how forgiving?

[dampainter]

I know that my god is a forgiving god, but how much? how many times can I sin...and be forgiven. there are some things that I am having a really, really hard time with.

[ 12-16-2003, 07:29 PM: Message edited by: dampainter ]

[happybrew]

I think you're asking the wrong question. You are asking how many times you can sin. We are not called to sin, though, but to repentance. The question, then, is not how many times we can sin, but what is the depth of our repentance.

1 John 2

1My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense--Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. 2He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for[1] the sins of the whole world.
3We know that we have come to know him if we obey his commands. 4The man who says, "I know him," but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5But if anyone obeys his word, God's love[2] is truly made complete in him.

This epistle has some harsh words for people who continue to sin, but these are tempered at the very beginning where he says "But if anybody does sin, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense--Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. 2He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins,". The reason he put this at the very beginning is to focus our attention on Jesus Christ. We can do nothing, absolutely nothing good without the power of God moving us. Jesus Christ is the atonement for our sins, no matter how many or how grievous, but we must access His grace through faith and through repentance.

Speaking from personal experience, only prayer and perseverence, both in virtue and in prayer, can eliminate habitual sins from our lives. If you have a problem in one area, think of the opposite of that sin, and work your darndest to cultivate that virtue, for example if you have a problem with anger, go out of your way to show kindness to people when you don't have to, so much so as to make it a habit. If you have a problem with coveting, go out of your way to exercise generosity even when you don't have to. Pray whenever you are tempted, and pray several times a day for deliverance from your temptations. We all have temptations. There was one sin that I committed that took me two years of prayer and planned, regular self-denial to stop doing it, and I've got others I still need to work on. But focusing on the sin brings it to our mind, and can increase the temptation. Don't focus on that. Focus instead on your repentance, which accesses the saving grace of Jesus Christ. Satan is the one who accuses us. Jesus blots out the ledger. Heartfelt contrition will obtain forgiveness. After that, keep that forgiveness in mind, and continue to praise God for that forgiveness, cultivate the opposite virtue, pray for the opposite virtue, pray for deliverance from your temptations, and keep your heart humble and contrite. Stay away from things that can cause you to stumble as if your life depends upon it, because it does. There will be setbacks, but don't focus on them. Repeat the process each time if you stumble, and persevere. Never give in to despair, but keep hope in your heart at all times.

God Bless

happybrew

[rob allen]

Dampainter I have had a similar problem in my life. The thing to remember is the thing I forgot is; "He who began a good work in you WILL!!!!! be faithful to complete it."

It may however not occur in what we precieve the proper timing to be. All we can do is read, do what we read and pray, and pray for eachother.

[Grantspastor]

The Bible puts no limit on the number of times God will forgive. I John 1:9 says "if we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us AND to cleanse us from unrighteousness". Here are a few thoughts.

1. Happybrew makes a good point about repentance.
If you truly seek help, God will help you get
the victory.
2. The Book of Romans says "make no provision for
the flesh"...in other words, if you are trying
to lose weight, don't leave a chocolate cake
sitting on the counter. Don't create or
tolerate opportunities that feed into the
problem
3. If you have not been baptized in water, that
is a key to overcoming sin
4. Accountablility and counsel are important
5. A simple prayer "Lord help me not to sin"
makes it a lot tougher to go ahead and sin
when you are tempted.

[dampainter]

[ 12-18-2003, 01:46 PM: Message edited by: dampainter ]

[Grantspastor]

No one is good enough to get into Heaven. There are no good deeds, acts of righteousness, avoiding sin, keep commandments, or anything else done by human effort that qualifies someone to get into Heaven. There is one way only to get into Heaven...and that is to accept the free gift of salvation offered by God. Very simply this means:
1. Acknowledging your sin
2. Believing that Jesus died in your place
3. Believing that He rose from the dead
4. Asking Him to forgive you and to save you.

The Bible simply says "all who call on the Name of the Lord will be saved" and "if you believe in your heart and confess with your mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord" you will be saved.

There's more to living a victorious christian life, but as far as salvation is concerned it is really that simple. The Bible says that when you put your faith in Jesus, He changes you inside.
He actually makes you into a "new creation".

Without this experience it isn't possible to become what God wants you to be. People can change their behavior on the outside, but only God can change us on the inside.

[PayDay]

It's hard to believe that something that determines your eternity can be so simple... but as Grantspastor said very well, it really is that simple. God doesn't make things complicated.


Believe and ask, that's it. Salvation is a free gift that he doesn't take back, but you have to reach out and accept it. You can know for sure.

The rest of the road is up to God and you to work out together as you get to know him better. Temptation will always be there and everyone struggles with it at times, but some of the strongest Christians I know have come from some pretty dark places and God just works miraculous changes in their lives. You can do things to not put yourself in the place to be tempted, but once you establish the relationship you'll begin to recognize that he is with you all the time, and it's a lot easier just to turn away when you're faced with tempation.

Take Care.

[DAB]

1 John 1:8-2:1 NIV
8 If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word has no place in our lives.


1 John 1:8-10 NKJV
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

1 John 1:8-2:1 NASB(UD)
8 If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.

9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us.

1 John 1:8-10 Greek new Testament
8 Eán eípoomen hóti hamartían ouk échomen heautoús planoómen kaí hee aleétheia ouk éstin en heemín

9 Eán homologoómen tás hamartías heemoón pistós estin kaí díkaios hína afeé heemín tás hamartías kaí katharísee heemás apó pásees adikías

10 Eán eípoomen hóti ouch heemarteékamen pseústeen poioúmen autón kaí ho lógos autoú ouk éstin en heemín
(Copyright (c)1966, 1968, 1975, 1983 by the United Bible Societies)

In these verses I do not see a limit on how many times GOD will forgive you, only that He promises to forgive if we confess our sins to Him.
ICL DAB

[ 12-18-2003, 01:49 PM: Message edited by: DAB ]

[happybrew]

dampainter: check your private messages.

happybrew

[Private-Aye-Fish]

John 3-17 For God did not send his son into the world to condemn the world but to save the world through him.

Thank you Jesus!

Phil