DuckBusters: Breasting vs. All (graphic pic heavy)

MarshBum · 01-08-2006, 06:30 PM

First, there are pics in this post that some may consider graphic. Given the audience, I'm sure it's ok, but I'm sensitive to the image hunters (voting minority) project to the non-hunters (voting majority). Maybe that's a topic of another post...

Anyway, the "Duck Busters" in the title of this thread is a reference to "Myth Busters", which is a show on The Discovery Channel that takes common held "myths" and tries to prove or disprove them. Like if you drop a penny from the Empire State building, it will go two feet into the concrete... etc... That's the sort of approach I'm taking here; to validate a claim made previously on iFish.

There was a lot of discussion in the past few months about the ethics of only breasting a duck out vs. taking all the edible meat. One individual claimed that the breast meat only accounted for 50% of the total edible meat (and in one post that number was revised to 60% by the same individual). I wanted to see if that was true, and sort of help set the record straight. That way, when the topic comes up again, as it surely will, we all know what the percentages are.

First and foremost, I'm not here to convince you one way or the other. I don't really care what you do with your birds as long as you use them, and treat them with respect. I did this because I was curious, and wanted to share what I learned... that's all.

So, on with the details.

The test bird is a Drake Mallard. He was pretty plump. Here he is:

I plucked him as good as I could with out going overboard. He was going to be skinned anyway. Here he is breast up:

So first, I breasted him out. No skin and no bone on the scale. Yes the scale is zeroed to include the plate. Here's both breast halves on the scale.

It came out to 9.75 ounces.

Now, the following pic is just so you can see how much breast meat I took. I'm not a surgeon. The point of this "experiment" was to do the cleaning of the bird as a hunter would. I felt it would not be realistic to take every last molecule off with a surgical scalpel, but to do as good as a job as I could with my bird knife. Judge for yourself.

Now comes the legs. He had pretty good meat on the legs. Here is a shot of the legs de-boned. It makes for a nice little pile.

And here they are on the scale.

Both of the legs came out at 2.50 ounces.

Now on to the wings. The meat is getting a little more scarce. Here are the wings de-boned.

And here they are on the scale.

Both the wings weighed in at 1.75 ounces.

Now to the back meat and rib meat. I basically took all the meat I could find on the carcass from here on out and piled it all together. I was scraping in some areas, getting everything I could. I cleaned this bird better than my Thanksgiving turkey. Here's the back and rib meat on the scale.

It weighs in at a mighty 1.00 ounce.

Finally, here is the carcass with all the meat taken off of it.

And here are the various piles of meat compared with each other.

So, here we have the results

Breast - 9.75 ounces (65%)
Legs - 2.50 ounces (17%)
Wings - 1.75 ounces (12%)
Back and Ribs - 1.00 ounces (6%)
Total - 15.00 ounces

So, the prior claim that it was only 50% and/or 60% was wrong, but not by that much. I have to admit I was a little surprised.

I would mention though, that this being a mallard, and a large one at that, had quite a bit of meat all over. I would not expect this to hold true for a diver, or be exactly the same for say, a widgeon... or a teal.

Anyway, here you go. I hope this helps you make your decision about what you should do when cleaning your birds. If not, no worries, I'm not here to tell you what to do.

MarshBum

waterfowlin101 · 01-08-2006, 06:36 PM

Ok, Geoff...I'm only through paragraph 2, and I'm already on the floor

.....Nice work (ok...back to reading).

Jon

reeldick · 01-08-2006, 06:38 PM

Thanks, you went thrugh a lot of work to give ifishers the facts.

waterfowlin101 · 01-08-2006, 06:40 PM

Great post....great pics. You rock Geoff...

.

Jon

Limbhanger · 01-08-2006, 06:43 PM

What about the heart,liver and tongue.... Jeez

That was a great experiment, very interesting.

gottafish · 01-08-2006, 06:56 PM

Very nice. Good Job

CMallardDrake · 01-08-2006, 07:20 PM

Great post MarshBum with great detail and fine photographic proof to boot!

About 15 years ago, (since we live out in the sorta wilderness) we put out at the edge of my front yard a hawk feeder. It's an eight foot post, with about three feet into the ground, with short plank nailed on the top.

I love roasted duck and as of late especially, pluck every dabbler I get for the roaster. When those times arise that we I have more ducks than we want for the roaster, we will breast out those birds and put the carcasses on the hawk feeder.

It's very entertaining to hear and watch the redtails come down to take care of the scraps on the carcass and when they are done, the results is like your photos but they at times eat up the neck and around the head. They too like dabblers.

Also, in the dark of night, we believe the owls come down too and feed on these birds we nail to the hawk feeder but we have never seen them in action for confirmation.

I tend to stop the debate with others and within my own soul of whether waste is occuring when I share my hunting success with the birds of prey.

rimrock · 01-08-2006, 07:26 PM

That was excellent.

I really appreciate you going through the effort and doing such a good job on the post/pics as well.

CMallardDrake · 01-08-2006, 07:28 PM

Oh...btw...

<font color="green"> "...delicious.....red.....meat.........." </font>

DukAddict · 01-08-2006, 07:28 PM

Very cool, nice job

Brett Neffendorf

Hunt'nFish · 01-08-2006, 08:16 PM

Impressive post Marshbum, nice work. Nice to know the facts.
Kinda surprised you didn't time yourself for each stage as well!!

Hunt'nFish

GL2 · 01-08-2006, 08:36 PM

I'm not wawterfowler, so I don't know sqaut about it.

This I do know, it seems that some people have a beef with other people just breasting out thier ducks. Seems that they, want to subject others to thier standards.

My point, if you want to breast them then do it. What are you talking about in the rest of the meat. Your talking ounces.
This isn't like wasting 10-20 or more pounds of meat like on a big game kill. I wouldn't want eat anything but, the brest off that duck.
Breast away I say, and don't let anyone trample on your liberty.
Yeah, the liberty to breast a duck in the year 2006. This shouldn't even be a issue.
What's next going thru each others garbage, looking for waste.
Next issue please?

GL2

D3smartie · 01-08-2006, 08:39 PM

I would like to know what percentage of hunters actually take that much of the wing, or even bother with the back/rib area. I sure dont know any. I am sure that E.H. takes every piece off of his 14.
Thanks for taking the time and photos MB.

lor · 01-09-2006, 06:05 AM

Thanx for going thru the process of conceiving this ideal, performing the work, taking pics, and posting it for all of us to learn from.

However, I find a couple of important pieces that people in different cultures will eat.
Firstly, what about the feet, some people eat feet.
Chicken feet, pigs feet. If you like seafood, you have probably eaten crabs feet.
Also, you left off the most important part of any bird, where all those tail feathers are you didn't pull off.
How about taking that oil bag and weight it, fry that sucker up and you got a meal. In some families, people fight over that oil bag.
I don't eat it, but I felt some would raise issue with seeing such a good piece of meat going to waste.

Mark Vickers · 01-09-2006, 07:09 AM

Very nice. An excellent post.

But you know, one bird does not make for a good statistical sampling. You need maybe 100 birds. Now get hunting!

Quackerhacker · 01-09-2006, 08:13 AM

MarshBum,

First of all, NICE POST!!! It is nice to see someone take the time and post information based on measureable fact. Great info for the newbie like me.

Thanks again!!

Quacker Hacker

Threemuch · 01-09-2006, 08:27 AM

But you aren't weighing the skin! Or the heart, liver and gizzard. And you can render alot of fat off anything you aren't using! Duckfat costs like 20 bucks a pound, and if you haven't cooked with it, you are missing something. There is soup to be made from those bones!

I will be the first to admit, I don't have the time to use every bird I kill to the FULLEST extent. Sometimes I do though, and it is kind of fun. Nice job on the boning of the wings and thighs. I think you got it all.

Could you please repeat the experiment on a spoonie, and a ringneck, and a merganser so I know the data for the ducks I normally shoot?

CMallardDrake · 01-09-2006, 10:19 AM

Quote:

"...There was a lot of discussion in the past few months about the ethics of only breasting a duck out vs. taking all the edible meat..."

MarshBum and/or others...

I missed the debate in the past about the ethics of waste while using the waterfowl that is taken in the field so I might be asking an obvious question that was answered then. Also, the synopsis might answer my question too but I'm not going to go look.

"What do the authorities say about just breasting out a duck?"

I ask because I've had folks tell me as they see hawks feeding on the above mentioned/posted "hawk feeder," that has a just breasted dabbler on it, that if the "authorities" saw this, I would be getting a citatation for wanton/waste.

They told me this about a decade ago. I continue to feed the birds of prey.

Chesapeake · 01-09-2006, 11:35 AM

Very informative post. Thanks! I cant say I care much about others opinions but after seeing this I think I will start taking the wings.

In the past I just took the legs and breast. I never figured there was much on the wings.

Another thing to consider with this is that the wings and legs are quite tough and full of tendon. This may push them off the list of edible parts for some folk.

Thanks again for the informative post.

baltz526 · 01-09-2006, 12:02 PM

great post. it seems to me, it would be simpler to just pluck the bird, bake it, then seperate the meat from bone.feed the waste to the dogs, eat the rest.than debone a noncooked bird

dcgrav · 01-09-2006, 12:23 PM

Thats awesome, Nice post!

Ethical hunter · 01-09-2006, 04:22 PM

CMallardDrake

Breasting mallard size ducks is considered wanton waste in Oregon.

Great post!! So, a minimum 35% more usable meat is on a mallard after taking the breast, 5.25 oz. per bird.

Interesting, 3 Just breasted ducks and 1 lb of meat wasted, 300 and 100lbs of meat wasted. That is a lot of duckaronni!! 100lbs! I think I would be hard pressed to get 100lbs of usable meat from one of these costal blacktails.

EH :smile:

CMallardDrake · 01-09-2006, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Breasting mallard size ducks is considered wanton waste in Oregon.

According to the authorities who can issue tickets or to every other waterfowler you ask?

This is the problem every time this issue comes up. Those who somewhat ridicule me when they see me plucking a whole duck for the roaster and say, "The breast is all that's worthy of messing with and I've never eaten a roasted duck that wasn't dry."

The majority of guys I know who hunt waterfowl take only the breast because they say they've never had a good roasted duck meal. I on the other hand, seldom breast out ducks because I savor the flavor of a full bodied roaster with my favorite parts being the legs and wings.

As my Dad would always say about game regulations and how they were interpreted... "Time to call my Philadelphia lawyer on this one!" :whazzup:

blacktail519 · 01-09-2006, 05:43 PM

You couldn't get me to eat that stuff

Chesapeake · 01-09-2006, 05:50 PM

While we are throwing around the "roasted duck" bit does anybody want to give up a recipe with cook time and temp?
I would like to try it. I cant remember ever having a roasted duck but I'm sure I must have as a kid.

I am currently rounding up parts to build a motorized plucker. I already have the rubber fingers, motor, and stainles drum. I just need to round up a few shives, an axle, and some pillow block bearings.

duckkiller · 01-09-2006, 05:59 PM

Great post I loved it

CMallardDrake · 01-09-2006, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Breasting mallard size ducks is considered wanton waste in Oregon.

According to the authorities who can issue tickets or to every other waterfowler you ask?

"...Also, it is important to note that the hunter must retain all edible portions of the carcass. The practice of taking only portions of the meat of a game bird (such as breasting birds out) is illegal..."

(page 9 of ODF&W, 2005-2006 Oregon Game Bird Regulations)

Sometimes I just need to go find out answers on my own. And...I'm assuming here that the debate that MarshBum mentioned was taking place here on the hunting board awhile ago about "breasting-vs-all", that this statement in the regs was posted at that time.

Guess this most likely will be all I have to say about this subject as I don't want to have a repeat of "awhile ago" here and mess up anymore this fine post and good long thread that MarshBum created.

GL2 · 01-09-2006, 07:11 PM

So you have to take all the game bird home, then breast it out?

GL2

Wreckless · 01-09-2006, 08:35 PM

Thanks Marshbum for stating some facts on the "beasting issue" . GREAT POST!!!

I think you showed that ethical hunters can prep the meat the way they see fit.
"Edible" has a different meaning to a lot of people. I completely agree (as do the regs) that boning out game is a great way to prep the meat. I bone out Deer, Elk, Ducks, Geese (sometimes), Doves......They all become part of many great dinners!!!!

BTW...E H. Shad are edible, but the only way I'll eat them is after soaking them in salt water and turning them into CRAB!!!!

MadMerganser · 01-09-2006, 10:53 PM

Chesepeake,
Recipe
1 mallard duck per adult
pluck whole skin on and clean
12-24hours soak in saltwater (draws blood out)
12-24hours soak in raspberry vinigrette mmm. (or italian) salad dressing
preheat oven to broil (real hot)
sear ducks at broil for 5-8 minutes(seals in moisture)
lower oven tempature to 300-325 and cook 30+/- minutes until thick part of duck breast is just pink in the middle. This recipe can be slightly modified for great results on a bbq
Critical when cooking ducks
1.sear in the juices
2.don't overcook (it's real easy to dry em out till they taste like a hockey puck) Shoot for medium rare or just a little rarer
If you don't like this recipe you need to adjust your taste buds cause thats good food there

Jeremy · 01-10-2006, 07:45 AM

Quote:

So you have to take all the game bird home, then breast it out?

GL2

Im pretty sure thats what they are getting at, you cant breast birds in the field so they can still identify what you shoot. You can do whatever you want with it once you get it home.

Crooked Hook · 01-10-2006, 08:15 AM

Marshbum, Great post!

It was somewhat surprising how much is wasted if you only breast them out. Thank's for taking the time to do that.

fishncliff · 01-10-2006, 08:25 AM

Very impressive.

I was watching the outdoor channel. They were showing a snow goose hunt in one of the states that start with " M".

After the hunt, the guide lays the geese out on the tailgate and fillets the breasts right off and tosses the rest of the goose, right there on tv.

Seems like breasting is more popular than we think.

wife&3kids · 01-10-2006, 10:29 AM

MB - how long does it take you to breast, wing and leg a duck? Is it longer than skinning or plucking and gutting?
I am curious, but it seems it would take a long time.
I realize we are talking about waterfowl, but again thank you for taking the time to educate people on the facts.

anyone who is 100 % either way on this is kind of fooling themselves imho.
All sorts of things that are killed are wasted. Basically all predator hunting. Also, come hunt deer with us up high in the canyons and you will learn how to bone a deer as it is the only smart way to get the deer meat out. This is all happening while under constant attack from bees. I do not feel horrible for not skinning the meat off the ribs. So if you are saying you have to take every portion of edible meat with you than I congratulate you on that effort.
I think we just need to remember that the definition of edible is different for all

The_Duck_Master · 01-10-2006, 11:24 AM

Quote:

So you have to take all the game bird home, then breast it out?

GL2

Im pretty sure thats what they are getting at, you cant breast birds in the field so they can still identify what you shoot. You can do whatever you want with it once you get it home.

Actually what they're getting at is whether it is ethical to only keep/eat the breast meat from a duck. The question of legality is very clear. Breasting is illegal no matter where it is done. The debate is whether breasting is ETHICAL or not.

Thank you MB for taking the time to post this. Very educational.

HuntNFishAddict · 01-10-2006, 11:51 AM

Geoff,
Nice Flowery plates. At least you could have given him the dignity of a single colored plate. HA HA.
Nice work.
JB

Salmonator · 01-10-2006, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Breasting is illegal no matter where it is done. The debate is whether breasting is ETHICAL or not.

The quote from page 9 is taken from text that is in an outlined box entitled "Field dressing of game birds, whats legal". In other words legs, wings and popes' nose goes home with you. It is my enterpretation of this text that it is not illegal to breast a duck at home. I for sure wouldn't call this a very clear regulation.

The_Duck_Master · 01-10-2006, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Guess this most likely will be all I have to say about this subject as I don't want to have a repeat of "awhile ago" here and mess up anymore this fine post and good long thread that MarshBum created.

chrispucci · 01-16-2006, 01:47 PM

TTT

Thsi should help people find it. This thread was quoted in the Oregonain today after all.

Thanks Geoff for taking the time to do this.

Critter Getter · 01-16-2006, 08:58 PM

Great post !I have to hand it to you , you did a real great job boning that mallard out . I couldn't have done it as well. You also answered a lot of questions about the breasting vs plucking issue . would have liked to see what the heart, gizzard meat weighs , I usually take that part also because it so easy to get at and my kids all grew up eating duck with the heart and gizzard fixed in the same pan. They usually had a fight over the hearts and gizzards if everyone didn't get their share. Thanks again ,great job.