Poaching poll

[sunshinefisherman]

I am interested in what you folks mean when you say "poaching."
I think we call all agree that all of these items are both illegal and unethical but do they rise to the level of poaching?

If you vote for "all violations" please make that your only choice.

[lor]

:lurk:

[skein]

I'm kinda with lor on this one. Driving illegally is not poaching. Even shooting across a road, while illegal, is not poaching.

Were you trying for subtle shades-of-gray?

Skein

[sunshinefisherman]

Originally Posted by skein

I'm kinda with lor on this one. Driving illegally is not poaching. Even shooting across a road, while illegal, is not poaching.

Were you trying for subtle shades-of-gray?

Skein

Yes, I am curious to see what violations are more socially acceptable (or unacceptable) than others.

My opinion is that if you have a tag for the time, date and game management unit, that it is a violation, not poaching. However there might be extreme cases involving the taking of game that rise to that level. What do you think?

[Trick]

Hopefully this doesn't turn into a flame post, but I like it to speeding. I have car, insurance and a valid license to operate the vehicle. I speed and am cited for such. I get a ticket, pay a fine and keep on trucking. Now, if i wasn't licensed and insured, they should take my car and suspend my rights to getting a license in the near future.


Doing all those things listed like shooting across the road or riding in a closed area is not poaching as long as you have a valid tag and are hunting during legal days and hours. Doesn't make it right, but it's not poaching to me....more of an infraction.

Poachers are the guys that go out with the willfull intent to break the law. No tag/license, during the off-season, after dark, etc...

Another way to look at it. I have a valid tag and I'm hunting in a valid unit during valid shooting hours. I shoot a buck on the private side of a fence. Am I a "poacher" or a "trespasser"? I think the latter.

[Old Coot]

I consider unlawful ATV use or driving on closed roads just the same as using a rifle in bow season. It is a prohibited method of hunting and therefore, in my book, poaching.

It is a premeditated willful breaking of the game laws giving the offender a distinct advantage over real hunters who abide by the rules. I do not consider poachers of any stripe to be hunterss. They are game shooters. There is a difference.

Cheating is cheating, no matter how finely you parse it.

OC

[woolybuggerboy]

Originally Posted by Old Coot

I consider unlawful ATV use or driving on closed roads just the same as using a rifle in bow season. It is a prohibited method of hunting and therefore, in my book, poaching.

It is a premeditated willful breaking of the game laws giving the offender a distinct advantage over real hunters who abide by the rules. I do not consider poachers of any stripe to be hunterss. They are game shooters. There is a difference.

Cheating is cheating, no matter how finely you parse it.

OC

[Beginners luck]

Game violations and poaching in my book are 2 different things.
If your state requires a certain amount of hunter orange, and you dont wear it. Is that poaching? I think its a game violation. Just an example. You shoot a deer ON my property? I dont care if you have a tag or not....If I didnt give you permission, thats poaching! Taking an animal when/where its not permitted? Poaching. I think if you are a licenced hunter with a tag for the appropriate area/time and you dont follow the regulations in the process of harvesting an animal....Game violation. Just my thoughts.....

[jokester]

Originally Posted by Old Coot

I consider unlawful ATV use or driving on closed roads just the same as using a rifle in bow season. It is a prohibited method of hunting and therefore, in my book, poaching.

It is a premeditated willful breaking of the game laws giving the offender a distinct advantage over real hunters who abide by the rules. I do not consider poachers of any stripe to be hunterss. They are game shooters. There is a difference.

Cheating is cheating, no matter how finely you parse it.

OC

I'll respectfully disagree with you here. I agree with the above statement that game violations/illegal acts and poaching are two totally different things. Now, some of you will disagree with me on this next statement (and I am IN NO WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM condoning illegal acts) but technically, until an animal is killed, it's a violation!

Look at it this way, if someone's out hunting on an ATV, however, they're riding in a closed off area...yes, that's illegal. Illegal in the fact that they're riding in a closed area! If they have a valid tag for that area, the only law they're breaking is the one with the ATV. If they had been on foot, there would be no problem.

There is a difference.

-jokester

[fiddler]

I agree with the last two posts. Unless a game animal or fish is TAKEN or POSSESSED illegally, I would think it's a violation and not a "poaching".

[Old Coot]

And I respectfully disagree with the last two posts.

Once the animal or fish is illegally TAKEN it is "poached." Past tense.

ATTEMPTING to illegally take is "poaching."

One who does either is a poacher, aka game thief, cheat, et al. They are neither hunter nor sportsman.

[jokester]

Originally Posted by Old Coot

They are neither hunter nor sportsman.

I will, however, 100% agree with you on this

-jokester

[SHLEPROCK]

A wildlife violation is a minor violation
A wildlife crime is a misdemeanor crime

[ehunter]

Yep and the wildlife crime should become a minor. I think that the value of the animal ought to be part of the fine. After all we as part owners (stock holders) of the state should be paid when our resources are stolen...

Originally Posted by SHLEPROCK

A wildlife violation is a minor violation
A wildlife crime is a misdemeanor crime

[weekender]

Originally Posted by Old Coot

I consider unlawful ATV use or driving on closed roads just the same as using a rifle in bow season. It is a prohibited method of hunting and therefore, in my book, poaching.

That makes about as much sense as charging a person with attempted manslaugher for doing 65 in a 55.

If you kill an animal and you can not or do not affix the proper tag to it than that animal has been poached. People need to stop trying to make everything so complicated.

[gottafish]

funny how many guys are shooting guns out of the vehicals during the late archery hunt. State police were workin there butts off in the indigo unit!!

[SHLEPROCK]

Originally Posted by ehunter

Yep and the wildlife crime should become a minor.

I am not sure what you mean

I think that if an animal is taken during a crime they have set price to pay for the animal in addition to a fine.

[HntnFsh]

I think the poll is way to incomplete.Unless your only worried about certain areas of the laws.

To me.Shooting an animal and leaving it.(not harvesting) is poaching in the lowest form.But its not even mentioned.

Maybe I'm just not looking at the poll in the right context.

[nocatchem]

Rules are rules and breaking any law pertaining to wildlife in considered poaching. Too many people get away with it. I think if everyone saw it this way there would less of it going on today. In my area it seems that no one gives a ****about private property. I as far as Im concerned tresspassing even without a kill is a poaching violation.

[CamoHunter]

Originally Posted by Old Coot

I consider unlawful ATV use or driving on closed roads just the same as using a rifle in bow season. It is a prohibited method of hunting and therefore, in my book, poaching.

It is a premeditated willful breaking of the game laws giving the offender a distinct advantage over real hunters who abide by the rules. I do not consider poachers of any stripe to be hunterss. They are game shooters. There is a difference.

Cheating is cheating, no matter how finely you parse it.

OC

OC,

I also must disagree with your statement.
This past year, I mistakenly drove on a road that was closed. I just drove on it and did not stop to hunt. I was wrong and whether I knew it or not it was a violation. My bad.
But in my opinion it did not make me a poacher. If I went out to illegally take a game animal, different story,

CH

[ehunter]

I am sorry that is what I ment. Make the penalty large enough people will think twice.

Originally Posted by SHLEPROCK

I am not sure what you mean

I think that if an animal is taken during a crime they have set price to pay for the animal in addition to a fine.

[SHLEPROCK]

I think that just about any of these examples given would get a ticket for attempting to take wildlife with prohitted method.
That is a CRIME and carries a hefty fine.
Anyone using those methods would be better off to go buy a beef.

[coyote243]

if you break the law in anyway knowingly to take an animal its poaching! 100% fare chase only, in my eyes. I dont want any trophy that I know I had to cheat to get on my wall.

[ehunter]

Originally Posted by coyote243

if you break the law in anyway knowingly to take an animal its poaching! 100% fare chase only, in my eyes. I dont want any trophy that I know I had to cheat to get on my wall.

[woolybuggerboy]

I really has to do with INTENT. Using the closed road example: Unknowingly driving on a closed road is totally understandable if it was not well marked. Something like that wouldn't make someone a poacher. Using a vehicle to hunt from, or knowingly driving a closed road to gain illegal access is a different story.

[leadeyedbugger]

Poaching by definition is hunting or fishing illegally. So if you are breaking the law to hunt or fish you are poaching. Shooting from or across a road, hunting private property without permission, hunting illegally from ATV etc is all poaching by definition.

[lonewolf21]

I would have to agree that all the above listed things are not lawful, but poaching is take take game unlawfully. so yeah there is alot of gray area. Not having a license or tag. hunting with spotlights (for big game)taking more than one animal. these are poaching. the others are infractions and need to be delt with differently by law enforcement.

[nobrownline]

Doing anything wrong is poaching. Intent has nothing to do with it. If you are out driving wrecklessy and kill someone you did not entend to but are you not a murderer? You go to prision for manslaughter. Same with drinking and driving. Nobody entends to kill anybody but if all rules would have been followed nobody would be dead. Just because its game doesnt make it less serious. JMO

[traks44]

IMO this poll is far far far from complete, in which case we dont really no much more than before

Hunting on private land is only trespass 1, unless they have also killed game in which case it would be poaching.

Illegal ATV use? Loaded gun, behind locked gate, etc etc.

The topics are far to broad to leave us with any conclusive information besides the obvious fact that some people should not be allowed to make rules and regulations

[YoungBuck28]

using a rifle and shooting from the road during late bow season was mentioned. Youth seasons are going on at this time and i know parents who think thats the right way to introduce their kid to hunting because its easy to sit in a truck and shoot instead of actually hunting. luckily mine know better. also, what if a buck jumps out in front of you on the way to your hunting spot? does the fact that you took the three steps to the side of the road make it ethical?

[Abalone]

As an intransitive and transitive verb poaching means catch game illegally; to catch wild animals or fish illegally on public land or while trespassing on private land.

[Hunt'nFish]

Doing anything wrong is poaching. Intent has nothing to do with it.

I guess that makes me a poacher then.

Seriously, mistakes are made. It's how you handle it that matters in my opinion. BTW, the judge didn't consider my minor violation a poaching incident. Nor did it show up in the Sept 06 OSP Newsletter.

I did not vote. But I know poaching when I see it.
Intent has EVERYTHING to do with it.

Say I shoot two pintails (a bull sprig and then a hen), do I turn myself in?? I could. Or I could just not shoot one tomorrow or the rest of the week. And I should definately revisit the duck ID books and learn the subtle differances between a pintail hen and a mallard hen. In fact I probably should just back off of hens all together. (Yes Rob, that is why I'm so shy of hens.)

How you handle a mistake is a big part of it.
Wasting game is the biggest sin of all in my mind. I will never pass judgement on the guy that takes it home, eats it and learns from that mistake.

How many of you have tossed a tag in the fire after an animal you know you hit got away?
I have, felt terrible about it. I screwed up, my animal got away, my loss but I'll not go out tomorrow and shoot another on that tag. No, I'll go spend the day tracking.

Did I mention.....How you handle a mistake matters in my book?
Hunt'nFish

[Wreckless]

Interesting discussion. I agree INTENT is the difference for me.

Before I say what I have to say, we've ALL made mistakes...."let he who is without sin, cast the first stone"..........Having said that.............

It's not "poaching" to drive a closed road. It IS "poaching" to hunt from a motor vehicle on a closed road. IMHO

If you shoot an animal for another person and they tag it you are a poacher.

If you shoot across a road to kill an animal, it was taken illegally (poached).

If you shoot an animal in the Santiam unit and tag it with your Willamette tag, it was poached.

If I shoot lead shot at waterfowl, I'm poaching.

It's amazing to me the people who are trying to justify INTENTIONAL illegal actions.

Again, I'm not trying to sound TOO judgemental, but if you INTEND to break the law to harvest an animal, you are a poacher.

OK, my soap box just collapsed from the weight, I'm done.

:lurk:

[Lefty]

Originally Posted by Beginners luck

Game violations and poaching in my book are 2 different things.
If your state requires a certain amount of hunter orange, and you dont wear it. Is that poaching? I think its a game violation. Just an example. You shoot a deer ON my property? I dont care if you have a tag or not....If I didnt give you permission, thats poaching! Taking an animal when/where its not permitted? Poaching. I think if you are a licenced hunter with a tag for the appropriate area/time and you dont follow the regulations in the process of harvesting an animal....Game violation. Just my thoughts.....

Perfect!

[coyote243]

So lets say im driving down a closed road and see some game. so i get out of the truck walk aways and harvest the game. Poaching or not?? or hows about to drive down a closed road to get downed game out? use a atv off raod? laws are not grey lines!! brake the law knowingly to take game...poaching!!! I wish we had more cops to enforce the people that think they make thier own rules and poaching fines were mesured in years in prison

[Beginners luck]

Some time ago, while DEER SEASON in the Santiam unit. Sitting on a BIG draw. I witnessed a man shoot a Cow Elk at the bottom of said draw. Poaching? OH YEAH! Then he proceeded to cut the backstraps out and then take off leaving the rest to waste.....MY BLOOD WAS BOILING! Spotting scopes are wonderful things. I got a VERY accurate description of him as well as vehicle make, model and licence #. I called a buddy that works for the Oregon State Police and called the T.I.P program from my cell and fortunately they caught up with him late that evening. I got a check from T.I.P. for his conviction. He got a steep fine, lost hunting priveledges for 4 yrs and they confiscated the rifle used. Or so I was told. Did he get what he deserved? Comments?

The positive note was that the remainder of the animal went to feed the homeless. Im OK with that part of it.

[sunshinefisherman]

Originally Posted by Old Coot

I consider unlawful ATV use or driving on closed roads just the same as using a rifle in bow season. It is a prohibited method of hunting and therefore, in my book, poaching.

It is a premeditated willful breaking of the game laws giving the offender a distinct advantage over real hunters who abide by the rules. I do not consider poachers of any stripe to be hunterss. They are game shooters. There is a difference.

Cheating is cheating, no matter how finely you parse it.

OC

Ok, so what if a person has a valid deer tag for the unit and everything else is legal but all he has is a sub legal caliber .17HMR for example. He takes and makes the back of the head shot and harvests the buck cleanly.

Poaching? Certainly no advantage here, just increased risk of wounding.

Ethical? Most would say not.

Violation, Yes.

[sunshinefisherman]

Originally Posted by Wreckless

OK, my soap box just collapsed from the weight, I'm done.

:lurk:

: laugh:

[Oregon-Jet]

Poaching

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Jump to: navigation, search
For other uses, see Poaching (disambiguation).

A seashell vendor sells seashells which have been taken alive from the water, killing the animal inside.


Poaching is illegal hunting or fishing. It may be illegal because:

• The game or fish is not in season, usually the breeding season is declared as the closed season when wildlife species are protected by law.
• The poacher does not possess a license.
• The poacher is illegally selling the animal or animal parts for a profit.
• The animal is being hunted outside of legal hours.
• The hunter used an illegal weapon for that animal.
• The animal or plant is on restricted land.
• The right to hunt this animal is claimed by somebody.
• The means used are illegal (for example, baiting a field while hunting quail, or using spotlights to stun or paralyze deer).
• The animal or fish is protected by law or that it has been listed as extinct animal or an Endangered Animal (see for example the Endangered Species Act for the USA)
• The animal or plant has been tagged by a researcher

It is currently estimated that the illegal wildlife trade is worth 10 billion US dollars.[citation needed]
Note that only wild animals can be poached. Stealing or killing domestic animals is theft ("cattle rustling"), not poaching.
Plant poaching is also on the rise. A prominent example is the removal of Ginseng [1] growing in the Great Smoky Mountains National Park. It is estimated that dried wild ginseng plants are worth more that $500 per pound on the black market.

[sunshinefisherman]

Originally Posted by Oregon-Jet

Poaching

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Oh, well then, it must be true if it's on Wikipedia.