Driving past the fish

[Pilar]

From what I have seen this year .. and years past ... I think we all drive past the fish. The warm water is close and the fish are looking for scooby snacks near whatever break there is.

Reports from Garibaldi confirm fish in close .. real close. My theory is that it is a good idea to drop gear in whenever you find the line with action from birds and a temperature change.

What do you think?

[Chesapeake]

I think you are right. Last time out we would have run for the 125 had one of the boats not came across the radio calling out jumpers. The day before we fished out at the 125 and then a few on the boat swore to seeing jumpers only 17 miles out on the run back in. We deployed gear for about 10 minutes and then dissmissed the claim and ran in. The warm water was all the way to the beach.

I think there is also the lure of the idea that there is bigger and better the farther out you go.

[Pilar]

All there is for me out there is a big fuel bill.

[CATCH AND EAT]

Originally Posted by Pilar

My theory is that it is a good idea to drop gear in whenever you find the line with action from birds and a temperature change.

What do you think?

Here's my theory: SHUT UP AND FISH!

[Smoked Salmon]

Originally Posted by CATCH AND EAT

Here's my theory: SHUT UP AND FISH!

Bah! Get back to work, all of youse!

[Double Trouble]

I thought that we ran past them on Monday. We left DB at 59.8 and it stayed that way all the way out. We dropped in anyway at about 22 miles because the water was a little better color, but the temp did not change and nothing esle was there to tell us to stop. We hit a double real quick, but was slow after that. We ended up about 30 miles. Ended up with the guys that went North getting some more. What do you do when there is nothing to tell you to stop. No temp break, birds, minimal water color change.

[Herring Problem]

I don't feel like workin anymore today.

Going Home!

[Chesapeake]

Originally Posted by Pilar

All there is for me out there is a big fuel bill.

The most we have ever burned is $200 worth in a day. The 150 Hondas are easy on the fuel bill. Besides we are weekend warriors and only get out a handfull of times a year.

Its alot different for you hard core folks that run 20+ times a year. Fuel can add up quick.

[Deeman]

I tend to agree. It seems though that there is a "dead zone" between the inside fish and the outside ones. Not the Green water fish, but the first good groups you run into. Case on point, on an earlier trip this year we were catching pretty good inside at about 20-22 mile when we got a report of REALLY good numbers out at the 125 line 8-10 miles outside. We did not touch a fish on the troll between the two areas, either on the way out or on the way back. But when we got back inside we started picking them up again and finished our day on the troll back to port. So one of the issues is that as we run out we see water that looks good but we dont really believe it. by the time we think maybe we ought to take a look we have run to the outside edge of the inside fish and pick up a couple on the troll out then hit the dead zone. Thinking there are no good numbers inside we then pick up and run on out. It has occurred to me that as soon as I see water that looks right I need to drop gear rather than debating it while I run over them and start the process mentioned above. From experience however this is easier said then done, especially when I have planned my hunt and have a route that I want to take. Breaking my Plan Of Operation (POO) (which is more true in my case than most) that early in the day is tough.

[CATCH AND EAT]

Okay, seriously. Yes John, I think we run over fish all the time. I have taken to stopping a little short and dropping gear for a 10 minute troll west and pick up and run. Did that a couple of times off the CR a few weeks ago when we were struggling to find fish. Sometimes they are closer than we think and other times they are way the heck out there.

Personally, I would rather set down on some biters than a bunch of jumping fish if I only had troll gear. Now with traps or livebait I'll take my chance with jumpers on a stop or two or three and wack'em silly.

[Eaglecap]

Good information!!
I know i'm driving over fish but always look for blue water thinking there will be more fish out there.

[skein]

Seems like last Saturday, Spoonplugger had determined a spot by checking the SST/Chloro charts, and found the fish right where he figured - on a definite break. (Spoonplugger, set me straight if I'm wrong)

IF we can get a decent Terrafin shot I will try that as well.

I'm still learnin'.

Skein

[Pilar]

I gotta believe the sat shots when they are available and recent. But long before satellites went whizzing around this rock .. there were birds. And fishermen have been fishing under birds since they started using boats.

I'm driving until I either see fish being stacked on somebody's deck or birds working a boil. And almost every trip we see this long before the intended destination.

[Threemuch]

I completely agree. I think most people drop in at the first temp break, and then head west after the first flury subsides, which always seems to happen after about 8:30 or 9am. Truth is, the fish and the warm water edge will move IN as the day goes on, especially on the calm days we all love to fish.

I used to fish with a friend in the bay area with an 8kt boat, a 42' Sea Chief Trawler called Cinnebar. Nice rig, but slow. So we trolled gear everywhere we went, and always caught fish well inside the main fleet.

However, what's your concern? Not catching enough fish this year?

[ron m]

I agree that if the signs are there, then put in and troll for at least 10 minutes. But that's the easy time to stop, when there are definite signs.

This year when I've been on the best bite there were NO signs except for the best one, rods going off! I decided earlier this year that stopping the run out and trolling for 10 minutes was no problem. If nothing else, it gets the rods rigged and in the apporpriate rod holders so it makes it easier to deploy them the next time. That works fine for me, we even deployed them once this year around the salmon trollers north of the rockpile since I wasn't sure if they were trolling for salmon or tuna. didn't take long to decide it was salmon, but when we stopped again we wer ready to immediately deploy and got fish quickly. Withe so much warm water and guys getting tuna in 300 ft of water off Garibaldi, I might try even sooner. If the tuna come in close it's almost for sure to feed, so I'd expect to get bit fairly soon if the tuna are there.

ron m

[Pilar]

Ron M .. I like the pre-deploy too. Get it all in the water and get everyone up to speed on the order of putting lines out. Usually I stop a mile short of the radio fish. But I think from now on it will be much closer in.

There is no concern Kurt. But we had a ball .. plugging the boat only 20 miles off Depoe a couple of weeks ago. By the time we were done catching TUNA! it was only 10 am. And the deck tanks were still on deck with fuel in them. Then a quick one hour run in. Wish every trip went like that so close to shore.

[SeaFever]

I just wanna go TUNA fishin....hopefully Friday...

[lor]

Originally Posted by Pilar

Reports from Garibaldi confirm fish in close .. real close. My theory is that it is a good idea to drop gear in whenever you find the line with action from birds and a temperature change.

I'm gonna ask a newby question.
The temperature break is self explanatory, it can be seen on the instrument panel. However the birds thingy has me a little confused.
What type of birds are you talking about. The little black ones which are always out there, albatrose, or those little swallow looking birds, I think its some type of tern. Is it just the presence of birds, or should we be able to see them working baitfish.

Reason I ask is because two weeks ago, we dropped gear about 15-20 miles NW of newport because we saw alot of birds rafted up in one spot.
We make a trip or two to the ranch, so we are familiar with the black birds and the albatrose, but we never saw that many in one spot. So we trolled for half an hour without success. We then followed the nearest charter boat out to the bluewater where we didn't see the black birds or the albatrose, just these little tern like birds which looked like they couldn't float.

We only caught 5 fish in the bluewater, on the way back in the last hour that we fished, we caught 10 fish in the green water with no birds in sight.

[Coastalfisherman]

When I look for birds, I look for albatross and the smaller version of them. I call them salmon birds, not sure of the real name. They should be actively working bait that is being pushed up by bigger fish from below. Birds all rafted up together have already fed and are sitting there resting from prior activity.

[retaliate]

We wondered Monday if we went past the fish, however we did troll from 15 out, to 40, & back to 15 & never got a hit inside 20, were they closer? The water was good color, & temp from 13mi out. I was showing 63 deg in closer, & 62 deg out further, altho very little temp break anywhere like Double Trouble said.

[Spoonplugger]

Good post! Sometimes we do drive past the fish no doubt. We can never tell a fish where he has to be, period. SST/Chloro shots are excellent tools, but things can change hourly. Birds can be great indicators, but whats under them? We just have to check it out. Sometime tuna are probably 100, 200 or 300 feet under those birds and we should probably just take a few minutes if we can't bring them up on the troll and drop a heavy jig and just see what happens. We must keep in mind to test all depths and all speeds constantly to see what may be the right combination on that particular day. And remember, fish are not active all the time, so we may have to be patient and wait for them to come to us. Right Keta?

[Spoonplugger]

One other thing that could foul up the SST/chloro shots is that the water could be layered horizontally instead of vertically. Tuna may be in beautiful blue water 100 feet under ugly green. We just don't know. They know and perhaps the birds are just waiting for the activity period.

What really gets me excited is to see birds actually working an area, revealing that the fish are no doubt actively feeding on the bait fish and driving them to the surface.

[retaliate]

We saw very few Birds Mon out of Depoe, most were in close with the Salmon, when we had the Triple on(Zoey was out there with us) was the only time we saw any Surface Tuna activity the whole day.

[tracker]

One thing is that once I find fish I really hate to leave them for radio fish or otherwise. Also a bit later on the birds will be a better indicator. As the tuna start jumping the birds help find them better.

[Hogmaster]

"Driving past the fish "

Yep.

See it happen all the time.

There are always TONS of fish that are driven by, every day.

Folk drive for miles and miles past them, ignoring all the birds and everything.

Yet they are there and waiting.

Right at the dock.

[Dan9113]

Lor-

I saw all of those birds rafted up the other day as well. There was also a big slick and the water was filled with what looked like grapenuts. That appeared to be what the birds were eating. We were marking a few fish (we were coho fishing at the time) but couldn't get a bits. Not sure what was in the water. Anyone?

Dan

[Reel Creel]

Ive had my best luck with the water color. I think it needs to be clear its ok to have some green in it but just clear, last year we got 18 one day and the best temp i could find was 58.5.but the water was clear really clear, So for me as soon as i start to sea the water change color i go a little more and start dumping gear. so if the temp is 58 or 59 thats ok in my book. If we dont pick somthing up in 30 to 45 mins then pull the gear bact in and move on.

[Grady252]

I drop gear early if the temp is there even if it isn't blue.... I have caught fish year after year inside of the pack. Last year I was catching cold water pigs.... 59 degree finger of water about 1/2 mile wide with 58. degree water on both sides..... back and forth I went until I boated about 20 average size 25lbs, and a couple in the 30's.....SKA Horse, Serious fun, and a few others were 15-20 mile past me not catching fish when we talked on the radio, they came back were I was and started picking up fish.....

This year first trip out I saw birds and bait at 15 miles out of Depoe 61 degree green water... Dropped my gear trolling at 6-7 mph started catching fish at 20 miles out worked the 20 to 22 miles out and caught until we decided it was enough....

I am not sure what the answer is, other than it is fishing.... I have also dropped gear early and trolled for two hours heading west until I found fish... I think many do run right past them though....

[Onokai]

Driving over fish is what folks often do-Sometimes we all do -its the signs we need to look for-this post from last year speaks to this as all the fleet that day pasted right over this area-but when I saw a jumper in 51 degree water we dropped in-no typo- 51 degrees. Look for the signs and remmember temp is only one-fish breezing and sometimes jumping are the best but bait and birds can be just as good-temp in ok but as this post shows temp can really not be the best -sometimes you have to forget temps.

Ono-Full report
Trailered up to Brooking Sun am from Blue lake
out by 7ish-took a 270 heading out-saw jumpers and surface
brezers in 51 degree water slid up to them and cast swimbaits
instant triple-hooked 8 fish in the cold water 2 big boys had 3
bite offs(chewed line) boated 5 at that stop-what a blast-that
started out days with a bang. Trolled the area -ran out more
saw surface movement about another 5 miles out tossed the
swimbaits and hooked into a school of Humboldt sqiud-boated
one on lite tackle. cleaned and iced--trolled about 38 miles out
rest of day for 1 more fish-
Back at dock Dennis was helping another boat dock and fell in
water dislocated his shoulder and Duncan drove him to C.C
hospital. That slowed the evenings plans for a restart but it all
got done and day 2 went again with Duncan and Glenn
Stockwell
Ran a 240's heading to the southern water for scatch trolling by
everyone but us Mid afternoon picked up and ran to yesterdays
area with Reel Steel and hooked 2 doubles straight away and
had 2 singles on swimbaits -lost 2 of them-boated 4 for the day-
ended early for us back to dock by 530-which for us is a first.
Day 1 was 98 gallons on the burn for 126 miles -day 2 was 104
gallons for 138 miles-2 days fishing for 10 fish-slow at best-this
water is breaking up but there are still fish there -the bite was
just off-late season fish are just harder to hook-
PS the casting gear we use is 20 # test and 25# test on lite
small Newell reels and lite rods- This year it has worked well-
casting to albies with the motor off is a real joy. Mark

Almost forgot -sea state was glassy very little wind if any most of time both days

[Spoonplugger]

A temperature breakline can be horizontal also. Where the water in the top layer can be 58 degrees and 50 feet down the water temperature could be 51 like in a thermocline, which would be normal. But the strong currents of huge bodies of water can do strange things. Whose to say that warmer water couldn't be forced under cooler water. Air masses do at times. I'm sure we've all experienced opposite currents while fishing halibut. Current flowing north on the top layer and 100 feet down current flowing south. We just don't know, but the fish do.

I like MarkMc's saying, "The fish are where you find them." Buck Perry says something to that affect, "The fish are either in the deep, the shallow or somewhere in between." We can't tell a fish where he has to be. We can use the knowledge we have to locate the fish such as, jumpers, SST for temp breaklines, chlorophyll for breaklines, working birds, rips, lots of sharks, trash denoting some type of breakline and etc. Another phrase of Buck Perry, "Knowledge is the key to fishing success."

[Duckworth Dave]

Saturday we droped lines at 3 miles off Twin Rocks and set a troll north at 2.5 knotts for salmon with divers/flashers and hering at 16 pulls. Pertect for silvers. They were silver alright. Fought great but when I got the first one to the boat my buddie says you have a tuna not a king. Remember 3 miles off Twin Rocks. Week before that we went out twice 45 miles on the chase to get 30 tuna in the box. As Crazyfish keeps telling be no more salmon every again tuna only. This Friday & Saturday we'll be trolling fast through the salmon water with full tuna gear with a large zone we have pinpointed already. Based on daily reports and temp of the water. The water was 64 the other day when we were hooking up so ya you have to be right that we go right past them. Warning to salmon fisherman we will be trolling fast with lots of gear, give us room.

[retaliate]

Originally Posted by Spoonplugger

A temperature breakline can be horizontal also. Where the water in the top layer can be 58 degrees and 50 feet down the water temperature could be 51 like in a thermocline, which would be normal. But the strong currents of huge bodies of water can do strange things. Whose to say that warmer water couldn't be forced under cooler water. Air masses do at times. I'm sure we've all experienced opposite currents while fishing halibut. Current flowing north on the top layer and 100 feet down current flowing south. We just don't know, but the fish do.

I like MarkMc's saying, "The fish are where you find them." Buck Perry says something to that affect, "The fish are either in the deep, the shallow or somewhere in between." We can't tell a fish where he has to be. We can use the knowledge we have to locate the fish such as, jumpers, SST for temp breaklines, chlorophyll for breaklines, working birds, rips, lots of sharks, trash denoting some type of breakline and etc. Another phrase of Buck Perry, "Knowledge is the key to fishing success."

Very true about the Surface water temperature, as a scuba diver often we would drop in 60 deg surface water , & the temp would drop to 50 or less 60' down, with trade winds it's certainly possible for some warmer surface water to mix in with cooler water at depths of 100' or more, + I have always thought warmer water bulids/pushes North inspite the strong N. blow, thru what I've been calling the "Subway", maybe one of those drop in/down temperture guages would be helpful?

[skein]

Buck Perry says ... Spoonplugger

'Course Buck Perry also invented the Spoonplug...

I swear I learn something every time I read these pages. I might even figure out how to go deeeeep for the big 'uns.

Thanks guys.

Skein

[backlash442]

Don't even let depth sway you from dropping gear. Caught them in less than 300' of water once. Would have never done it if not for these big fat tuna coming straight up out of the water right along side of us while running out. We were actually fishing inside of the rockfish party boat. Probably a once in a life time deal though. Was told by guys fishing all their lives they'd never seen anything like it and hasn't happened since.

[Pilar]

One of the things that never cease to amaze me is the variety of bird behavior.

You see birds sitting in a group on a slick.

You see shearwaters and albatross cruising wavetops.

You see the small (smaller than terns) shorebird looking birds sipping shrimp as they dart and hover.

You see shearwaters piggy backing on feeding TUNA! My favorite by far the birds sit and then when the jumpers boil they hold thier wings up and paddle with their feet, walking on water with the tuna boiling right under them.

Activity is the thing. And yes you can and will catch fish in lifeless water.

[Tinman]

I've noted 4 types of water color out there, namely dirty brown, dirty green, clean green, and clear blue. The first two are non-starters for tuna. However, clean green is fine for tuna. Clear blue may be better for large numbers of tuna, but I suspect the larger fish are in the clean green.

The bottom line for me is that tuna have been so incredibly abundant the last few years, you can catch them in almost any half decent water.

[ChrisCurtis]

Has anyone ever tried to spy on these fish with a fish camera? My buddy has one with a 60' cord, I'm tempted to borrow it this weekend for kicks. These are top water fish, right? I wonder how the water clarity is??

[Bait O' Eggs]

I have an underwater camera I built in '03 with intentions of filming the tuna bite a lure. By the time the TV gets in the boat, and the camera and 100 feet of cable etc.. it takes some room which is always precious on tuna trips.

I have taken it out a few times trying to film, but the swells were to big to keep the camera running in clean water. Each swell creates quite the bubble disturbance over the rear facing camera lense. Sort of a blair witch project kinda thing. The next flat day I will be attempting this again to get some footage of tuna taking the lure. I was just playing with the camera this last weekend.

I always run over fish. I dont want to fish the first fish I get to. I want to fish where I think the concentration is the thickest. Besides coming back at them from the West they dont expect me coming, and I get to sneak up on them.

[San Anita]

Originally Posted by Pilar

All there is for me out there is a big fuel bill.

We gave it a shot a couple weeks ago, had 61 degree water 15 miles out, birds and dolphins SW of Depo. Trolled for about half hour and not a hit. Maybe further North would work better in close.
I still think its worth a try.
Bill