Barry Bonds

[Super Fluke]

I hope Barry never gets to 756, he cheated he doesn't deserve the best record in all sports. I hope someone throws at him and hits his knee or elbow and breaks it so he can't play any more. In about 10 years, A-rod will have about 810 homers.

[sliverpicker]

Barry who?

[Pete]

Where does he fish?

[Ryan Pultz]

It would be nice to see everyone walk him or maybe hit him with a pitch or two I know I would not want to be the pitcher that gave him the hit rp

[fishncliff]

When and where has it been proven that he cheated.
He's been accused, but no decision handed down.
Right now I don't see any reason for him not getting the record.

[treebutcher]

barry will never out class a man such as Hammerin Hank!!

[Hogmaster]

Let's suppose Barry was juiced and the balls weren't.

Was Sammy juiced? McGuire? Who's to say A-Rod hasn't? It is sad that baseball turned such a blind eye, but what about the pitchers who Barry faced? Were they all clean?

It seems a ridiculous premise to say that he doesn't deserve it. If he juiced when they weren't checking or before they said it was illegal, so what (from a baseball perspective)? And if he did while it was, so must have many others. But it hasn't been proven.

Clean the sport up, but give him his due, because no matter what, the fact is he has hit the ball out of the park that many times.

And yes, I think he is a jerk. That has nothing to do with the record.

Oh, and BTW... If you were so talented you made it to the bigs, but not so talented that you could hit 35 or 40 homers in a season, and had a nagging hammy or sore shoulder, and someone told you you could recover more quickly and get quicker bat speed and more strength by taking a substance that wasn't tested for that could result in MILLIONS more for you and your family in your future, do you think you might be tempted?

I blame the players only to the extent that creative tests and management of the sport haven't kept pace with the risk/reward formula that people use to enrich their lives.
Really.
Because you just might have a different feeling if you walked in their shoes. No, not
Barry. The others you AREN'T talking about...

[Fast Water]

Originally Posted by Hogmaster

Clean the sport up, but give him his due

I might, juuuust might give a casual glance in his direction as soon as I see Pete Rose in the HoF.

The commissioner needs to hang for many reasons.

[baitslinger]

Hog, way to tell it like it is. I don't like the fact that Bonds most likely took steroids and he is not the most likeabe guy either. But, there is a lot more to hitting that many home runs than just taking steroids. The fact is that he is a great player. It is further compicated that for many years it was perfectly "legal" to take the drugs, and like hog says who knows what the pitchers have done?

It is impossible to really quantify how many more homers he may have gotten if he was guilty If he is proven guilty, I think he should have an asterisk behind the record or just take it away altogether. I do hope at some point that A-Rod or somebody just breaks it and is clean. That would end the controversy once and for all.

[Joe Schwab]

I agree with everything Hogmaster said. The league has had their head in the sand for years and they share in the problem. So do the Universities that turn a blind eye when a student athlete suddenly bulks up and adds 30-40 pounds of muscle. Gee how did that happen?

You don't just take steroids and go out and start smacking them out of the park. The talent level still has to be there.

And yes the fans too. Their expectations of athletes far exceed anything they themselves are capable of. College and Pro sports have become twisted. And you can bet it is spilling into the high schools.

[jimh]

MLB, could have done the right thing and kicked him out. They didn't, so they get the result they deserve. And the fans that pay to go to the games get what they deserve. In comparison, Pete Rose did nothing wrong. I don't even know how you can compare cheating for years compared to betting on a game that you aren't playing in.

I'm not a fan...can you tell.

[mandinga]

hundreds of players have juiced...especially players from barry's era.


yet...there is only one barry.

[PapaHog]

Berry is hitting against better pitchers than Hank yet berry will never get the respect he is do because of the steroids allegations.

I wish baseball would do what it takes to clean up the sport. Cycling and track and field could teach baseball a lesson. Drug testing and strict rules about performance enhancing drugs.

[Jaws]

Did steroids make Barry Bonds a better home run hitter? Maybe. But what it really did was prolong his caraer past the point when he should have retired. I'm guessing it added at least 7 to 8 years of peak homerun performance. Look at him without the juice. The mans a wreck! That should have happend years ago. And the record would have been safe.

[blackdog]

Hogmaster - I agree completely.

Now, I don't want Barry to break Hammerin' Hank's record. Not because he's been using performance enhancing drugs for years (and undoubtedly still is - there is NO test for growth hormone) but because he's been a #1, top notch stink hole for years. Alienates his teamates, looks out for himself, and is a jerk to the media. Give me a break. Racism, as some have claimed, also has nothing to do with this. He's a jerk and people don't often root for jerks.

I just want him to get it over with so we can quit hearing about it every 10 minutes. :frown:

[jvp]

if you watch the footage of the all-star game where they introduced the players and they walked across the dugout and then on to the field. everyone announce on the nl side high fived the adult on their way to the field. everyone but barry he stopped on the dugout and shook hands and spoke with 2 little girls. tells me he may not like us adults but he doesn't have a grudge against kids. baseball is no purest sport. spit balls nail files. amphetamine, cork bats, just to name a few so if bud tried ,till congress made him wake up, ignoring and profiting from these "sins of the players". also just as the commis was ruths friend when maris broke the single season record hense the asterick bud is a friend of hanks hense the coming asterick eh. just history repeating itself.

[B-RUN STEELIE]

He will get his record regardless, Hall of fame ??? I wouldn't vote for him. Baseball is ruined by the vary fact that are Yankees. Any sport thats unlimited check book is bogus.

[RichH]

I'm impressed by the number of people posting here that have the inside track that Barry absolutely, positively cheated. I wish I was that much of an insider.

Just because Barry's a jerk doesn't make him any less of a talented player. Ty Cobb was a notable jacka** and yet no question of him going to the hall of fame. Pete Rose should be there because of his accomplishments on the field.

[Hogmaster]

I think Charlie Hustle should be in the Hall. But even he has admitted he was hopped up - on amphetamines - during his playing years. Why should amphetamines be OK, ignored, as performance enhancers? Why should substantial use of substances during the 60s and 70s be ignored?

That's why this seems so absurd. Training regimens and better diets are an advantage early players did not have. Should records be asterisked for that too?

The bottom line is that if people are being paid for physical performance, then there will be motivation to gain an advantage. It is true in every sport - name one that hasn't had issues associated with it.


Is it criminal to "set up" the situation? Maybe, but who is going to pay someone millions for NOT being "as good as they can be"? I heard an interview with Dusty Baker the other day (on Bonds). He said sure, he suspected Barry was juicing. But what was he supposed to do about it? He wasn't there to watch over him 24/7. What Barry (or any other player) did or didn't do away from the field was not something the manager, owner or commish could do anything about. Especially because he said he didn't. Yes, the league has been slow to implement programs to make it harder to cheat. But, for example, with HGH it is still possible...

And there are millions of dollars involved. So the next "untraceable performance enhancer" is right around the corner. I still say the problem isn't Barry (or any other player). It is a flawed reward system that is part of the fabric of our society that isn't going away. Good for those that maximize their potential, however it is done, as long as they get away with it is the end game. If they shorten their lives by doing it, that is their choice. That is (our) reality.

As was written, Bonds hit the dingers.

[blackdog]

What part of Barry Bond's admitting his use of 'the clear' in a grand jury testimony leaves any questions about whether or not he's used any performance enhancing drugs?????? Sure, he's never tested positive but HE ADMITTED IT!!!! Plus, if you really think he hasn't (besides his admission) you REALLY are ignoring reality.

[leadeyedbugger]

Whether he did or did not juice to me does not matter, lots of people juiced and we have no idea as to who did or did not. How many other players, how many pitchers....Oh yeah, and how many other people in the hall of fame are confirmed cheaters....at the least Gaylord Perry for sure, i'm sure there are more.

The way i look at it Barry Bonds was the best player of his generation, his generation at least partially includes the steroid era. But he was still the best player of his era, he still gets in.

[fishinpox]

Alright, Did Barry use steroids? Good chance. Did he do anything against the rules of baseball if he did? No. From an ethics stand point maybe he did something wrong. Then again who sets the standard for what is ethical. What I think is ethical and what somebody else thinks is ethical could be totally different.

Barry gets a lot of attention for his alleged steroid use. But what about the infielders who suddenly could get to that ball in the hole, or the outfielder who could catch anything remotely close, or the pitcher that increased his speed? We may never know how many players in baseball have increased their level of play by taking steroids. All we know is that "America's Favorite Pasttime" is no longer the pure sport we used to play as kids. It's a shame, but that's just the way it is now.

[Just_learning]

give him the record-put an asterisk by it and call it a day.

[El-Kabong]

Originally Posted by Just_learning

give him the record-put an asterisk by it and call it a day.

who cares. spectator sports are boring

[MXRacer105]

Originally Posted by Just_learning

give him the record-put an asterisk by it and call it a day.

Well put...

Bonds will most definetly find his way into the hall of fame because of the home run record, it just has to happen. Regardless, he will always be a dick in my book...

[ehunter]

You need to realize that him getting into the hall of fame could result in a medical emergency because if his head swells any more it could be dangerous to his health

[P8ntballrman]

Hank Aaron did it on beer and hotdogs.........

Barry Bonds did it on steroids.....

in my mind there is only one homerun king and that's Hank the Hammer....

I mean come on if he was such a great homerun hitter then why didn't he play in the homerun derby....

[cptdarel]

I don't care for Baseball, BUT, If he did use the stuff, get use to it, sports wants records, they want to be entertained, they need a Bonds in every sport, Barry didn't do it! the game did it, the FANS did it!

[Clyde]

I agree...I also think the Roger Maris (sp?) should get his record back and strip McGuire from it. As well though...I also think Pete Rose should be allowed to be in the Hall of Fame.

[Big TULE]

I hope he does it soon,i am tired of hearing about it...
Who cares if he does break the record, it has no affect on my life, or my families life. that is what is important.
If people wuld worry about there life and family as much as they do about sports there would be less to worry about. take care of what is important first...

[Super Fluke]

Originally Posted by Clyde

I agree...I also think the Roger Maris (sp?) should get his record back and strip McGuire from it. As well though...I also think Pete Rose should be allowed to be in the Hall of Fame.

I agree with you, give the record back to maris, and let Pete go in the hall of fame. I say if you do steriods you should never be able to play ball again and all your records shouldn't count. Hammerin' Hank hit 755 without cheating and the babe hit 715 by drinking beer and eating hot dogs.

[stlhdr]

How many players are there that hit .225 with three homers every season that are taking steroids? I'd bet quite a few. Even if you're on steroids, you still have to be able to hit the ball. Look at the size of Roger Clemens early in his career compared to his size now, but we don't hear about him I think because he's liked alot more than Barry. If we take into account the suspicion of steroids during a player's career, I don't think we're going to have very many players get into the hall of fame that played from the early nineties until now. And I am a Barry Bonds fan.

[BCF]

Originally Posted by treebutcher

barry will never out class a man such as Hammerin Hank!!

It was rumored that many players including Aaron took uppers all the time. It was just part of the game.


Say what you will Bonds is the best hitter and maybe the best ball player of this century.

BCF

[Big TULE]

I think people do not want him to succeed because he is such a pain in the rear to people... This is just hear say but i heard he told a kid that he would need 20 for an auto. I do not know if that is true or not, just hear say. I really could care less. I love to play the game, and i love watching the mariners as i grew up watching them. Now i am trying to son to enjoy sports as much as i did at his age.
I used to love A-rod, then i dispised him now i am older and could care less, i think he is awesome, and i dislike the Yankees, but he is one of the best. If i had there talent i woul dbe trying to get the most for my talents also...

[foxer]

Aaron didnt have access to Creatine and other supplements that ARE legal to use. You cant compare the two records really as that was so long ago. I say, let em use whatever is legal. Goes for the Tour De Surrender as well. Also, todays athletes are in much better shape physically and mentally than in the past. If I recall correctly, most athletes in the Aaron era had regular jobs after the season was over.

[speedshooterxt]

I dont care what anyone says, hes a great ball player even if you take the home runs away....he made a big mistake, and he is paying the price, more that what is probably necessary. Hes still a good ball player!

[RichH]

Originally Posted by El-Kabong

who cares. spectator sports are boring

Amazing additition to the conversation. Thanks so much.

Having spoken with some people that have actually met and talked with Barry he is not the jerk the media makes him out to be. They said he was very friendly and outgoing.

Imagine that, the media blowing something out of proportion.

Stop the presses!

[Wang]

No doubt in my mind that Barry used/uses steroids. I'm sure his use of steroids prolonged his career thus allowing him to soon become the all time leader of home runs. I have to wonder how many of his dinger's would have been routine warning track out's had he not used steroids? I do believe without the use of roids he would still be one of the best to ever play the game and a member of at least the 500 club and more likely the 600 club.

No doubt Bonds is a great ball player and possibly one of the best(if not the best) to ever step up to the plate. My problem with him is he is just a numbers guy who is all about himself. He has no concept of team play and really never has from what I've seen.

Regardless, he's one of the best players I've ever seen play and have to wonder what his stats would look like if he played full seasons and was pitched to more often.

[ehunter]

How much of his injuries can be tied back to taking steroids??? He has brought the public reaction on him self. The shame is if he had not tainted him self so bad he would be up there with the Babe and Hank on his physical abilities alone the public would be cheering him instead of jeering him.

Regardless, he's one of the best players I've ever seen play and have to wonder what his stats would look like if he played full seasons and was pitched to more often.[/quote]

[drhall99]

These are the reasons I like to watch a clean sports like Bicycling.....

[Wang]

Here's what I call a pretty funny SNL skit on Barry. A buddy sent me this and I got a pretty good laugh out of it.


http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fusea...ideoid=2402957

[Super Fluke]

Originally Posted by Wang

Here's what I call a pretty funny SNL skit on Barry. A buddy sent me this and I got a pretty good laugh out of it.


http://myspacetv.com/index.cfm?fusea...ideoid=2402957

that's pretty funny

[ehunter]

Yes that was pretty good:grin:

[B-RUN STEELIE]

If I was Baseball manager here is what I would do.. Next time Barry hit so much as a routine grounder... I would throw the ball out into the middle of right field and just let it sit there.. If it was a routine fly ball, just let it land and sit there.. make him run the bases for a no contest inside the park homer.. an anti-climatic end to a bogus record.

Either that, or if your the pitcher just throw him obvious meat balls and let him knock them out of the park. If not for chasing a record, he sucks as a ball player. His batting avg is dirt, he can't run, and he is a bad out fielder as well.

I remember before all the steriod use was exposed, they were actually claiming that the balls were juiced, when if fact it was the players. Sosa has what ?? 12 homers this year ?? Kinda shows what happens when you take away steroids and corked batts

[Super Fluke]

barry bonds just hit number 755:frown: I hope he stops playing

[RWTIII]

Originally Posted by Capt. Hook

You don't just take steroids and go out and start smacking them out of the park. The talent level still has to be there.
.

I beg to differ. BRETT BOONE, enough said!!!

I for one will stand and cheer for Barry Bonds.:bowdown :
There's probably more cheating Baseball than NASCAR!!!!!!!

[bugleboy]

He had 500 home runs before any of the steroid stuff even started!!! He is an incredible hitter, you just can't argue that!! Even if he did juice, so did the pitchers and the other hitters of this era, do you see anyone else with anywhere near 755 homers??? Give the guy his due, he is probably the best power hitter of this generation!!

[Super Fluke]

A-Rod is the best power hitter of our generation, he is also one of the best all around players.

[fishncliff]

I found it interesting that the pitcher who threw #755, was investigated and suspended for steroid use.
boo all you want, but the man is playin the game like everyone else.
I don't hear any complaints about the drug use in the 50's - 70's.

[husker]

barry bonds has fnally hit 755....big deal.....i lost respect for that man back when he was a pirate.....3 for 31 in 3 championship series back in those days and he was the MVP.....not....cant stand stand him.....and nobody gets better in there late 30's like he has.....

[PapaHog]

Put him in the Hall of Fame........... Who cares

[Just_learning]

Originally Posted by fishncliff

I don't hear any complaints about the drug use in the 50's - 70's.

Thats because in the 50's to 70's they had to overcome performance depreciating drugs. THe players back then had to overcome the all night binging show up hung over, and still play one hell of a game.

...slight rip on a Lewis Black skit.

[Irish Pennant]

I don't follow baseball but I did the Beavers and I don't know why I read this thread but sense I did, of all the postings I've read, this is the most relevant.

Originally Posted by Jaws

Did steroids make Barry Bonds a better home run hitter? Maybe. But what it really did was prolong his carer past the point when he should have retired.

I can't wait for college football, the next tuna trip, fall chinook, archery season and hunting for ducks, geese, pheasant, grouse and chuckers.