Gas outboard vs diesel inboards

[5-Cents]

If all my stars line up right in the next few months I might be getting a new boat and I pretty much got my mind set on a nice salty glass boat designed to spank some of them there ocean fish

It seems that boats with outboards are getting bigger and bigger and may be something to consider versus inboard diesel... what are your opinons when comparing the two power options?

I just cant seem to get excited about fishing the river any more

[backlash442]

How big of a boat and how heavy (they don't always go hand in hand)? Diesel will get much better fuel economy if in a big heavy glass boat. In fact those new Volvo D series will outperform a KAD series even in a heavier boat than the KAD is in. Top it off you can even run faster and still get better gph. Truely amazing.

I'm probably one of the few on this board that would pick a diesel over an OB. IMO if you are going to be doing a lot of fishing (especially offshore) I'd take the diesel any day and wouldn't look back. Just don't expect it to go slow enough to troll for salmon.

[tomictime]

...I think it really depends on three things..
1. the boat..big iron is needed for certain applications
2.) The I/O is the weak link..which MOST people forget in the debate...
3.) hard to beat 3 + MPG planning efficiency with the new 4-stroke OB's...

[flatocean]

If your looking for an ocean boat there is a 25' Parker with twin 225 Yamahas
on Craigs List for 65000. Looks like a fine boat
flatocean (boat slabhunter)

[backlash442]

Wouldn't that 3 mpg depend on how heavy the boat is? You think it'll push a 7000+ lb. boat at 26 knots and burn only around 8 gph? Buddies D4 260 hp will do that.

Outdrive a weak link? Volvo makes a pretty good OD and has for many years. I know several owners with thousands of hours and not one problem but I guess nothing is perfect. Also you could always go with a jackshaft.

[Duckworth Dave]

Recently had to ask the same question as I was shopping for my second tuna boat. The old boat was just that 1969 Berturm 25' & 10.5 beam with twin 6 cyl chev's. 100 gals per trip and slow in and back to the barn.

The new tuna boat shopping was all about speed, confort, room for fish ,and deck space, with some fuel ecomey. I looked at inboards and outboards. The bigger the boat they all go inboard but I was on the line with 30'. And then when you jump to 34' 36' the money really jumps. $150,000 plus plus and that is used. I liked the Grady White Marlin 30' but used they seem to bring big money used, which seem to run outboards only.

I shopped the country for a Grady and found a new brand to me Stamas. A salesman told me about the brand as I was crying about the price of a used Grady. I looked at 5 different Stamas's on the net and they make a very nice sport fish express. Full walk around deck 11.2' beam with a huge deck space. 30.2' oal. The one I bought came with twin 250 efi Yamama's with stainless steel props. 107 hours on 2004 motors. The layout is very close to the Grady for way less money. The prices are so soft in Florida on used boats even with 5 grand shipping it was a very inexpensive tuna boat with all the toys. I bought this boat for less than what the two motors are worth. So the boat and electronics & shipping are FREE. Gas is the way to go still for me anyways, till I get a 34 or 38 or bigger than I will go diesel.

[Grady252]

This debate can go on and there are may different opinions. Personally I think most people do not go deisel because of the expense. The proven dependability, longevity, fuel efficiency of a deisel is hard to argue...... Deisel is very safe as far as boat fires go as well.

The big reason not to go deisel: COST .......... the initial investment is more, the maintenance is more, and I think they are a little heavier. Most boats I have seen with Deisel are also a little slower......

Have fun shopping!!!

[Chrome Bumper]

Those Volvos are nice, efficient and low maintenance.

[Bluefinn]

Originally Posted by Chrome Bumper

Those Volvos are nice, efficient and low maintenance.

look at the price of diesel granted you do not have to pay road tax with diesel but it is not a cheap fuel any more.I say 30' and under twin outboards.I had many hours on my volvo outdrive I also serviced it every 100 hours which means pulling the boat out.I like the idea of lifting the outboards out of the water.The outdrive sits in the salt water all the time.
Volvo parts are not cheap.I just rebuilt my outdrive $9500 ouch!

[Nalu]

Trailerable- Outboards.

Non-trailerable- true MARINE diesels with shaft drive.

Of course there are a few boats such as Tower Todds Albermarle which is very nice and fit the trailer/diesel mold.

Outboards- (assuming newer ones) Quiet, no fumes, high power to weight, lower initial cost, low service cost, relatively easy repair, way lower replacement cost, decent fuel economy, FAST.

Cons- Two biggest in my book are the weight on the back of the boat and they obstruct the stern of boat during fishing.

Diesel- (If below deck motor, shaft driven) Good fuel economy, extended life if used very regularly, good weight distribution, clear stern for fishing.

Cons- Even best new diesels smell like diesel. (I don't mind but many do) Initial cost, service, replacement, parts.

You can get a newer 33' boat with twin inboard diesels that runs just about the same fuel efficiency as a 30' twin outboard deep vee such as a Grady Marlin. Of course it will be pushing 25 knots when the Marlin will be pushing 30.

So, here's something that most people probably won't agree with me on. When you're to the point you are now, the difference in fuel efficiency really is irrelevant. You currently have a great boat that you can chase tuna with now that is decent enough with fuel efficiency. If you're moving up from that boat, then you obviously see advantages to a faster deep vee that gives you more offshore options and the ability to sprint rather than jog. At this point, you need to consider what you want out of a boat more than fuel efficiency. How many offshore trips will you REALLY make a year? 10? 15? 25?

And trust me.....you'll still burn a hundred gallons in a day....you'll just go farther.

One more nice thing about an outboard..... If it blows up during the middle of the season, you can always just hang a new one.

[Reelentless]

Originally Posted by 5-Cents

If all my stars line up right in the next few months I might be getting a new boat and I pretty much got my mind set on a nice salty glass boat designed to spank some of them there ocean fish

It seems that boats with outboards are getting bigger and bigger and may be something to consider versus inboard diesel... what are your opinons when comparing the two power options?

I just cant seem to get excited about fishing the river any more

I've never owned a boat with outboards so I won't comment on those.

My boat has twin diesels (shafts) with about 2300 hours on them. Not sure why people think they are expensive to maintain. So far I've replaced fluids, filters, and a few odd parts. The only real expense was the exhaust elbows. Had they been flushed regularly and not "hung up wet", they wouldn't have needed to be replaced. If you are diligent about the small stuff, diesels will offer years of service. To replace one of my engines would run me about $17000. How much is a 250hp outboard and how long will it last?

Some things to consider:

How heavy is the boat you are looking at?
How much do you use the boat?
Will it be moored or trailered?
What kind of range are you looking for?
Do you want twins or a single engine?
Do you plan to cruise up and down the coast like the Myrtle Bee does or will you stay within 50 miles of your home port?
What is your rough budget?

With a little more info we can give you more useful advice.

[5-Cents]

It sounds like size is coming into question here, and lets face it gentlemen - size is an issue when it comes to boats!

For what I am looking at is going to be in the 33' - 40' range, with the 35' - 38' ranges looking the most appealing as far as price and layout goes. I know there are a lot of power options in the 33' - 36' size range right now.

The main issue is of course fishablity but having a boat the whole family can enjoy with overnighter capibility is a big deal too... those express models offer a very nice blend of both worlds.

There is a lot of good input here - I really appreciate it!

[Snowwolfe]

It mostly boils down to cost of the motor (s) and the fuel and how much you expect to use the boat every year. A smaller factor is how much fuel the boat holds and do you need the additional range to run further out.
When I purchased my Sea Sport I paid 5k extra for the 496 (375 hp) I/O. The cheapest diesel was another $15,000 on top of that. Where I live diesel is now about .40 a gallon more than gas.
Just do some simple calculations as to how much you run the boat and expected mileage.
I suspect as a general rule diesels make a lot more economical sense on boats 28 feet or longer but in my case I would never make up the cost difference with better mileage.
In a 30 foot boat or bigger I would go diesel everytime.

[Zodiac-Fisherman]

I would definitely look at a 40' Cabo Express.

With the 40' You can easily fish in 10' seas all day long.

You will not find a better 40' express out there!!!

The price difference from the 32' Cabo to the 35' isnt much, and from the 35 to the 38' isnt much either. Definitely look at a 38 or 40 Cabo.


And you can take it down south and kick rear end with it!!

[Reelentless]

Originally Posted by 5-Cents

It sounds like size is coming into question here, and lets face it gentlemen - size is an issue when it comes to boats!

For what I am looking at is going to be in the 33' - 40' range, with the 35' - 38' ranges looking the most appealing as far as price and layout goes. I know there are a lot of power options in the 33' - 36' size range right now.

The main issue is of course fishablity but having a boat the whole family can enjoy with overnighter capibility is a big deal too... those express models offer a very nice blend of both worlds.

There is a lot of good input here - I really appreciate it!

On a boat that size, no question, twin diesel inboards. I cant imagine hanging 2 or 3 300 hp outboards off the back of a 38' boat.

[Zodiac-Fisherman]

Oh, do not get a fly bridge, too much weight too high off the water line, an express will ride much better, and fish much better as well, much better visability from the helm.

[Nalu]

Reelentless- You are absolutely right about cost not being overly expensive on some diesels, especially standard older models. Also right about the intended use making a big impact on what to run.

The diesel cost really starts to take place when you are looking at newer common rail models that provide the lower noise, less emissions, and the ability to crank up the speed and still maintain relatively good burn rates. Replacing these type of motors is more in the $40k range.

When you are talking normally aspirated or even standard turbo CAT 3116's or the like the cost is a much more reasonable.

[retaliate]

Yeah! a Boat that size you would be better off with a Diesel or 2, However some can't deal with the fumes of a deisel or a 2 stroke outboard, something you might want to consider, for yourself, & your Family, for some it's the difference between getting sea sick or not.

[Nalu]

Originally Posted by 5-Cents

It sounds like size is coming into question here, and lets face it gentlemen - size is an issue when it comes to boats!

For what I am looking at is going to be in the 33' - 40' range, with the 35' - 38' ranges looking the most appealing as far as price and layout goes. I know there are a lot of power options in the 33' - 36' size range right now.

The main issue is of course fishablity but having a boat the whole family can enjoy with overnighter capibility is a big deal too... those express models offer a very nice blend of both worlds.

There is a lot of good input here - I really appreciate it!

Shane- Sounds like you have a nice boat on your mind.

If the "main" issue is fishability, my humble opinion is to go on the smaller size as opposed to the larger size.

Start comparing cockpit size on boats in the 32-35 foot range versus the 35-40 foot size. You'll find that there is very little difference. The difference typically becomes more amenities below, and more beam.

As far as rough weather goes, regardless of what ZF says, you're unlikely to be fishing any more days in a 35-40 foot boat than you are in a 32-35 footer. If it's too rough for a 34 foot boat to fish here, then you're not going to fish a 40 footer, especially as a new big boat skipper, and one that doesn't HAVE to be out there.

What you get with a smaller boat is more speed. In 32-35's you can still cruise at 20-24 knots and push 30 if you have the right engines. Pushing past 35 feet and you can still push the knots if you have the right boat, but it starts to become more and more cost prohibitive.

As far as Express versus flybridge. You need to ride on some of the Express boats and see for yourself. More than a few ride very bow high, Cabo's, Luhrs, Albemarle and Vikings included. At slower speeds in the 14-18 knot range some of these are very difficult to see what is right in front of you. Again, contrary to what ZF says, there are MANY excellent boats out there with fly bridges. Length to beam ratio and draft are what's important. A narrow beamed boat can't handle it the same way a beefy beam does. Some flybridges are bad, but how many Bertrams do you see with flybridges? A lot, and they're considered probably the most classic of all offshore fishing vessels and copied by more designers than any other.

So...more to think about...but that 32' - 35' foot boat is right in the sweet spot. Good speed relative to fuel economy, lots of room below, and cockpit size that about maxes out when it comes to sport fishers.

[Reelentless]

Originally Posted by Zodiac-Fisherman

Oh, do not get a fly bridge, too much weight too high off the water line, an express will ride much better, and fish much better as well, much better visability from the helm.

Hmm, personal preference I guess.

My boat has a flybridge and the only drawback I've found is that the pilot is left out of the action when you are trolling. Its just not practical to climb up and down to fight fish. Or if you plan to go out alone, the flybridge could be an issue if there isnt a lower helm.

I cant imagine having any better visibility while up in the flybridge, especially while docking. I can see 360 degrees. Being up that high is a little intimidating at first, but once you get used to it, the view is great.

I have heard others say that express boats ride better compared to their flybridge counterparts. But once you get into the size class 5-cents is looking at I think you start splitting hairs. Does a 35 Cabo Express have a better ride then a 35 Bertram Flybridge? Maybe, but they both ride very well and the advantage of the flybridge far outweighs the minor difference in ride. Just my opinion of course.

Don't get me wrong, Id LOVE to have a 32 Cabo Express with a tower. But if I had that much scratch to spend on a boat, I'd opt for a used 35 Cabo with a flybridge, or better yet, a very used 35 Bertram with a flybridge.

[backlash442]

You step to a boat in the 35'-40' range it won't matter what power source you go with it's going to burn fuel if running at 15-20 knots. Maybe the newer engines won't burn so much but the older ones sure will. Think you'll be lucky to get 1 mpg on a flat calm day. My buddies 36' Express Topaz just sucks the fuel and he only cruises at 8 knots.

Forgot to mention the Radovich owners which was only 32' and they hammered that thing running around (20 knots or more at times) and they were breaking out hundreds/person at the dock and that was when diesel was probably a buck and a quarter!

[Grain of Salt]

Just remember, over time, big boats stay at the dock more often than small boats(with regards to sportfishing)...you'll know your boat is too big to go fish when the wife brings a plant on board.

[smalldog]

Just to throw this in...
Most guides up in Alaska choose outboards.
They buy an extra and throw it in the garage.
If your diesel breaks down, you may lose days or weeks of fishing ..waiting for parts and doing the repair.
If you have an outboard. Just swap it out with the spare and dont loose any fishing time.
After two years they trade them in for new ones.
That's where you get good deals on used motors.
Some of them have very little hours on them for what you can pick them up for.
Also, worth the shipping cost to get a two year old motor with low hours for less than half what you would pay down here.

[Tuna Dog]

A lot of good comments...I've been shopping boats and my next boat will most likely have a flybridge or tuna tower. I've ran my buddies 42' and when your docking it definitely makes things easier when you can see all the way around. It also gives you more visibility when looking for birds or other things when your up off the water a little ways.
His 42 foot Chris Craft has 454 gas engines and he gets 1 MPG running 17 knots. The boat will run 30 knots but it guzzles fuel pretty good. Let me tell you 30 knots on a boat that big is flat hauling.
I fished on my buddies 31 Cabo and at 19-21 knot cruise it also got 1 MPG. The diesels will last longer before replacement and will also cost about twice as much but right now gas is cheaper than diesel when filling the tanks. I personally like diesels in big boats and outboards on boats up to 32'
Both boats have similar deadrise and the 42 footer is definitely a smoother ride but size does have some advantages and as mentioned when it's rough out there most people don't like getting beat up and stay at the dock.
The 42 footer happens to be for sale as he's replaced it with a 46'. It's about $80k..if interested send me a pm and I'll hook you up with him.

[colbachlaw]

I currently have my first flybridge boat, and I can't ever see buying another boat without one.

The visibility is fantastic and you always have a great view of your spread. I see a lot more jumpers with my eyes 10' above the waterline.

I bought a boat with a lower station and thought I would use it alot. I hardly ever use it because the visibility is not so great and I like to be out in the sun.

I don't know if it effects the ride that much, as I have been able to fish and run in 9' seas. It does roll a bit, but in the worst conditions I have fished in, I could still run 18 knots. The only time I don't like a flybridge is when I am fishing with just one crewmember, as it is a pain going up and down the ladder everytime I hook a fish.

If you are going to put a lot of hours on the boat and keep it for a long time, diesels are the way to go. If you are not going to keep the boat for a long time, the additional costs of diesels is hard to justify, as the extra $20-40K buys a lot of gas. Boat prices are really down right now, so you should be able to buy a nice used diesel convertible for a little over $100k.

There is a good gas v diesel article on www.yachtsurvey.com

Mike C

[Reelentless]

The cost of fuel is a relatively small cost to owning a big boat. If you are concerned about fuel costs, reconsider buying a big boat.

Even with diesels, I only get 1.5-2 mpg at cruise, and my boat isnt that big. Trolling I can get up to 6. Last summer diesel was about 50 cents a gallon cheaper at the Newport marina. A trip to Tuna Town (about 50 miles out) and back, plus trolling all day we burned about 90 gallons of diesel. A gas boat with small blocks would burn double that. My boat only holds 165 gallons so I would have had to pack fuel. The fuel bill for the diesels was $270. If I had gas engines it would had been $630. Again, to justify the cost of diesel engines you need to use the boat A LOT.

Mike Colbach has a 35 Bertram with 454's I think. Maybe he will offer his opinion. I am pretty sure he wished he had diesels on some of those longer trips.

[CATCH AND EAT]

Shane with a boat that big I would think about diesel vs gas. Inboards for a boat of that size would be my preference. 34 and under I would take a look at the outboard setups. Never owned a diesel boat but I have had I/O's and now outboards. Love the outboards but again my boat is a 26. All a matter of choice. If you get a big boat like that then you should not have an engine house to worry about. Having outboards at that point just gets in the way.

[tomictime]

in the class of boat you are looking at, unless you go w a florida go fast w minimal beam ratio, you need BIG iron and no outdrives.

Sorry, Yes Volvo I/O's are great, but nothing is free, the extra mechanical complxity and inability to tilt clear of salt and more moving parts = higher costs and less reliability. Yes, I have owned I/B, O/B and I/O. Gas and Otto D. Never owned a rotary (ha)

re: jackshaft..great idea, about $4K as an option and gets you somewhat better hull balance (depends on the boat) and a walk around motor box. Also gets you even more moving stuff to maintain.

The 30' Grady is sweet w twin 250 F4- yamis. Hoghunter (Jeff) knows....

Hi tech hull layups..like the Ocean roamer 30/33' w twin D4's does not get 3 mpg. w a single D6-350 it barely clears 3 mpg as I recall.....

bring real fuel burn curves.

My F4-250 is 2.6-3.0 MPG pushing 6K hull at cruise speeds.26 +

oh and Mike is SOOOOOOOO right, better MPG allows us to hunt far and longer, every day is 140L for me in BC..no matter what I do....

[Ride Red]

Ocean Sport Roamer 30

PERFORMANCE DATA (FOR D4 260HP)

Idle 1 RPM 700 MPH 4.37 GPH .58 MPG 7.53 RANGE 2,259
Idle 2 RPM 700 MPH 5.98 GPH 1.02 MPG 5.86 RANGE 1,758

RPM 1000 MPH 7.36 GPH 2.04 MPG 3.61 RANGE 1,083
RPM 1500 MPH 10.47 GPH 5.79 MPG 1.81 RANGE 543
RPM 2000 MPH 17.14 GPH 9.4 MPG 1.82 RANGE 546
RPM 2500 MPH 31.05 GPH 13.6 MPG 2.28 RANGE 684
RPM 2700 MPH 31.63 GPH 14.5 MPG 2.18 RANGE 654
RPM 3000 MPH 36.69 GPH 17.2 MPG 2.13 RANGE 639
RPM 3200 MPH 39.68 GPH 19.7 MPG 2.01 RANGE 603
RPM 3300 MPH 40.48 GPH 21.9 MPG 1.82 RANGE 555
RPM 3600 MPH 44.85 GPH 28.2 MPG 1.59 RANGE 477

PERFORMANCE DATA (FOR SINGLE D6 350HP)

RPM 600 MPH 4.50 GPH 0.28 MPG 16.07 RANGE 4,821
RPM 1000 MPH 7.00 GPH 1.05 MPG 6.67 RANGE 2,000
RPM 1500 MPH 9.70 GPH 2.5 MPG 3.88 RANGE 1,164
RPM 2000 MPH 12.10 GPH 6.4 MPG 1.89 RANGE 567
RPM 2200 MPH 15.00 GPH 7.5 MPG 2.00 RANGE 600
RPM 2400 MPH 18.20 GPH 9.1 MPG 2.00 RANGE 600
RPM 2600 MPH 22.5 GPH 10.5 MPG 2.14 RANGE 643
RPM 2700 MPH 23.7 GPH 11 MPG 2.15 RANGE 646
RPM 2800 MPH 24.5 GPH 11.4 MPG 2.15 RANGE 645
RPM 3000 MPH 29.0 GPH 12.6 MPG 2.30 RANGE 690
RPM 3200 MPH 33.0 GPH 14.6 MPG 2.26 RANGE 678
WOT 3650 MPH 39.5 GPH 19.7 MPG 2.01 RANGE 602

Grady Express 305 w/twin 250 Yamaha 4-stroke

RPM MPH GPH MPG
1000 4.9 2.5 2.0
1500 7.1 3.8 1.89
2000 8.6 5.9 1.46
2500 9.7 8.7 1.11
3000 10.8 12.4 0.87
3500 15.7 15.8 0.99
4000 21.5 20.2 1.06
4500 32.8 25.1 1.31
5000 37.6 30.1 1.25
5500 42.2 36.8 1.15
6000 45.5 43.1 1.06

[backlash442]

The O.S. is an all around heavier boat so not sure the comparison is apples to apples. It's over 1100lbs heavier dry. Holds more fuel. Holds more water. However, it doesn't say what the weights were at testing. Interesting to see that the GW actually gains mpg as the speed increases up to a certain point. Problem is how often do you get to run a boat doing 30+ knots on the ocean? You'll also notice that the range is double with the diesel compared to the OB. Probably more so when you aren't running at 30+

Anyone out there owned an OB for 10 years or longer? How has it held up and how much weight are you pushing?

[colbachlaw]

Reelentless,

I spend way too much time thinking about repowering with diesels, but I just can't justify the cost.

I have talked to Cummins and Yanmar reps and it always ends up looking like $80K to get it done, and it would take 10 years for me to break even (although it would add $20-30K in resale value).

With our short season, it just didn't make sense for me to spend the extra $$, plus used diesels can be a big risk. When I grenaded my 454 last year, I was up and running with a new 454 in the boat a week later for under $10K. If a diesel had gone bang, my season would have been over, as I didn't have $25K laying around for a new engine.

Newer injected big blocks get around .8nm per gallon in my boat, whereas diesels would get around 1.1nm per gallon. I am getting around .6nm per gallon right now which means around 130-190 gallons per trip. With the big cost difference, injected big blocks are not a bad option.

When I factor in that my crew (most of whom own boats and know the costs) usually pick up a good chunk of my fuel bill, it really does not make sense to spend the extra dough. That being said, this is going to be my last gas boat, as when I step up to a 42', gas motors will not be an option.

Used diesels boats are pretty cheap right now, so if I had to do it over again and had the $$, I would go diesel and get a motor survey before I bought the boat. I guess this gives me a good excuse to buy a bigger boat in a couple of years.

Mike C

[Baxter]

One thing to figure in, with regards to initial costs relative to fuel expenses...

Right now, with fuel around $3.00/gallon, it may be hard to make a diesel pencil out to clear advantage. But do you expect prices to stay in this range? Where do you predict prices will be in 5 years? 10 years?

Fuel prices doubled over the last 5 years. Anybody want to wager they won't double in the next 5?

Do the same calculations at an average $6.00/gallon and see how things change. Fuel expense over the life of the engine, whether gasoline or diesel, can come to dwarf the original purchase price, even in a pleasure craft. So, at some price per gallon, the combined expenses of the diesel motor will clearly drop below the combined expenses of the gasoline motor.

I can remember 5 years ago when people would still buy a pickup truck with a big V-8 or V-10 gasser. Who wants one now?

Your mileage may vary.

[Onokai]

Tomictime said(you need BIG iron and no outdrives)-I agree with a 38-40 footer unless its a florida type speed boat-then go for 2-3 yami f350s
The straight shaft drive is the ticket in that class boat.
One thing know one has brought up and there is a good article in the current us boats mag about this is the cooling systems for inboards-That is a mantainance issue that you really need to address on inboards more than outboards. I assume you will give up easy trailabity with this hull as well. Good luck with the new boat. Mark

[Zodiac-Fisherman]

Bertrams ride well because they have a great hull design, they are solid and heavy.

With an express you can have a engine room with hydraulic rams. Which allows you to have a open engine room with the helm deck jacked up. You wont find that on a flybridge.

[Anthony1013]

We have been very happy with our Yanmar Diesel in our 28' Albin. Sure, it's not a rocket ship but quite often the water conditions off the Columbia don't allow for much more than a 18-20 knot cruise. The smell of the diesel is not a problem for me, especially if we are on the troll for TUNA! It is more prevalant at salmon speeds but I am always able to position myself in the cockpit away from the fumes. The range is amazing... we hold 192 gallons and typically burn about 50-60 gallons on an average tuna run to the 125 line. The cost of fuel is just that... it's the price of having fun! Diesel on the water has always been less than gas (red dyed diesel has no road tax in the price ) however the gap has shrunken recently. The cost of ownership has been very reasonable.... we are religious with the maintenance but I will tell you that Yanmar is very proud of their parts.

Good luck shopping and we can't wait to hear about the new addition!

Anthony
MadMoney

[fishbaja]

Nalu hit the nail right on the head.

[CATCH AND EAT]

One thing to keep in mind is that I think Shane is also wanting to sleep on this boat. With a wife and a couple of kids he's going to need some room.

Shane buy a nice 30 foot Roamer or Glacier Bay and purchase a beach house. There ya go.

[Two Fister]

Originally Posted by CATCH AND EAT

One thing to keep in mind is that I think Shane is also wanting to sleep on this boat. With a wife and a couple of kids he's going to need some room.

Shane buy a nice 30 foot Roamer or Glacier Bay and purchase a beach house. There ya go.

Bernie speaks the truth.

It's not like a 35-40 boat is going to be easily trailerable so you're going based out of one port. You've got plenty of folks on ifish that'll run you out of a different port if you want to see some different water or a charter will be a lot less than moving the boat up and down the coast. If you want to do a San Juans trip I think the cost of moving a big boat up there and back would be close to cost of renting a nice motoryacht from Anacortes Yacht Charters or one of the other rental companies. With a 30' boat you could still trailer it if you were really motivated to see another port.

Also having the boat be the base of operations is going to necessitate taking the family unit fishing with you regardless of the weather or their interest. You're essentially taking the house with you every time you head out fishing. Where are they are going to go when you go out on a rough day? Maybe the outlet malls!?!?! You're into the cost of a beach house right there.

TF

[Commish_3]

I have built hundreds of fishing vessels and yachts with diesel engines. Last season I built two 32 foot charter vessels for Alaska which had twin 250hp Suzuki outboards. They ran fast and were a good choice for those vessels. I have a 36 foot Trojan with twin Cat engines that I use for ocean fishing. On a vessel of that size, I would reccommend diesel engines. If the diesels are taken care of, they will outlast several sets of outboards.

[tomictime]

....I never meant to say that the Grady w 2 X f4-250's would get the same milage as the Roamer..my point was few Diesels exceed 3 mpg in hulls this size.
oh and the 30' is a sweet boat

[5-Cents]

Thanks for all the input guys! I really appreciate all the well thought out comments!

If/when this happens I know that a boat is never what would be considered a "good" investment if you are looking at it in pure $$$ but can be a priceless addition when the investment is in your family and friends and spending quality time togther having fun - you cant ever put a price on that!

[KeyWest]

Originally Posted by CATCH AND EAT

One thing to keep in mind is that I think Shane is also wanting to sleep on this boat. With a wife and a couple of kids he's going to need some room.

Shane buy a nice 30 foot Roamer or Glacier Bay and purchase a beach house. There ya go.

Be carefull when buying a "family" boat. I've found that when it's nice out, the family wants to go cruising - looking at houses along the water, etc. When it's poor out and unfishable, the family will tell you - you can go fishing this weekend.

[Nalu]

I completely concur on the right boat and a beach house.

The novelty of the family staying aboard a boat in the winter will quickly wear off. Staying at your beach house in December is a treat and a welcome thing. A boat is not a substitute.

Having the family at the beach house while you go place or check the crab pots then return home...

Going fishing for 2 hours then returning to the couch and the monopoly game or jigsaw puzzle...

Fishing with 3 good friends and having the wife and kids come from the house to meet you at the dock with a boat full of fish........ Does it get better?

The siren lure of the big boat is certainly understandable. Many are called.........then they got beach houses.....

The beach house it the best boat investment I've ever made.

[Pau Hana]

I went back and forth before I purchased my current boat- gas won out over diesel. Eventually I'd like to end up with one of the larger cat hulls w/ diesels- 28 to 30'.

ProKat had a 28' model with twin 1.7 Merc diesels that carried 220 gallons of fuel, and had a range of about 1200 miles at 28 knots

[tomictime]

me too brutha''..me tooooo, they make lots of new boats every year, no more new waterfront having both is a well appreciated dream ))

Originally Posted by Nalu

I completely concur on the right boat and a beach house.

The novelty of the family staying aboard a boat in the winter will quickly wear off. Staying at your beach house in December is a treat and a welcome thing. A boat is not a substitute.

Having the family at the beach house while you go place or check the crab pots then return home...

Going fishing for 2 hours then returning to the couch and the monopoly game or jigsaw puzzle...

Fishing with 3 good friends and having the wife and kids come from the house to meet you at the dock with a boat full of fish........ Does it get better?

The siren lure of the big boat is certainly understandable. Many are called.........then they got beach houses.....

The beach house it the best boat investment I've ever made.

[Short Fetch]

It sounds like you are leaning towards a larger heavy displacement boat and I think realistically your only option will be twin diesel. I would not hesitate to go with i/o's as long as they are volvo penta duo props. Straight inboards would be my next choice as they are bulletproof if not a little less efficient. One thing to remember when comparing fuel burns, is that all manufacturer supplied data is with a relatively unladen vessel. On the other hand most of the data from forum member vessels will be at "fighting weight" and will be more accurate. If you did decide to stay around 33 feet and up to 16000 lbs displacement, I would not hesitate to go with a single diesel as long as it was 350 hp or larger. Just one mans opinion. I would recommend you listen to all then research and decide for yourself. Tight lines, Osprey

[tomictime]

..good advice..and..the venerable Volvo D6 now comes in 370 HP

Originally Posted by osprey@wavecable.c

It sounds like you are leaning towards a larger heavy displacement boat and I think realistically your only option will be twin diesel. I would not hesitate to go with i/o's as long as they are volvo penta duo props. Straight inboards would be my next choice as they are bulletproof if not a little less efficient. One thing to remember when comparing fuel burns, is that all manufacturer supplied data is with a relatively unladen vessel. On the other hand most of the data from forum member vessels will be at "fighting weight" and will be more accurate. If you did decide to stay around 33 feet and up to 16000 lbs displacement, I would not hesitate to go with a single diesel as long as it was 350 hp or larger. Just one mans opinion. I would recommend you listen to all then research and decide for yourself. Tight lines, Osprey

[Short Fetch]

Hey Tomictime. What size is that Almar of yours and what kind of power? Nice ride. Do you ever fish Nootka? I figure with a handle like Tomictime you must know Cameron and Katherine. Osprey

[Hoghunter]

Shane, good luck in your pursuit of a new boat. There's lot's of good advice on here about all the different boats and engines available.

I can maybe give a little advice as someone who has a similar family situation as yours. I have a wife and two kids. They like to go on the boat and do a little fishing. But they enjoy the cruising, anchoring, harbor hopping and town visiting more than the actual fishing. When I went about getting my current boat (Grady 305 Express) I looked at something that could fit most of their needs for the frills and cruising amenities and meet my needs for a good hard core fishing boat. I also wanted a boat that was trailerable so that I can visit far away ports without having to traverse rough ocean conditions to get there. The family really doesn't like the rough conditions.

I think 30' is about the maximum size if you want a boat that is trailerable without a great deal of hassle. If you plan to strictly cruise and fish in your home region which I presume is the Columbia river and Oregon coast then a 33' to 38' boat would fit the bill.

When we want to all go on a cruise and be gone for a week then most of the time we end up spending half the nights in a lodge at one of the marina's along the way as the boat get's a little cramped for the kids. So there's lot's of variables here but in the end you need to get a boat that fit's your desires and will keep you and the family happy.

If you ever want a ride in the Puget Sound on a 305 Express give me a holler. I would be more than happy to oblige.

[tomictime]

24'..when it grows up it wants to be Hoghunters' GW 305..

Yes..but i fish North of Nootka.

and I do know of them..

Originally Posted by osprey@wavecable.c

Hey Tomictime. What size is that Almar of yours and what kind of power? Nice ride. Do you ever fish Nootka? I figure with a handle like Tomictime you must know Cameron and Katherine. Osprey

[sherwin]

http://hf-boats.com/

[Chrome Bumper]

That size puts you in diesel v drive or direct drive. Gas is an option if you won't be putting on a lot of hours.