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Black Boxes Mandatory for Cars: Privacy?

3K views 34 replies 26 participants last post by  Lead Bouncer 
#1 ·
As I predicted several years ago:
About 96 percent of all new vehicles sold in the United States have the boxes, and in September 2014, if the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has its way, all will have them.

The boxes have long been used by car companies to assess the performance of their vehicles. But data stored in the devices is increasingly being used to identify safety problems in cars and as evidence in traffic accidents and criminal cases. And the trove of data inside the boxes has raised privacy concerns, including questions about who owns the information, and what it can be used for, even as critics have raised questions about its reliability.

http://www.nbcnews.com/business/black-boxes-cars-question-privacy-6C10700483
You have the right to remain silent but your car, not so much. And the data will be used against you...
 
#5 ·
Isn't this the same thing that Progressive started offering? The little thing that you plug into your OB2-connector, so they can montior your driving habits?
 
#6 ·
I heard about this for the for the first time just last week... guy at work has one in his truck... First thing I thought of when he told me about it was "expletive" THAT!
 
#19 ·
As Tilla said, insurance companies will start requiring black boxes if you want their insurance...or any insurance. And of course, driving without insurance would prompt the "tell on me" feature.

It looks to me like there will be no "privacy" in the US pretty soon. Everyone will be tracked by their cell phone and car. The government will know your whereabouts at all times. I think this is a much bigger deal than gun registration.

Bit don't worry, if you have done nothing wrong you have nothing to fear (depending of course on who is in power, whether or not you support them and whether or not they want to make you afraid). (And of course, you know that little phrase is exactly what the Third Reich told the Jews.)
 
#8 ·
You guys are worried about your car data while the the NSA captures all your cell, data and internet browsing.Read the European press on line.They are outraged over there.And we stress over car data? My personal feeling is if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear.
 
#11 ·
Until they decide to look for what you have no reason to hide. Christine Odonell, didnt have anything to hide, but the house she didnt own was liened by the IRS and the information was leaked by the IRS to her campaign opponents.
 
#9 ·
I kind of like the idea of a black box, having been in an accident with no witnesses willing to come foward an electronic footprint would of been nice. Imagine being able to tie in with the traffic control system and demonstrate that the light was green when you were hit by a red light runner. Being able to prove that the person that hit you was speeding or weaving back and forth. I have only been in three accidents in 30 years of driving and in all three the people involved have been unable to agree on fault. It would be nice to be able to download the data and just know who was in the right.
 
#12 ·
Timothy Murry was driving a Government issue car so it wasn't his vehicle so no court order/warrant needed.

I'm pretty sure it is a different story for you and I driving our personal vehicle. My company has given me express orders to not assist any one other than the owner of the engines control module with downloading the information within it. When I do assist I hand the information to the owner, not his lawyer, and definately not to law enforcement. The owner can then do as he wishes.

It is actually pretty funny to see half a dozen folks gathered around a wrecked truck to watch me hand a jump drive to the owner, and I walk into the sunset.
 
#13 ·
I'm against it. Someone will hack into the circuits and defeat it. It'll be done via the wiring harness or grounding some ic legs together or similar. And they'll share it on the net.

I can see the merits in regards to accidents. However, as the owner, I want to control the data and record, or not, and delete, at my discretion.
 
#14 ·
It gets worse, I saw a program about the future of automobiles
They said that in the near future that all cars will have a GPS device that will send signals to satelites that will tell them where you are, how fast you are going, etc and the satelites will relay the information to ground installations that will know the speed limit where you are, traffic light operation etc
Then if you are doing something wrong mail you a ticket
Sounds very scary Here comes 1984
Of course the benefit would be it would probably slow down car theives
 
#17 ·
I care.....I'm not doing anything wrong either, but privacy is being lost at light speed it seems like these days. Just another chip in a crumbling foundation.

As far as the insurance discounts....if you feel comfortable to let other people watch you and volunteer for it, that's your business. They are violating my privacy too much already without me volunteering.
 
#20 ·
Apparently the man is already tracking our license plate numbers.
http://www.aclu.org/blog/technology...-documents-license-plate-scanners-reveal-mass

Maybe we should start a private citizen personal data encryption business. That way nobody from iFish will be able to figure out where I hunt or fish. It probably already exists though.

Seriously though, once Google cars become ubiquitous Google will once again have a leg up on the governments of the world who want Google's data. In a way Google is becoming more powerful than any country out there, their reach extends across international boarders after all....
 
#23 ·
Black Boxes seem to be the industry's answer to radar detectors. Why do you need a radar detector if you are within the allowable speed limit.

The NSA surveillance bothers me greatly. Our company is in international trade and I travel often. In the course of a day it is possible to have conversations (phone, e-mail &/or skype) with people and companies from 5-6 countries.

How do I know that Abdullah who owns a steel mill in Hatay Turkey is not secretly pushing money Asli who then passes it to the Assad Government. Although we have done nothing wrong, do we now go on a watch list?

When we were dealing heavily in China, I witnessed some events that would trigger a trade law violation in the US. If traced back around would we be now suspect because we had visited that factory?

I don't worry about us doing something wrong. I worry about the perception by a fool in the government and being tagged. If we are tagged and our shipments start to come under more intense customs exams, it would bankrupt us quickly. Intensive exams run between $2,000 and $8,000 each.

I worry about being falsely tagged and spending days in Customs where you are not technically in any country and US laws may or may not apply.
 
#25 · (Edited)
Not doing anything wrong - who cares.
That's it, pave the way to having no rights because you aren't doing anything wrong. Run with that attitude as it's allowed huge amounts of spying on the common man like you and myself for the past 20 years or so. If you're not bothered by it, you should be.

Moreover, this just reaffirms I need to buy old simple cars. Then I can put a metal box console in them and toss my phone in it while I'm on the move. Then I just pop up on the map, then disappear again, when I start moving. Tracking me would be exceptionally boring, as I suspect most Americans would be. This way they at least have to track me with all those little cameras on every stop light instead to connect the dots.

And of course, you know that little phrase is exactly what the Third Reich told the Jews
Uh, hmmm, scary ****! And everyone seems to be doing the same as the Germans did and scoffing at it while it gets worse.
 
#30 · (Edited)
Most likely it's not a modular component that you can unplug. One will need to know schematic wiring and electronics quite well. Also, it'll probably require a shop manual to get that detail. And lastly, it's likely integrated wtih your GPS, so you may lose that feature as well.

In short, not easily, but yes, absolutely it can be defeated, it's just electronics. A properly grounded piece of the circuit usually does the trick.

But this is not the government yet. The insurance companies are working this device into the vehicles and may make it mandatory to get insured or as a guide to a persons insurance rate. Then they will use the government to make it law.
Which returns me to my older car statement to defeat this scenario without doing anything.
 
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