Keeper Sturgeon,Ocean or River, that is the ?

[Tacklebuster]

Let's revisit this subject shall we.....

I have read posts and talked to tons of people, guides, and lastly myself on this subject and have compiled a few things to help seperate the facts from the myths on telling the two apart. Keep this in mind that this is my opinion and my opinion only based on what I have learned over the last seven seasons of keeping and eating fish on various sections of the river.

Color- Most people you talk to will tell you if the fish is more of a "white" color it is an ocean fish. Myth in my opinion. Water temp plays an important part on the color of the fish. Just about every river fish you catch in mid to upper thirty degree water will be "white" and fresh looking.

Scutes- Most people will tell you that an ocean keeper has sharp scutes while a river keeper does not. Myth in my opinion. Oversize fish fresh from the ocean follow shad in from the ocean and spawn every year. When is the last time you caught a peeler with razor sharp scutes? I catch numerous amounts every year in the gorge and am very hard pressed to get one with sharp scutes. Granted some are resident fish but a lot are fresh from the ocean. How many twenty to thirty inch resident river fish do you catch with dull scutes? Most of them are sharp enough to shave with. I have caught keeper sturgeon in the estuary with dull scutes that were fat and the bellies have been full of "needle fish", anchovies, and herring. Most resident river keepers have mud in their bellies.

Weight- Ocean fish will be fat as a rule of thumb. They eat a lot better than river fish do this time of year and it will show when you catch one. River fish keepers tend to be on the skinny side from not having the feed the ocean fish have.

Belly color- Most ocean keepers you will see have white bellies. Most resident river keepers will have a yellowish tint to their bellies.

Most if not all of your keepers, whether ocean or river, have spent a majority of their lives in the river anyway. A lot of your keepers migrate in and out of the rivers all the time so labeling some can be impossible.

The table fare has alot to do with what the sturgeon have been feeding on and how you take care of the meat before it hits the table. Fish that have been sucking mud for a couple of months before they become your dinner will not be very tasty, I don't care if you catch the thing three miles offshore in the mighty Pacific. Fish that have been eating smelt, anchovies, herring, etc. and are very healthy and are taken care of properly can't be beat.

Prepare your fish- Instead of hanging your fish by a rope and dragging it around for hours before you finally bleed it, skip the first part and bleed your fish the moment you decide to keep it. The more the fish swims around on a rope and gets yarded in and out of the boat the worse it's going to taste. When a fish is stressed out it will let of chemicals which can effect the way it taste. Bleed you fish and put it on ice, the meat will be firmer and will taste much better.

Be sure and trim everything off the fillets except for the white meat. Let the fillets sit on ice for at least 24 hours before you eat or freeze it. This will let the fillets drain and set up. This will also make the taste much milder. Soak your fillets in milk for about four hours before you cook them. The taste, if done right, is night and day compared to a fish that has been drug around all day, cleaned, and then Vac Packed.

You guys and gals be safe this winter and enjoy the fishery. I'll see you on the water.

[ 01-31-2004, 03:27 PM: Message edited by: Tacklebuster ]

[STGRule]

Everything sounds about right to me. I do however think you may correct about the color, but for a different reason. We routinely pull snow white-bellied, light gray fish from 74-degree water in the pools above Bonneville dam. I have seen sturgeon kept in cold spring water in hatcheries that are black as coal because the water is shallow and clear. It appears to be a function of light rather than temperature. Cold water is usually found during the winter months when high run off muddies up the water inhibiting light penetration. Ocean fish generally are in deep enough water to lose the dark pigmentation that occurs. I think they just "tan up" when in clearer, shallow water.

[hookumhi]

Thanks for the info

[Fish Hawg]

Water temp plays an important part on the color of the fish. Just about every river fish you catch in mid to upper thirty degree water will be "white" and fresh looking.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">Two weeks ago My brother and I caught 30+ shakers in 35'-65' of 35deg water on the columbia. Maybe five out of the 30 were white, fat, and razor sharp. The rest were dark dull snakes.

I cant wait for more Input

Tacklebuster, Great topic ....Ross

[ 01-31-2004, 03:45 PM: Message edited by: Fish Hawg ]

[Fshklr]

Interesting observation STGRule.
I have always liked the LIGHT colored ones over the darkies usually with sharper scutes as well.
Have you also noticed darkies with that salt look with sharp scutes?
If it's 45 to 60 I'm going to tag her what ever she looks like

[Waterfish]

Tackbuster, I've read other posts on Ifish that also said that they taste better if you don't drag them around all day and then bleed them at the end of the day. So... how do you handle a keeper that you catch in the morning? If you bleed it after you catch it, do you fillet it on the boat? By law, would that be legal? Wouldn't you have to keep the carcass in case Fish & Game wanted to measure it? Or do you bleed it, gut it, and put the whole fish in a humongious ice chest that you carry on your boat? One more question: If you catch a keeper at the end of the day and take it straight home to fillet it, is there any reason to gut the fish?

[ 01-31-2004, 03:53 PM: Message edited by: Waterfish ]

[David Johnson]

Waterfish,

No reason to gut a sturgeon at all, just bleed it. Fillet it with guts in. Put it on ice whole in a large cooler.

It is illegal to fillet on the water.

[ 01-31-2004, 03:58 PM: Message edited by: David Johnson ]

[David Johnson]

I like the idea of bleeding the fish right away as it would keep people from "high grading"

STG-please fill people in on high grading.

[ 01-31-2004, 04:01 PM: Message edited by: David Johnson ]

[Waterfish]

David, I have one of those big white Igloo ice chests that Fisherman's sale. I just measured the interior of it, and it is 34" long. This ice chest already takes up a fair amount of room in the back of my boat. I suppose I could curl up a sturgeon in it (maybe?), but one of the bigger keepers, in the upper 50 inch range would be pretty tricky. Not to mention having room for ice or TWO keepers. So how big of an ice chest do you carry on your boat?

[Taildragger]

Is it true that the bigger fish usually dont taste as good as the smaller ones?

[Salmonator]

If you look though that mud in their stomachs (and coming out of other places) you'll find their dinner in there. Usually hundreds of 1/4 to 1/2" clams mixed through all of it. Some of the biggest tastiest sturgies I've caught in the estuary were packed with mud. It just happens to be what they were feeding on at that time or tide. As far as fish size I honestly think the bigger fish taste better but I may just be biased because there's more meat :grin:

[STGRule]

High grading is one of the more despicable things that some so-called sport-fishers do. They keep a fish tethered to their boats or the shore with a rope through the gills “just in case” they catch a bigger one. The rope abrades the gill tissues, killing the tissue and it can also cause the fish to bleed out as the rope tears the gill tissue. The cortisol (stress hormone) builds up in the fish and can reach lethal levels. Even if they keep the fish, the flesh quality has been compromised. Worse yet is if they let it go because they catch a bigger one. After release the fish may swim off at first but will likely die from being unable to respirate efficiently from the gill damage. Sorta like removing part of your lungs and sending you on your way. If they lose too much blood it will also be fatal. High cortisol levels cause a number of health problems and can also kill the fish. That is why it is against the law to high grade fish

[David Johnson]

[img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img] Thank you STG

It just makes me sick to hear somebody talking about how they were high-grading. Their argument is how tough the fish are. [img]graemlins/berry.gif[/img] I know/knew they are killing all those fish.

Ya hear guys talk about the time "uncle so and so brought home a sturgeon that had sat in the truck for two hours and then they put in the bath tub and it was swimming around...." I've always said, "ya, it might be alive but I'm sure it had brain damage or something...."

[David Johnson]

Waterfish,

I thought you had a big boat? I've got one of those big, huge coolers. Not sure what size it is but I think it's 105 quarts

I haven't packed it around in the boat for sturgeon, yet, but I have used it for salmon and steelhead for summer steelhead and chinook. It holds a bunch of fish and lots of ice.

[Waterfish]

David, No my boat is not very big, it's only 17.5 feet long. Scroll back a few pages or do a search on a thread called "Do you have an old boat?". That first boat is mine. It looks like it's bigger than 17.5 feet but thats' just an optical illusion. So if you haven't used your 105 qt cooler for sturgeon, do you have another cooler that will hold a 60" fish?

[Tacklebuster]

I forget the quart size of my cooler but most coolers I see on the back of sleds will work. Bleed your fish then put it in the cooler. You will have to bend the fish to make it fit but it will fit if you make it. I have put three good fat keepers in my cooler more times than I care to count.

Don't gut your fish unless you like making a mess. I do sometimes check and see what they have been feeding on.

In the estuary the fish should have bait fish along with small clams in their stomach. In the stretches of river around Portland or St. Helens their bellies are sometimes full of mud. I will promise you it makes a difference.

[Biteme]

River fish or Ocean fish? They are the same fish. Sturgeon migrate with the food sources. The only "river fish" are the small ones that havent grown big enough to start moving up and down the river. While some will hang up high in the river longer they will all go to the salt water if there isnt a dam in the way when the food sources dry up and the water temps rise.

[Salmonator]

I suppose if they're eating anything out of the mud regularly out of the Portland/St.Helens area they're going to taste like doo-doo (yes I've tasted a freshwater clam ). Funny thing is I can never remember catching a sturgeon with baitfish in their stomachs in the estuary though I doubt I searched them all. They've almost all been packed with mud and clams which would make sense since most were caught in 10' depth or less and caught with bait on the bottom where the mud happens to be. I'm sure the mud and clams in the estuary are much tastier than the stuff just downstream of swan island and the portland sewage treatment plant. [img]graemlins/dork.gif[/img]

[Tacklebuster]

The estuary fish will have some clams and a little grit in their bellies but they are also full of baitfish, at least the ones I open are.

It's like eating a deer. If you shoot one in the mountains compared to a grain fed deer you shot on Uncle Ernie's farm, your going to notice a big difference in the taste of your steaks, at least I do.