They stole a Elk - 4x4 bull

[dewfish]

They stole a bull, or did they. This is the question I put to you the reader. If you find a elk or the blood trail to it. Would you let the hunters in the area know about it.? That are looking for it.These hunters waited for night fall to claim there prize. They even had the gall to tell people they shot it. The story go like this; Opening morning my son and friend are with me in route to our hunting spot. The elk are in the road a 1/4 mile from where i park to walk in. The boys get out walk up the road and into a clear cut to get a look at the elk. I hear three shots and they are starting to now walk back to the truck. They are happy, excited that they both shot at bulls. I park and get ready to pack. I let the guys know there is a road at the bottom to pack to. We get down there and no elk. I find blood going SW but not alot. Toms bull is going West. We start tracking one bull loose blood 200 yards out. start swinging loops, wider and wider. The one bull the 5x5 is heading up hill. I send them up and across hopeing to cut the bull or blood. There real close and a woman from Forest Grove shots and kills the bull. My son had hit the bull in the rear flank or quarter. We now have four guys looking for the shot bulls. Cant find blood on the smaller bull. Thought we saw him once close to howards camp road. Cant find either elk. Well one of the camps near beaverdam that hunt the area found blood crossing the road and waited for night fall to get the bull we shot out of the woods. First off. Would you say anything to anyone in helping said hunters get there elk. Second would you say that you shot it. I have a big problem understanding hunters ethics like this. Yes i have found elk others have shot. Yes I have waited for hunters to come claim the elk they just shoot at earlier. Im mad that i could not find either bull. Im glad both bulls where found. I dont like unethical hunters. I wish I found both the bulls we shot.

[gottafish]

Well Im not a rifle hunter But I thought they dropped animals a lot quicker than that Ive never had a bow shot elk go over 200 yards. If you put it in the pump house you /son would have found it much closer. DO you agree?? Look Its a crappy deal your boy lost his elk to someone else. Id chalk it up to a learning experiance. and tell him to be darn sure of the shot. The texas heart shot shouldn't have happened. IMHO More than likely the elk took off and they shot at bulls running away.Right???

[Hogwild]

I'm sorry to hear your son and friend lost their elk but IMO from what I just read no I don't think the elk were stolen. I do think there were several mistakes made by either excitement, lack of experience or both which seemed to have cost them their elk. My first thoughts are "why" once they shot the elk did they leave the area and head back to the truck? I could see that once the elk were down 1 of the 2 going to get help but not both. If the elk takes off and runs in front of some one else it's theirs to do with what they want.

Since I do not know the age or skill level of the hunters/shooters I have to wonder why a plan was not laid out prior to the hunt what should be done if they were to shoot a bull. IMO the lady had every right to shoot and drop the bull followed by tagging it. Maybe she could see or tell the bull had already been hit maybe she could not tell I don't know because I was not there. In any case a wounded elk can travel a long ways and who knows if the original shooter is even tracking it, lost it's track or has the skills to do so.

As for the other bull that crossed the road and was taken out at night. Once again I was not there but is it possible the "other" hunters who waited till dark to get the bull out were waiting to see if the original shooters were trying to track it down? Could the bull they took out after dark have been a different bull that they indeed shot?

[98ramtough]

Sorry to hear about your boys missing nice bulls but it sounds like the 5x5 was wounded and someone else cleaned it up. You say you never found blood on the 4x4? I don't see anything wrong that the other people did except some poor shooting. Two nice wounded bulls is a lot of wasted meat, glad someone found them. Sucks it wasn't you...


Mike

[sooslaw]

Not to be critical, but I agree with others. The boys sound like they made bad shots. If the elk are in the clearcut and in the open, they might have had time for a better shot?? If an elk comes wandering by and I am in the woods during elk season with a tag, I am going to shoot it too. If after I shoot it and discover it had been shot, what do I do, sit around and wait for some hunter to show up that may not? Good lesson learned for the boys. Tough way to learn it, but thats life. It would be a shame for either or both of those elk to rot away in the woods, thank god for hunters roaming the woods. Sorry about your luck this season, get out there and find another one before its over!

[baltz526]

here is what i envision from your story, two inexperienced hunters (we where all them once) walk up on a heard while walking up a road, got excited and made bad shots (guns do not shoot magic bullets) then do to the inexperience, did not immediately go after these crippled elk agressively. this was done in a heavily hunted area, where lots of other hunters where hunting elk. these other hunters where just cleaning up the mistakes. the woman did the right thing, if the other hunters took the other elk, knowing you where looking for it, after finding it dead. they are theives, but the problem started at the shots. buy each hunter a shooting stick, or mono pod and make them practice shooting in hunting situations. next time, the elk will be dead where they shoot at them( if everything else works correctly)

[ehunter]

I agree with every what every one else said. People go crazey over elk worse than deer. If the shots had been better there would be no discussion. I think the woman did the right thing as to the other hunters not sure if they were trying to steal the elk you could not find or lucked out?? For me if I know that you had shot it and I found it I would have let you know. I have done this on elk during bow season. I think it is a unfornuate (sp) lesson learned but I am glad the elk were found. I wish you guys better luck next time...

[burnsfactor]

I'd have to agree with others. The Woman was right on. The other guys if they knew you had shot it and they found it, should have let you know. We had a wounded elk running around one year that a Sixteen year old shot. It runs by us and a guy I was talking too pulls up and kills it. We could see it was shot ( in a bad spot). The Kid and dad comes walking up. You could see the depressed look on the kids face. The guy I was talking too turns to him and says you better tag your elk son. The kid said thank you about fifty times. His first elk. Just to show you there are good guys out there! The boys like Baltz said made some mistakes. Make sure of your shot. They should have followed, finished the job, and tagged the aninals. Even if they dumped them right on the spot they shouldn't have walked back to the truck 1/4 mile. That just asking for someone else to tag the elk. It's a unfortunate lession but I bet one that they remember. Pat

[Chesapeake]

I myself havent bean in that type of situation but when it does happen I will claim my elk based on wheather or not my shot was a good kill shot. As for the 5x5 it sounds like it wasnt, so to me the elk is the womans.

As for the other elk I think we can also assume this wasnt a good kill shot because you couldnt find the animal.

"Well one of the camps near beaverdam that hunt the area found blood crossing the road and waited for night fall to get the bull we shot out of the woods."

This comment sounds like hearsay (sp?) to me. I would be interested in thier take on the situation.

[corrirod]

Ditto what everyone else has said. The boys will hopefully take this to heart and learn from it. Make sure to get the right shot and this issue never comes up. Glad the elk were found and not wasted.

[Rip'N'Lips]

It would appear from your post that you had lost the trail on the animals. My question for you would be, would it better for someone else to get them or to lose them and have them die and rot...

Teach the boys that it is there responsibility to humanely dispatch the animal. If they had the time to pick out their bulls, they had time to take good shots. If they don't shoot enough, get them to the range before next season.

It is a tough lesson, but I would rather hear that both animals were recovered, than seeing another post about lost elk...

Rip'N'Lips

[Rank Amateur]

I pretty much agree with the rest too. The only thing I would have a problem with is if the second group knew I was looking for my bull and had seen the blood and kept quiet. Then again if I can't track, maybe I don't deserve the bull to begin with. Definately a learning experience and a reason I try to hunt the brush, very seldom ever happens out there, but like you said you were just driving to your hunting spot and that can happen to anybody.

[jvp]

more range practice is in order

[johndeeregreen]

Sorry about there luck and your anger, but you are going to have to get over it and come to the fact that the elk were not the boys because they had there bullets in them. They need to be taught to relax and take good shots.

[beardbuster]

Boy, this is a tough one, but everyone who posted a response has hit the nail on the head. If a wounded elk is running through the woods, no body has a clue who shot it or how far it has been running. An hunter would put the animal down. If someone was in hot pursuit of the animal and knew where they hit it, they by all means I would let them tag it.

Just because you "hit" an animal does not make it yours. I do feel bad for the boys. They should have made better shots and I am sure they will be practicing a lot more. I hope they are reading these posts.

I would not label it stealing unless you had hard evidence of people intentionally removing the animals with a confrontation.

I know its hard to swallow, but I did not find anything wrong with what the other hunters did.

[ElkMaster78]

Hi, if the boys don't have some steady sticks get them some. They are great and will take some of that bull fever shake out of their shots.
Pole Cat makes some good sticks.
Tony

[Crayfin]

I guess I am still wondering about the 5x5. You said that the boys were close enough to know that a woman shot it and that they knew where they hit it? They were on the trail and came up on the final resting place with her standing over it? If that is the case...................then she should have handed over the bull. Regardless of where they shot it (I agree with the masses on this one--they need a little more practice) they were actively pursuing the critter and where making efforts to put an end to the chase. There is nothing saying that they would not have caught up to it and done just that. I have put several shots into elk for people and have had it done for me once and at no time was there any questions as to who was going to put their tag on it.

I guess it is a judgment call....but from what I can gather--they were making the effort to do the right thing. Had it been me--I would have probably helped them gut it/pack it out and talk to them about trying to make good decisions when shooting at critters

[Lucky one]

A little practice never hurt anyone in the shooting department. But even when you put good shots on elk they can go a long ways. I had a deer go five hundred yards hit hard in the vitals this year. I was shooting a 7mm. The bullet just passed right through without mushrooming. The deer had to bleed out before it died. When you go hunting sometimes you just have bad luck.

Learn from the experience and next time hopefully things will go better.

[Northwest Pest]

I agree with the majority.....sorry for your boys loss.

[Quaka Wacka]

Bummer deal.. but I too see no wrongdoing. And its a much better ending than two elk you know you hit going to waste. The biggest lesson besides practice and make the first shot count, is aggressivily follow and finish a wounded animal.

[Buck Fever]

Just out of curiosity, what caliber were the rifles? And how far were the shots?

[mcknerkneykak]

"((My son had hit the bull in the rear flank or quarter. ))"

Elk don't go very far before laying down when shot in a hind quarter.
Personally I'd have given the bull some time to bed and stiffen up before going after him--If I knew that I'd hit him in the rear quarter. (I am drawing my opinion from about 40 years of elk hunting experience.)
On the other hand If I was hunting in a crowded area I might push the bull harder. (Key word is might.)
Lots of unknowns here. Kind of a tough judgement call.

[SlyHawk]

Originally Posted by Quaka Wacka

Bummer deal.. but I too see no wrongdoing. And its a much better ending than two elk you know you hit going to waste. The biggest lesson besides practice and make the first shot count, is aggressivily follow and finish a wounded animal.

I agree fully. Seem's to me that there wasn't any immediate follow through on their part. if you shoot at an animal and it doesn't go right down, check it out. Go to where the animal was when you shot, look for blood etc. and track it. Stay on it until you're convinced that you made a bad shot, or find the animal. If someone else happens on the wounded animal before you do, and finishes it off, it's theirs. Let them have the Texas heartshot, and shoot better next time.

[blacktail519]

Well Im not a rifle hunter But I thought they dropped animals a lot quicker than that Ive never had a bow shot elk go over 200 yards. If you put it in the pump house you /son would have found it much closer. DO you agree?? Look Its a crappy deal your boy lost his elk to someone else. Id chalk it up to a learning experiance. and tell him to be darn sure of the shot. The texas heart shot shouldn't have happened. IMHO More than likely the elk took off and they shot at bulls running away.Right???
__________________

I would have to agree.
Buy the boys a membership at the local range, and hope for a better experience in 2007.

[Super Fluke]

That really sucks.

[jv2333]

That bs. Its tough to get away from from that crap, no matter how far in the woods you go you still run into morons like that