2-3 tours in Irag is just wrong?

[retiredgal]

Many things seem bad about the middle east wars, but to me, re sending the same vets back, over and over is totally wrong. It just is not fair in my humble opinion. Many of our youth never see service much less combat and experience the horror of war? I haven't, but I can read and watch newsreels and any war appears to me to be bad news indeed to those that have to participate. Perhaps in time of war, we need to have a system that brings in adequate replacements so those that have survived one tour don't have to keep going back until they maybe "lose the roll of the dice" ?

Nobody likes a "draft" but nobody likes to feel like they are being "abused" and "used"!

SUPPORT OUR TROOPS should be more than a slogan with our leaders.

[SteelheadBum2]

Support the troops!! But I DO NOT support this war, nor any other middle eastern war. This whole terrorism badwagon is getting out of hand to the point where our own gov. lies to us about the reason to go to war.

I do belive it is TOTALLY unfair for the vets to expierence 2-3 tours in a row, when they signed up knowing this would not happen. It is unfair and a total overworking of our young men. I will ONLY support a draft if we are flat-out invaded on our home soil, and our country was in a total state of emergency. The government is supposed to do what is in the intrest of the people, and if the people dont believe in an unjust war, and recruitment rates are down, maybe our government should recondsider what they have started. Having a draft to force citizens to fight a war they, by majority know is unjust, is an attack on our democratic princibles.

Support our troops!

[JustCallMeDave]

I have serious concerns about leaving this thread open, as it will most likely lead to politics and inflammatory statements.

Hesitate before you do either.

[El-Kabong]

Re: 2-3 tours in Irag is just wrong?

wrong or criminal?

fail to give them proper training, equipment or support when they are there and then ignore/neglect those who come back injured. these are sad times for those who serve.

EK

[fish_on]

This thread is just wrong. Playing liberal politics with our soldiers is criminal.

[stumpyin08]

i don't see anyone playing liberal politics, I see concerned citizens speaking out. I support our troops (US Army vet), yet the way our goverment went about the current conflict (starting a war under false pretenses, then lying about it) is wrong. just my . Doug

[RODACTION]

I can't believe how soft my county has become.

40 years ago this little thorn would have been gone (within months) with cheering familys, dances, and BBQ's.....knowing our USA is safe for another day.

Being in the milatary is a job, (and you SIGN up for it)(today) and it is to defend this great country of the USA, no ifs, or buts, and you answer to the commander. (it is not a free ride)


Harms way is in the contract......1 month or 10 years.

Yes bring our forces home, after we put out the fire.

[retiredgal]

Please understand that my empathy for our troops is not meant to be politcal criticism of why, how, if we should be there, just sharing my thought that dirty jobs and hard work should be shared, versus some doing all the hard stuff, while others stay there distance. I guess, this "lets all work together equally, and share the hard times principle" goes back to the roots of our country's beginning?

If you agree or disagree, please don't make this a political free for all about conservative or liberalism, or who did what wrong to get us where we are today. Our troops are suffering badly, 10 more killed today, no telling how many injured and I grieve for them, their families, friends and neighbors.

IMHO: Supporting our troops partially means, having adequate numbers available to do their assigned mission and adequate numbers to minimize potential risk and harm to each and everyone of them in this horrible day in day out "policing type action" we are trapped in today.

The thread is about multiple tours in a war zone for a few being equitable?
Good war, bad war, is not the topic here. Fairness is the topic.

[BCF]

Originally Posted by RODACTION

I can't believe how soft my county has become.

40 years ago this little thorn would have been gone (within months) with cheering familys, dances, and BBQ's.....knowing our USA is safe for another day.

Being in the milatary is a job, (and you SIGN up for it)(today) and it is to defend this great country of the USA, no ifs, or buts, and you answer to the commander. (it is not a free ride)


Harms way is in the contract......1 month or 10 years.

Yes bring our forces home, after we put out the fire.

It is not to late to re-up. Our local mailman is 54 and and passed his physical and was deployed to Afganistan. If you feel the way you say you do, then you should re-enlist and do more than place a magnetic yellow sticker on your vehicle.

Hope that doesn't offend you. It just seems like a real solution to the problem of solidiers having to do multiple tours.

BCF

[PGJPJ]

Political bashing aside. I don’t know how America can win a war anymore. Not since Vietnam, the American public seems to have become a soft weak nation. I’d have to qualify my remarks by saying that I did serve in the Marine Corps in the early 90’s, but didn’t have to go to war.

I think the problem is that we don’t have to sacrifice anything, unless you have family directly involved. In WWII, everyone had to sacrifice. Women went to work in factories, supplies were rationed, and the US was completely involved.

Now, we are asked to keep buying our Star Bucks, and go about our business as if nothing is happening. How are we going to ever going to keep the attention span of the average American long enough to fight AND WIN a war?

IMHO, if we ever have to fight China, or North Korea, we’re through.

[norms gone fishing too]

how soon we forget before veitnam there were no tours. you went tell the job was finshed. i too say bring our boys home from this mess

Norm

[Irish Pennant]

Mods go ahead and close this thing. Everytime I try to come up with a reply I find that I have to delete it. There's no way I can be nice and I have to bite my tongue. It's not a worthy thread if the some of us can't express ourself without insulting others.

[JustCallMeDave]

Originally Posted by Irish Pennant

Mods go ahead and close this thing. Everytime I try to come up with a reply I find that I have to delete it. There's no way I can be nice and I have to bite my tongue. It's not a worthy thread if the some of us can't express ourself without insulting others.

As long as everyone can show the restraint that you have we might be able to have intelligent discussion on the topic without closing the thread.

[TheRogue]

My rough & tumble Curry County logger uncle always told me that you do everything humanly possible to avoid fights, even to the point of embarrasing yourself, because in the end, no-one wins.

But, if you absolutely have to fight, there's no other alternative....you go in for the groin, put the person down, and then kick them until they stop moving. No such thing as a fair fight.

War should be the same way.

TR

[Just_learning]

My take on the military is that it is a job. People “enlist” and are given duties to fulfill. Unlike other “jobs” though you cant just quit, and walk away. Otherwise there would be many more people coming home from Iraq, and many more who would have returned from Vietnam. As we grow and the world becomes smaller the option of fighting a “fair war” as decided upon by the UN and at the Geneva Convention become less and less likely. With things like bloggers and YouTube people are able to see what is transpiring in almost real time. It is slowly removing the censors that are put in place by the people who control what we see in our news outlets. What made Al-Jazeera such an “enemy” of the current war is that Bahrain was not part of the accords that forbid the showing of dead, wounded, and the aftermath of shelled areas through mass broadcasts. As we as grow through technology, the days of riding into town on your horses and killing every man, woman, child, and pig becomes more and more a thing of the past. After WW2 the idea of collateral damage and mass killing to break the will of the enemy through a show of brute force became less of an option. I think we are finding it hard to realize that its easy to fly over and bomb strong holds and claim victory, but afterwards in order to really realize it you have to put boots on the ground. When that happens is when people get killed. Winning a war psychologically and winning it physically are two completely different things. Today more than ever America is realizing that truth. Without bringing politics into this, I think we should give the troops an option to stay or leave. The ones who actually feel we are making a difference will get to stay and fulfill their duties and the dead weight will return home. If given these options such atrocities as Haditha can easily be avoided.

[craigcw]

No one, including all persons in the goverment, wants to keep our citizens in a war. We all want them to come home. I have talked to a few returned soldiers, some after 2-3 tours, and they have all had positive attitudes. None of them like the danger and fighting, but they all felt that they were doing the right thing. It seems that the American "people" are failing; the soldiers won't lose the war, but America can.
I would like to see fewer multiple tours for a soldier, but it is a voluntary service and should stay that way.

[12244]

Keep it open and clean please. I am enjoying the viewpoints and experiences.

[rimrock]

They're soldiers aren't they? The Marines I know personally at lest (career men) can’t wait to go back…to them the job isn’t done and (this may sound strange to some) they like to fight. Being in the military is being in the military. I appreciate a soldier’s sacrifice, as many people make great sacrifices in life as well, but fighting is what I thought soldiers did? It’s rather difficult on them and their family I’m sure, a great challenge, but what is a soldier's life suppose to be?

We best support them as a Nation with gratitude and giving them all the recourses they need. We owe them that if we as a Nation send them in harms way.

[Cornbread]

Before Vietnam there were no "tours" that is a concept created by the draft because Americans felt it was cruel to keep drafted soldiers in a war for more than a year. Our Military is once again an all volunteer force and I believe if you sign on for 3 or 4 years if you end spending those 3 or 4 years in a war then so be it. War is what the military is for, no ifs, ands, or buts about it. when you sign up you do so knowing full well you could spend all of it in a war should one happen. War sucks hard core but America needs to realize that wars iin third world countries are long and nasty if we want to to leave the country better off then when we went into it. We have to be ready for an occupation like the British did in Malaysia (war of the running dogs) if we hope to re-build the places we invade. I served in the Marines for 8 years. I spent a total of 18 months not in a combat zone during my whole service. I only spent 6 months in the US in that entire time. At one point in my career I left one combat zone spent three months in the states and then redeployed to another. I never once thought it was unfair. I signed up to be a Marine. Marines go to war, if your not in a war you are training for one. I'd be in this war too if I hadn't been damaged to the point where I can't re-enlist but that is the breaks sometimes you get wounded and have to become a civilian whether you like it or not. What I am trying to say is America needs to get harder as a people if we ever hope to win a war and multiple tours isn't unfair it is your job as a Soldier, Sailor, Airman, or Marine to serve your time you enlisted for and if that happens to all fall into a war then you serve your time in war until your enlistment is done not until some concept called a tour is done.

[crabbait]

Originally Posted by norms gone fishing too

how soon we forget before veitnam there were no tours. you went tell the job was finshed. i too say bring our boys home from this mess

Norm

Huh???? The standard tour in Viet Nam was a year (and a day). Very few went for a second tour without requesting it.

My bad: I missed the "before".

[roadsend]

"After WW2 the idea of collateral damage and mass killing to break the will of the enemy through a show of brute force became less of an option."

For us or the bad guys?
When you are dealing with people who use airplanes and car bombs to deliberately create collateral cililian damage and mass casualties and you show undue restraint in the pursuit of them and their enablers you play right into their hands.
Their is no doubt in my mind that given the determination of our enemies and the divisive attitude of so many Americans, Europeans and others, there will be many more 9/11s and Iraq, Afghanistan type wars in our future.

"Winning a war psychologically and winning it physically are two completely different things."
The deference with which our media treats terrorists and mass killers, using instead terms such as "militant" and "insurgent" makes it pretty clear to me that we are behind the power curve psychologically. More media hoopla is made about such screwups as the Abu Graib photos and vebal insults to Saddam at his well deserved exeucution than is made about the videos showing the brutal and bloody beheadings of Nick Berg and other unfortunate victims of our reprehensible enemies.

Two and three deployments are not great to look forword to, or back on.
I can't help, however, but recall that my brother-in-law had only one deployment in the tropical Pacific during another war. His tour lasted from 1942 until 1946.

[Bait Bucket]

Originally Posted by norms gone fishing too

how soon we forget before veitnam there were no tours. you went tell the job was finshed. i too say bring our boys home from this mess

Norm

That wasn't the case at all. Tours of duty varied throughout the conflict from one year to 13 months. Lot's of draftees did the one tour for one year. "Lifers" like me did multiple tours at different lengths.

[RichH]

Originally Posted by retiredgal

Many things seem bad about the middle east wars, but to me, re sending the same vets back, over and over is totally wrong. It just is not fair in my humble opinion. Many of our youth never see service much less combat and experience the horror of war? I haven't, but I can read and watch newsreels and any war appears to me to be bad news indeed to those that have to participate. Perhaps in time of war, we need to have a system that brings in adequate replacements so those that have survived one tour don't have to keep going back until they maybe "lose the roll of the dice" ?

Nobody likes a "draft" but nobody likes to feel like they are being "abused" and "used"!

SUPPORT OUR TROOPS should be more than a slogan with our leaders.

That's why there was a draft. We don't currently have one due to all volunteer service. Maybe not the best system but it's what we're currently dealing with. As mentioned above, when you volunteer it is for whatever the needs of the service you volunteered for good, bad or otherwise.

[Wang]

Well said Rod and Rogue!

If we're going to be in war, we need to keep the experience on the battlefield as high as possible to gain every edge possible. I also feel that one tour does more harm than good.

[Chrome Bumper]

Bring most of them home, our leading intelligence justifying our acts was faulty. Only the Kurds seem to want us in their territory, we don't need to fight some other country's civil war, let them spill their own blood.

No! to the draft, no need to drag more innocent kids into the quagmire at this point. These kids did not volunteer to serve for many legitimate reasons. Our country is not in immanent danger in the veiw of many, a draft is not justified. If compulsory service is required for all additional restraints on the commander in cheif's powers should accompany it.

God's speed to those who volunteered to serve our commander in cheif's will.

If the problem is multiple deployments for our service men is the problem bring it up with someone who can make a difference, like your congressperson and commander in chief.

Surprised this thread hasn't been locked yet.

[bassin]

Just my two cents worth.
2 and a half tours in Nam. And the folks at home stoned us as we got off the plane at Travis Air Base. That was support?
You inlist to do a job. Do the best job you are sent to do.
IMHO it's those who have not served complain the loadest.
And Leave the politics out of it.

[skahorse]

Support the troops!! But I DO NOT support this war, nor any other middle eastern war.

Any other middle eastern war?? So the region is off-limits? What about other parts of the world?

I do belive it is TOTALLY unfair for the vets to expierence 2-3 tours in a row, when they signed up knowing this would not happen.

Knowing this wouldn't happen? Who said they "knew" this wouldn't happen? I know several enlisted Army soldiers who are more than willing to spend as much time as necessary to finish the job in Iraq. If you signed up for Army ground forces, or the Marines, you're kidding yourself if you think you're not going to combat. Especially if you signed up post Iraq war start. Now, some of the reports of Air Force boys running patrols outside the wire are not necessarily the way I would position different troops, but i'm also not a war educated officer.

I will ONLY support a draft if we are flat-out invaded on our home soil, and our country was in a total state of emergency.

Too me, this would be HIGHLY irresponsible of our gov't. Tune up time on a new recruit is not quick. If they see a lack of troops, and the possibility of attacks on our Home soil, they better be drafting ASAP. I would not want to think about the damage that would be done if we were under-manned at home and there are invading troops... While we wait 8 weeks to get men in place. Hope you can defend your home adequately.

The government is supposed to do what is in the intrest of the people

I believe every war that has been started by this country has been for this reason. Now, to debate the merits of "in the interest of the people" would be very difficult. But when you figure that that region has a resource we are VERY, VERY dependent on, I would say it's in our best interests to protect a claim of that resource. While I'm not saying this is a "Blood for Oil" war (and I know you may or may not be either), could you imagine if oil prices doubled, tripled, or even quadrupled from what they are now?!? The economic instability, depression, looting, rioting, etc... I would consider protecting that in our interest...

And while the pursuit of alternative fuels is much needed, it's long way off from relieving us of middle east dependance.

and if the people dont believe in an unjust war, and recruitment rates are down, maybe our government should recondsider what they have started. Having a draft to force citizens to fight a war they, by majority know is unjust, is an attack on our democratic princibles.

Where is the data that shows the majority consider this an unjust war? I know approval ratings are down for the administration, and the war, but theres a huge difference between that and a "majority that know it is unjust"(ie, criminal). My personal approval rating of both are down, and I would say so in a poll asking as much, but I wouldn't call it unjust. I think we should be attacking harder, with more forces.

--Ska

[Jaws]

Originally Posted by Chrome Bumper

Surprised this thread hasn't been locked yet.

It will be now. Thanks

[12244]

After stumbling last night upon an old thread where ifishers took some soldiers fishing, I hope this thread goes on, like it is. Topic: Soldiers.

[RichH]

Originally Posted by Jaws

It will be now. Thanks

Why? Disagreeing is not a reason to lock as long as things are kept civil.

[retiredgal]

Originally Posted by RichH

Why? Disagreeing is not a reason to lock as long as things are kept civil.

Thanks!

Different ideas, values and such, still allow all of us to get along and try to find consensus is one of the things that has made us such a great country. I respect all your different views on this topic and many are food for further thought. I think calm discussion of different ideas is good for all us and allows a person to measure their stance for validity.

[12244]

Your welcome, and thank you for a good thread. Here is a very recent comment from a real soldier on Q the photographers work in honoring the fallen.

SPC Thomas Holliday March 4, 2007 2:22 pm (Pacific time)

"Q, I really appreciate what you do for the one percent of the american public, the men and women of our armed forces. I am a soldier currently serving on active duty with the Army. I have been to Iraq and have lost a few close friends including SGT John T. Bubeck this last Christmas day. Whether or not if you can agree with this global war on terrorism or not, do agree that every man and woman in uniform is doing what they volenteered to do, protect the american way of life. That is what I do everyday as a soldier and that is what all the soldiers whom gave their lifes for. Thanks again" SPC Thomas Holliday, US Soldier

Originally Posted by retiredgal

Thanks!

Different ideas, values and such, still allow all of us to get along and try to find consensus is one of the things that has made us such a great country. I respect all your different views on this topic and many are food for further thought. I think calm discussion of different ideas is good for all us and allows a person to measure their stance for validity.

[diamondfish]

I saw this thread and wanted to get a comment in before it was locked. As a combat vet having served in Iraq, I myself would rather return for a second or third tour in the middle east, than see someone who has never witnessed combat, exposed to it.

I guess its my way of shielding those who dont need to be exposed to the things over there. I will grant you, when we sign on the dotted line we assume the possibility of being deployed.....or redeployed. We know it, we accept it, but when it comes down to it, nobody wants to experience it.

It is a life changing experience, there is no better way to explain it.

[Yamhillbilly]

My little brother is a career soldier, 2 tours in Afganistan and is currently on his 3rd visit to Iraq. Even after all he has seen and experienced he is committed to the mission and believes in what he is doing. He has shared his feelings that to pull out now, mission incomplete, would mean a need to return later to finish what was started. I am concerned for his safety and that of his brothers in arms. I would hesitate to contradict the opinion of one who has first hand knowledge and taken the risks such as he has.
I would love to have him home and safe, but he has made his choice. Ican only live with it.
He has my complete and unwavering support.

[johndeeregreen]

Untill we can kill ALL the bad guys we can't win any war.
With that being said lets dig out some old A-Bombs and get this war over.

[Cool Texan]

Originally Posted by johndeeregreen

With that being said lets dig out some old A-Bombs and get this war over.

Yeah, screw the innocent women and children who have nothing to do with any of this and wish more than we do that it would just end.

[Just_learning]

Yeah. Lets just bomb every body...and then bomb ourselves, then blow the world up! And maybe all the other planets just in case...except Pluto, its not really a planet anyways.

[johndeeregreen]

Sorry about your nerve I hit Tex but we all have are own opinions. I could throw some more out there but the mods. would have them gone in the blink of a eye.
It's not that I don't care about kids, I DO but I was saying how we can win. Lets remember IT IS WAR not a game of checkers.

[PapaHog]

Quote:
Originally Posted by norms gone fishing too
how soon we forget before veitnam there were no tours. you went tell the job was finshed. i too say bring our boys home from this mess

Norm

Originally Posted by Bait Bucket

That wasn't the case at all. Tours of duty varied throughout the conflict from one year to 13 months. Lot's of draftees did the one tour for one year. "Lifers" like me did multiple tours at different lengths.

Bait bucket, notice the before Vietnam. Like Koera, WW2, WW1 and the Civil war me tinks.

[RichH]

Originally Posted by johndeeregreen

Untill we can kill ALL the bad guys we can't win any war.
With that being said lets dig out some old A-Bombs and get this war over.

I feel that we need to complete our mission over there but this is truly never a valid option. That technology really has no place on this planet if you remotely care for anyone other than yourself.

[Chrome Bumper]

Originally Posted by Just_learning

Yeah. Lets just bomb every body...and then bomb ourselves, then blow the world up! And maybe all the other planets just in case...except Pluto, its not really a planet anyways.

Let's just nuke Pluto in a small way, its now categorized as a dwarf planet. Don't forget Ceres and Eris too. (Don't dwarves come in sets of seven?)

[flapbreaker]

Just wondering out loud here. I would think that having guys/gals in the field who have "iraq experience" would be quite valuable and far more effecient than replacing the workforce all the time.

I do think that the reservists might be getting the short end of the stick though. Most had regular jobs, family and mortgages. From what I remember the rules were changed on them, but I could be wrong about that.

[PapaHog]

Originally Posted by basin

Just my two cents worth.
2 and a half tours in Nam. And the folks at home stoned us as we got off the plane at Travis Air Base. That was support?
You enlist to do a job. Do the best job you are sent to do.
IMHO it's those who have not served complain the loudest.
And Leave the politics out of it.

Before we got off the plane at San Francisco international airport we were told to change into civilian clothes because they would spit on you at the airport.

If we changed we could not fly home on reduced fare so most of us had to endure this because we could not afford to fly full fare.

I had just come from the worst week of fighting of the whole tour and it would have been a mistake for someone to spit on me. Thank goodness that did not happen to me. I was yelled at and called names but not spit on.

You might ask if I would go again? You betcha, Duty honor and country.

[johndeeregreen]

Originally Posted by RichH

I feel that we need to complete our mission over there but this is truly never a valid option. That technology really has no place on this planet if you remotely care for anyone other than yourself.

I'm not sure about how you think because I think I like my families safety more than I like the bad guys who want us dead. Lets not forget 911.
Thank you PAPA for your time spent fighting the bad guys.

[Cool Texan]

You're right JDG...we should nuke this bad guy...

[johndeeregreen]

Ok Tex do you think we can win this war we are in now. I don't care if you agree or not with it. DO YOU THINK WE CAN WIN IT yes or no.

Oh I said A-Bomb I'm sorry I ment H-Bomb. I dont like radiation

[RichH]

Originally Posted by johndeeregreen

I'm not sure about how you think because I think I like my families safety more than I like the bad guys who want us dead. Lets not forget 911.
Thank you PAPA for your time spent fighting the bad guys.

Well, by that logic we need to bomb North Korea, Iran, Somalia, Iraq, the French don't like us much and that girl I ticked off in high school.


All kidding aside though, once you start when does it stop?

I can't condone nuclear force ever being used again. If we can't win by conventional means then maybe we don't deserve to win.

And I will second your thanks to all who have or will serve in our armed forces. Words truly are never enough.

[Queeg]

Originally Posted by johndeeregreen

I'm not sure about how you think because I think I like my families safety more than I like the bad guys who want us dead. Lets not forget 911.

"9/11" justifies invading Afghanistan - - - Iraq? No.

[Just_learning]

CT-
I wouldnt be too sure? Arent some Haz. Wastes disposed of in yellow bags? QUICK! Shoot now, ask questions later.

[Cool Texan]

Originally Posted by RichH

and that girl I ticked off in high school.

That is crazy talk....she's American. Cant we just kick her cat instead??

[johndeeregreen]

Dear guys=Hey this is fun and all and I could go for hours but I got to go to work.
Love = Torey

P.S. Keep it coming. My skin is thick.

[Got One!]

I dont see anything wrong with 2 tours, when you join the military this is what you do. Just like any other job ya fix it till it aint broke no more.

This said, remember what happened during the Clinton years. I have friends that were run out of the miltary that had years of experience, bases were shut down all over, and they were all thrown out before their pesions popped up.

Somalia 12 years ago, anti-Iraq war Democrat, Rep. John Murtha urged then-President Clinton to begin a complete pullout of U.S. troops from the region.
Clinton took the advice and ordered the withdrawal - a decision that Osama bin Laden would later credit with emboldening his terrorist fighters and encouraging him to mount further attacks against the U.S.

In a 1998 interview with ABC's John Miller, Osama bin Laden said that America's withdrawal from Somalia had emboldened his burgeoning al Qaida force and encouraged him to plan new attacks.
"Our people realize[d] more than before that the American soldier is a paper tiger that run[s] in defeat after a few blows," the terror chief recalled. "America forgot all about the hoopla and media propaganda and left dragging their corpses and their shameful defeat."

So no for your child sake no, get more troops again and finish this now while they are weak because if it isnt crushed now your grandchilden are going to be in a world of hurt.

[Chrome Bumper]

Think these kids need nuking too?


The terrorist set fire to stock piles of sulphur weighing 5 or 6 megatons next to their home within a day of me taking this picture, nuking may be unnecessary. Terrorists where pretty scarce under Suddam's reign. BTW many of or boys get hurt or killed putting out the fires.

[JustCallMeDave]

Fifty three posts into it, is it too late to ask where this Irag place is?

[RODACTION]

Just a stones throw from Irun

[flapbreaker]

Originally Posted by Chrome Bumper

Terrorists where pretty scarce under Suddam's reign.

This statement is misleading. As long as you were from Saddam's clan you had less to worry about. There was plenty of **** and torture to go around under his rule. I'm not trying to justify the U.S. actions but feel like people have incredibly turned Saddam into Mother Theresa.

[3riversBob]

First:

Retired Gal........Thank you for starting such a thought provoking thread. I understand your position and it does seem like one tour of duty is enough for anyone.

Second:

Ifishers.......Thank you so much for keeping this thread, for the most part, civil and close to on topic. And thank you Mods for allowing this to continue as there are some post that are teetering on the edge but for the most some great views being shared.

From my perspective..........................

The fall of 2005 while my boy was a senior in high school he decided he wanted to join the Army. We had discussions of what he wanted to do and I reminded him that we ARE at war and if he joins he WILL go to war. "I understand!", he said, "I know I will go and that is what I want to do".

In June of '06', he shipped out to Ft. Benning, Georgia for Basic Training. He completed Basic, went the next week to Airborne Jump School, and a week after Jump School started and completed Ranger Training. He is currently stationed at Ft. Lewis, Washington.

I attended his graduation from Basic training and while there talked with several Drill sergeants (sp). To the man they said that they would rather be in Irag doing what they are trained to do than be home training new recruits. They understand the need for training and so they do what they have to do but if given a chance they would be signing up for another tour.

My boy will deploy to Iraq in June for his first tour. His unit just returned in January and are training and preparing for their return in June. They all understand the need to return home and rest and train but what they are trained for is war and that is what they want to do. They WANT to go back!

In my eyes not going at all is the perfect scenerio. If they must go, I would be tickled to daylights if it were only one tour. The reality of it is that they are doing what they signed up for and they wouldn't have it any other way.

I am so damned proud of my son for what he is doing and will continue to support him and pray for him every day until his safe return home. I will do the same for all the men and women that are serving. I hold the men and women of our Armed Forces that are serving and have served in the highest esteem and thank them from the bottom of my heart for their sacrifices.

Is 2-3 tours in Iraq wrong?

I don't believe, as others have stated, that it is wrong, given that those serving are there of their own volition.

The exception maybe, are those men and women who served their country, and then as reservists, were called back and did a tour. Enough for them!

If those serving were of a draft then they too might be an exception. But since there is no draft at this time it is a mute point.


Sorry if I rambled, I will admit I have been very emotionally involved all day reading this thread and as I have been typing this been tearing up.


Thanks,
Bob

[Uglygreen]

I can't condone nuclear force ever being used again. If we can't win by conventional means then maybe we don't deserve to win.

Rich, that is an interesting statement. Would you say the use of Nuclear bombs was justified in WW2?

- Brad

[FROGGY]

Most the guys I served with while in the military are still in. My best friend is returning for tour #3 on friday. He wants to go back.
I think most of the active duty military feel that way.
So 2 or more tours is wrong? Not according to my friends, or a majority of the military.
Us folk back here sitting on our behinds are the only people that have a problem with it.

[PapaHog]

3riversBob, Good post and thank God for men like your boy. God Bless