crap under the bow doesn't help twin Trojan troll batteries (160lbs right there), danforth sand anchor, chain & come-alone to winch the boat off the bank and back to water.)
So buy the biggest HP motor for a given size motor. You can never have too much.

As for weed, etc.....I have to agree with the guys. Pumps don't like weeds. But then that is also what a kicker motor is for. I can't belive you guys hunt w/o a back up motor. Not me man! I get in enough trouble as it is.

But I do have to say I love my elec bowmount bass motor for picking up deep water deeks. Minn-Kota 55AP w/ Autopilot and wireless remote. Cats meow. Weeds don't bother it either.

Good luck w/ you search.
Hunt'nFish

xstreme357 · 01-20-2009, 10:41 AM

h2o sounds like you know exactly what you want... don't let others try and talk you out of what you want. if your huntin sand and mud it will chew up a liner as well... but that's part of a pump. i've burnt through two of them this hunting season hunting sandy bottoms. i love my pump, get what you want bud. if you don't have weeds, you'll have sand, and if you dont have sand you'll have mud, if you dont have mud you'll have rocks and all can be troublesum for any motor pump or prop.

scottishsetter · 01-20-2009, 11:17 AM

I have a Starcraft 16' Semi-vee. I put a near complete 8' sheet of plywood in the bottom for a floor. Might check out Skipper Bill's in Spokane. I just made my trailer and took it to Spokane to pick it up, they were great. Not sure of the motor capacity, but the free-board is very good; tracks well with a LS 15hp Honda and gets to plane quick.

H2Ofuzz · 01-20-2009, 11:29 AM

Ok here I found one its a 2007 Tracker grizzly 1660 it has a 2007 mercury 2 stroke 50hp Jet the guy that owns it is an older guy that only had it out 4 times he took it out to the river and scared him self pretty bad and has not had it out since. He is asking $8000 its out of my price range but i am going to see what i can do. What do you guys think?

billc_sbio · 01-20-2009, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H2Ofuzz

Ok here I found one its a 2007 Tracker grizzly 1660 it has a 2007 mercury 2 stroke 50hp Jet the guy that owns it is an older guy that only had it out 4 times he took it out to the river and scared him self pretty bad and has not had it out since. He is asking $8000 its out of my price range but i am going to see what i can do. What do you guys think?

I'm not sure how much that length Tracker weighs, but that might be an o.k. setup.

When Mercury sells their O.B.s with the Jet Pump already installed, they mark them for the equivalent thrust H.P. So that motor probably has an 80 H.P. powerhead.

That would probably push that Tracker along to your liking.

Eric Strand · 01-20-2009, 01:46 PM

PM sent

H2Ofuzz · 01-21-2009, 06:43 PM

Well i am still looking. Found a few but they were a little out of my price range.

H2Ofuzz · 01-22-2009, 06:18 PM

Tell me what you guys think of this boat its smaller than what i want but i might work out ok.

http://seattle.craigslist.org/oly/boa/1001011753.html

BerettaMan · 01-22-2009, 07:27 PM

H2O,

I've been reading this thread for a day now and biting my tongue, so here is my two cents. I've owed five different boats with jet pumps, motor size was 25 hp on two of them. That is 25 HP motor with prop that was converted to pump, so really running 15-18 HP at the pump. One boat was a Lund 14 ft DLX ( Aluminum V boat ), the other was a 14 ft Lund Jon boat. I spent lots of time in both these boats and they worked great ( this is a two man setup). The jon boat was light and flat so I could take that thing anywhere. I could take my buddy, dog, 3 dozen decoys, guns and ammo with no problem. It was a little tight (small boat) but we shot lots of ducks and had a great time. Weeds and grass are a problem when your at idle and putting around but usually we could get through it. When on a plain at high RPM the weeds are no problem. I also fish several rivers with both of these boats.
If your on a budget you might start looking for a good 14-16" Jon boat with no motor. You can find these new for $2000.00, less if you find a used one. Once you get the boat you could look for a motor, used 8 or 9.9 Mercury sells for $800.00 and will get you started.
A motor with pump that is in good shape is tough to find and are quite spendy; a new 25 hp with jet will run you $3000.00 and at least $2000 for used. There is lots of junk out there that needs lots of work so be careful.

I hope this information helps, good luck

BM

Bootstrap Bill · 01-22-2009, 07:46 PM

You could always run a prop motor with a jack plate.

nunyet · 01-22-2009, 08:39 PM

I have a ******* lift that I used on an old 20 foot Woolridge boat with a 50 hp on it. Made out of cast aluminum and real stout, Glen Woolridge sold many of these, will sell for 150.oo This would make a great duck set up as you can lift the motor way up when off step.

nunyet

baltz526 · 01-22-2009, 10:14 PM

be patient and buy the boat you want, powered the way you want it. do not just buy a boat you think might work because it is a good deal. the boat you have is a better boat than the one in the craigslist add

Hunt'nFish · 01-23-2009, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H2Ofuzz

Tell me what you guys think of this boat its smaller than what i want but i might work out ok.

http://seattle.craigslist.org/oly/boa/1001011753.html

Over priced if you ask me.

Berrettaman makes some good points about size. When hunting out of the boat, smaller is better. Easier to hide, easier to get dragged back to water when the tide rolls out.
But it's limited in how much weather & wave it can handle. And it's hard to use it for fishing the rest of the year....certainly not the river sled you seek.

Pros and cons to both big and small.

IMO, it would be best to have both. A 12-14ft jon AND a bigger sled for shuttle work.
Or you could go big and get a couple layouts. (this is my approach)
Hunt'nFish

scottishsetter · 01-23-2009, 11:00 AM

Might try looking at the Klamath Wide Jack Boat. 21" at the transom.

Edit; Alumacraft makes a welded Waterfowler model 16'//others up to 20' These are the Modified vee boats that Starcraft no longer makes. Very versatile.They also make a light riveted model line.

Cave · 01-23-2009, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billc_sbio

Another idea is what used to be popular down in the Klamath Basin. I don't know if these are made anymore or not, but there used to be a unit called a "Jack-ass Motor Lifter" that was made/sold by Pelican Marine (if I remember correctly?) that was a bolt-on transom unit that allowed you to run your prop O.B. then used a mechanical linkage that easily raised your motor up for running in shallow water/mud.

This was before the Mud Motors became popular and it worked pretty well. I had some friends that had this setup and it allowed the best of both worlds, using your prop and running in shallow water. (This was done with a long lever and you could raise/lower your motor on the fly

)

Maybe some of the iFishers from down K-Falls way can say whether these are still around/used anymore?

I just saw one of those setups at pelican marina yesterday. It was on a jon set up for ducks in their "used section" for sale. For what it's worth, I just picked up a 1644 smokercraft modified V with shorelander galvanized trailer, some fishing extras, and a 25hp 2 stroke for 2k. Doesn't shed any light on the motor ideas, but there are some great deals out there with the economy and the end of duck season should help out for the next month or so too. Once spring hits, boat prices seem to go up fast. Good luck.

H2Ofuzz · 01-23-2009, 12:50 PM

Were is Pelican Marina?

ogrejager · 01-23-2009, 02:06 PM

Klamath Falls.

(hint: google "Pelican Marina Oregon")

H2Ofuzz · 01-23-2009, 06:41 PM

Thanks i called them and they said they did not have anything. I think in the next couple weeks with duck season ending there should be some boats popping up.

shawfowl · 01-24-2009, 02:29 PM

Might check these place's out.

http://www.boats.com/sites/melsmarine In Eugene,know of a few hunter's that have gotten hunting rig's there,and they are happy.

http://www.waterworldboats.com/locations.asp?nav=113230& This is where i got my G3.They usually have some used set-up's in stock and they Grizzly Boat's.