Coho fast water techniques?

[SteelheadBum2]

I am going to join the coho flyfishing challenge this season, and I was wondering what are the techniques one uses for fast riffle water coho fishing?

sinking line
floating line with split shot
indicator
type of flies
colors?

I will be mostly fishing on the Sandy as usual.

Thanks!

[North-west steel]

Three words indicator , cabalero eggs!

Steel'

[AndyK]

Originally Posted by SteelheadBum2

II was wondering what are the techniques one uses for fast riffle water coho fishing?

sinking line
floating line with split shot
indicator
type of flies
colors?

When fishing runs and riffles, I have been most successful using a sink tip line. The type of sink tip (Intermediate, type 3, etc) depends on speed and depth of water.

I nymph with a floating line (with or without an indicator) in smaller waters. There are occasions when I will nymph pocket water in larger rivers. For coho, I rarely use an indicator.

My best flies for swinging are the Purple Angel, Purple Shrimp or a dark soft hackle. My favorite colors are Purple and hot Pink.

[VO2Max]

Originally Posted by SteelheadBum2

I am going to join the coho flyfishing challenge this season, and I was wondering what are the techniques one uses for fast riffle water coho fishing?

sinking line
floating line with split shot
indicator
type of flies
colors?

I will be mostly fishing on the Sandy as usual.

Thanks!

I had great success on the Sandy using both a floating line with spit shot/nymphing technique as well as a sink-tip attached to a butt section on my floating line with a 3-4" leader. Usually used a Purple Angel, Coho Candy and both seem to do the trick. I am not as seasoned an angler as the other gentlemen are surely, but have sure had alot of fun using the above gear. Have fun and I wish you the best of luck! Have any coho started to show yet? I am in Bellingham, WA now but am planning a trip back to OR this early fall to fly fish the Sandy and to Elk hunt the Minam unit. Gotta love it when the coho are in! ERIK

[rob allen]

most important is to make sure the fish are actually taking your fly coho in fast water are usually panting ( opening and closing their mouths as they flare their gills)... Most of the coho flyfishing i have observed in person and seen advocated on the web has been flossing aka snagging..

just be careful and ethical...

[SteelheadBum2]

No way to stop that Rob. In fast water, the fish just gets on the hook really, no detecting a bite or nothing because its such a fast drift. However, I find that I never encounter alot of foul hooked fish when I drift the fast water, unlike in the holes, so that leads me to believe that they bite more in the fast water than anything.

And yes I watched a flyfisherman floss fish with a indicator last year, so there is no total ethical method that will result in 100% non flossed fish.

Thanks for the info gentlemen!

[SteelheadBum2]

Erick, the coho usually always show after the first big rain of september. Sometimes as early as September 9th according to some of my catch logs.

It should be off the chain this year with all the fish being caught in the salt this year.

[mgdfly]

If you qwnt to reduce the # of foul-hooked fish,tie your flies with a 25# mono weedguard, just like you would on a bass fly. I've been doing this for many years on some Chum, Coho, and Chinook flies, and use them anytime fish are stacked together and there is a high probability of snagging fish. Trust me, the guard will NOT make any difference when a fish actually TAKES your fly, but WILL slide across the back and fins without snagging up. Many times, a fish will hammer the fly as it slides over the fish next to it. Egg patterns do work sometimes, but i prefer to use bright, flasy patterns strippedrapidly thru a pod of fish in faster water, or bright maribou patterns with short pauses between quick strips in slower pools. there are occations where a small dark pattern with a bright butt will work, but it seems to take darker fish that have been in the river a while. Bright, fresh Coho love to chase things moving FAST, the're used to chasing baitfish. That's why spinners work so well on them. Nothing quite like watching a chrome bullit chase your fly across the river and inhale it right in front of you!

[Steelie Mike]

Last year when the salmon were in my local rivers, I decided to try circle hooks. Although I did not catch any salmon with them, I did manage to catch a steelhead in the same pool that had old salmon in it. I know a fellow Ifisher who uses them in Herman and tidal water for salmon with success too. They will reduce snagging and flossing fish.

[Matthewc]

I heard a rumor that the ODFW and secret outside the wire biologists are hard at work engineering a coho strain for the rivers east of the coast range that will readily accept a fly of any color or sort so that anglers fishing the Clackamas river would no longer have to feel "unethical" while fishing for coho salmon....

It could be said that those fish are better off left for the gkill nets and the Astoria area anglers but the biologists have not been able to figure out why they can not get the coho to turn around and head back down to the mouth for an additional month after they have passed the longview area. They are considering asking the California Sea Lions for additional help in turning the salmon around for one more pass. It was not cleat yet if they would then keep the season open several weeks longer for a larger harvest of the surplus coho if the lions could infact turn them around with brute force and intimidation.

Until the secret outside the wire bios champion their goal you are being asked to please stay home and watch re-runs of "Good Times" on your tv and not fish the river as it may be untethical. You are free however to take your kids and your cameras down to the river to watch as 12,000 hatchery surplus coho splash around and die in the upper reachs of Eagle creek for the first 2 miles below the hatchery after they shut the gates because theres just to many to deal with... Umm they might hit some eggs though, maybe, well depends....You might try the eyeFISH "egg flossing" method. I hear tail that method is both ethical and legit. Yes it may be possible to do that with a fly rod but remember the moment you add a split shot you once again become unethical so stick with the sinking tip on this one kids.

When walking the thin grey line [fishing the Clackamas river for coho] it is always important to ask the hatchery coho you just caught if it was indeed his intent to bite the fly or if he has any complaints that you may have force fed him. In the event this happens and he sais "I just visited the dentist and do not need my teeth cleaned by the likes of you"!" you are asked to release him unharmed and move on with your life...

Anything beyond this may require the use of a padded room

[SilverFly]

First I want to thank Rob for his reminder and respectful approach to this touchy subject that pops up about this time every year.

I will also be the first to admit that coho are flossed, - both intentionally and incidentally. However, I do not think it happens nearly as often incidentally as many believe, and I think that many "intentionally" flossed fish, - actually took the offering. I believe that the ethics lie in the intent of the sportsman. And in a hatchery harvest fishery where the fish should be removed from the river there really isn't an ethical dilemma to keeping a fish that was legally hooked, whether or not it took the offering willingly (so long as the angler was trying to fish legit).

As for flossing coho in fast water, I disagree that it happens as much as some people think. The reason being is that the best way to fish in fast, pocket type water is by nymphing, either with or without an indicator. This type of presentation is vertical in nature (by definition) and therefore presents the line in a manner which is extremely inefficient at hanging up in a salmon's mouth.

For once, let's actually examine the physics involved by looking at the problem in 3 dimensions.

First let's define what kind of a "flossing target" a coho mouth actually looks like:



When viewed in 3D, it is readily apparent that the only presentation that effectively presents the line in a manner to hang up in a salmon's mouth in a horizontal presentation across the current:



Just my two cents...

[Meskel]

Im confused – growing up I was always told to floss at least once a day.

[wctc1]

I have a couple of fast water reaches I wander, and wonder about ...

Bought a new 8 weight rod -- dang, hate to say it, carbon based, madril formed -- and medium sink line for this year's frustrations.

Just don't think a split shot does the job, unless of course, it's the size of a cannon ball, etc ...

Also have some "new-to-me" colorful fly designs right out of the old books.

Should be interesting, but since I'm just an old country boy, it don't take much.

J Hector

Ps: those is the faces of two of my alleged fishin' buds.

[Steelie Mike]

I think it is easy to see that Guy aka Silverfly has really thought this one out .

[rob allen]

"Bright, fresh Coho love to chase things moving FAST, the're used to chasing baitfish. That's why spinners work so well on them. Nothing quite like watching a chrome bullit chase your fly across the river and inhale it right in front of you!"

amen to that

I grew up site fishing to summer steelhead on the Washougal and as a greedy teenager i would sometimes fish too long for one fish and i can say without any doubt at all if you dead drift over a fish long enough ( or a pod of fish) you WILL eventually foul hook them.. if you are on a pod of fish make a few casts if they don't hit move on. continuing to bang on the same fish for a hundred casts is nothing less than harassment in my opinion.

it's EASY to foul hook fish in the mouth.. floating line sinking line split shot no split shot indicator no indicator it doesn't matter.

again I'll reiterate something i have said many times 20 years ago this never would have been an issue people knew what was ethical and what was not and didn't stand people trying to pass of snagging as ethical angling. The fact that this has become commonplace really shows how our sport has deteriorated to appease those who need their egos stroked and those who's need for instant gratification keeps them from learning how to really fish.

[Matthewc]

rob was flossed and released as a child.



Just Joking rob : )



Keep up the word man, Peace

[SteelheadBum2]

Originally Posted by rob allen

The fact that this has become commonplace really shows how our sport has deteriorated to appease those who need their egos stroked and those who's need for instant gratification keeps them from learning how to really fish.

I would not say its more common place now than yesterday. My grandpa has been fishing since the 50s, and he says it was just as bad, with MUCH more snagging than anything. He said he even saw people pitchfork fish!

I really only see flossing taking place during coho season and up in alaska for sockeye. And the people who are doing the flossing were the same people I saw fishing for steelies and nooks legitmatly months back. Sockeye and clack Coho hardly bite! Only time I could get the sockeye to bite was when they were colored up and angry, or they were not moving. Coho only bite when they are on the move and very fresh which leaves hardly any prime time available to hit the rivers when they are on the bite. Coho also seem very suseptable to be flossed since they tend to hold in tightly packed schools, and have huge hooked mouths that catches line easliy.

I hope they change out the clack coho stocks to coastal coho stocks that bite alot better. Natural selection has removed alot of the biting gene is seems. Up in alaska, coho bite 24/7 not matter how low and clear the rivers are or how dark they are.

[Jig]

Meskel...that's funny right there!

[Jig]

Rob Allen...

You are so right...they like it fast...

[SilverFly]

I grew up site fishing to summer steelhead on the Washougal and as a greedy teenager i would sometimes fish too long for one fish and i can say without any doubt at all if you dead drift over a fish long enough ( or a pod of fish) you WILL eventually foul hook them.. if you are on a pod of fish make a few casts if they don't hit move on. continuing to bang on the same fish for a hundred casts is nothing less than harassment in my opinion.

I also spent much of my degenerate youth sight fishing for steelhead on the Washougal, and I agree that, yes, if you dead drift over the same fish or pod of fish too long you will eventually foul hook one.

I also agree that Coho (at their best) love to chase bright flashy fast moving things, and when they are in that mood, they are among the greatest sport fish to be caught on a fly. However, they also respond in a much more subtle manner and will take a small offering very gingerly. I HAVE SEEN THIS MYSELF MANY TIMES, Coho will move a foot or maybe mere inches and pick off a dead drifted fly.

The common perception of Coho are aggressive, sight-oriented, feeders because they attack baitfish on or near the surface, - particularly as they near maturity as they pack on weight prior to the spawning migration. This "aggressive stereotype" has become so pervasive, some people find it hard to believe silvers can be taken with more subtle methods such as nymphing. However, Coho will, and do, feed heavily on smaller fare including various marine invertebrates such as euphasiids (krill), amphipods, crab larvae, etc.... Do some research on what kind of patterns and techniques are used for resident Coho in Puget Sound and it is more like reading about lake fishing for trout. Steelhead like Coho, sometimes strike very aggressively depending on their "mood" and how the fly is presented (large fly on the swing), - yet are more easily caught dead-drifting smaller patterns with a much more subtle take. If there is a reason why Coho are somehow "exempt" from similar behavior, I would like to hear it.

Nobody here is advocating harassing fish by pounding them on the head until they bite or are accidentally hooked. I like to fish pocket water for Coho because it is often the only water available to fish. Typically the fish are on the move in such water so you're rarely going to get more than a few casts at a given pod of fish anyway. The reality is that "moving on" to the next spot likely means going home for the day, - unless you want to crowd in somewhere else. It's not like staking out a prime spot in a run to wait for the next pod of fish to show up in a boulder lined slot.

I love to fly fish for sport, but I also love to eat salmon and I don't want to support non-selective commercial fishing by buying salmon. Like it or not, hatchery fish exist, and they need to be harvested. Until the day that hatchery runs are no more, I will slug it out with the masses, put the finest food God made on my family's table, - and enjoy myself anyway.

[SteelheadBum2]

Originally Posted by SilverFly

Until the day that hatchery runs are no more, I will slug it out with the masses, put the finest food God made on my family's table, - and enjoy myself anyway.

True that!


I am diff. going to slug it out in the fast water this year with the fly rod! So much more fun to fight a fish on one anyways...just gota put down that darn drift rod.

[woolybuggerboy]

video on coho fishing with the fly- http://www.************************....es/movies.html

awesome videos