Conservation (Constipation) in the White House?

[DK]

relax ray, old jed in florida has it handled

[garyk]

Ray --

You can put your fears to rest. In Oregon, conservation rules, especially Federal rules, are not funded by license fees.

[Net Boy]

From what I understand about the Million Mom March, it was not to encourage all guns being removed from hunting Americans. Rosie does good things for kids, as a new father I feel that there needs to be better gun control to help protect our kids. Gore's lawyers will not need to elect him, the popular vote of Americans has come close to doing that. Now let's see if the electorial college can do the same. I do hope Gore can pull this out. I also hope the rivers rise soon so we can talk about fishing.

[Ray Wilcken]

I am all for conservation of fisheries and hunting grounds but not to the extent that I believe Al Gore will go (If his lawyers elect him)in making it more difficult for anyone to fish and hunt! After all he sided with Rosie O'Dumbo in the Million Mom march. If Rosie had her way all hunting would be done away with! I believe Gore will regulate states so much with new conservation rules that fishing and hunting licenses will go through the roof!

[Ray Wilcken]

The popular vote is still out! Millions of votes still to be counted! Remains to be seen if Gore will win it!

[fishhead5]

Dont get me started on better gun controll. Why don't they work as hard as getting drunks off the road. They would save a lot more lives, probably clean out too much in Washington DC.

If a person misspells a word is it the pencils fault?

[Ray Wilcken]

Those same activists that talk about gun control are in the same camp as those that are in animal/fish activist camp. These are the kinds of nuts that want to protect anything from flies to the fish and deer we catch and hunt. If you want the government to regulate gun control they will regulate everything else too! Look what they just did in California taking more land away from the state and putting it under the National Government control. If you think that the government can't effect your state and your fishing hunting rights you better think about it again!

[Net Boy]

Ray & Fishhead,

Sounds like you guys need to go fishing and relax a little. Go Gore!

[nivtup]

Gun Control v. The ability to hit your target with the first shot.

J/K

Control starts in the home. We only need the government to take care of the things that we cant seem to manage on our own. Teach your children to respect guns and the lives of others.

Keep your guns locked in a safe place, remember always that your kids are smarter than you think and probably know where you hide the keys.

If we take care of gun control then the government can quit worrying about it.

[THE REEL HEY_YALL]

Gun control to me is simply a one handed rest or two handed rest? Life's fickle questions.

As far as keeping drunks off the road??? What the hell is up with that? It's not congress or legislation that keeps them off the road, it's the driver, and it's law enforcement. I have had 2 DUI's and both were so messed up because of the way they were handled, and your "legislation" to keep drunks off the road still has me waiting on getting a driver's license that by law should have been reinstated almost 2 years ago. Just because I relocated states/jobs each state has it's own BS about it's driving privileges. I don't believe in drunk driving at all, but for someone to have 2 drinks and get a DUI is BS! But as a firm believer in "the Lord works in mysterious ways" if someone passes away at the hands of of a Drunk driver, then it was meant to be....well it's too deep to explain here, but yes, they should throw the book at the guy just the same. wooo.....anyways.

Gotta take a strong exception to that offending statement 'Yall, that "if someone passes away at the hands of a drunk driver it was just meant to be". NO it wan't. It was meant not to be! And we have to do whatever it takes to stop the carnage of innocent people by irresponsible people who drink alcohol and drive! BTW, I'm NOT trying to be holier than thou; I've done more than my share of drinking and driving in years passed, but never got a DUI because I drive slower than the speed limit and very carefully. Now I try to have a designated driver on occasional party nights or park it (I parked it after the Ifish party and stayed down with friends instead of trying to drive home). - RT

[THE REEL HEY_YALL]

OK RT, can o worms time....so you are saying you believe in fate, but yet you don't believe in fate, but yet.... see you aren't making any sense. When someone passes away of circumstances that seem to be prevented, then it always will seem like they died before their time...which isn't true. Everyone dies plain and simple, some heinously, others in their sleep, some accidental, and some accidental that could have been prevented. It doesn't matter. Carnage, etc will always be here as long as man is walking the earth. The Lord does things that seem so questionable, but trust me they are all done for a reason. a death to someone by a Drunk driver could be a test for the family of the victim, or it could be a test for his friends, or it could be a test for the driver that was drunk, his family, etc. see it all is interwoven together that's what makes things so complexed. People pass tests and they fail tests...it's all up to the person(s) on how they handle these tests of life and Faith. No, I am not in support of Drunk driving at all, and I think it's terribly wrong to drink and drive, and yes it's up to us as people to prevent accidental things...but if it's meant to be there's nothing man can do about that no matter what the legislation and enforcement,etc. Life is a test of Faith. How's your Faith? I am ending any and all arguments on this subject as I have given my point of view roughly, but nicely, and sorry to offend anyone who has an opposing view(s) but I guess even atheists and satanists have their own warped and twisted views on life yep that was a cheap shot. Now let's break this up and get back to what we do best and that is mess with Osprey, oh yeah, and fish

[Dances]

RT
I got pulled over about 3 weeks ago for a suspected DUI and I am not even old enough to drink but any ways the guy said that I had crossedd teh center line and was driving abnormaly slow when infact I was turning. After he pulled me over he had me do the little eye test and then the breathalizer. he gave me back my stuff and walked off. I think he was board or some thing

[garyk]

Hello Ray,

Gotta challenge you on the 'facts' there buddy.

>You can't hunt on federal set aside land.

What do you mean? The Hanford Reservation? The whole National Forest acreage (other then Bull Run) is open to you, and me. As are the BLM lands, and the wildlife refuges.

The real lock-up is on the private timber lands.

>You also can't fish for salmon that the >government puts on the protected list.

And with good reason, fish stocks aren't just put on arbitrarily. The 'protected list' isn't the problem. The factors that drove the stocks down to that remnant level are.

> more annexation of land if Gore makes president.

Annexations? What annexations?

[Ray Wilcken]

I'm not sure how this discussion got onto drunk driving. I will say as a final word that the federal government has a lot of say into what we do in fishing and hunting! You can't hunt on federal set aside land. You also can't fish for salmon that the government puts on the protected list. These changes can effect your fishing and hunting licences in the State of Oregon because the state will need to generate lost revenue some how from issuing special tags for hunting areas and fisheries. We shall have to see who makes the White House, but expect radical changes to fishery laws and more annexation of land if Gore makes president.

[Ray Wilcken]

I'm talking about National Parks and National monuments. The kind Clinton just annexed in California. You cannot hunt in those areas.

[Phish_on]

So, you just want to hunt and fish out of control anywhere you like until all the animals are gone ??

Then what will you hunt and fish for ?

Why is conservation such a dirty word with you guys ?

Is the whole universe revolving around you and your gun ?

[wak'm&stak'm]

I cant leave this one alone...Hey-yall.....I for the life of me have never been able to figure people like you out. Out of one corner of your mouth you say we have a loving and true God, one who is all forgiving, kind, and so on. Then you turn around and paint this very ugly picture of how we are all pons in a much bigger game, saying.....Our loved ones could be killed and it was a test to see how we react?....That is about the most stupid reasoning I have heard. I thought the bible said time and unforseen occurances befall mankind, or another words accidents happen, not everything is pre ordained.
When that charter boat sunk a few years back and those fisherman went down, there were a bunch of ding bats back then at the memorial saying don't worry be happy because God wanted them...give me a break.
Hey-Yall I think sometimes people have to take responcibility for there own actions and can't always use the Lord as an excuse. "It wasn't my fualt the devil made me do it".
You say you trust God, but it is no differant than mose who get up and read thier horoscopes to see what kind of day they will have, saying "it is not my fault the planets weren't in my favor".
I like to think life is what we make, and we do have a say so in what happens, good or bad. If this is not true why do we even care or try because, "it is not my fault anyway".

[Ray Wilcken]

Just a reply to "Phish On". As I stated in my original message I am for conservation just like the next person. I do like to bring a fish home once in awhile and a deer home once in awhile. I don't believe there is a crime to that! What I don't believe in is radical conservation, the kind that Al Gore deals in. I don't believe in all the radical conservationist groups like the Sierra Club (The radical conservationist group that helped put mountain lions on the protected list in California). There are so many lions there now that they are coming into the cities eating dogs, cats and joggers. I whole point is I don't believe in radical groups that want to protect everthing from fleas to flies. My views are my own and are not subject to recount.

[Ray Wilcken]

"GARYK" you are comparing apples to oranges!

[DanS]

Ray,

The lions aren't coming into the city, the cities are coming to the lions. I agree that wildlife management by ballot is a very dangerous thing, but I think your assessment of what would happen to our hunting and fishing if Gore were elected is pretty unrealistic. The real threat to hunting and fishing will come via statewide initiatives, rather than via the White House. As urban populations become a greater percentage of the state's population, the more people tend to vote for "feel good" wildlife management. As far as I'm concerned the initiative process is a load of crap that takes us away from the representative government that's supposed to make the laws.

Fish on........

[garyk]

Ray --

You're speaking too broadly. You can in fact hunt in the National Monument areas, perhaps not all,(you're example in California?) but most you can, such as in our new Steens Mtn. conservation area.


Second, these lands were not 'annexed' as you state. They were publicly owned, Federal lands both before and after.

The various designations, change management directions and goals - not ownership.

[Phish_on]

Oh Ray, Gore is so far from "radical" ! Both candidates are so "middle-of-the-road" I don't think you have anything to fear. "Radical" groups like the Sierra Club just act as a counterpoint to "radical" groups like the NRA, somewhere in the middle of the road is compromise, and reality.

Both sides have to keep fighting, to make sure the middle stays in the middle -- I kinda flew off the handle back a few posts. But I know which side I'm on !

And don't worry about Gore. I voted for him, he lost the game. He should get over it. Show us your stuff, "W" ! hahahahahahahaha (good luck Bubba!)

[THE REEL HEY_YALL]

Like I said, it's the wrong place to even get into this discussion with anyone and I have ended my talks in the process wak em stak em. Everything in life is pre-ordained whether or not you believe it. Apparently you have watched "Final Destination" one too many times. Sure you have choices, but either way God knows which turn and the outcome will be when you come to that fork in the road. I don't use God as an excuse ever. I use him as a reason and I use him as an answer, but for me to say I am using him is quite the opposite because, in fact, he is using me. nuff said.

Yes, nuff said. Like the political posts, bringing differing religous opinions onto a fishing BB can create unresolved arguments meant for other type BB's. The only political aspects I brought were how would candidates affect fishing and the environment and it balloons from there. So, nuff said. Thanks. - RT