Take a stand................fish anyways

Artwo · 04-17-2001, 07:53 AM

I've been reading all the posts this morning about the tooth tangle nets and how angry everyone is about our sport fishery being cut short and all. So my suggestion is, for all you folks who have had the means/availability to have fished during the week this whole season long you should continue to go out and fish anyways. Only don't take your rods with you, take your camera. We should be out there video taping this netting experiment and documenting whether or not those natives are released unharmed. If there are floaters than film yourselves picking them up and showing they are native fish and then send them back to there watery grave. We can sit here on this BB all damn day and rant and rave all we want but it won't do any good if we don't put out a real effort to show that the time is now to stop the netting on all inland water ways. If vative fish are killed by these experimental nets than the people have a right to know the real truth, send your film to our local news so the truth can be seen.

JK

PS and join an organized group (like steelheaders), we need to ban together now. Only we can save our fishing rights.

Pilar · 04-17-2001, 08:10 AM

Artwo, how could you keep this from becoming an angry confrontation? It's a great idea but only if cooler heads prevail. Is there some way we could get a news crew on a guide sled? With all of the money spent by sport fishermen surely the news media would have some interest. Feature the netters killing wild Salmon on the 5 oclock news!!

Remember the thing that makes it all OK for the netters is that they do their thing out of the public eye. I think some exposure would raise public awareness and make them very uncomfortable. I daresay that netters would fall short if they had to publicly justify killing wild fish to sustain thier fishery.

An idea I had was for some fishermen to visit ODFW headquarters all over the state and fill their parking lots with trucks, boats and trailers as a protest. The one in downtown Portland would only accomodate 20 or so trailers before becoming useless to the employees at ODFW. Maybe some public disobedience would get the broadcast media attention.

Grits · 04-17-2001, 08:23 AM

Pilar is on the money with going to ODFW stations and respectfully protesting. I would offer that these commercial guys are just trying to make a living and are going to take whatever season the ODFW gives them so our complaint shouldn't be with the commercial guys but the people who make the rules allowing them to be out there. I think we are up to over 1,000 IFISH people and I would imagine that if the Govenors office, ODFW, and your Senators, Congressmen and State Legislatures all started recieving a large volume of calls/e-mails that at least we might get more answers. Politicians are in office because they have learned to appeal to the masses so it is our job to present ourselves in mass. Lastly I would like to say the person I am the most dissapointed in is the Govenor. He has touted his self as an avid fly fisherman so I thought as Govenor he would have enhanced sport fishing but it seems like he has done nothing but sit by while our oppurtunities decline and because of this most of my calls will go to his office to persuade him to help protect a sport he claims to love.

finclipped · 04-17-2001, 09:02 AM

I don't think net fishing can be justified, however keep in mind what these "tangle nets" are trying to do. They are trying to find a commercial fishing technique that will reduce kill impact on wild fish by requiring that wild fish are released in a survivable manner. By reducing commercial take of wild fish, we will all have greater access to harvestable hatchery fish. This is something that commercial fisherman have never done in the past. I think the writing is on the wall... soon commercial fisherman will be required to fish selectively, something that will have a positive impact on wild ESA listed fish. Something sports anglers are already doing. Now, if we could just convince the tribes.... [img]images/icons/frown.gif[/img]

If it were up to me, no nets would be allowed in the river, but its not. I say let them test these nets, for the benefit of future fish runs.

Artwo · 04-17-2001, 09:31 AM

Pilar,
As far as the filming of the net experiments, I believe that us as the sport fishing portion of the debat we owe it to our selves to keep this non-confrontational. I know it is a very sensitive issue but we need to be mature about it because this will have direct impression of us to the public eye. I do like your idea of a non-confrontational assembly at the ODFW/WDFD and yes invite the media.

Grits,
I agree whith your statement about writing to our goverment representatives but I think we now need to take it to the next level. I agree that the netters are just going with what's given to them but we should be trying to find ways to offset their losses for not netting and offering options to them for more productive ways to make a living. I to am not very impressed with our govenor's stance on the commercial/sportfishers issues as well.

finclipped,
I to like to see that some efforts are being made to take a different direction to selective harvesting for the netters as well. But, I am totally against any kind of netting of inland waterways in general. As I said above, I would like to see our state goverment looking at offering the netters educational assistance and such to eventually eliminate the netting all together. A similar program like what was offered to the loggers when the bottm fell out of that industry.

All I am saying is, that I believe there can be a way to get the nets off the rivers and still not impact the individuals who are trying to make a living doing it.

I also don't believe that the general public is fully aware of the real impact these nets have on our resource. Certainly not like the attention that has been given to old growth timber. People in general need to get involved, not just the sport fisherman. Public awareness is the key I believe.

One last thought, however we all decide to make our voice heard we need to do it in a civilized manner. If this can be accomplished we (the sport fisherman) will be all the better because of it.

PS Again, Join an organization and make your voice heard.

JK

Artwo · 04-17-2001, 02:07 PM

Capt. Hook,
I agree with you that the netters don,t make their entire living from fishing but I believe they should be compensated in some way for the permits they hold. Teach them a different trade that they can use to suppliment their income is what I am suggesting. Can you tell me why in the f@#$ the BPA would spend $360,000 for experimental nets that they are not even sure will work when that money could have been used to purchase some of the permits from those who are waiting for a buy out. It just doesn't make sense to me........ What is the BPA's interest in netting anyway?

Richter · 04-17-2001, 05:49 PM

There was a test on the tooth tangle nets about 10 days ago or so. One 10 minute set(short piece of net)near Skamokawa/Cathlamet yielded 31 fish. They could not handle that number of fish! Take them out of net, put wild fish in holding tank, etc., So they stopped after one drift. I don't really expect anything to be better this go round [img]images/icons/shocked.gif[/img] .

orsturgeon · 04-17-2001, 06:02 PM

I just do not understand why everyone is so ****** at the WDFW/ODFW? The salmon allocations are federally mandated. States do not have a say in the number of fish we catch. What good is it going to do to protest at department offices? If you do not want to waste your time protest those in charge of rulemaking. And it helps to get all of the information you can before doing this. And I do not mean what you hear down on the river.

Grits · 04-17-2001, 08:11 PM

orsturgeon

Educate us all. What Federal entity decided that the last day of sport fishing on the Columbia was going to be today?

Joe Schwab · 04-17-2001, 09:03 PM

Orsturgeon, where did you get that information? The feds as far as I know do not allocate Columbia River salmon. the Columbia River compact does that within the ESA paramaters. Washington and Oregon lower river gillnetters are entirely controlled by the compact. Lets hope the Feds never get to that point.

[ 04-17-2001: Message edited by: Capt. Hook ]

BUGLEMAN · 04-17-2001, 09:59 PM

I see peacefull resistance as a tool for publicity. Free advertisement. Look how successful the environmentalist were by putting that guy up on the ledge in downtown. It is all politics. Politics is what has gotten the guardians of mother earth thier unfair allocation. Politics will undo it.

I like the idea. I know I can get out of bed and beat them to the hole.

There is one very good thing to this tooth tangle net. That is if it is proven to lower mortality and still be an easy way to fish then the lazey and wastefull people will be forced to use it. We then will get a better allocation.

How does the compact work?

Coot22 · 04-17-2001, 11:02 PM

Here is my take on the whole issue. I agree with everyone that we need to take a stand. That is definitely the first step. It is great that the gillnetters are trying to work out a selective fishery but who is paying for those clipped salmon and steelhead? Sport Fishermen. That is beside the point though. If the gillnetters are allowed to take clipped fish, then they are in immediate competition with sport fishermen for a small number of fish. This is an accident waiting to happen. Also, no one can convince me that a tooth tangling net is less harmful and traumatic to a fish then being hooked and then released in a few minutes as oppossed to a longer period of time. Yet I agree. The gillnetters need to be compensated just as the loggers were. I have talked with birdhunter about one idea for the compensation of the gillnetters. In Hawaii (and maybe some other states that i am not aware of) the commercial fishermen are also the guides. The boats get a permit to sell their catch to the stores. They are just like guides except they are not restricted on how many rods they can fish or how many fish they can keep. So, for example, this spring, let us say that a guide takes out two customers. he would be able to fish as many rods as he or she pleased as a guide and then let us say that this guide boats 20 fish. The customers get one each, if they wanted one at all, and the rest would be sold to the markets. Some might argue that there are not enough fish in the water to do this. Trust me...there are...ask birdhunter how many fish we caught in the ten days we were in hawaii!!!
With this idea in effect. The guiding business would get back on its feet and we would not have to worry about fighting with the gillnetters at all times throughout a season. I say, train the gillnetters to get their guide liscense through the coast gaurd, for free if we have to, and get those nets out of the water! This is just one idea...who knows if it would work but it is the first step to a solution. Just my thoughts and ideas.

-CKH

Joe Schwab · 04-17-2001, 11:15 PM

Artwo, I hate to beat a dead horse but lower river gillnetters do not make their living fishing for salmon on the Columbia River. Most commercially fish in Alaska or are retired fireman, teachers, police officers etc. I can't see any analogy between them and loggers, who worked at their jobs full time. Gillnetters have told me they can't even make operating expenses in a few day season. Why do they do it? Most have grandfathered permits that are saleable should they ever increase in value.
Or they are waiting for BPA to buy them out.Some just do it because they can. Anyone who seeks to make money off the resources of nature should be prepared to bow out gracefully when the time comes. And that includes guides, who incidentally have never been compensated like commercial fishermen when fisheries crashed. Its called self employment.

fishhead5 · 04-18-2001, 06:13 AM

orsturegon, if they have done such a fine job, why is this even a topic?

Fishhead5

blackdog · 04-18-2001, 06:28 AM

One issue in regards to these new nets that I haven't seen discussed is in regards to their release methods. The boys from 'Fins, Feathers, and Furs' were chastised for their release techniques on fish they quickly landed and only had out of the water for a few seconds on the Hot Tomale Show. How many of the wild fish that have had their teeth tangled in these nets for a hell of a lot longer time, more than likely thrashing about like a true spring chinook the whole time, are actually going to make it when they get tossed back in the Columbia? Maybe I am naive, but this seems like a basic issue that just won't be overcome with this new net.

Pilar · 04-18-2001, 07:39 AM

I'm glad someone finally got the point. Public perception is the key to this issue. Every time we have a cornback brown trout run on the Willamette the public outcry to City of Portland is heard. The Media responds to this with news coverage. The Public involvement makes it an issue the media cares about.

Netting wild salmon by any means will remain a enigma to the public unless it is brought to the forefront. Protesting and inviting the media is the first step. If you want this issue to fester then gripe about it on this board and do nothing else.

If you want to get the media involved then join me at the ODFW offices with your boat and trailer. Lets pick a time that maximizes the pain in the @ss factor and that gives the media time to cover it for the evening news. Get this thing in the public spotlight!!!

We got the talking done, now I'm looking for a few good fishers to join me in a protest of gill netting on the Columbia River.

Anyone??

[ 04-18-2001: Message edited by: Pilar ]