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Troubled waters.... Kenai goes to C&R, no bait

8K views 50 replies 26 participants last post by  ShutUpandFish 
#1 ·
It's official.... EO issued today... read and weep for the mighty Kenai.

http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm...1503&year=2011


June 27, 2011
A PORTION OF KENAI RIVER KING SALMON FISHERY RESTRICTED TO PROTECT THE EARLY-RUN. THE LATE-RUN FISHERY IN THE LOWER RIVER REMAINS UNCHANGED.
As of June 27, three out of the four indices used to assess the abundance of early-run king salmon in the Kenai River indicate a run that is well below average. All department assessment methods indicate the run is similar to the runs of 2009 and 2010 that produced escapements estimated to be near the lower bound of the optimal escapement goal (OEG) of 5,300 to 9,000 early-run king salmon. Due to the high level of uncertainty of whether the minimum escapement of 5,300 fish will be achieved it is warranted to conserve Kenai River early-run king salmon in an area of the river where they are susceptible to a harvest rate that could result in an escapement below the OEG.
Anglers are advised that in the Kenai River drainage from an ADF&G regulatory marker located approximately 300 yards downstream from the mouth of Slikok Creek, upstream to the outlet of Skilak Lake, and in the Moose River from its confluence with the Kenai River upstream to the northern-most edge of the Sterling Highway Bridge, the Kenai River early-run king salmon sport fishery will be restricted as follows:
• Only king salmon less than 20 inches in length or 55 inches or greater in length may be retained. King salmon 20 inches or greater in length and less than 55 inches in length may not be possessed or retained, may not be removed from the water and must be released immediately from 12:01 a.m., Wednesday, June 29, through 11:59 p.m., Thursday, July 14, 2011. Harvest of king salmon less than 20 inches in length or 55 inches or greater in length is still allowed.
• Use of bait is not allowed from 12:01 a.m., Wednesday, June 29, through 11:59 p.m., Thursday, July 14, 2011.
Beginning Friday, July 1 bait is allowed only downstream of the ADF&G regulatory markers located approximately 300 yards downstream from the mouth of Slikok Creek.
For information of inseason assessment of Kenai River king salmon visit our website at: http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/sf/FishCo...ADFG=main.home.​
 
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#2 ·
It's official.... EO issued today... read and weep for the mighty Kenai.

http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm...1503&year=2011


June 27, 2011
A PORTION OF KENAI RIVER KING SALMON FISHERY RESTRICTED TO PROTECT THE EARLY-RUN. THE LATE-RUN FISHERY IN THE LOWER RIVER REMAINS UNCHANGED.
As of June 27, three out of the four indices used to assess the abundance of early-run king salmon in the Kenai River indicate a run that is well below average. All department assessment methods indicate the run is similar to the runs of 2009 and 2010 that produced escapements estimated to be near the lower bound of the optimal escapement goal (OEG) of 5,300 to 9,000 early-run king salmon. Due to the high level of uncertainty of whether the minimum escapement of 5,300 fish will be achieved it is warranted to conserve Kenai River early-run king salmon in an area of the river where they are susceptible to a harvest rate that could result in an escapement below the OEG.
Anglers are advised that in the Kenai River drainage from an ADF&G regulatory marker located approximately 300 yards downstream from the mouth of Slikok Creek, upstream to the outlet of Skilak Lake, and in the Moose River from its confluence with the Kenai River upstream to the northern-most edge of the Sterling Highway Bridge, the Kenai River early-run king salmon sport fishery will be restricted as follows:
• Only king salmon less than 20 inches in length or 55 inches or greater in length may be retained. King salmon 20 inches or greater in length and less than 55 inches in length may not be possessed or retained, may not be removed from the water and must be released immediately from 12:01 a.m., Wednesday, June 29, through 11:59 p.m., Thursday, July 14, 2011. Harvest of king salmon less than 20 inches in length or 55 inches or greater in length is still allowed.
• Use of bait is not allowed from 12:01 a.m., Wednesday, June 29, through 11:59 p.m., Thursday, July 14, 2011.
Beginning Friday, July 1 bait is allowed only downstream of the ADF&G regulatory markers located approximately 300 yards downstream from the mouth of Slikok Creek.
For information of inseason assessment of Kenai River king salmon visit our website at: http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/sf/FishCo...ADFG=main.home.
Bad deal for the fish, but hopefully they are taking the needed steps. I fished that river several times back in the early 90's. It was only a matter of time IMO. There is no doubt you are much more versed and experienced with that river and fishing over all compared to me.
Maybe they should have a slot limit for the entire river, and leave the big ones to spawn. It has been proven...take the largest genes out of the breeding pool and throw back the little ones. You will end up with little fish.
 
#4 ·
Bad deal for the fish, but hopefully they are taking the needed steps.
Could have made that call last Friday, but they wanted to "wait and see" thru one more weekend to spare the weekend warriors that already had plans.

In the end, they had to to do what they had to do. Good call.

Unfortunately they're gonna miss the boat for Slikok without extending all the way down to Sunken Island.... 300 yds only captures the existing Slikok Sanctuary.

Hoping peer pressure gets folks to lay off the fire engines that'll be staging there for the next 3-4 weeks.
 
#3 ·
How should one know the length of a massive King Salmon over 55 inches, without removing it from the waters and with doing preventable damage to an undersized fish. Not really quite a question, but more or less a realistic possibility of causing more harm than good. I agree as well to determine a better size/ slot limit to leave and or replenish the healthy genetics of the larger Salmon. Thank you, for sharing this EyeFish.

Hope things get better for our northern most rivers soon, and the returns of fish return to somewhat normal numbers of the past. :palm:

-Dan
 
#6 ·
How should one know the length of a massive King Salmon over 55 inches, without removing it from the waters and with doing preventable damage to an undersized fish.
The only reason they put the 55" rule in there is to give someone the infinitessimal chance to bonk the next world record. For all intents and purposes, that fish no longer exists in the early run of Kenai kings. A 55" fish is incredibly RARE.... even if it looks like the biggest fish of your life, it's probably still NOT 55". If there's even any doubt, just let it go! That's the best way to not damage undersized fish. If one had even half a concsience, he would let that fish go even if it were over 55".

That said, if one must measure, this is the best way I know how.



 
#7 ·
Unfortunatly, it will continue to spiral down....down...down...,until the majority taker of the fish is controlled. :twocents:


Shazaaam.......We all know that, but those in charge seem to always be in denial, and are more than eager to point the finger of blame elsewhere. Like habitat destruction, or water temps, or lack of baitfish.

Funny thing is, all up and down the west coast there are healthy stocks of chinook salmon.

Over harvesting and un-imaginable amounts of dead bycatch for other specific fisheries are deemed to be not responsible for the devastating impacts to certain salmon runs.

I hope they figure it out before it's too late for the all-mighty Kenia kings.
 
#8 ·
That's good and bad news at the same time. Don't know why someone would want to keep something precious over 55" as you mentioned Doc but I've seen pictures so I guess there are people that will do that.

Hopefully this restriction will not affect us if and when we manage to get out there for sockeye (7-16--8-1ish)

Hopefully the department can do everything they can with the help of fishermen of course to prevent a total collapse in the great fisheries on that river.

Thanks for sharing with us,
Chef Serg
 
#11 ·
Allowing the take of a fish greater than 55 in length is merely a ploy to allow a world record to be taken from the Kenai in the hope of attracting more anglers to that river for the sake of all the guides there so their business can increase. Along with their commercial take of salmon, no wonder they are having troubles.

Way to go, Alaska. You are sitting up there with the fewest people in the nation and you still screw up a very productive stream with your pro-take policies and trampling of fish. But, then again, you aren't really unlike the rest of the country and the world. What a shame that humans continually screw up fish runs. With the continuing increase of humans on the planet, fish will continue to dwindle and then humans themselves.
 
#12 ·
jacksalmon, no different than the fall chinook issue here on the coast. Oregon has been riding the fine line of escapement for quite some time with this return and still continues to hammmer the stock into submission. Oregon is also catering to the guides and the clients they fish with little concern for the wild chinook return. We don't have to point finger at Alaska when this state has the track record it has, not good for the wild fish.
 
#16 ·
If you read my post, it says that Alaska is like the rest of the world and USA when it comes to hammering fish, and, the last I looked, Oregon was part of both the USA and the world. The only possible saving grace for Oregon is that many of our fish are taken by commercials in BC and, guess where else, right you are, Alaska. So, the pounding of Oregon fish may not alone be due to Oregon taking. Whereas Alaska does not have the same explanation. I would guess that no Alaska fish are taken in Oregon waters, fresh or salt. There you have it.
 
#14 · (Edited)
I don't know what is causing the decline of the early run Chinook on the Kenai, but if it's like other salmon fisheries, it's likely a combination of alot of factors. The usual suspects are likely at work on the Kenai.

However, targeted ocean harvest on Kenai Chinook is probably the scariest factor, if it's happening. I have no evidence, but if someone (Japan, Russia, China) has located the areas in the open ocean where these fish go during their adolesent/adult life, it's the death knell for these fish. Open ocean harvest (i.e., international waters) of Pacific salmon is notoriously difficult to manage or control. Even with strong regulations in place, they're hard to enforce.

It's not that much different than the Columbia River Chinook getting hammered in SE Alaska and BC. Once the commercial fishermen, or recreational anglers, find the feeding grounds for these fish, it's over. All the in-river harvest reductions, EO's, habitat improvement, hatchery introductions (heaven forbid) etc, etc, will do nothing if ocean harvest is not tightly controlled. And if the ocean harvest of ER Chinook on the Kenai is in international waters, I'm not optimistic about the future of these fish.
 
#17 ·
It is commercial take that is responsible for most of the problems in Alaska and Oregon. Until there is a ban on the commercial sale of chinook in this country, there will continue to be commercial take and decimation of runs. Good luck in getting a ban on the commercial sale of chinook, so, guess what, chinook runs will continue to be hammered. If a wilderness like Alaska cannot keep its runs healthy what hope is there for the rest of the planet?
 
#15 ·
This is not a new occurance on the Kenai system. I fished the river twice ( can't remember exact years) in the late 80's early 90's out of the "Fishing the West" lodge. Both times C/R (total) and no bait. Still have the 53 3/4" measurement line from my fish of a lifetime. I would call the recent restrictions as very wise proactive management and I hope they continue the practice as they see the need to protect this wonderful resource. :twocents:
 
#19 ·
Jacksalmon - Your statement is a bit of a stretch; and Freespool's calling you on it. Commercial fishing is certainly a factor in the decline of Pacific salmon stocks, particularly in Oregon. But whenever I see those massive blocks of concrete in the middle of the Columbia River, I wonder how the salmon can possibly co-exist with hydropower. They're managing, but it ain't easy.

I used to think that Alaska might be different. And perhaps sometime in the past, it was. But I'm not so sure anymore. The habitat seems to be in good shape, but other factors are starting to loom large.

Fishing is clearly a factor, even in Alaska, and I was careful not to just point at the commercial fishermen. Those of us (like me) who like to fish for salmon are part of the problem too. From the point of view of a Chinook salmon, we're all guilty.
 
#23 · (Edited)
Jacksalmon - Your statement is a bit of a stretch; and Freespool's calling you on it. Commercial fishing is certainly a factor in the decline of Pacific salmon stocks, particularly in Oregon. But whenever I see those massive blocks of concrete in the middle of the Columbia River, I wonder how the salmon can possibly co-exist with hydropower. They're managing, but it ain't easy.

I used to think that Alaska might be different. And perhaps sometime in the past, it was. But I'm not so sure anymore. The habitat seems to be in good shape, but other factors are starting to loom large.

Fishing is clearly a factor, even in Alaska, and I was careful not to just point at the commercial fishermen. Those of us (like me) who like to fish for salmon are part of the problem too. From the point of view of a Chinook salmon, we're all guilty.

I agree with everything you have to say. I just have a viewpoint that says that taking a NW fish to put on the table of a New York City diner is flat out immoral in these days of declining numbers of fish. I know you would disagree with that, but we can all have our opinions. Even with the dams on the Columbia, which ain't coming down, when they can't even get the Snake dams down, the runs would be looking one hell of a lot better, if there were no commercial fishing.

P.S. I had a ODFW biologist tell me that, in his opinion, the North Coast chinook runs are in much worse because of the Alaska commercial harvest of those runs as they migrate through Alaskan waters. Is that scientific enough for you and Mr. Freespool, whose theme is habitat is everything and commercial take has no significance.
 
#28 ·
I think the Kenai kings are getting decimated by the incidental commercial sockeye catch in the Cook inlet. I've fished it a couple times, my brother and father-in-law every year. Many of the kings we've caught have net marks on them.
Be careful around here with any mention that commercial take of chinook could have anything to do with the decimation of the runs---there are a lot of commercial fisher lovers on this website.
 
#31 ·
Ya gotta be a dam fool to believe present day harvest management and angler retention patterns haven't killed the Kenai's kings.

Early timed fish depleted by disproportionate exploitation.
Mainstem spawners depleted by disproportionate expliotation.
Lower river spawners depleted by disproportionate exploitation.
Older age classes depleted by disproportionate exploitation.
Large fish depleted by disproportionate exploitation.

These all exert tremendous selection pressures against specific segments of the population.

If you are a Kenai king genetically destined to grow old and large and programmed to return early and/or spawn in the lower mainstem.... you and your kind have gradually and systematically been wiped out by decades of disproportionate exploitation by the sport fleet.

The commercials are just as culpable. Indiscriminately intercepting any freshly arriving late-timed fish sockeye-sized or bigger thru all of July. On a typical run-size, 800-1200 kings are taken by the Cook Inlet beach nets each and every day they are deployed.... with dire consequences for the escapement of all adult age classes of chinook.

As far as we can tell at this point, the fate of the early run rests entirely on the shoulders of in-river users.

As far as the late run goes, clearly the blame can be shared. With a net fleet systematically depleting the available fish homing for the river combined with disproportionate exploitation of the earliest timed and largest mainstem spawners, there are now fewer fish than ever. Moreover, large fish retunrning in the first 2-3 weeks of July have been all but wiped out. Thank goodness for the fish returning in the final week of the season and beyond. They are vulnerable to only a limited number of days of in-river exploitation.... those coming after July 31, NONE at all. These latest-timed fish are the backbone of what remains of the Kenai's legendary chinook. The last remnants of what used to be the flagship king fishery in the state.

Shameful to see it all happen in my lifetime.
 
#32 ·
Those are some nice pictures, and such slabs! I was talking to my Father about this and he was surprised it hadn't been changed already. "About time.." was his reaction statement. Being only 24 yrs. old and only dreaming of making it to BC or the Legendary Kenai river in Alaska. I probably will never have the fishing my father had 15 years ago while taking numerous trips North in search of Giants. Another very sad story for a once spectacular Fishery. I am sure the fishing is still amazing, but from what I understand this should have been done a long time ago?
 
#34 ·
Take note that Doc is identifying the sources of the problem without differentiating between user groups. Recreational and commercial exploitation are both guilty.

I realize there is no direct commercial fishery on Kenai Chinook, but the sockeye gillnet fishery (drift/set net) might just as well be one. I also believe the recreational harvest has likely put a huge dent in the spawning population. However, if that's the case, it's one of the few examples of a fishery that collapsed due primarily to recreational angling. Most anglers, including me, are not effective enough to collapse a robust stock of fish, without other contributing factors such as habitat loss (not a big issue on the Kenai). But given the heavy fishing pressure on the ER Chinook on the Kenai, it's likely happening. Sad to see.

They need to shut it down.
 
#35 ·
Take note that Doc is identifying the sources of the problem without differentiating between user groups. Recreational and commercial exploitation are both guilty.

I realize there is no direct commercial fishery on Kenai Chinook, but the sockeye gillnet fishery (drift/set net) might just as well be one. I also believe the recreational harvest has likely put a huge dent in the spawning population. However, if that's the case, it's one of the few examples of a fishery that collapsed due primarily to recreational angling. Most anglers, including me, are not effective enough to collapse a robust stock of fish, without other contributing factors such as habitat loss (not a big issue on the Kenai). But given the heavy fishing pressure on the ER Chinook on the Kenai, it's likely happening. Sad to see.

They need to shut it down.
I have already expressed my view that sport angling has a higher moral value than commercial, but preservation of the fish run has the highest moral value. Assuming that it is mostly sport angling that is responsible for the downturn in Kenai chinook, then I would like to know how it is that Alaska let it get that bad. Was the state F&G department so determined to continue the money flow to the Kenai guides that they simply ignored the reality of declining chinook runs and let the guides with their paying customers from all over the world hammer and hammer these fish? I won't believe for a second that nature played on a trick on them and they just couldn't see it coming. Why is it that humans always let it get as bad as possible before trying to do something about it?
 
#38 ·
Remember that Pacific salmon populations fluctuate normally, even under pristine conditions. That presents an enormous challenge to fishery managers, particularly on the Kenai. They may have the data to show that stocks are declining, but who is to stay this is not just natural fluctuations? Significant declines have happened in the past. So why is this any different? The folks who depend on these fish for their livelihood (guides, hotels, businesses, etc) make the claim that the fish managers are over-reacting, or the fish managers believe the sky is falling. Who's to say the fish stocks won't bounce back next year? The fish managers certainly can't since they cannot predict next year's return with any degree of certainty. So the harvest continues.

But when the stocks fail for, say, 10 years in a row, it's easy to say there's a problem, and it ain't natural flucutations. But, by then it's too late. Should have done something 10 years earlier........

This scenario has played out in the PNW for decades. Perhaps it's Alaska's turn.
 
#41 ·
Remember that Pacific salmon populations fluctuate normally, even under pristine conditions. That presents an enormous challenge to fishery managers, particularly on the Kenai. They may have the data to show that stocks are declining, but who is to stay this is not just natural fluctuations? Significant declines have happened in the past. So why is this any different? The folks who depend on these fish for their livelihood (guides, hotels, businesses, etc) make the claim that the fish managers are over-reacting, or the fish managers believe the sky is falling. Who's to say the fish stocks won't bounce back next year? The fish managers certainly can't since they cannot predict next year's return with any degree of certainty. So the harvest continues.

But when the stocks fail for, say, 10 years in a row, it's easy to say there's a problem, and it ain't natural flucutations. But, by then it's too late. Should have done something 10 years earlier........

This scenario has played out in the PNW for decades. Perhaps it's Alaska's turn.
Alaska deserves what they get with their policies. When the fish bounce back, if they do, the ADFG will only conclude that it is once again time to hammer 'em.
 
#39 ·
It's official.... EO issued today... read and weep for the mighty Kenai.

http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm...1503&year=2011


June 27, 2011
A PORTION OF KENAI RIVER KING SALMON FISHERY RESTRICTED TO PROTECT THE EARLY-RUN. THE LATE-RUN FISHERY IN THE LOWER RIVER REMAINS UNCHANGED.
As of June 27, three out of the four indices used to assess the abundance of early-run king salmon in the Kenai River indicate a run that is well below average. All department assessment methods indicate the run is similar to the runs of 2009 and 2010 that produced escapements estimated to be near the lower bound of the optimal escapement goal (OEG) of 5,300 to 9,000 early-run king salmon. Due to the high level of uncertainty of whether the minimum escapement of 5,300 fish will be achieved it is warranted to conserve Kenai River early-run king salmon in an area of the river where they are susceptible to a harvest rate that could result in an escapement below the OEG.
Anglers are advised that in the Kenai River drainage from an ADF&G regulatory marker located approximately 300 yards downstream from the mouth of Slikok Creek, upstream to the outlet of Skilak Lake, and in the Moose River from its confluence with the Kenai River upstream to the northern-most edge of the Sterling Highway Bridge, the Kenai River early-run king salmon sport fishery will be restricted as follows:
• Only king salmon less than 20 inches in length or 55 inches or greater in length may be retained. King salmon 20 inches or greater in length and less than 55 inches in length may not be possessed or retained, may not be removed from the water and must be released immediately from 12:01 a.m., Wednesday, June 29, through 11:59 p.m., Thursday, July 14, 2011. Harvest of king salmon less than 20 inches in length or 55 inches or greater in length is still allowed.
• Use of bait is not allowed from 12:01 a.m., Wednesday, June 29, through 11:59 p.m., Thursday, July 14, 2011.
Beginning Friday, July 1 bait is allowed only downstream of the ADF&G regulatory markers located approximately 300 yards downstream from the mouth of Slikok Creek.
For information of inseason assessment of Kenai River king salmon visit our website at: http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/sf/FishCo...ADFG=main.home.
These should be permanant rules through July 31, not the 14th.. And they should start at sunken island as mentioned..
 
#48 ·
EO officially extended thru the end of the season.

http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/index.cfm?adfg=fishingSportFishingInfo.NR&NRID=1515&year=2011

Due to a high level of uncertainty whether the early-run king salmon escapement of 5,300 to 9,000 fish was achieved, it is warranted to continue to conserve Kenai River early-run king salmon that may still be transiting in areas outside of designated sanctuaries. In addition, all five indices used to assess the abundance of late-run king salmon in the Kenai River indicate a run that is well below average. All department assessment methods indicate the late run is similar to the runs of 2009 and 2010. The final 2009 escapement estimate was slightly below the sustainable escapement goal range and the 2010 escapement was likely below lower bound of the sustainable escapement goal of 17,800 to 35,700 late-run king salmon. Therefore, it is warranted to continue to manage the early run conservatively and begin to slow down the harvest of late-run king salmon while the run continues to develop.
Anglers are advised that in the Kenai River drainage from ADF&G regulatory markers located approximately 300 yards downstream from the mouth of Slikok Creek, upstream to the outlet of Skilak Lake, and in the Moose River from its confluence with the Kenai River upstream to the northern-most edge of the Sterling Highway Bridge, the Kenai River early-run king salmon sport fishery will be restricted as follows:
• Only king salmon less than 20 inches in length or 55 inches or greater in length may be retained. King salmon 20 inches or greater in length and less than 55 inches in length may not be possessed or retained, may not be removed from the water and must be released immediately from 12:01 a.m., Friday, July 15, through 11:59 p.m., Sunday, July 31, 2011. Harvest of king salmon less than 20 inches in length or 55 inches or greater in length is still allowed.
• Use of bait is not allowed while fishing for any species of fish from 12:01 a.m., Friday, July 15, through 11:59 p.m., Sunday, July 31, 2011.
Although bait continues to be allowed downstream of the ADF&G regulatory markers located approximately 300 yards downstream from the mouth of Slikok Creek, additional restrictions for this area are possible if the run does not improve.
For information of inseason assessment of Kenai River king salmon visit our website at: http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/sf/FishCounts/index.cfm?ADFG=main.home.
 
#50 ·
I think describing Alaska runs today as mostly being wilderness is silly. Mining, logging, oil and gas development, etc... When you add ridiculously lenient commercial and sport harvest to the equation, Alaska is most definitely NOT a conservation friendly state.

Google "Pebble Mine" for an example.

Alaska is blessed with some of the most incredible fish, wildlife, and public lands on the planet, but the political mindset in the state is "use it up fast!" rather than "conserve it so it lasts forever".
 
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