Landowners who have denied public access

[Ben Hur]

Two years ago a 50 year old and a 18 year old hunter were hunting close to private property in a dense stand of 2nd growth fir that you could see about 30 ft. into. An adjoining clear cut that was posted no hunting and clearly belonging to a rancher across the pasture held at least 4 big bull elk that many people had watched over the summer. The boy was sent into the clear cut to push the elk to his friend in the timber edge right on the property line. A big bull was bedded down and the boy stumbled onto it and got excited and started shooting toward the house and the cows in the pasture. The bull went into a draw and up the other hillside and the boy kept shooting until it died. When he went to get the bull he found the other bull still in the draw and killed it also. A spike wandered down the hill and the boy killed it also. The landowner rancher called the state police and the animals were confiscated. The enfarious duo went back to town to get a buddy off work to tag the third bull, without gutting any of the animals. It took a while for the 2 to convince the third guy and he went with them 4 hours later and they all went back where the OSP stopped them and cited them and made them help gut and skin the animals they killed. They were all cited for numerous things including trespassing.

This is the type of story more likely to happen than someone killing an animal next to private property. What do Ihunters have to say about this? Other stories as screwed up as this one?

[StickFish]

Hope they serve jail time, loose their hunting rights and pay the fines associated with the offenses. A perfect example of why some land owners do not allow access to their lands - shooting towards the house and live stock - enough said

[sturgn]

Those guys are poachers and shouldnt even be considered hunters, and they broke multiple laws and got what they diserved but you cant put HUNTERS in the same class as them...

Originally Posted by Ben Hur

Two years ago a 50 year old and a 18 year old hunter were hunting close to private property in a dense stand of 2nd growth fir that you could see about 30 ft. into. An adjoining clear cut that was posted no hunting and clearly belonging to a rancher across the pasture held at least 4 big bull elk that many people had watched over the summer. The boy was sent into the clear cut to push the elk to his friend in the timber edge right on the property line. A big bull was bedded down and the boy stumbled onto it and got excited and started shooting toward the house and the cows in the pasture. The bull went into a draw and up the other hillside and the boy kept shooting until it died. When he went to get the bull he found the other bull still in the draw and killed it also. A spike wandered down the hill and the boy killed it also. The landowner rancher called the state police and the animals were confiscated. The enfarious duo went back to town to get a buddy off work to tag the third bull, without gutting any of the animals. It took a while for the 2 to convince the third guy and he went with them 4 hours later and they all went back where the OSP stopped them and cited them and made them help gut and skin the animals they killed. They were all cited for numerous things including trespassing.

This is the type of story more likely to happen than someone killing an animal next to private property. What do Ihunters have to say about this? Other stories as screwed up as this one?

[No Fences]

Originally Posted by sturgn

Those guys are poachers and shouldnt even be considered hunters, and they broke multiple laws and got what they diserved but you cant put HUNTERS in the same class as them...

Agreed.

[Smoked Salmon]

Is this a real story, or something that might happen? Is there a chance we could get a link to a news paper which has an article on this? I'm certain ifishers would be keen on watching the progress of any poaching case.

[ehunter]

We have hunted next to private property in Eastern Oregon and to be honest we try to stay off the fence line. I have watched bulls walking the fence line and would never have thought twice about shooting. It is simple its the law. We have talked to the land owner and he is a big rancher who gets paid a lot for his hunts. He told us simply never to cross the fence if we shot some thing that made it across to come to ranch house and let them know. Now we have respected his wishes and he has never seen a foot print from us on his side no matter how tempting plus his place is miles from where we hunt heck we could proabably sneak in and he would never know but that is wrong.

I would expect that if we went and told him what happened and where the bull was shot and we can prove that the elk was on our side that he would be reasonable about it.

I don't think its really rocket science if you cross the line and hunt on his land your poaching. If we shoot a animal on our side and can prove it he seemed reasonable.

Your best bet is to try to avoid the hunting the fence line.

[Ben Hur]

This is a real story, I read it as it was written up in an OSP monthly report for the North Coast District maybe 3 years ago depending how you count seasons. I heard it from the wildlife biologist who took the brain tissue samples from those animals and I talked to the landowner personally about what had happened. He was so upset as he usually lets some of the disabled and or handicapped veterans hunt his place and now those bulls, the feed to grow them and his respect for hunters were all gone. You can call these guys poachers not hunters, but they had "hunting licenses" and were "legal hunters" just like most of us, until they weren't. That is why I was harping on the ethics of hunting would prevent most of these types of stories tarnishing most hunters good image. But if you start to challenge landowners for game, I'm afraid you will just look like the greedy outlaw guys in this story. Posting your admissions that you just trespassed because you can get away with it and you wanted the game you shot is the same thinking that got these three poachers into trouble. Poaching is rampant now and no one understands that they are stealing from all of us or maybe just a group of disabled veterans. If you want the OSP version I can try to find it for you. If you like this true story I can get you a couple of hundred more in the same vein.

[ehunter]

Ben Hur I think this is totally different than shooting a animal having it jump a fence and die? This story is about law breakers from the moment that they crossed the fence they were trespassing. I think that a lot of poachers have tags in their pockets but at the point they stop becoming a law abiding citizen and start breaking the law they become poachers.

Some people think hunting is all about getting the animal part of it is ego part of is peer pressure and they will do what ever it takes. When you can start to enjoy the hunt for what it is with out the feeling to have to succeed to satisfy your ego or your friends there will be a lot less poaching going on or trespassing.

I also agree that poaching is hurting us all, both in PR and in stolen game animals.

Originally Posted by Ben Hur

This is a real story, I read it as it was written up in an OSP monthly report for the North Coast District maybe 3 years ago depending how you count seasons. I heard it from the wildlife biologist who took the brain tissue samples from those animals and I talked to the landowner personally about what had happened. He was so upset as he usually lets some of the disabled and or handicapped veterans hunt his place and now those bulls, the feed to grow them and his respect for hunters were all gone. You can call these guys poachers not hunters, but they had "hunting licenses" and were "legal hunters" just like most of us, until they weren't. That is why I was harping on the ethics of hunting would prevent most of these types of stories tarnishing most hunters good image. But if you start to challenge landowners for game, I'm afraid you will just look like the greedy outlaw guys in this story. Posting your admissions that you just trespassed because you can get away with it and you wanted the game you shot is the same thinking that got these three poachers into trouble. Poaching is rampant now and no one understands that they are stealing from all of us or maybe just a group of disabled veterans. If you want the OSP version I can try to find it for you. If you like this true story I can get you a couple of hundred more in the same vein.

[Klicker]

If you like this true story I can get you a couple of hundred more in the same vein.

With verifiable links?

[nevermiss]

What a travesty for those of us who refuse to do anything of an illegal nature. And these ARE poachers, not hunters. Private property is just that: private. If you don't own you don't roam. The "antis" are looking for just this kinda story to try and close us down, for good! Throw the book at em!

[Ben Hur]

This is a real story, I read it as it was written up in an OSP monthly report for the North Coast District maybe 3 years ago depending how you count seasons. I heard it from the wildlife biologist who took the brain tissue samples from those animals and I talked to the landowner personally about what had happened. He was so upset as he usually lets some of the disabled and or handicapped veterans hunt his place and now those bulls, the feed to grow them and his respect for hunters were all gone. You can call these guys poachers not hunters, but they had "hunting licenses" and were "legal hunters" just like most of us, until they weren't. That is why I was harping on the ethics of hunting would prevent most of these types of stories tarnishing most hunters good image. But if you start to challenge landowners for game, I'm afraid you will just look like the greedy outlaw guys in this story. Posting your admissions that you just trespassed because you can get away with it and you wanted the game you shot is the same thinking that got these three poachers into trouble. Poaching is rampant now and no one understands that they are stealing from all of us or maybe just a group of disabled veterans. If you want the OSP version I can try to find it for you. If you like this true story I can get you a couple of hundred more in the same vein.

[Jaydub]

OSP FIsh & Wildlife newsletters can be found here http://www.oregon.gov/OSP/FW/fw_newsletter.shtml

There are several tresspassing related stories in the Sept. edition alone. The newsletters are good reading. Sometimes they make you mad, sometimes they make you laugh.

[Jimbow]

First off, a young kid should not have been put in a situation like that. There is far too much adrenalin involved in moving a large bull elk off its bed than to have a youngster go in and make the "shoot or not shoot" decisions by and for himself.

[RB fish]

This is a true story it happen on Phill Davison home ranch where he lives. The place is called copange up on the north fork just outside Florence.

[Radke]

Originally Posted by Jimbow

First off, a young kid should not have been put in a situation like that. There is far too much adrenalin involved in moving a large bull elk off its bed than to have a youngster go in and make the "shoot or not shoot" decisions by and for himself.

How can you say that!!!!

The person has a gun, he is hunting. To say he is too young to make a decision about what to shoot!!!!!

say it ain't so

and while I'm on my soap box. Just because a 'hunter' does something illegal, we can't simply say they aren't a hunter. Hunters do illegal things.

like throwing beer cans out the window. coors and busch light usually!!!

okay, I'm off now

[EvilD]

Where I grew up we had same the same issues. Thousands of private acres and millions of acres of public land. Many people think the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence (maybe it's bigger racks on the other side?). Any how there was this mythical buck named 'Waldo'. Huge rack, monster body etc... some times he was seen on public land, other times he was spotted along the hwy with private land for miles on either side. Then one day at school one of my teachers says to me "I shot Waldo but he took off running and went onto private land and I can't get in there to get to him". So I asked him where it went and he said that's where the problem is. The wounded animal went onto a good family friend's (friend of my family's) property and we both knew that there was not a snow ball's chance in heck that the property owner would let anyone go after it.

After calling and swinging by the ranch we never were given permission to go after the buck even though my teacher knew EXACTLY where the buck had gone to die. About five or six days later the land owner went down to the river where the buck was and killed him. The meat was wasted and the animal suffered in agony for a very long time.

It was in Northern California and was a blacktail, hanging weight was 195lbs. Rack was 8x10 and 28" outside spread.
There could have been a happy ending to this had permission been given. Just going in there and getting that monster out also crossed my mind but I (we) chose to play by the rules.

D