The Black Box? myth or fact

NAUTI-NOTIONS · 06-24-2003, 05:17 AM

Can anyone offer up a true testimonial on the use of a black box on your downriggers. I read all the propaganda from the makers and it all sounds good . however not sure if its myth of fact in the real world. Scotty�s offer theirs for $ 100.00 more than Cabelas. They both appear to do the same thing? I understand the ion theroy but does it matter to the point of $100.00 investmentor is it just another gadget to get my money.

Threemuch · 06-24-2003, 07:04 AM

By my way of thinking, unless your boat has a galvanic corrosion problem, it is a small gain at best. I have fished with many boats that had it, and many that did not. Caught fish without it, been skunked with and vice-versa. My experience says that it MIGHT up your catch 5% or so. It's not a 2 to 1 thing or anything.

Pilar posted a design for a home made one a couple years back. I think I have it, and if I do, I will post it.

KB

Uglygreen · 06-24-2003, 07:10 AM

Remember that its possibly illegal in Oregon.

UG

jcarufo · 06-24-2003, 07:20 AM

Black box technology was stumbled upon and developed by an engineer in the 70's, if I remember right, that was working with the commercial fleet in B.C. to try to stop galvanic corrosion. What he discovered was that at certain voltages to the downrigger wires the boat crews were reporting increased success while trolling (.6 to .7 volts). Slightly more voltage didn't repel the fish, but made them more active as they approached the boat and more were lost. Any negative charge repeled the fish. You can get the same effect as the black box by bonding all of your electric devices to make sure no ground shorts are present and adding zincs until you reach the desired voltage. Next time you are in the water, drop the downrigger balls to about 10 feet. Use a meter set to 1 volt with + to the cable and - to a large groung like your outboard. Generally it should read slightly positive unless you have a real electrical problem. What the 'box' does is place the correct voltage into the system overridding any potential problems. I bought an old never used 'Electrocatch' unit that was designed for the commercial industry a couple of years ago for $5.00 on Ebay. It seems to work as described. I think in a prior post, Pilar described constructing a 'box' from Radio Shack parts for even less than that. Spending even $100 for the Protroll unit seems a little extreme to me. Just bond your electrics together, make sure you have no electrical shorts to the hull, keep your zincs clean and you should be close to the right voltage without one. I still have a copy of the report around somewhere if you're interested.
By the way, Cannon electrics used to create a circut with the water as a pole that put a negative charge into the cable. When the downrigger ball broke the surface it stoped the retreive of the wire. I don't know if they still use the design, but a good friend had a pair on his boat in the late 90's and had decreased success from his norm until he added a black box. He eventually switched back to Scotty's. There we saw a tangable difference. Hope this helps,

Jean

Troller · 06-24-2003, 08:42 AM

I have one in my boat. I fish in washington. It is legal for gamefish and salmon is a gamefish in washington. I think it helps it's one of those 1% things maybe it will give you a 1% better chance of catching a fish. But my theory is it doesnt hurt either. But if you add up enough %1 percent things the more you do the better your odds. I also have a salmon scenter that I attach to my downrigger line above the ball to leave a scent trail in the water to help draw fish behing the boat. Things like having fresh bait, using gloves and scent when handling bait and lures. Trolling at the correct speed. Having all your gear setup so you are fishing and not rigging. They all add up to a better success rate. If it was my last 100 bucks I wouldn't get one. But lucky for me I had just enough left for a 99 cent big mac. :grin: I would certainly call the odfw and find out if they are legal or not.

Uglygreen · 06-24-2003, 09:43 AM

Take it for what its worth.

ORS 498.208

Use of electricity or foreign substances to take game fish prohibited. (1) Except as the State Fish and Wildlife Commission by rule may provide otherwise, no person shall:

(a) Use in any body of water any electric current that may attract, frighten, retard, stun, kill or obstruct the movement of any game fish.

(b) Place in any body of water any foreign substance such as blood or fish offal or any gas, chemical, drug or powder that may attract, frighten, retard, stun, kill or obstruct the movement of any game fish.

(c) Use in any body of water any explosive device for the purpose of taking game fish.

(2) No person shall possess any game fish that the person knows or has reason to know was taken in violation of subsection (1) of this section. [1973 c.723 �92]

UG

SlabQuest · 06-24-2003, 10:29 AM

Actually salmon in saltwater in WA are food fish. It is illegal to chum (use the scenter) in WA for game fish.

My $.02 is that the black box helps. I will go with a 20% improvment in catch rate w/ the box.

NAUTI-NOTIONS · 06-25-2003, 05:20 AM

Troller, point well made in the 1% do add up, its not my last $100.00 unless you ask my wife,

SlabQuest, @ 20% wow,,, perhaps your voltage was way off. are you fishing in a alum. boat?

are they more effective on a metal boat verus a glass boat.

I read where Scottys don't have as big of a problem as cannons.

SlabQuest · 06-25-2003, 06:12 AM

Actually, I have only fished w/ the BB a few times. I KNOW that it doesn't repel fish. I have had a lot of strikes while using it.

We had Tom Nelson speak at our local PSA meeting. In his charter, he hooks about 1,500 salmon per year. He does a LOT of experimenting. He used the 20% figure for the BB. (And he was not selling the BB that he recommended) 20% is only 1/5 more strikes - not that many and kinda hard to judge.

salmon university

No, I don't have an aluminum boat.

One thing that I can absolutely guarantee is that the BB won't help you catch fish that aren't there!

[ 06-25-2003, 07:16 AM: Message edited by: SlabQuest ]

Jeffhead · 06-25-2003, 02:10 PM

When the fishing is good I don't think the box makes that much of a difference. The money you spend will come back in the payoff when it's scratch fishing, thats where the 20% or whatever your figure comes in. I've had days where we had the black box and fish in the boat where the checkers at the ramp had 4 fish for 50 boats, 2 being ours. It won't make fish bite but it will attract more fish toward your gear. More fish equals more biters. To me it is just another piece in the arsenal that was worth the investment. Your tune your lures to run right and attract fish why not your boats electrical field. If you run downriggers the weak positive electrical field is there anyway because of the disemilar metals in the water so why not use it to your advantage.
Good luck and tight lines, Jeff

BOTTOM TIME DIVER · 06-25-2003, 07:00 PM

reality check!
1. ground it
2. wire a zinc near lead
3. check with ohm meter
4. drink beer and catch fish

good fishin'

Rodbender · 06-26-2003, 10:27 PM

I fished a number of times with a Guide here in BC who swears by the BB-Scotty model.
Once in Tahsis Inlet I was amazed by the Salmon showing on the sounder-we were trolling for Chinook and it had been slow.
He said "Oh those are Sockeye do you want some"?
He cranked up the voltage and Pow!Pow we had Sockeye on Anchovies!
Another pass with the wires running hot we had out 2 Sockeye each then we turned it down and kept fishing for Chinook.
I'm a believer m'self.

corrirod · 06-26-2003, 10:49 PM

I was just at Joes at the Beaverton mall today and they had the Pro-Troll version for under $80.