Anchor rode to chain splice?

Seefood Man · 03-13-2008, 12:49 PM

I am running a 9/16th HD rode to 20ft. of 5/16th chain and using it on a 1100lb windlass. It is obvious that I need to learn to re-splice this from time to time as it is taking a beating going through the windlass. My question is a back-splice the same as a anchor-chain splice? And what do you think I can do to reduce the friction of this splice as it moves through the windlass?
Thanks Folks

Ploughman · 03-13-2008, 01:02 PM

What kind of rope is it (3 or 8 strand)? Regardless, there is a splice for both that is different than a butt (end) splice. Because your going through the chain, you don't have to make a crown like with a butt splice. I am pretty sure that samson and new england ropes both have splicing diagrams on their websites. On my rode, the splice is coated with liquid electrical tape at the chair/rope junction. It reduces the chafing on the rope as the first link of the chain is stuck to the rope splice.

Boats · 03-13-2008, 01:09 PM

http://www.animatedknots.com/chainsp...matedknots.com

Hope this helps!

Also: Would think some chaffing gear might help to prolong the life of the splice.

Seefood Man · 03-13-2008, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ploughman

What kind of rope is it (3 or 8 strand)? Regardless, there is a splice for both that is different than a butt (end) splice. Because your going through the chain, you don't have to make a crown like with a butt splice. I am pretty sure that samson and new england ropes both have splicing diagrams on their websites. On my rode, the splice is coated with liquid electrical tape at the chair/rope junction. It reduces the chafing on the rope as the first link of the chain is stuck to the rope splice.

It is a 3 strand, Does the liquid electrical tape hold up well under those conditions? I guessing that you don't coat the entire splice just at the terminal end of the rope, Am I reading that right?

Seefood Man · 03-13-2008, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boats

http://www.animatedknots.com/chainsp...matedknots.com

Hope this helps!

Also: Would think some chaffing gear might help to prolong the life of the splice.

What kind of chaffing gear are you thinking Boats? I am running 20ft of chain and the splice has to pass over the bow roller and through the windlass. I would be really interested to see what you got going.
Thanks Pete

Ploughman · 03-13-2008, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seefood Man

It is a 3 strand, Does the liquid electrical tape hold up well under those conditions? I guessing that you don't coat the entire splice just at the terminal end of the rope, Am I reading that right?

Yes, just at the end, maybe the final inch. It's just worked into the strands and against the link. The idea is not to keep the splice together but to keep the link from working/moving against the strands. If I knew how to post a photo, I would. As far as holding up, well its better than nothing.

Boats · 03-13-2008, 08:35 PM

PM Sent...

USCGBoating · 03-16-2008, 07:57 PM

Instead of splicing right to the chain I would recommend a swivel. You can get a swivel that has an eye on one end and a clevis on the other. If you splice the line to a thimble on the eye end of the swivel you have a stronger connection that will not chafe as much plus reduce wear on your line from kinking.

Dan

Grizzly II · 03-16-2008, 08:02 PM

Dan's advice is how to address the question. No only will it reduce the chafe, but in a change of tide it will allow the boat to swing without twisting the rode.

Rod

Road Rage · 03-17-2008, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by USCGBoating

Instead of splicing right to the chain I would recommend a swivel. You can get a swivel that has an eye on one end and a clevis on the other. If you splice the line to a thimble on the eye end of the swivel you have a stronger connection that will not chafe as much plus reduce wear on your line from kinking.

Dan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arima Grizzly

Dan's advice is how to address the question. No only will it reduce the chafe, but in a change of tide it will allow the boat to swing without twisting the rode.

Rod

The swivels, in my experience, won't fit through a windlass, requiring the direct rode to chain splice.

Grizzly II · 03-17-2008, 07:45 AM

Road Rage. You are right about not fitting thru the windlass. Don't have one so never considered that.

Onokai · 03-17-2008, 07:52 AM

Dans advice is best unless you have a windless like I do then its direct to chain. Mark

USCGBoating · 03-18-2008, 06:07 PM

Question, How big of a boat are you anchoring and how big is the anchor? Twenty feet of chain seems like a whole lot. On the 44ft MLB's we had a 30 lb danforth with 6 feet of half inch chain . That was plenty to keep the anchor flat on the bottom and that was a 19 ton boat. You may be better served to go up in chain size a bit and shorten the amount you have. Just a suggestion.

Dan

Onokai · 03-18-2008, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by USCGBoating

Question, How big of a boat are you anchoring and how big is the anchor? Twenty feet of chain seems like a whole lot. On the 44ft MLB's we had a 30 lb danforth with 6 feet of half inch chain . That was plenty to keep the anchor flat on the bottom and that was a 19 ton boat. You may be better served to go up in chain size a bit and shorten the amount you have. Just a suggestion.

Dan

The boat is 23 whaler with about 25-30 feet of chain and 200 feet of line I will measure the chain size next time I'm over at friends barn. I like to dive from boat and have it be there in same place when its windy so there is no such thing for me as too much chain. You need some line for stretch. One of the things a diver learns from experience watch the boat pull on anchor rode is how a small amount of chain jerks and lets the line pull more of an up angle instead of the prefered lower angles with lots of chain. Also chain does not get cut on rocks where we usually anchor (reef). My small whaler (19 footer) has 30 feet of chain on a 30# danforth and 200 feet of 7/8 sampson braid-its overkill but as stated before I know its there when I'm underwater. Mark

PS Its a drag when the boat"s gone when you surface-been there done that.

USCGBoating · 03-20-2008, 08:18 AM

Can�t agree with you more on the angle of the line. The standard scope of anchor line should be about 5 to 7 times the water depth. If conditions are such that you have a lot of wind and sea the scope should be increased to about 10 times the water depth. So if you use 5 times the water depth, in 50 feet of water you should have 250 feet of anchor line out. If you do not keep that sloping angle the anchor and chain will do as you describe and drag.

Not having that angle will also add undue stress to your anchor line. If you have to great an angle the line will shockload, wearing down the fibers of the line and reducing the strength of the line.

You may want to look into a swivel and there are many different styles out there to choose from that can work with a windlass. Here is one manufacturer of stainless ground tackle as an example,. There are many other companies out there that are local that have the same stuff.

www.suncorstainless.com

Dan

Irish Pennant · 03-20-2008, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boats

http://www.animatedknots.com/chainsp...matedknots.com

Hope this helps!

Also: Would think some chaffing gear might help to prolong the life of the splice.

Looking at that splice, it is just a back splice. How weird. I would think that that would ware fast. I can see why Seafood Man wants to learn to do it his self.
Seafood Man, I know how to splice 3 strand and would be willing to meet up with you and show you how.

Chrome Bumper · 03-20-2008, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by USCGBoating

Not having that angle will also add undue stress to your anchor line. If you have to great an angle the line will shockload, wearing down the fibers of the line and reducing the strength of the line.

Dan

Great point! With wire and fiber rope there is a lot more going on inside than first meets the eye.

Chain helps to keep the top of the anchor low so the flukes can dig in, it helps in conjunction with the scope. Under heavy load the chain weight becomes less effective.

Seefood Man · 03-20-2008, 09:48 AM

I will get you some pics of the anchor setup I have. The windlass and the end of the anchor, when it is set in the nest, is about a foot apart, so if I did a thimble splice I would only be able to have one foot of chain as the thimble won't pass through the windlass. Likewise, with a swivel it would have to be at the end of the anchor. I think the current anchor and chain is weighing in around 45lbs, I will re-weigh it though. It might seem a bit over kill, however, when I drop it it sticks. The most dangerous thing that happen is slide down river with to light of an anchor. I would like to thank you all for the input and advice. I'll try to get those pics up today.
Stay well
Pete