Training a Lab for Upland

Threemuch · 01-09-2008, 07:05 AM

My lab is working out great for waterfowl, and I am very happy with that. I don't do alot of upland, but I would like my dog to not be completely worthless when I get the chance.

Is there specific training for upland? Or do you just let the dog work, keeping them close? I have been working on teaching the dog to quarter, but other than that, I really don't know what to add?

onstep · 01-09-2008, 07:15 AM

Use your handling skills from running blinds. They get the idea pretty quick from there. 3 or 4 trips and she should have it. Biggest thing I see is dogs working to far out and to quickly.
Before you go do some T work and she'll be fine.

Hunt'nFish · 01-09-2008, 07:35 AM

I 100% AGREE with that!

When training up Chance I was pretty intimidated about bring a "green rookie" out in the marsh with some of the fine dogs many of my Ifish buddies have. So I really worked the honoring and handling drills into the ground. I was insistant about it as well, to a extreme perhaps.
But the result was a dog that handled very well.

SO fast forward to this past pheasant season....Chance & I joined BillC & Jimbo and I wasn't sure what to expect from Chance. Well the 1st day produced no birds. Chance was confused and doubting that there were any dead ducks to be found out there. But he still zigged & zagged per my casting.
Second trip he's getting this zig-zag stuff down, now he thinks this is some new game. He's right. Fresh bids in the area, lots of birdy scents everywhere, soon Bill's dog Sparky jumps a bird and Chance see all this go down. AHHHH Those are cool, I'm sure he's thinking to himself. A little while later Chance gets his chance, a double. "AHH...these ARE cool birds, I get it!"

Upland was no real big leap for him. We are no experts at it by any means, but we had fun and he did fine.

So, Kurt, I'm sure Lucy will do fine. Just work the casting drills over the summer and you'll both be good to go.
Hunt'nFish

PS: Oh Kurt on more trick to help. Rope toy and scent.
We go for a walk around the neighborhood with my girls. I can't remember who told me this trick but you put a little scent on a rope toy, and hide it. (I have the girls hide it up ahead of us.) Walk the route and cast her left & right back & forth and she'll find it. This conditions her to obey the casting because each time she finds the toy her trust in you builds. Your not just casting her back & forth w/o reward.

Threemuch · 01-09-2008, 07:44 AM

That's good news, since handling for blinds is this spring/summer/fall's project. She gets the basics now, but needs plenty of reinforcement and work.

ORhunter · 01-09-2008, 08:41 AM

No dog learns to hunt without experience. It's not something you go out and train for. Taking a retriever from the duck blind to the fields is a whole new ball game for the dog. Fetching is all about sight retrieving or handling for the retrieve. Hunting is all about the dog learning to use the nose. You'll need to understand the dog will not produce a lot of birds while learning it has a nose so accept this. Once the nose is discovered, you can work on range etc. The dog should pick up on quartering in it's own so just be patient. Doing some drags with dead birds or hot dogs will help the nose work.

llama77 · 01-09-2008, 09:50 AM

Your dog already knows how to use its nose. It searches for bumpers and unless your a way better shot than most of us, has probably had to hunt some cripples.

It will instantly recognize the scent of a game bird as somthing that needs to be hunted. Once it figures out youll shoot the pheaasants or chukars it finds it will be a done deal.

It will be the easiest thing for your dog to transition too. Its a natural thing for them to hunt. Nothing magic about it. Take that dog hunting and have fun. Use the retriever skills where applicable.

It will be more about the number of birds found during a trip than the number of trips.

James in Idaho · 01-09-2008, 10:17 AM

The last few years I've hunted far more upland than waterfowl with my chessie. I think the most important things you need are a almost rock solid whistle "sit" and a place to train on birds. When the little beastie ranges out too far you whistle sit 'em until you catch up, same goes when they are chasing a runner. They learn the correct pace and distance pretty quickly. You can also use this to teach sit to flush if you want that. With enough birds they pick it up pretty quickly, so don't overlook shooting preserves. I'd recommend someone else to do the gunning at first so you can concentrate on the dog.

twolabs · 01-09-2008, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Threemuch

My lab is working out great for waterfowl, and I am very happy with that. I don't do alot of upland, but I would like my dog to not be completely worthless when I get the chance.

Is there specific training for upland? Or do you just let the dog work, keeping them close? I have been working on teaching the dog to quarter, but other than that, I really don't know what to add?

i would go see marie at estacada bird farm and make sure the dog is birdie i've hunted with "master hunter" dogs that could care less about uplands and never put a bird up,that i saw.

twolabs · 01-09-2008, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Threemuch

My lab is working out great for waterfowl, and I am very happy with that. I don't do alot of upland, but I would like my dog to not be completely worthless when I get the chance.

Is there specific training for upland? Or do you just let the dog work, keeping them close? I have been working on teaching the dog to quarter, but other than that, I really don't know what to add?

packer · 01-09-2008, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Threemuch

My lab is working out great for waterfowl, and I am very happy with that. I don't do alot of upland, but I would like my dog to not be completely worthless when I get the chance.

Is there specific training for upland? Or do you just let the dog work, keeping them close? I have been working on teaching the dog to quarter, but other than that, I really don't know what to add?

The big difference hunting with a lab versus a pointer is keeping the dog close enough so when he flushes a bird you can get off a shot . I used a check cord made to the length i wanted the dog to hunt out in front then we spent a lot of time just walking with the cord hooked up . After that we started use a drag bird while hooked up to the cord . After the dog figures out what you want him to do they usually progress pretty fast .

twolabs · 01-09-2008, 12:35 PM

get some pen raised birds pull the flight feathers out release them in a grassy field and see if your dog can find them and bring them back. when she does that then get a e-collar to keep her close.

Tilla · 01-09-2008, 06:47 PM

Teaching a lab to trail I feel is the key.
PM me if you want to train for this, a 15 minute intro does wonders, wingclipped running birds are helpful.
Also trailing fun can be had with a stick, string and dead bird of choice. Drag the wet bird from your front door and hide it in the nieghbors junipers, best done at night to reduce dependence on eyesight. Always set up the trail downwind.

billc_sbio · 01-09-2008, 07:11 PM

I'd add that it's good to teach your dog (Flusher) to quarter, while staying WITHIN RANGE.

To do this successfully, your dog does have to already be trained to obey the hand and whistle signals for "Over" (left & right) as well as "Come" to your whistle.

Then I use a Check Cord ~50' long (a horse training "lunge line", which is a very pliable flat nylon strap line works very well for this as it's very compliant and also lighter weight and eaisier on the hands than a conventional check cord) and let my dogs out on this and start off by giving them an "Over" command in one direction, then as they are about to hit the end of the line in one direction, give them 2 toots on my whistle and give them the "Over" command in the other direction.

The dogs pick up on this very quickly, and in no time will just change direction on the 2 toots without any hand signals.

Running them this way for several sessions on the line helps define their working range.

Then I take them off and repeat this without any line. If/when they get too far out, I whistle them back in.

My own dogs have been trained with the command, "Hunt" and they know that when I give them this command they're are free to go out in front and quarter and look for birds.

This can be expanded, and if the dog handles well and learns to do it, this quartering can be increased to go back and forth, across a line of hunters, say 3 or 4 online.

Various dogs seem to differ in how well they handle this. My current dog is pretty good for 1 hunter on either side of me, but really likes to stay close and hunt for ME. However I've had other dogs that were good for 2-3 hunters on either side (which, I think is ideal).

ogrejager · 01-10-2008, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hunt'nFish

PS: Oh Kurt on more trick to help. Rope toy and scent.
We go for a walk around the neighborhood with my girls. I can't remember who told me this trick but you put a little scent on a rope toy, and hide it.

I think that was me, Mike, unless you heard it twice.

Vade and I played that game inside the house a lot, too. I would have friends over and tell them to hide the toy, then tell Vade to find it. That was fun.

To stay on topic, basically, you've already got the good advice. If your dog gets too far ahead, pull him back with the "come" or "here" that s/he is already familiar with. Then use the "over" or whatever you use to change directions.

My final suggestion--LOTS of birds/time in the field. Everybody that I know that has a lab can tell me the day the dog figured out what the "game" was. They all took days in the field.