Q? How many like M1 Garands... How about .270s?!

billc_sbio · 01-02-2006, 01:00 PM

While this is a little off topic for the "Hunting" forum, hopefully, because it's shooting related, it'll be acceptable.

The other ".30-06 100 yr. Anniversary" topic is fun because it has to do with our most popular Sporting cartridge for hunting, the .30-'06.

And as has frequently been the case with popular Sporting/Hunting cartridges (.45-70, .30-40 Krag, .30-06, .308 Win/7.62 NATO, and .223 Rem/5.56 NATO), the '06 was first a U.S. Military round, later adopted for hunting.

It first appeared in the 1903 Springfield bolt action rifle, then later, in the 1917 Enfield, and finally in the M1 Garand rifle that was the main battle rifle for WW-II as well as Korea and wasn't replaced until 1957 when the "Improved Garand" 7.62 NATO M14 Rifle appeared.

So, many of us know this...and maybe now, those who didn't, do.

But did you know that ORIGINALLY the Garand Rifle WASN'T a .30-06?!! :shocked:

Originally it was a .270!

It fired a shorter (more similar to a 7mm-08) round that was called the ".276 Garand"!

In my collection of Odds 'n Ends Cartridges, I have one. It's marked "FA31" (Frankford Arsenal 1931). Kinda looks like a miniture .30-06! :grin:

The Army was skeptical about its performance and had tests performed. The .276 Garand passed, with flying colors!

But later, it was shot down by Gen. McArthur, who insisted that the rifle be built in .30-06!

So, that's what happened...John Garand went back to the drawing board and redesigned certain dimensions and changed various components to make it compatible with the already existing standardized military cartridge.

What he came up with was one of the best battle rifles ever built.

Don't be surprised if someday you see a similar .270 military cartridge adopted.

John Garand was just way ahead of his time!

01-02-2006, 01:35 PM

7mmX51 NATO, I think the British played with this in early L1A1's.

Just Fish · 01-02-2006, 02:19 PM

It would have been a heck of a battle field round 130 gr at 2900 fps

billc_sbio · 01-02-2006, 02:44 PM

Quote:

7mmX51 NATO, I think the British played with this in early L1A1's.

Yep, I think that time WE shot it down (again!)

Now (I've heard) our guys are looking at it again!

grsteelies · 01-02-2006, 03:04 PM

That would be one cool rifle. I love my garands, and my m1a1. Nothing like hearing the "ding" from an emtpy clip popping out the top. How much is that .276 worth?

billc_sbio · 01-02-2006, 03:46 PM

Hehe, that .276 Garand (properly called .276 Pedersen) I have is just a single ROUND of ammo!

I don't know how many actual .276 Garand RIFLES were built or are still in existence!

I'm sure there are some, probably in various museums somewhere.

My guess is that they're worth a few coins!

sliverpicker · 01-02-2006, 04:28 PM

In the mid/late 60's my oldest brother was in the Oregon National Guard based in Hillsboro. I think he went to the national matches at Camp Perry, Ohio three straight years. One year he came home with a brand NEW M1Garand 30.06 40 years later, it still has yet to be fired!

He'd bring home hundred's of spent 30.06 and .308 brass, in fact I'm still using military brass in my .308

Just thought I'd share

billc_sbio · 01-02-2006, 04:52 PM

Quote:

In the mid/late 60's my oldest brother was in the Oregon National Guard based in Hillsboro. I think he went to the national matches at Camp Perry, Ohio three straight years. One year he came home with a brand NEW M1Garand 30.06 40 years later, it still has yet to be fired!

He'd bring home hundred's of spent 30.06 and .308 brass, in fact I'm still using military brass in my .308

Just thought I'd share

If he was a match shooter, shooting in those matches, there's a good chance that that rifle he brought home might be a M1NM, National Match rifle?!!

When I was in High School, I had a friend who was on the State Jr. Rifle Team. His father belonged to a company that had their own company rifle team and they were a DCM (Director of Civilian Marksmanship) affiliated club.

So, before heading off to Camp Perry, for the National Matches that year, my friend's father got him a BRAND NEW M1 NM! :shocked:

You had to be "qualified" to get one (he was!).

I remember going over to his house after school and looking (drooling) over it! Brand New in the box...$150! :grin:

sliverpicker · 01-02-2006, 05:05 PM

I'll call him later and ask if it's an NM model or not. It didn't cost him anything, he won the rifle at the shoot!

That's the same brother in the pic I sent you with the Ruger #1 .257 Roberts.

sp

billc_sbio · 01-02-2006, 05:20 PM

Quote:

I'll call him later and ask if it's an NM model or not. It didn't cost him anything, he won the rifle at the shoot!

That's the same brother in the pic I sent you with the Ruger #1 .257 Roberts.

sp

Look here to see what they presented to match winners in the "old days"

http://trapdoorcollector.com/ &

http://trapdoorcollector.com/Assinniboine.html :shocked:

(Moderator, this is a collector's site).

AnnaDraMoss · 01-02-2006, 05:23 PM

My hunting rifle of choice is still the sporterized 03a3 dad built in the late 50's.
Btwn dad and I we've purchased three Garands pieced together from the DMC, all of which I fired the first shots at certified matches and scored double X's @ 200 yds with each of them.
Granted my overall scores were not impressive but thats just me shooting, but the weapon is highly impressive for its accuracy and superior specifications in design and materials it was built from.

sliverpicker · 01-02-2006, 07:42 PM

He couldn't remember if it was 1964 or 1965, but he won the National Guard High Individual division. He didn't mention his score, but he mention the 200, 400, and 600 yard range.

He thinks they awarded 5 or 6 M1NM Garand's each year, one for regular Army, Marine Corp, etc.

He said the rifle has an extra fancy blueing and stock finish then the standard National Match model's.

The next time I get out to his place I'll take a couple of pics of it to share.

sliverpicker

Catching Nemo · 01-02-2006, 11:16 PM

The "new" 270, for the military, is called the 6.8mm Remington SPC.

Here is a little write up on the 6.8mm.

gottafish · 01-02-2006, 11:42 PM

Neat artical, Hey look at the eyes on that mule deer in the photo. To me it looks like spot light action. LOL

fish forever · 01-04-2006, 07:45 PM

Garands are a blast to shoot. Best thing about them is you can fully dissassemble one, reassemble and be able to hit a target at 600yds without rezeroing. They also kick significantly less than a bolt 30-06.

I have one set up for hunting - put it in a synthetic stock on it which shaved a pound of weight. Shooting ballistic tip ammo/scirrocos it Will shoot 1.5-2moa with iron sights. Have yet to bag something with it but looking forward to using it on my next coast range elk hunt.

If you do plan to use one for hunting - dont forget to use a 5rd clip. The 8rounders are illegal for big game.