Massive Catch of Keepers Reported

[ssteelheadsteve]

Well Maybe.Got your attention.Please read on
Oregon Trout,Native Fish Society,Trout Unlimited.
We give up. You win. You have convinced the FEDS and most of the newcommers to Oregon that in 500 years we will be able to fish on some streams (catch & release of course)after winning a lottery "beat". You have convinced us that there will be clean water for industry, people and fish despite the fact that there will be 3X more of us in the region.If your not asking Disney studios for money now you should be as they have given PETA the right to use Disney logos and charcters in their " fish belong in the ocean not on your plate " campaign aimed at kids. Now that you have convinced all those in power that we will some day have rivers filled with Salmonids so thick that you can " walk on their backs without getting your feet wet" we would like to ask a favor. Of course we will have teams of government employes to clean up the smelly bodies not to mention that dead animals will be offensive to some folks in our perfectly politically correct society so they MUST be rendered.The small favor.One (1) Stream One stream for The Angler.Planted with 1 million Steelhead.One Million Spring Kings.200,000 Fall Kings,2 million Coho and 100,000 Searun Cutthroat and 500,000 Chums to keep the snaggers busy.Then the Angler will have a place to fish and I know the people at ODF&W will have the preservation of these runs as their highest priority.Then The Angler will know we will have fish in the future.After all you have successfully ( soon) closed our hatcheries,repaired all our streams to a condition far superior to that which the Creator gave us and now your perfect rivers that are protected from ultraviolet and atmospheric pollution are now sustaining the maximum number of " natural " fish possible. One stream for ODF&W and The Angler.One Stream just in case you anti fishers might have a slight chance of being wrong.Is one river too much to ask from a victor.Your organizations reign supreme.Perhaps with an eye to the future you could grant The Angler just one River basin where the state would guarantee enough clean water to preserve Salmonids.Perhps we should have 2 streams for this purpose in case of a natural calamity. I ask to much you say.Well how about it ? Just one River for The Angler. Please.

[ 01-28-2004, 04:43 PM: Message edited by: ssteelheadsteve ]

[Ty]

Not sure what kida reaction u are looking for?

Oregon Trout,Native Fish Society,Trout Unlimited.

These groups are looking out for everyones best interests as far as all sport fisherman are concerned.

Livingston Stone in the late 1800's figured that all salmonids of the NW would be gone by the millinium and had the briliant idea to set aside the entire Kodiak Island as a wild salmon and steelhead park so to speak.

He saw the Columbia River on it's knee's from overfishing far before the dam's and figured salmonids would be forever gone at the rate the CR was reaped.

So what exactly is your point "steve"?

[img]graemlins/1zhelp.gif[/img]

[ 01-28-2004, 06:51 PM: Message edited by: Ty ]

[TheRogue]

Originally posted by Ty:

Oregon Trout,Native Fish Society,Trout Unlimited.

These groups are looking out for everyones best interests as far as all sport fisherman are concerned.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">You're kidding, right?? [img]graemlins/icon_argue.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/icon_argue.gif[/img]

[Ty]

Oregon Trout,Native Fish Society,Trout Unlimited.

These groups are looking out for everyones best interests as far as all sport fisherman are concerned.


In the big picture of things they are doing what is right for the resourse. There has to be some balance in our fisheries. And they are not out there as groups like PETA...... These guys are doing what they see as right. In the big scheme of things, they may be right.

[Salmon Stryker]

Steve,

[img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img]

[Joe Schwab]

Ty, Where are you getting your info? Trout Unlimited? Overfishing before the dams? I'd really like to see that statistic backed up before commenting.

Well done Steve!

[Kruechief]

Ty, :whazzup:

Steve... [img]graemlins/applause.gif[/img]

Krue [img]graemlins/lurk.gif[/img]

[Paddlefish]

SSSSSteve:

You've raised 138 good discussion topics. Can we talk about them more s-l-o-w-l-y?

And, did you take your meds today?

(Sorry 'bout the last wisecrack. Couldn't resist.)

[Mojo]

Steve,
Since those groups are so wrong, let's absolutley discount any good they have done. We don't need to protect or improve our environment. Our streams are perfect as they are. The Willamette doens't need any water quality improvement, because there are fish living in it right now.

I belong to Trout Unlimited. Have been a sponsor for years. Here in Idaho we have cleaned up several rivers, fenced riparian habitat to keep cattle from destroying the banks and educated landowners as to the benefits of clean water to the entire ecosystem. Many of these streams now host larger populations of fish than they have seen in decades. It is groups like this, and the local fishing clubs that have restored miles and miles of river, and are partially responsible for the great runs of fish we are now seeing. YES!, I realize the good runs are also due to flushing fish down the Snake and Columbia, and AWESOME ocean conditions...but these groups help. They also help when it comes to dealing with the politicians. These organizations carry more clout than any one individual, when they lobby our elected officials. Yes, they sometimes side with groups I feel are a bit off the mark (overzealous). Politics makes for strange bedfellows. Instead of griping about these organizations, start one that represent your feelings, convince others to join, and get involved.

[ 01-28-2004, 10:05 AM: Message edited by: Mojo ]

[willierower]

:grin:

[ 01-28-2004, 03:13 PM: Message edited by: willierower ]

[BUGLEMAN]

Who know what ssteelheadsteve wants. But I can tell you from what I think of his post, he doesn't like what he sees happening. Plain speaking is what we need around here. Sportsmen are getting the shaft.

How about just one river for the Portland metro. One river for the North coast. One river for the South coast. One river for those who fish East of the Cascades.

[willametteriveroutlaw]

:whazzup: :whazzup: :whazzup: .. Oregon trout, trout unlimited, and the native fish preservation society are all anti-hatchery, so not on my list of groups that I will support.. nsia and other groups like tillamook anglers do way more to help the "average fisherman". As for you steve.. Whats your point?

[Tanner]

Oregon Trout,Native Fish Society,Trout Unlimited.

These groups are looking out for everyones best interests as far as all sport fisherman are concerned.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica"> Dude, you might want to do a little bit of research. Since when did "All Sportsman" only include the Range Rover driving, fly fishing catch and release only crowd..... These groups are a threat to the serious sport fisherman.

[Mojo]

There is a big difference between doing away with ALL hatcheries, and doing away with all organizations that promote clean water and viable ecosystems. There is also room for COMPROMISE. The biggest problem I see are the extremeists. The world is painted in shades of gray, and all you hear anymore is black or white.

By-the-way Tanner, I drive a Ford pickup, and my Come-to-Jesus stick has dispatched its fair share of hatchery steelies and salmon... :grin:

[ 01-28-2004, 01:15 PM: Message edited by: Mojo ]

[onthebank]

Ok I’m new to the Ifish community and I know that my opinion is like..... Well we know what its like and we all have them. Anyway this is my opinion, I am all for conservation, I want my children, my children's children, and so on the opportunities to go land a big one, I will gladly give up some of my freedoms to see that dream come true. My only question is why does it seem that the "powers that be" are trying to accomplish this dream is such a one sides manor? I mean why commercial fishing seems unaffected by the "total catch projections" like the sports fisherman are. I am only a novice fisherman but last time I went out I could only catch at best one fish at a time, while these big boats pull in thousands of pounds at a time. I just feel like I’m being hung out to dry because I’m not big business. That’s my only big complaint, I love the sport and will keep doing it till it either becomes illegal or I die. Thanks for the floor. Your friend on the bank

[Mojo]

onthebank...you make a good point.

I also believe that Oregon needs to join the rest of the United States of America, and recognise all navigable (and I define that as if I can float it in my kayak) waters as public domain. You can't trespass to get on the river, but by-God you can wade 7 miles in (at least stay below Mean High Water Mark) and fish.

[monoman]

Ty
Maybe it's a youthful thing....But OR Trout,Native Fish and now TU do not care a bit about your fishing. Look up their mission statements, than see if they have applied them to their law suits,to prevent you from fishing. Read some of the letters OT has sent to ODFW, they are public. They are now preservationist, not conservationist.

[Born to be Wild]

Oregon Trout,Native Fish Society,Trout Unlimited.

These groups are looking out for everyones best interests as far as all sport fisherman are concerned.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">I'm not very familliar with these groups but had some experience with two of them last fall.
Native Fish Society's Bill Bakke and Trout Unlimited's Katelyn Lovell both opposed the biologically sound Siltcoos and Talkenitch lakes wild coho fishery that is so meaningfull to bussiness's and fishermen.
They attempted to rob fishermen of an opportunity to retain wild coho in those lakes and lost.
The science was there and sound.

I appreciate some of Bill's work I have seen on his website and appreciate some of the good (education) that comes out of it but experienced first hand that these groups can work against fishermen.

Dano

[Ty]

Capt Hook,

The CR was severely overfished at the turn of the 19th century, and there are many historical accounts of this!

These groups are doing what is biologically sound, I never said that I aggree or even understand all that they stand for. Much of what they dtand for does benifit the average everyday sport fisherman. The may be extremists and preservationists, I am not and never will be. They are right to assume that there is no and I mean no proof that there is any long term sustainability to be associated with hatcheries.

I love catching fish, and I don't think we shoudl eb with out hatchries. But, biologically there is no sence in it. In fact hatchries definitly are not in the best interest of wild fish, just the facts.

[Born to be Wild]

Right on Ty.

There has been some good come out of these groups but there is some self interest also not friendly or balanced for the fishing community.

Dan

[glassblower]

I think what he is getting at is that at the rate things are being taken from us you will be paying a fee to walk over to a fence and look at a river from a 1/4 mile away and daydream about what it might be like to go fish it. Thing are getting bad with groups like Peta, Greenpeace, Sierra club, Etc on the prowl

[Joe Schwab]

Ty, the only historical accounts of overfishing in the Columbia River prior to the dams, which are the biggest killer of fish by far, was the overharvest of Sturgeon.

Commercial fisheries were thriving and so were the salmon runs until the dam building began. Are you aware there were a number of dams including Grand Coulee that were built without fish ladders?

Fish runs were plentiful in the 1800s and on into the 20s and 30s. That is precisely what got us into the treaty of 1855. No one except the Native Americans placed much value on salmon, due to the fact that they were so plentiful.

Look for the links on the History of Salmon Fishing on the Columbia.

[ 01-29-2004, 02:24 AM: Message edited by: Capt. Hook ]

[Go Harley]

Originally posted by onthebank:
I just feel like I’m being hung out to dry because I’m not big business. That’s my only big complaint...

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">Don't forget that this coming November. The environment, specifically how it pertains to salmon restoration, needs to become a hot political issue.

If those above-mentioned organizations are our lobbyists on Capital Hill they need to be fired. They're obviously not doing their job when a state like Iowa gets $50 million to build a domed tropical rain forest and between Oregon and Washington we get a meager $10 million for Columbia River salmon.