OPAC MR Breaking News by RFA w/news article

[Salty Walty]

This information was provided for recreational anglers by RFA Oregon.


John H/RFA Oregon attended the OPAC Social last night and was told by a couple of the OPAC members that there was going to be an announcement at todays meeting from the Govs Office regarding Marine Reserves. This information was not supposed to be given out until the today but because of our good relationships that we have developed over the years we were able to find out sooner.

The Governor has decided that the Marine Reserves must now be surrounded by MPAs. No definition of anything given but if some of the current definitions are used pelagic and salmon fishing might be allowed.
Once again Ted has decided to throw a monkey wrench in the process and change the parameters. There was no mention of why this revision was needed. It is sad to see that these areas are already growing in size before they are even established without any study or scientific reasoning.

I am off to the meeting.

[CATCH AND EAT]

I hate that guy. What a fool and he is doing his best to screw up the Oregon Coast. Governor K. Go plant a stink bomb somewhere else. Arrrrrrrrrrrr.........................

[namu mac]

BOAT FOR SALE? Croquet anyone?

[skein]

C'mon, Bernie, take it easy on him. After all, he's DC's brother, and with those genetics....



Skein

[Chromaflage]

I'm thinking that maybe it's time for a trailer boat flotilla in Salem. This is proceeding just the way it was anticipated - and our brothers to the south of us had warned us.

[hookup1]

Originally Posted by Chromaflage

I'm thinking that maybe it's time for a trailer boat flotilla in Salem. This is proceeding just the way it was anticipated - and our brothers to the south of us had warned us.

I am in when and where

[Irish Pennant]

The sportsman's heritage is being killed by the death of a thousand cuts. The knife blows are coming from every direction and directed at every aspect of the sportsman's way of life. MR's are just one item on a long list of attacks. For me it started with the ban on hunting cougar and bears with bait or dogs. That victory for the utopians just emboldened them, they have stolen so much from us since then that now we are in a fight to save our fishing heritage. I encourage you to visit the hunting, inland fishing and yes the fly fishing forums and join their fights. There battles are our battles, their opposition is the same people, political movement and mindset that's after us.

[Boatdog]

Dear Ted,



.

[Salty Walty]

I was not there to directly hear the News but John H summed it up for me by saying. It appears that with the cautions about avoiding economic impacts, potential harm to the fishing industry and such in his Executive Order. The MRs will not be big enough. I am sure that he or Keywest could fill in more but that is the reason for this last minute land grab attempt.

On another note. Thanks to many months of attendance, hard work and testimony at OPAC Meetings by RFA and KOF members. There are no longer exempted groups in the MR process on the issue of disturbance. You no longer have to kill something to disturb it. There was much discontent from the other Ocean user groups about this. Their claims of doing no harm and being one with the environment did not pass the smell test when information was given to contradict their claims of no harm. Great job Dean.

[Pilar]

Three cheers for Walt and especially Dean. Ride this surfer dude o[]oo.

There's a disturbance alright. A political deal exposed and now reversed. Most of this stuff won't stand the light of day. We just have to keep flipping rocks and see what crawls out.

[Mypursuit]

This MPA addition was expected and just as ridiculous.

Thanks everyone for their contributions so far. Sorry I missed todays OPAC meeting. Work interfered.

Guess we need to be constantly vigilant. We have to keep challenging this. At some point a boat trailer assault on Salem will probably be necessary.

[Deeman]

Beware the straw man. MPAs are a distraction from the real issue... MRs. They also make a good bone to throw to make it look like they are willing to compromise. Defeat the MRs and the MPAs are a non-starter.

[garyk]

Originally Posted by Salty Walty

....was told by a couple of the OPAC members that there was going to be an announcement at todays meeting from the Govs Office regarding Marine Reserves. .

What happened?

[Salty Walty]

See post #9.

The job of reading the request/order/directive on the Governors behalf was Dave Fox of ODFW. It is a matter of public record now and should be up on the OPAC site as soon as Laurel or Jay can get it on the OPAC site. http://www.oregon.gov/LCD/OPAC/index.shtml

For those who have not been following this very closely. ODFW was given the task of representing the Governors Office at OPAC Meetings.
If you would like to hear what was said from Dave Fox himself his # is 541 867 0300 ext 228


As I said before, I will let Dean or John give a more detailed account.

I would also like to commend OPAC Chairman Scott Mc Mullen for cutting to the chase during the disturbance debate.

[KeyWest]

Walter,

It is difficult to access the real reason behind the allowance of MPA's in the process. The stated reason was:

"ODFW is finding it difficult to balance the competing goals of no significant economic impact and still meet the biological goals - therefore some extractive activities may be allowed"

"MPA's are are not an instead of - but they are an additional tool"

It was very unclear as to the reasoning, scope, criteria, etc. IMHO, I came away with the feeling that the crabbing industry was blocking implementation of the MR's and by allowing crabbing in the MR's they could get on board. The reason I came away with this was that crabbing was referred to many times by Dave Fox as potentially being allowed within a MR/MPA.


I would suggest we sport fisherman also get on board with a similar deal. We agree to MR's as long as the following activities are allowed:

• Surfing
• Kayaking
• Swimming
• Crabbing
• Clamming
• Fishing
• Etc.

All of this is just conjecture on my part as OPAC members were really confused about this and pretty much agreed to not discuss MPA's and continue with the task at hand - finalizing the MR guidance document.

I'm sure a call to the Gov's office would clarify everything.

[garyk]

Originally Posted by Salty Walty

The job of reading the request/order/directive on the Governors behalf was Dave Fox of ODFW. It is a matter of public record now and should be up on the OPAC site as soon as Laurel or Jay can get it on the OPAC site. http://www.oregon.gov/LCD/OPAC/index.shtml
.

Unfortunately, it's not there - yet. Nor is there any announcement on the Governor's official site. Maybe tomorrow?

[Smoked Salmon]

Originally Posted by KeyWest

I'm sure a call to the Gov's office would clarify everything.

I've yet to receive a reply to my phone calls, letters, or emails about the Marine Reserves. Some democracy...

[ducky-fish]

like was said before a flotilla to salem and add casting some sharp hooks with stiff rods may get their attn.

[Kabuki Joe]

Originally Posted by KeyWest

Walter,

It is difficult to access the real reason behind the allowance of MPA's in the process. The stated reason was:

"ODFW is finding it difficult to balance the competing goals of no significant economic impact and still meet the biological goals - therefore some extractive activities may be allowed"

"MPA's are are not an instead of - but they are an additional tool"

It was very unclear as to the reasoning, scope, criteria, etc. IMHO, I came away with the feeling that the crabbing industry was blocking implementation of the MR's and by allowing crabbing in the MR's they could get on board. The reason I came away with this was that crabbing was referred to many times by Dave Fox as potentially being allowed within a MR/MPA.



I would suggest we sport fisherman also get on board with a similar deal. We agree to MR's as long as the following activities are allowed:

• Surfing
• Kayaking
• Swimming
• Crabbing
• Clamming
• Fishing
• Etc.

All of this is just conjecture on my part as OPAC members were really confused about this and pretty much agreed to not discuss MPA's and continue with the task at hand - finalizing the MR guidance document.

I'm sure a call to the Gov's office would clarify everything.

...remember my post about the fox hunting ban in the UK, the houndsmen got on board with the "incentive" that hounds would be excluded from the ban...the ban was passed, it was revised to include all foxhunting (including hounds of course) and the rest is history...once the MR's/MPA's are passed, it's too late, the foot is in the door...


Dave

[PC Silver Streak]

Originally Posted by Salty Walty

This information was provided for recreational anglers by RFA Oregon.


John H/RFA Oregon attended the OPAC Social last night and was told by a couple of the OPAC members that there was going to be an announcement at todays meeting from the Govs Office regarding Marine Reserves. This information was not supposed to be given out until the today but because of our good relationships that we have developed over the years we were able to find out sooner.

The Governor has decided that the Marine Reserves must now be surrounded by MPAs. No definition of anything given but if some of the current definitions are used pelagic and salmon fishing might be allowed.
Once again Ted has decided to throw a monkey wrench in the process and change the parameters. There was no mention of why this revision was needed. It is sad to see that these areas are already growing in size before they are even established without any study or scientific reasoning.

I am off to the meeting.

What's that tell you...change the rules during the game Ted! I smell something fishy! This MR issue is not based on science, but politics.
This whole issue is bad for Oregonians and get ready for imported seafood from China, coming to a coast restaurant near you.

[Kabuki Joe]

Originally Posted by PC Silver Streak

What's that tell you...change the rules during the game Ted! I smell something fishy! This MR issue is not based on science, but politics.
This whole issue is bad for Oregonians and get ready for imported seafood from China, coming to a coast restaurant near you.

...but Oregon is a blue state, and as a blue state, we (partisan removed) need to protect the birds and bee's...


Dave

[PC Silver Streak]

Originally Posted by Kabuki Joe

...but Oregon is a blue state, and as a blue state, we (well, I'm a republican so "we" is used for the democrats in charge) need to protect the birds and bee's...


Dave

Yes...protect the birds and bees from mankind, but what about the other predator-prey relationships and diseases that inflict harm on the birds and bees?

[smalldog]

MR=marine reserve

MPA?=?

[Metal Manipulator]

Originally Posted by smalldog

MR=marine reserve

MPA?=?

MPA= Marine Protected Area

This means in my opinion that the area within an MPA is under the jurisdiction of a manager that can make decisions on activities within the area as he deems nessissary. This means we can be excluded from activities in the area if the MIC makes the decision. NO VOTES NO COMMITIES AND NO INPUT FROM YOU AND ME.

If you don't believe me just read up on what has taken place in California.

[Bill Monroe]

Returning to Key West's point...
Several extractive activities are allowed in MPAs that aren't possible in an MR, so it works the other way as well...giving ODFW the flexibility it might need (is begging for?)...

[HiTekRdNek]

I think that putting an MPA in conjucntion with an MR is just giving them the extra room to make the MR's bigger when they want.
It doesn't look like anything I'm willing to go along with.
This change in the vision is not something I want any part of.
Let's remember they have no science in support of anything they want and now they want more.

[roadsend]

Folks, a brief reminder to keep this thread non-partisan.
This topic is quite possibly the greatest threat ever to our coastal fishing heritage. It has the potential to profoundly affect quite a few of us and it is in all of our best interests to keep it open. The IFISH mod team asks everyone to please use good judgement in your posts.

[Scaup]

Originally Posted by Bill Monroe

Returning to Key West's point...
Several extractive activities are allowed in MPAs that aren't possible in an MR, so it works the other way as well...giving ODFW the flexibility it might need (is begging for?)...

Yes, in most California MPAs. salmon trolling and albacore trolling is allowed, everything else is prohibited. But there was a big push by the environmental groups to eliminate salmon trolling due to the potential of rockfish by-catch. How many of you have caught a Canary or Yellow-eye while salmon trolling?

For that matter, how many of you have caught an albacore within the 3 mile limit?

MPAs are basically, defacto MRs, with a different name.

[Salty Walty]

I was sent this article from the Daily Astorian. It appeared in the 9/2/208 issue.


Governor tweaks concept of marine reserves
Kulongoski adds marine protected areas to plan

By CASSANDRA PROFITA
The Daily Astorian

The state of Oregon has surprised sport and commercial fishers by changing the rules on its marine reserves plan a month before site proposals are due to the Oregon Ocean Policy Advisory Council.

At the recent OPAC meeting in Garibaldi, officials with the Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife announced the state will allow less restrictive marine protected areas in addition to marine reserves, which are completely off-limits to all extractive activities.

"It was a major surprise," said Frank Warrens, an OPAC member from Portland. "The governor's original instructions to OPAC were to come up with nine or less marine reserves. He did not mention anything at all about marine protected areas. ... This is a whole new wrinkle."

Gov. Ted Kulongoski has asked OPAC to recommend by November up to nine marine reserve sites within the state's three-mile territorial sea where all fishing and other extractive activities would be prohibited. Marine reserves are touted as a way to preserve biodiversity and advance scientific research. Site proposals are due to OPAC by the end of September.

But up until last month, the state's plans did not include marine protected areas, where some fishing activities such as salmon trolling and crabbing would be allowed.

Now, it appears marine protected areas are needed in order to meet the governor's mandate of creating marine reserves that are large enough to provide ecological benefits without causing significant economic harm to coastal communities.

Ed Bowles, fish division administrator for the Oregon Department of Fish and Wildlife, said some groups designing site proposals were having trouble meeting the governor's dual mandate, and allowing marine protected areas should help the process.

"MPAs are not an alternative to marine reserves or a replacement," he said. "They would simply be considered as a complement to marine reserves if the economic impacts constrain the size or boundaries of proposed sites to the point that the ecological objectives aren't likely to be met."

Bowles said the goal of the marine protected area would be to expand the ecological benefits of the site without increasing the economic impacts to coastal communities by banning some extractive activities and not others.

"The apparent rationale for ... adding to marine reserves with marine protected areas is the fact that a larger marine reserve cannot be implemented without considerable economic impacts to coastal communities," said Warrens. "In order to make marine reserve small enough, the people proposing them were concerned they weren't going to have enough value as research areas."

Brad Pettinger, a member of OPAC and the administrator for the Oregon Trawl Commission, said it was "bad form" for the state to make a last-minute rule change without any notice.

"I don't think people appreciated something coming into the process this late," he said. "It wasn't even on the agenda."

The kind of fishing that will be allowed in the marine protected areas will depend on the site, but bottom trawling is generally perceived to be more environmentally destructive than other fishing techniques. Proposals that favor one kind of fishing in a marine protected area and exclude another could cause rifts in the fishing industry.

"I don't think the fleet is going to go for it," Pettinger said.

Astoria resident Scott McMullen, who also sits on OPAC, said the last-minute rule change upset some council members but he doesn't think the inclusion of marine protected areas will have a big impact on OPAC's role in recommending sites to the governor.

At the Garibaldi meeting, OPAC approved its final guidance document for the marine reserve selection process without making any changes to include new rules for marine protected areas. The Council has agreed to favor proposals that meet the governor's mandate and have support from local communities and user groups.

"Every proposal *- regardless of whether it has marine protected areas or not - will still have to meet the requirements the governor set out," said McMullen. "Even if you have a big marine protected area, that restriction cannot have a significant impact on the coastal economy."

Bob Rees, a Tillamook-based fishing guide who is working on a marine reserve site proposal off Cannon Beach, said adding marine protected areas to his group's proposal site has expanded the total protections at the site.

"For what we're trying to accomplish from a conservation perspective, marine protected areas are a good thing," he said. "It's just another tool in the tool box when it comes to working with industry and ocean users. It's a tool we can still use to promote conservation and allow some limited extractive activities."

[PC Silver Streak]

They should have started out with MPA sites (less restrictive) instead of No-Fishing sites (Marine Reserves) in the first place. However, MPA's can easily be converted to MR's.

[HiTekRdNek]

I'm still not trusting them on this one. As already said it is very easy to change an MPA to a MR. It is only a rule change. Feels like the same pill being force feed, now just candycoated.
I still want to see scientific studies on our current conditions. Not science that is brought form some other time and place.

[Chum Bucket]

When is Ted's term up??? Obviously not soon enuf.

[Irish Pennant]

Originally Posted by Chum Bucket

When is Ted's term up??? Obviously not soon enuf.

It don't matter. there's a clone/clown machine that just keeps pumping them out. Until that machine breaks or is broken, this fight will continue.

[blubeast]

Thanks Walter for keeping us informed....

[Smoked Salmon]

Gosh. Will clam digging be affected by the Marine Reserves? I wonder if any kids will get pinched for taking sand dollars off the beach.

[Mypursuit]

Originally Posted by Smoked Salmon

Gosh. Will clam digging be affected by the Marine Reserves? I wonder if any kids will get pinched for taking sand dollars off the beach.

Yes & Yes....seriously....if they get what they want.

[Reel Knotty]

Hmmmm...kinda sounds like the playbook they used on our Southern neighbor...now if I am remembering right, they created the MPA's, then afterward, banned salmon trolling in the MPA's in Northern CA because of bottom fish by-catch (that didn't exist)...gee, I wonder what they will do here...

[black magic]

It has been heard from reliable sources that the Tillamook County Commission may soon be coming out with a rebuttal to this MPA proposal.

[Mypursuit]

Originally Posted by black magic

It has been heard from reliable sources that the Tillamook County Commission may soon be coming out with a rebuttal to this MPA proposal.